Where's all the Christians on this forum ?

tf19

Where's all the Christians on this forum ?

This forum seems completely dead, and mostly full of non Christians and drive by trolls.

The atheist forum seems to be much busier, with much less trolling going on ?

Rather strange for a country where during the last census 90% claim to be Christian.

How many Christians really have an interest in Christianity and learning / talking about it ?

Zombrex

tf19 wrote: »

Where's all the Christians on this forum ?

This forum seems completely dead, and mostly full of non Christians and drive by trolls.

The atheist forum seems to be much busier, with much less trolling going on ?

Rather strange for a country where during the last census 90% claim to be Christian.

How many Christians really have an interest in Christianity and learning / talking about it ?

A lot of regular Christians have left this forum lately. Why is anyone's guess, theories range from them getting sick of arguing with non-Christians, to atheists causing so much doubt in them that they left to either re-evaluate their faith or shield themselves from such questions.

There used to be a lot of complaints that atheists had taken over this forum but the mods have been very good at restricting common themes to a handful of threads, so Christians are really free to discuss what they like. But that hasn't happened. Perhaps there are other online sites that are better suited to Christian discussion and people have left to go there.

Manach

Or that boards.ie is now so large that there are other forums that are as interesting but without the broad and sweeping trollish posters than seem congregate here.

homer911

It seems that every serious question that gets posted is immediately trolled, styming any serious discussion, or indeed its a case of pearls before swine...

I have seriously considered following the biblical path and brushing the dust off my sandals so to speak, but I'm hanging in here in case there is one serious question i can provide a helpful answer for..

tf19

homer911 wrote: »

It seems that every serious question that gets posted is immediately trolled, styming any serious discussion, or indeed its a case of pearls before swine...

I have seriously considered following the biblical path and brushing the dust off my sandals so to speak

I'd forgotten about that important advice.

From what I've seen I think you're right, others probably paid heed to that advice as well, and I think so will I.

Peace.

Benny_Cake

The OP only gave Boards 48 hours before closing his account in disgust. One could be forgiven for thinking he spent time here before.

Anyway, if anyone has any suggestions as to how the forum could be improved, it would be interesting to hear them. In my opinion, a forum covering something as broad as Christianity will always suffer in comparison to sites which focus on smaller subsets of Christians (Catholics, evangelicals, progressive Christians etc). Plus we're fishing from a small (Irish) pool here, though A&A draws a lot of activity (mostly from a relatively small group of committed users), Islam, Buddhism, Paganism and Spirituality don't get much traffic either.

Personally I've tried to make this forum a more welcoming place to any user who is interested in discussing Christianity. If someone is violating the charter, be they Christian or non-Christian, report their ass. Anyway, suggestions are welcomed (the megathreads are going nowhere though)

Zombrex

Benny_Cake wrote: »

The OP only gave Boards 48 hours before closing his account in disgust. One could be forgiven for thinking he spent time here before.

Anyway, if anyone has any suggestions as to how the forum could be improved, it would be interesting to hear them. In my opinion, a forum covering something as broad as Christianity will always suffer in comparison to sites which focus on smaller subsets of Christians (Catholics, evangelicals, progressive Christians etc). Plus we're fishing from a small (Irish) pool here, though A&A draws a lot of activity (mostly from a relatively small group of committed users), Islam, Buddhism, Paganism and Spirituality don't get much traffic either.

Personally I've tried to make this forum a more welcoming place to any user who is interested in discussing Christianity. If someone is violating the charter, be they Christian or non-Christian, report their ass. Anyway, suggestions are welcomed (the megathreads are going nowhere though)

I've always like the idea of a "secular" subform, or "skeptics" subform or what ever you want to call it (bit like they have in the Paranormal forum) where people can discuss issues around Christianity and Christian claims without necessarily having to come from it as a believer.

