Publicans want 15% levy on off licence sales....

Menas

...to cover lost revenue due to Alcohol advertising ban in sports.

They claim that this 15% levy on off licence sales would "protect the employment intensive on-trade sector and 50,000 associated jobs while generating badly needed revenue for sports and other areas."

Methinks they have been supping too much of their own stock.

http://www.thejournal.ie/lid-levy-alcohol-sponsorship-sports-1013466-Jul2013/

checkyabadself

How nice of them to rally behind the sports teams. Great bunch of lads.

Sir Humphrey Appleby

Greedy publicans in a "lets screw the drinkers" shocker!:eek:
Seriously they want to be able to benifit from pubs full of fans watching sporting events, and they want the stay at home drinker to foot the bill!
They will be demanding a 50% levy on those watch Sky Sports at home next!

Links234

That's exactly what we need, more bailing out and subsidising of faltering industries :rolleyes:

Uriel.

I really wish the VFI would stop looking for Government intervention to screw over their competitors (and ultimately the consumer) and instead actually do a bit of light shining on their own members and give them a kick up the arse to redevelop the tired old model that is their industry.

Honestly, I don't know the profit margin after tax on a pint in a pub, but I am sure it's healthy enough, but this carry on of being charged the guts of €5 for a spirit and then looking for €2 for a splash can fúck right off.

Also, the fact that for the most part it's the same ****ty beers. And the usual model of blaring music and no other forms of entertainment.

Like any other business, if hey are struggling then they need to reinvent themselves and not seek the Government to take out their competitors for them.

mathie

Uriel. wrote: »

Like any other business, if hey are struggling then they need to reinvent themselves and not seek the Government to take out their competitors for them.

[homer]Can't someone else do it? [/homer]

Links234

Uriel. wrote: »

Also, the fact that for the most part it's the same ****ty beers.

Yup, if all you've got is Carlsberg, Heineken etc, I'm not going to be visiting your establishment. If pubs are losing out to offies, maybe it's the range that's on offer that's a factor?

Cabaal

You know the way dvd rental shops are loosing money due to online movie downloads,

Well I think the government should introduce a levy on all downloads, this money can then be given to dvd rental shops.

This is no different to what the pubs want really.

mathie

Cabaal wrote: »

You know the way dvd rental shops are loosing money due to online movie downloads,

Well I think the government should introduce a levy on all downloads, this money can then be given to dvd rental shops.

This is no different to what the pubs want really.

You wouldn't download a white wine spritzer.

flutered

actuall if the goverment got rid of below cost selling of booze by the muntiples it would make a massive difference to the exchequer, but it is a nettle they do not want to grasp.

sbsquarepants

Uriel. wrote: »

Like any other business, if hey are struggling then they need to reinvent themselves and not seek the Government to take out their competitors for them.

Except banks, insurance, farms, airlines, and so on.
Despite having slightly socialist leanings myself, i think large swathes of this country could do with a good hard dose of capitalism - it's called fúcking reality people - if the shít you peddle offers little or no value to consumers they won't want to buy it. Governments should have more backbone than to bend to the whims of these fúckwits - adapt or die end of story.

Cabaal

Cabaal wrote: »

You know the way dvd rental shops are loosing money due to online movie downloads,

Well I think the government should introduce a levy on all downloads, this money can then be given to dvd rental shops.

This is no different to what the pubs want really.

From a socio-economic point of view. Alcohol should be at least twice it's price in off licenses. The cost that alcohol costs the health service is unreal. I drink by the way. I'd have no problem paying higher prices.

Cabaal

Deleted User wrote: »

From a socio-economic point of view. Alcohol should be at least twice it's price in off licenses. The cost that alcohol costs the health service is unreal. I drink by the way. I'd have no problem paying higher prices.

I agree on the dangers of drink, I grew up in a pub so I've seen the damage drink does likely more then the average Joe has.

Its evil stuff and taken for granted in this country, people don't respect it and the level of many people's good nights out is how little they remember due to the intake of drink.

This is a worrying aspect of many people in this country, we are certainly nothing like the French or Germany when it comes to drink. We drink to excess as a country.

listermint

Cabaal wrote: »

I agree on the dangers of drink, I grew up in a pub so I've seen the damage drink does likely more then the average Joe has.

Its evil stuff and taken for granted in this country, people don't respect it and the level of many people's good nights out is how little they remember due to the intake of drink.

This is a worrying aspect of many people in this country, Some are certainly nothing like the French or Germany when it comes to drink. Some drink to excess as a country.

FYP


Also France has its own alcohol problems as does most of 'the western world' i think people believe the continent to be stuck in some 50-60s wine sipping neuvo haven. Which it isnt.

