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Irish riders' diaries

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    #32
    buffalo
    Registered Users Posts: 8,065 ✭✭✭buffalo


    http://www.independent.ie/sport/other-sports/nicolas-roche-my-legs-were-burning-like-hell-but-i-didnt-care-today-was-the-day-i-could-make-a-difference-on-this-tour-29417279.html

    Nico on yesterday's efforts and the splits.


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    #33
    dastardly00
    Registered Users Posts: 13,331 ✭✭✭✭dastardly00


    Latest diary entries....

    Nico:
    our jerseys are so skin-tight today that I had to stuff another five bottles down the front of mine before riding back up with them wobbling all over the place, banging off my legs.

    Dan:
    after four hours I really started to suffer with the heat. My brain felt like it was being cooked, like being boiled alive.


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    #34
    buffalo
    Registered Users Posts: 8,065 ✭✭✭buffalo


    Rest day interview with Dan: http://www.independent.ie/sport/irelands-dan-martin-if-i-want-a-beer-ill-have-a-beer-29424731.html
    Cycling is a hard sport and if I have to make too many sacrifices I can no longer do it. I've found a happy medium.

    It's not that I'm going to get drunk every week but if I want a beer I'll have a beer.

    A man after my own heart.


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    #35
    buffalo
    Registered Users Posts: 8,065 ✭✭✭buffalo


    http://www.independent.ie/sport/other-sports/nicholas-roche-i-stopped-by-the-team-car-to-apologise-to-my-directeur-sportif-29425931.html

    Nico knew exactly what he was doing yesterday, pity it didn't work out.
    Although there were 26 riders out front, the one I was watching was Rui Costa, who recently won the Tour of Switzerland. Costa is a decent climber and a very good time triallist, and I knew that if he got over the top of the final climb on his own, with 12km to go, he would be very hard to catch on the descent.

    ...I went flat out to get to Costa's wheel but when he put the hammer down on a steep bend, I simply didn't have the legs to stay with him and completely blew up.


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    #36
    buffalo
    Registered Users Posts: 8,065 ✭✭✭buffalo


    Nico: http://www.independent.ie/sport/other-sports/roche-one-of-the-irish-fans-made-me-laugh-29429686.html
    I wasn't riding flat out and Ag2r's John Gadret, who had started two minutes behind me, caught me on the top of the final climb.

    You may remember him as the team-mate whose head I wanted to put through the window of the team bus a few years ago when he didn't give me a wheel after I punctured. Nowadays we get on fine and today I pulled to the side and let him past as he took a few risks on the descent in a sudden rain shower.


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    #37
    buffalo
    Registered Users Posts: 8,065 ✭✭✭buffalo


    http://www.independent.ie/sport/other-sports/nicholas-roche-when-i-got-to-irish-corner-my-legs-didnt-work-anymore-29432304.html

    Headline: 'When I got to Irish Corner my legs didn't work anymore'. Sounds like Hansen wasn't the only one on the beer yesterday! :pac:


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    #38
    godtabh
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 23,211 Mod ✭✭✭✭godtabh


    buffalo wrote: »
    http://www.independent.ie/sport/other-sports/nicholas-roche-when-i-got-to-irish-corner-my-legs-didnt-work-anymore-29432304.html

    Headline: 'When I got to Irish Corner my legs didn't work anymore'. Sounds like Hansen wasn't the only one on the beer yesterday! :pac:

    Riding today's diary suggests that today is going to be extremely tough for Roche. If Saxo attach throughout the day it could be another very long day for him with the Gruppetto


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    #39
    buffalo
    Registered Users Posts: 8,065 ✭✭✭buffalo


    Roche's final day: http://www.independent.ie/sport/other-sports/nicolas-roche-sooner-or-later-the-hard-work-ive-put-in-has-to-pay-off-29437691.html

    Favourite bit:
    Jesus was nowhere to be seen

    I realise giggling about people called Jesus is probably immature, but I can't help it.
    I helped close a gap for Alberto on stage 10, and helped open a one-minute split for him in the crosswinds of stage 13. I got in a breakaway on stage 16, although I didn't have the legs to make the most of it and then rode hard to keep us in front in the team classification on Friday's 19th stage to Le Grand Bornand.

    I've also learned a lot from riding for Alberto. He is meticulous about his bike and equipment, even down to the air pressure in his tyres.

    Sounds like he's learned a lot, but again, I wonder why it's taken ten Grand Tours for Nico to start caring about tyre pressure. Is that not something every amateur checks before the start of a race? When you turn pro, do you get blasé and expect the mechanics to do it, and assume it'll be fine?

    Looking forward to seeing how he does in San Sebastian and the Vuelta!