Any problem with "troll" discussions can be moved/branched into this sub-forum. This gives people a place to argue about things like the believability of the Bible, the existence of an historical Jesus, the dangers of homosexuality, the truth of the Genesis account etc etc leaving the main forum free to discuss Christian topics that are more theological in nature from the context of belief.

My 2 cents

MrPudding

Benny_Cake wrote: »

Personally I've tried to make this forum a more welcoming place to any user who is interested in discussing Christianity. If someone is violating the charter, be they Christian or non-Christian, report their ass. Anyway, suggestions are welcomed (the megathreads are going nowhere though)

Not really sure how to improve things, though Zombrex's suggestion might have some legs.

I can understand why some christians might be put off form posting, but at the same time I think there is great value in discussing these beliefs, and discussing them critically. Perhaps a "mirror" thread might be an option? So where there is a thread started by a christian discussing a particular point, perhaps someone interested in the counterpoint could open a new thread, named in such a way as to identify its purpose, where those interested in discussing, more critically, the points raised in the original thread could do so without derailing the original discussion.

I would be concerned that a sub forum might either end up as somewhere that believers simply did not go. With the mirror threads at least the footfall is kept in one place. I appreciate that it would be more work, administratively, but it would allow those that want a nice friendly discussion about a particular point to have a thread free of us heathen thread wreckers, but at the same time would allow us, and those believers that are interested, somewhere to thrash out some details.

I would also like to say that I find your moderation to be pretty good, all things considered. I did have a bit of a soft spot for Fanny, but as an alternative you will do.

MrP

Fanny Cradock

One of the forums I now frequent over this one has the advantage of -

a) Being smaller. This means it's a tighter community but at the same time it's far more diverse in terms of the range of beliefs from the religious and non-religious.

b) Has a specific sub-forum that allows members to post rants about people, places or things. It sort of like a safety valve.

Doctor DooM

Fanny Cradock wrote: »

One of the forums I now frequent over this one has the advantage of -


b) Has a specific sub-forum that allows members to post rants about people, places or things. It sort of like a safety valve.

Boards has a forum literally called ranting and raving

Fanny Cradock

Thanks. But what I'm talking about is quite specific to this forum. I don't think it would work on Boards, tbh. Didn't mean for it to come across as a suggestion for here.

As for why I personally don't post as much here - my surfing habits have changed over the last while and I now spend a lot less time engaged in forums arguing the toss and more time on a select number of blogs.

Geomy

Benny_Cake wrote: »

The OP only gave Boards 48 hours before closing his account in disgust. One could be forgiven for thinking he spent time here before.

Anyway, if anyone has any suggestions as to how the forum could be improved, it would be interesting to hear them. In my opinion, a forum covering something as broad as Christianity will always suffer in comparison to sites which focused on smaller subsets of Christians (Catholics, evangelicals, progressive Christians etc). Plus we're fishing from a small (Irish) pool here, though A&A draws a lot of activity (mostly from a relatively small group of committed users), Islam, Buddhism, Paganism and Spirituality don't get much traffic either.

Personally I've tried to make this forum a more welcoming place to any user who is interested in discussing Christianity. If someone is violating the charter, be they Christian or non-Christian, report their ass. Anyway, suggestions are welcomed (the megathreads are going nowhere though)

Hi Benny you seem to close down threads before they get a chance to be challenged.

Fanny Cradock

MrPudding wrote: »

I did have a bit of a soft spot for Fanny, but as an alternative you will do.

The phrase "adequately sufficient" springs to mind.

:P

(Sorry Benny just ribbing ya!)

SoulandForm

Benny_Cake wrote: »

The OP only gave Boards 48 hours before closing his account in disgust. One could be forgiven for thinking he spent time here before.

Anyway, if anyone has any suggestions as to how the forum could be improved, it would be interesting to hear them. In my opinion, a forum covering something as broad as Christianity will always suffer in comparison to sites which focus on smaller subsets of Christians (Catholics, evangelicals, progressive Christians etc). Plus we're fishing from a small (Irish) pool here, though A&A draws a lot of activity (mostly from a relatively small group of committed users), Islam, Buddhism, Paganism and Spirituality don't get much traffic either.