Cabaal

listermint wrote: »

FYP


Also France has its own alcohol problems as does most of 'the western world' i think people believe the continent to be stuck in some 50-60s wine sipping neuvo haven. Which it isnt.

No the likes of France and Germany aren't stuck in the 50's, but at the same level it certainly has a overall healthier attitude to drink then Ireland as a country does.

Its more about the enjoyment and enjoying people's company and less about getting sh*tfaced in order to enjoy yourself.

CardBordWindow

Cabaal wrote: »

....... We drink to excess as a country.

I drink TO ARTHUR! :pac:

floggg

Cabaal wrote: »

You know the way dvd rental shops are loosing money due to online movie downloads,

Well I think the government should introduce a levy on all downloads, this money can then be given to dvd rental shops.

This is no different to what the pubs want really.

And everybody with a car should have to support the blacksmith industry.

Anybody know how I can become a blacksmith?

listermint

Cabaal wrote: »

No the likes of France and Germany aren't stuck in the 50's, but at the same level it certainly has a overall healthier attitude to drink then Ireland as a country does.

Its more about the enjoyment and enjoying people's company and less about getting sh*tfaced in order to enjoy yourself.

This may have been true 10 years ago. But youth unemployment has changed that landscape.

Banjo String

They've no problem with Tesco etc selling cans of coke for 50c, while they charge €3 for the same thing

sbsquarepants

Deleted User wrote: »

From a socio-economic point of view. Alcohol should be at least twice it's price in off licenses. The cost that alcohol costs the health service is unreal. I drink by the way. I'd have no problem paying higher prices.

I would. I pay enough tax as it is. I haven't wound up in a&e over some some drunken accident, my liver is doing just fine, i've never wound up in a cop car, or driven over an innocent bystander. I haven't cost the bloody health service, or any other service two pence because of my drinking.

Cabaal

listermint wrote: »

This may have been true 10 years ago. But youth unemployment has changed that landscape.

Sources for this claim?

anncoates

The goverment really need to aggressively put the boot into the VFI and their monopolistic bleating and attempts at market cornering but it's never goimng to happen when they have the ear of a lot of politicians,.

Cabaal

sbsquarepants wrote: »

I would. I pay enough tax as it is. I haven't wound up in a&e over some some drunken accident, my liver is doing just fine, i've never wound up in a cop car, or driven over an innocent bystander. I haven't cost the bloody health service, or any other service two pence because of my drinking.

Perhaps not now,
But if you for example continue to take in a high level of drink then this will likely lead to health issues in later life.

Your defense is like smoking and then claiming you don't cost the HSE a penny. Yeah not now, but later life is a different story.

keithclancy

Cabaal wrote: »

No the likes of France and Germany aren't stuck in the 50's, but at the same level it certainly has a overall healthier attitude to drink then Ireland as a country does.

Its more about the enjoyment and enjoying people's company and less about getting sh*tfaced in order to enjoy yourself.

Walk around Lille, Paris, Duesseldorf or Berlin and you'll see just as many alco zombies wandering around the place.

Saying that, I don't think cheap alcohol necessarily = more alcos, they'd be off drinking meths or something else to forget their troubles.

Ireland is pretty much on par with Germany and France for consumption rates.

Source:

http://www.oecd-ilibrary.org/sites/9789264183896-en/02/06/g2-06-01.html?contentType=/ns/StatisticalPublication,/ns/Chapter&itemId=/content/chapter/9789264183896-25-en&containerItemId=/content/serial/23056088&accessItemIds=&mimeType=text/html

anncoates

Deleted User wrote: »

From a socio-economic point of view. Alcohol should be at least twice it's price in off licenses. The cost that alcohol costs the health service is unreal. I drink by the way. I'd have no problem paying higher prices.

The proposed levy is suppsoed to benefit publicans so how the hell is it a progrssive mesaure to tackle the issue of alcohol abuse?

There's not a whit of proof whatsover that an increase in off-sales prices is going to address our complaicated realtionship with alcohol unless by some utterly far-shore chance that the government might actually - allocate resources to and - attempt to sensibly tackle the problem inst4ad of mrerly creaming in extra money on drink that people will still buy anyway while propping up the ailing business model of their parish pump mates.

Faith+1

mathie wrote: »

You wouldn't download a white wine spritzer.

You wouldn't download a Car either

FatherLen

I paid 23.80 for four pints on the weekend.


and they wonder why I buy 12 cans for 14.

sbsquarepants

Cabaal wrote: »

Perhaps not now,
But if you for example continue to take in a high level of drink then this will likely lead to health issues in later life.