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    #40
    Squidgy Black
    Registered Users Posts: 21,629 ✭✭✭✭Squidgy Black


    buffalo wrote: »
    Sounds like he's learned a lot, but again, I wonder why it's taken ten Grand Tours for Nico to start caring about tyre pressure. Is that not something every amateur checks before the start of a race? When you turn pro, do you get blasé and expect the mechanics to do it, and assume it'll be fine?

    I'd assume he's talking about Bertie having some sort of preferred pressure rating that he insists on every stage. I'd say for most of them they just let the mechanic do the job and once it feels right during the warm ups etc it's fine for them.


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    #41
    TinyExplosions
    Registered Users Posts: 6,860 ✭✭✭TinyExplosions


    buffalo wrote: »
    Sounds like he's learned a lot, but again, I wonder why it's taken ten Grand Tours for Nico to start caring about tyre pressure. Is that not something every amateur checks before the start of a race? When you turn pro, do you get blasé and expect the mechanics to do it, and assume it'll be fine?

    POssibly because he's just an incredibly average rider that Ireland has built up to be some sort of contender when he just can't hack it. He under performed as a team leader in AG2R (some would say not through lack of trying), and he's not done brilliantly as a climbing domestique for Saxo.

    Maybe it's time we realise that he's god a famous dad, but is a journeyman at best?


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    #42
    goose06
    Registered Users Posts: 742 ✭✭✭goose06


    TinyExplosions wrote: »
    POssibly because he's just an incredibly average rider that Ireland has built up to be some sort of contender when he just can't hack it. He under performed as a team leader in AG2R (some would say not through lack of trying), and he's not done brilliantly as a climbing domestique for Saxo.

    Maybe it's time we realise that he's god a famous dad, but is a journeyman at best?

    He's still better than anyone on this forum will probably ever be so why not just enjoy having him riding the grand tours and let us all live in hope that he'll pull one out of the bag one of these days.


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    #43
    ford2600
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,457 ✭✭✭ford2600


    TinyExplosions wrote: »
    POssibly because he's just an incredibly average rider that Ireland has built up to be some sort of contender when he just can't hack it. He under performed as a team leader in AG2R (some would say not through lack of trying), and he's not done brilliantly as a climbing domestique for Saxo.

    Maybe it's time we realise that he's god a famous dad, but is a journeyman at best?

    He's a very solid professional, honest and hard working.

    Not good enough to compete at very top level, but that is no crime. It's a very high bar.

    We should be proud of him. He leaves it all on the road, and while not top drawer, before Dan he was the only Irish guy in grand tours for many a long day


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    #44
    BTH
    Registered Users Posts: 3,075 Mod ✭✭✭✭BTH


    ford2600 wrote: »
    He's a very solid professional, honest and hard working.

    Not good enough to compete at very top level, but that is no crime. It's a very high bar.

    We should be proud of him. He leaves it all on the road, and while not top drawer, before Dan he was the only Irish guy in grand tours for many a long day

    While I agree with the first part of your post the bit in bold is clearly nonsense.


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    #45
    buffalo
    Registered Users Posts: 8,065 ✭✭✭buffalo


    stetyrrell wrote: »
    I'd assume he's talking about Bertie having some sort of preferred pressure rating that he insists on every stage. I'd say for most of them they just let the mechanic do the job and once it feels right during the warm ups etc it's fine for them.

    I'd have a preferred pressure for every stage. How bumpy is the road, how wet is it, how fat am I today... all factors to be taken into account. I'm surprised Roche, and indeed all riders at his level, doesn't do the same.


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    #46
    buffalo
    Registered Users Posts: 8,065 ✭✭✭buffalo


    Dan: http://www.irishtimes.com/sport/other-sports/dan-martin-diary-final-day-when-i-look-back-there-were-really-many-good-memories-1.1470701

    Love his, and Garmin's, style:
    We had a lot of fun racing that day . . .we were racing like juniors again, with tactics thrown completely out the window.


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    #47
    godtabh
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 23,211 Mod ✭✭✭✭godtabh


    buffalo wrote: »
    I'd have a preferred pressure for every stage. How bumpy is the road, how wet is it, how fat am I today... all factors to be taken into account. I'm surprised Roche, and indeed all riders at his level, doesn't do the same.

    As I've said many times before its things like this that are the difference of him being an average grand tour cyclist and a contender.

    If he recovers properly we may see what he has learned in the Veulta in a couple of weeks.

    I'll still cheer him on regardless


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    #48
    mcgratheoin
    Registered Users Posts: 1,461 ✭✭✭mcgratheoin


    godtabh wrote: »
    As I've said many times before its things like this that are the difference of him being an average grand tour cyclist and a contender.