Personally I've tried to make this forum a more welcoming place to any user who is interested in discussing Christianity. If someone is violating the charter, be they Christian or non-Christian, report their ass. Anyway, suggestions are welcomed (the megathreads are going nowhere though)

Are you a Christian? Do you actually believe in that humanity need to be saved?

Benny_Cake

SoulandForm wrote: »

Are you a Christian? Do you actually believe in that humanity need to be saved?

I'm not sure what that has to do with positive suggestions on how the forum could be improved? Since I've good reason to be suspicious of what motivates your question, I'm going to leave you hanging in suspense. There is no doctrinal test for posting on or moderating the forum, and I'm pretty sure there has been at least one non-Christian moderator in the past who did a pretty good job.

In any case, if you have an issue with myself or any other moderator, take it to Feedback. This is for positive suggestions on how the forum could be improved.

To everyone else who offered suggestions - thanks, there are some interesting ideas there. I'll try to get to them in the next few days.

SoulandForm

Benny_Cake wrote: »

I'm not sure what that has to do with positive suggestions on how the forum could be improved? Since I've good reason to be suspicious of what motivates your question, I'm going to leave you hanging in suspense. There is no doctrinal test for posting on or moderating the forum, and I'm pretty sure there has been at least one non-Christian moderator in the past who did a pretty good job.

In any case, if you have an issue with myself or any other moderator, take it to Feedback. This is for positive suggestions on how the forum could be improved.

To everyone else who offered suggestions - thanks, there are some interesting ideas there. I'll try to get to them in the next few days.

I will take that as a no.

One of the worst things humanity has to be saved from is homosexuality the loving teaching on you dont allow here.

Benny_Cake

SoulandForm wrote: »

I will take that as a no.

Take it whichever way you like. If you're that curious, it's easy to find everything I've ever posted on Boards. As I said, given that I suspect your motivation in asking the question I'm not going to give you the satisfaction of an answer.

SoulandForm wrote: »

One of the worst things humanity has to be saved from is homosexuality the loving teaching on you dont allow here.

Ah, now we come to it....

It was the "loving teaching" (abusive remarks) that you offered on the megathread that led to you being banned from it, and you're not going to be allowed to pursue the topic here either. Consider yourself banned from this thread as well. If you think you've been treated unfairly, take it to Feedback.

lmaopml

I think it's just the nature of this forum in relation to 'this site' which is quite large and has some pretty cool forums ( I recently fixed my home alarm thanks to the guys on home security etc. and didn't hand out 150euro - so that's cool! ) and also the general and personal interests of the posters drawn here.

I often frequent certain blogs etc. or other sites that might be more oriented towards Christianity - and that's nice, but I also post here when a topic either peeks my interest, or ruffles my feathers, just like anybody else.

You've got to remember when you post here that you are not only posting on a Christianity forum, but also one that is very 'broadly' Christian, and even the Christians will bicker at times. There is an element of drive by posts that one can either ignore or get pee'd off with, but this is an open forum too...so that's part and parcel of it.

I think if you come here you get what you ask for, it's truly a mixed bag of opinions and they are diverse in the extreme - this forum is unique in that way, there are no sheeple, just really strong minded opinions. I think it must be very hard to moderate - hat's off!

They say there are a few things that bring out the worst in people with an opinion, money, politics, and religion - go figure!

There are other forums online, but this one is what it is, and I think it's good to post here and to talk to other people with varying opinions, even if I don't agree, it's good to talk and to gain insight. That's what it's all about. This is the 'mixed' bag forum imo, it's neither the Christianity forum nor the Atheist forum, or the 'Spiritual' forum, it's the 'Religion' forum of boards, because it's where all the venting happens...and most people haven't got a clue what perspective the other is coming from for a while.