Your defense is like smoking and then claiming you don't cost the HSE a penny. Yeah not now, but later life is a different story.

You do have a point there, or you would if this was actually about health, but it's not.

Alcohol consumtion is falling in Irleand year in year out for the last decade, we now drink on average 100 pints less per year than we did a decade ago. Health costs must be falling, so why the sudden need for action?
This stunt has nothing to do with costs to the HSE. It's to do with gombeen politicians being manipulated/coerced by a powerfull lobby group. What the fúck do the publicans care about sport or the HSE cost over runs - they only care about selling pints!

suicide_circus

i was charged €3.60 for a 250ml sparkling water in a club last night. That is all.

rubadub

flutered wrote: »

actuall if the goverment got rid of below cost selling of booze by the muntiples it would make a massive difference to the exchequer, but it is a nettle they do not want to grasp.

Have you any links to back up that claim?

In the UK (similar enough pub/offie/supermarket setup as here) they investigated the effect of a ban on below cost selling. They quickly figures out that there was minimal below cost selling going on , only a few non-mainstream drinks happened to be below cost. I firmly believe the same is here, I have never seen any evidence of it being hugely widespread, but certainly hear publicans and vitners moan about it being rife.

Some places who sell cheap drink do not fall into the idea behind below cost selling. e.g. the local centra did 20 heineken for €15 for ages, nobody was doing full weekly shops there, only a moronic owner would sell below cost in a shop like that. It just doesn't add up.

The publicans are the idiots paying distributors a fortune so wrongly presume everybody pays the same. I see this with guys I know who have cash & carry access, they presume it MUST be cheaper.

It was reported at the weekend that ministers have struck a compromise deal on ending alcohol sponsorship of sports by 2020 although significant hurdles remain with regards to how to replace funding of some €20 million that sporting organisations currently benefit from.

This might sound crazy, but maybe, just maybe -some non-alcohol related company will advertise at sporting events, like they already do...

There is no real relation between the advertising ban & the pubs. This could just as easily have been restaurants saying they want a 15% levy on all food sold in supermarkets to help the sporting organisations & protect the labour intensive restaurant trade.

adocholiday

The drinking culture has drastically changed in Ireland. I'm 26 and have been going to pubs/clubs for about 10 years. When I started going out, going to the offie for 'pre-drinks' was an alien concept unless you were smashed broke. In the town I come from there were 3 very popular pubs, all of which you would have to be in by 8.30 on a Saturday to have a chance of getting a seat and most of my friends would be out. Pubs were heaving with people. Head down to 1 of 2 nightclubs then and queue for a half hour to get in.

Fast forward to 2013. I was working in a shop at home for a few months and there was a few 18-23 year olds there. Their Saturday night consists of going to the off licence and buying cheap beer/spirits, heading to one of their houses and getting pissed, then head to the late bar/club and have 1 or 2 drinks before heading home. We had a work do in a pub one night and none of them showed up until after 11.30, they were all drinking at home.

This tells you all you need to know about the pub trade, and publicans have themselves to blame. Say what you want about the entertainment model or whatever, price is the number 1 issue.

snubbleste

Drug peddlers seek state assistance to safeguard their trade

EyeSight

these guys are idiots. i remember one of them using this argument on Matt cooper about 2 years ago: "But if people drink at home, they are probably going to smoke while drinking and they will probably have kids in the room who could get cancer". Seriously?

Mr Benevolent

I just brew my own. Can't go wrong. I abhor paying €5 for a pint of utter crap. I used to go to the pub once a week, now it's 5 or 6 times a year.

kirving

In other news, the chipper association of Ireland is calling for a 15% levy on potatoes.

StephenHendry

Here they go again, the vfi/publicans wont' give up on this !!! talk about ignoring the elephant in the room as to why they are struggling to survive

Cabaal

Kevin Irving wrote: »

In other news, the chipper association of Ireland is calling for a 15% levy on potatoes.

In a statement earlier this morning, the chipper association of Ireland said:

"Damn none fried potato products putting in on our fried potato products profits!

How dare people have options available to them at a lower price"

Knasher

I was out with a couple of friends in a pub this weekend. About half way through the night I realised that I was fighting a losing battle with the sound system, my throat was hoarse from shouting at people and my ears were ringing from people shouting back. At one point I was waiting for lulls in the music just so I could squeeze in a few words every couple of minutes. Eventually I just gave up and complied with the pub was clearly trying to get the punters to do; stop wasting valuable drinking time chatting to your friends, I finished up my pint and got the hell out of there.