    Possibly true, but is it just me or does Nico get a harder time than Dan over stuff like this? I know Dan has won a lot in the last few years, but imagine the response if Nico was to say that he refused to train at altitude because he wouldn't be happy there.


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    #49
    buffalo
    Registered Users Posts: 8,065 ✭✭✭buffalo


    mcgratheoin wrote: »
    Possibly true, but is it just me or does Nico get a harder time than Dan over stuff like this? I know Dan has won a lot in the last few years, but imagine the response if Nico was to say that he refused to train at altitude because he wouldn't be happy there.

    That's probably true (about Nico getting a harder time), but Roche has been ProTour level for longer, and was a team leader, and - leaving physical ability aside - should be expected therefore to be more capable and experienced than Martin.

    Or perhaps because Roche has been writing his diary for so long, we all know his flaws and his mistakes that he openly admits, where we haven't gotten a glimpse of that side of Martin as much.

    As for Martin not training at altitude - whatever he's doing at the moment is working for him, so why should he change it?


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    #50
    TinyExplosions
    Registered Users Posts: 6,860 ✭✭✭TinyExplosions


    goose06 wrote: »
    He's still better than anyone on this forum will probably ever be so why not just enjoy having him riding the grand tours and let us all live in hope that he'll pull one out of the bag one of these days.

    I really hoped it was a given that I accept he's better than all of us, but that doesn't change the point of my post. For a pro rider, he's average at best. It's fine enjoying watching him at grand tours etc, but it seems like every year it's 'going to be his year' and there seems to be a mad rush of blood to the head that inflates his chances of results
    ford2600 wrote: »
    He's a very solid professional, honest and hard working.

    Not good enough to compete at very top level, but that is no crime. It's a very high bar.

    And I'm not saying that it is a crime, just that we should maybe lower our expectations and rabid enthusiasm over him -he's just not good enough to be a team leader at the highest levels


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    #51
    godtabh
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 23,211 Mod ✭✭✭✭godtabh


    TinyExplosions wrote: »


    And I'm not saying that it is a crime, just that we should maybe lower our expectations and rabid enthusiasm over him -he's just not good enough to be a team leader at the highest levels

    I dont think our expectations are too far off the mark. This year with his new role people were expecting a stage win. He pushed a break and almost got there.

    No one expects a grand tour one. A top 10 i think is acheivable.


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    #52
    BQQ
    Registered Users Posts: 2,060 ✭✭✭BQQ


    TinyExplosions wrote: »
    For a pro rider, he's average at best.

    While not at the very top level, I'd definitely say he's above average.


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    #53
    TinyExplosions
    Registered Users Posts: 6,860 ✭✭✭TinyExplosions


    BQQ wrote: »
    While not at the very top level, I'd definitely say he's above average.

    A couple of stages in 2nd tier races is not above average palmares.

    A stage in the Tour de l'Avenir, one in GP Internacional Paredes Rota dos Móveis, one in the Tour du Limousin and a Stage in the Tour of Beijing are not particularly impressive results (Irish national titles notwithstanding).

    He's been in the top 10 once out of 10 starts in grand tours... I simple don't see how the expectation is there for him to be anything other than a domestique?


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    #54
    TinyExplosions
    Registered Users Posts: 6,860 ✭✭✭TinyExplosions


    godtabh wrote: »
    This year with his new role people were expecting a stage win.

    Irish people were, I don't know if anyone else was. He didn't really come that close to one, except being in a brreak away for a while.


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    #55
    godtabh
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 23,211 Mod ✭✭✭✭godtabh


    TinyExplosions wrote: »
    Irish people were, I don't know if anyone else was. He didn't really come that close to one, except being in a brreak away for a while.

    Saxo wouldnt have put hom in the break if the didnt think he could


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    #56
    BQQ
    Registered Users Posts: 2,060 ✭✭✭BQQ


    TinyExplosions wrote: »
    A couple of stages in 2nd tier races is not above average palmares.

    A stage in the Tour de l'Avenir, one in GP Internacional Paredes Rota dos Móveis, one in the Tour du Limousin and a Stage in the Tour of Beijing are not particularly impressive results (Irish national titles notwithstanding).

    He's been in the top 10 once out of 10 starts in grand tours... I simple don't see how the expectation is there for him to be anything other than a domestique?

    Maybe we have differing opinions on what "average" constitutes.
    I would say an average pro would never finish in the top 10 in a grand tour.

    I have little doubt, he'd have more stage wins to his name if that had been his aim.
    At AG2R he was always too high up in the G.C to get away in a break.


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