I think it would be cool to have a forum for 'Christian minded people' and even sub forums too - ( what fun!!) or even to be allowed to post a thread that had a tag of 'Christian minded responses please' in this one, but I don't know how that would be possible on boards.ie with a broad 'don't be a dick' policy that seems to cover that very broadly and kind of imo in a restricted, but general way.

So it is what it is, and I think it attracts some and not others to interact, but who may find a wealth of information on other forums, and indeed on other parts of this site too. We post here or not, simple really.

ecowise2

Zombrex wrote: »

I've always like the idea of a "secular" subform, or "skeptics" subform or what ever you want to call it (bit like they have in the Paranormal forum) where people can discuss issues around Christianity and Christian claims without necessarily having to come from it as a believer.

Any problem with "troll" discussions can be moved/branched into this sub-forum. This gives people a place to argue about things like the believability of the Bible, the existence of an historical Jesus, the dangers of homosexuality, the truth of the Genesis account etc etc leaving the main forum free to discuss Christian topics that are more theological in nature from the context of belief.

My 2 cents

A version of the above is probably the best suggestion.

Currently, 80% of the threads are about peoples problem with Christianity and are populated in the majority by non Christians, there's no tolerance, room, or space for Christian to Christian talk and exchange of Christian ideas.

This part of the forum charter seems to have been abandoned :

"This forum has the additional purpose of being a point on Boards.ie where Christians may ask other Christians questions about their shared faith. In this regard, Christians should not have to defend their faith from overt or subtle attack."

All time here is seems to be spent repeating the same reply's to the same objections to Christianity over and over and over. The soapboxing just never ends, leaving no gap for any meaningful Christian discussion.

Balanced and truthful criticism of Christianity is helpful, and keeps Christians sharp, but the entire forum now seems to exist for the sole purpose of criticism. Everything else just gets drowned out.

This is not about any particular mod here, they have been trying their best, but perhaps a new approach / rejig is needed, given the posts this forum seems to attract.

It feels much more like after hours here than other forums do, and it's not working.

lmaopml wrote: »

I think it's just the nature of this forum in relation to 'this site' which is quite large and has some pretty cool forums ( I recently fixed my home alarm thanks to the guys on home security etc. and didn't hand out 150euro - so that's cool! ) and also the general and personal interests of the posters drawn here.

I think someone else also used the excuse of the "largeness" of the entire boards site. It doesn't really wash in my opinion. The size of the overall site does not affect the atheist forum for example. Perhaps the Christianity forum should be moved there as a sub-forum ? (Joking) (maybe)


Anyway, good luck with the revamp Benny, we'll help you anyway we can.

Turtwig

I think the problem in general is that boards has a higher proportion of non religious people than devoutly religious. Yes, I know what the Census says but we all know that's a pile of crap.

Also it may just be me but it looks like this forum gets hit with more religious trolls than A&A does?

ecowise2 wrote: »

Perhaps the Christianity forum should be moved [to Atheism&Agnosticism] as a sub-forum ? (Joking) (maybe)

We do have cookies.:D
All are welcome.

ecowise2

Jernal wrote: »

I think the problem in general is that boards has a higher proportion of non religious people than devoutly religious. Yes, I know what the Census says but we all know that's a pile of crap.

Agreed, but you'd think at least 20% of the 80% might be telling the truth.

Jernal wrote: »

Also it may just be me but it looks like this forum gets hit with more religious trolls than A&A does?

I don't know if the trolls are religious or not, could be, or pretty mixed up about what Christianity and/or religion is about. The Atheism forum seems to handle them quite well, they're allowed their say until it starts to be messing and soap boxing.

Jernal wrote: »

We do have cookies.:D
All are welcome.

Chocolate Hob Knobs might just swing it !