Needless to say that is yet another pub on the list of ones I won't be visiting any time soon. Honestly I think a lot of pubs have forgotten the reason people go to them in the first place (or at least why I'd go), to have a drink and a laugh with friends. Drowning out conversation might force people to drink more, but at the price of repeat business. I've no regrets in seeing pubs like that go out of business.

the purple tin

I wouldn't be suprised if something daft like this went ahead. A lot of our politicians either own pubs or are silent partners in them.

Menas

There are two types of pubs in this country in my opinion. There is the small country pub that has been there forever , have their prices at rock bottom and still struggle to get punters thru the door. I paid €3,60 for a pint of plain in one of these places over the weekend.

Then there are the more urban pubs who had it great during the boom but cannot adapt their business to the market and cannot figure out why their trade is suffering.

To use the example of my own local. I was in there last week and there was a bunch of auld wans in there and no one else but me and the barman. But they had the horse racing on all the tv screens in the place at high volume. Barman reading the racing post! Go figure.

Caliden

FatherLen wrote: »

I paid 23.80 for four pints on the weekend.


and they wonder why I buy 12 cans for 14.

I was home in Galway at the weekend and went to a fairly popular pub (McSwiggans) and got 5 pints of Guinness for 15 quid.

Good luck getting a (decent) pint of Guinness in Temple bar for less than a fiver.

Menas

Caliden wrote: »

Good luck getting a (decent) pint of Guinness in Temple bar .

Corrected that for you.

podgemonster

The VFI are the most hypocritical shower of spin doctors out there. For years they milked us in the boom, bars popping up everywhere, expensive drink and crap service.

They cry out saying that pubs are closing and people are losing jobs. Do they not stop to think that we are over stocked on pubs and some of them should close. There are 5 pubs in my village, with barely 500 people living there, the nearest town has 12 pubs and a population of 2000 people. We are over stocked.

It is survival of the fittest in my mind, if you provide good service, have good value, reinvent yourself and have a good atmopshere then you will have loyal customers and develop a good reputation and thus survive. Instead the VFI try to impose a cartel across Ireland to make sure all the pubs keep their drink prices up and keep shambolic dingy half empty pubs open for the sake of 2-3 job position.

shruikan2553

How do restaurants survive when there are take aways but pubs cant survive with off licences. Maybe they could think of a way of being competitive? Or would that require some sort of understanding of business. The more they complain, the less I want to use a pub.

suicide_circus

Caliden wrote: »

I was home in Galway at the weekend and went to a fairly popular pub (McSwiggans) and got 5 pints of Guinness for 15 quid.

Good luck getting a (decent) pint of Guinness in Temple bar for less than a fiver.

so the entire population of Dublin should move to galway. problem solved.

This is a stupid proposal but the most stupid proposal is the banning of drink advertising in sport which is leading to this proposal.

It's absolute nanny state bull s*it. The amount of money that will be lost for sport is huge and they expect drinkers to make up this difference when the drinks companies are happy to pump money into sport,

Its a sad day for sport when the anti-drink and anti-fun brigade in the government force this on the county. All this on top of the fact that in reality drink advertising in sport is making no difference to consumption etc.

BeerWolf

"Rabble rabble"!

Beefy78

Cabaal wrote: »

This is a worrying aspect of many people in this country, we are certainly nothing like the French or Germany when it comes to drink. We drink to excess as a country.

Cabaal wrote: »

No the likes of France and Germany aren't stuck in the 50's, but at the same level it certainly has a overall healthier attitude to drink then Ireland as a country does.

Its more about the enjoyment and enjoying people's company and less about getting sh*tfaced in order to enjoy yourself.

Hmmmmm I've been to pubs in Germany which have their own dedicated areas for vomiting.

Sir Humphrey Appleby

flutered wrote: »

actuall if the goverment got rid of below cost selling of booze by the muntiples it would make a massive difference to the exchequer, but it is a nettle they do not want to grasp.

Below cost selling my ass!
if the oublicans got their act together and provided a service at a price that was affordable then they wouldn't have half the problems they claim to have.

This is akin to restaurants demanding a levy on groceries to stop people eating at home!

HalloweenJack

Clearly this is the VFI's latest Eureka moment after that whole "minimum-pricing" push didn't work out...

**** the VFI. They are a shower of complete **** and have no business intuition whatsoever. If they did, they'd readjust and figure out how to increase profits. But no, they're stuck in the Tiger and have no concern for their customers, they see them as wallets with mouths. They need to get their heads out of their holes.

SolarFlash

I agree with the VFI only I would make it 90% not 15%. It's bad for the economy people drinking at home. PS I'm looking for a bar job if u know any going pm me cheers.