Links234

I think the issue is that compared to other faiths or religious forums on boards, Christianity is an incredibly politicized forum where most of the regulars seem to want to discuss political and social issues that are far beyond the remit of discussions on faith. I'm an occaisional poster, but I post almost exclusively within the gay megathread, which seems to be the main topic that many regular christian posters are utterly obsessed with beyond anything else. Most of the time, I cannot even keep up with the regulars, because they seem to be anti-gay on a very, very dedicated level and argue exhaustively about it.

maybe the problem is that so many of the regular christian posters are just one-issue posters with an unhealthy obsession? I know that I wouldn't even be posting here if it wasn't for the amount of anti-gay rhetoric that gets posted that I need to counter, it's ridiculous.

ecowise2

Links234 wrote: »

I think the issue is that compared to other faiths or religious forums on boards, Christianity is an incredibly politicized forum where most of the regulars seem to want to discuss political and social issues that are far beyond the remit of discussions on faith. I'm an occaisional poster, but I post almost exclusively within the gay megathread, which seems to be the main topic that many regular christian posters are utterly obsessed with beyond anything else. Most of the time, I cannot even keep up with the regulars, because they seem to be anti-gay on a very, very dedicated level and argue exhaustively about it.

maybe the problem is that so many of the regular christian posters are just one-issue posters with an unhealthy obsession? I know that I wouldn't even be posting here if it wasn't for the amount of anti-gay rhetoric that gets posted that I need to counter, it's ridiculous.

On the contrary I think you'll find just as many, are in fact non Christians obsessed with the subject, unfortunately some Christian extremists keep feeding them with extremist and inappropriate language. Hence the megathreads were tried, and worked for a while.

The majority of Christians would rather spend their time discussing far more important Christian issues, but there seems to be nowhere to do so, without being trolled, or having to constantly defend their belief. Hence the forum has just turned into a forum for two sets of polarised extremists soap boxing over the top of one another, and as you say only one issue posters seem to stay to shout over the top at one another.

In real life, how could Atheists have a productive conference if Christians were standing up and heckling it every 5 minutes ? Or vice versa how could Christians have a meeting ? That doesn't work in real life, so it's hardly going to work here.

The charter section saying : "This forum has the additional purpose of being a point on Boards.ie where Christians may ask other Christians questions about their shared faith. In this regard, Christians should not have to defend their faith from overt or subtle attack." seems to have been set to one side to facilitate some threads, fair enough, but this now seems to have spread to every single thread, which I don't think works at all.

Balanced and truthful criticism of Christianity is helpful, and keeps Christians sharp, but the entire forum now seems to exist for the sole purpose of criticism and soap boxing between Christians and Non Christians. Everything else just gets drowned out. I don't believe that's what Christians really want from this forum, but if they do fair enough.

Turtwig

Have the [Christian Based replies only] tags been forgotten about? They seemed to be very effective in culling what directions threads would go?

MrPudding

Jernal wrote: »

Have the [Christian Based replies only] tags been forgotten about? They seemed to be very effective in culling what directions threads would go?

They were deemed as not allowable... I think the admins may have had an issue with them.

One thing I don't like about that type of thread is it not possible to address or question anything said in it. So, for example, if there was a thread, for christians only where someone, for example, said that non-religious were inherently evil due to their lack of belief in a god, there could be no response.

Perhaps my idea of mirror threads might be an acceptable way around this. Christian only thread might be allowable if each had a mirror thread. The christian thread could be vigorously and mercilessly moderated, but anyone interested in a more wide ranging debate of that particular topic could use the mirror thread. I suppose it might be roughly analogous to the "Cool vids, pics and link" discussion thread...

MrP

ecowise2

MrPudding wrote: »

One thing I don't like about that type of thread is it not possible to address or question anything said in it. So, for example, if there was a thread, for christians only where someone, for example, said that non-religious were inherently evil due to their lack of belief in a god, there could be no response.

I think modding can take care of calling anyone inherently evil just as well.

I don't like the idea of Christian only threads either, I would not be in favour of them, also because at the end of the day there is no way of telling who's a real Christian and who's pretending to be an extreme Fred Phelps style one to troll a reaction and get fed.

Personally I think a sub forum called something like "Criticism, doubts and queries about Christianity" or suchlike would work well for both Christians and non Christians alike, where beliefs and practices can be both explained / defended and queried / challenged. Leaving the main forum for mostly (but not exclusively) Christian issues. If someone wants to challenge any mainstream belief on forum, e.g. on a thread about in the bible with the tried and trusted "Ah sure the bible is bollocks", instead they can start a "The bible is all bollocks" thread on the sub forum. Any Christians that want to argue with this point of view, and there will be plenty, can then whale away there.

Chances are the sub forum will actually by busier than the main forum, at least until a broader range of posters return. But at least there is some hope of developing a Christian community on the main forum.

MrPudding

ecowise2 wrote: »

I think modding can take care of calling anyone inherently evil just as well.

I don't like the idea of Christian only threads either, I would not be in favour of them, also because at the end of the day there is no way of telling who's a real Christian and who's pretending to be an extreme Fred Phelps style one to troll a reaction and get fed.

Chances are the sub forum will actually by busier than the main forum, at least until a broader range of posters return. But at least there is some hope of developing a Christian community on the main forum.

My suggestion might have been a little too tongue in cheek, but regardless, it is not inconceivable that view or opinion might be posted that needs addressing. Having it in another forum where people may never venture does nothing to highlight the issue there might be with that particular view.

The gay mega-thread is a great example of this. There are a number of christian poster speaking out against the attitude of other christian posters, and I think that is fantastic. If criticism was banished to a sub-forum, or banished completely I think the forum would be much poorer for it.


This would be a main reason why I would prefer a mirror thread. All the traffic is kept in one forum. Additionally, I think it is more likely for people to dip into another thread if it is right there in front of them rather than in a different forum. I would guess many people would not visit the sub-forum, but they may be tempted to duck into the mirrir thread of a topic they are interested in.

MrP

ecowise2

MrPudding wrote: »

My suggestion might have been a little too tongue in cheek, but regardless, it is not inconceivable that view or opinion might be posted that needs addressing. Having it in another forum where people may never venture does nothing to highlight the issue there might be with that particular view.

The gay mega-thread is a great example of this. There are a number of christian poster speaking out against the attitude of other christian posters, and I think that is fantastic. If criticism was banished to a sub-forum, or banished completely I think the forum would be much poorer for it.


This would be a main reason why I would prefer a mirror thread. All the traffic is kept in one forum. Additionally, I think it is more likely for people to dip into another thread if it is right there in front of them rather than in a different forum. I would guess many people would not visit the sub-forum, but they may be tempted to duck into the mirrir thread of a topic they are interested in.

MrP

Do you open a mirror thread for every single thread ? - and banish all criticism to mirror threads ?

You could equally argue Megathreads are banishing criticism to a thread where mainly the extremists on both sides with their mono obsession soapbox and shout over each others heads, and the rest of us can avoid.

I think if you read my post I was pretty clear I don't agree with banishing criticism at all as you call it. Quite the opposite in fact. I know quite a few sub forums that are more popular and heavily used than main forums. A sub forum is not banishing anything. If you think it is, then by all means make the main forum "Criticism, doubts and queries about Christianity" forum and Christianity can have a sub forum for shared Christian faith, where anyone making claims like "all non believers are inherently evil" can be modded, just like anywhere else.

I'm merely trying to find ways where it's easier for moderators to police the following forum charter "This forum has the additional purpose of being a point on Boards.ie where Christians may ask other Christians questions about their shared faith. In this regard, Christians should not have to defend their faith from overt or subtle attack.", this seems to have proved impossible with the present arrangement.

MrPudding

ecowise2 wrote: »

Do you open a mirror thread for every single thread ? - and banish all criticism to mirror threads ?

No, not necessarily. I was thinking where the topics may be more controversial, or, assuming they were allowed, where the thread has a christian only tag.

ecowise2 wrote: »

You could equally argue Megathreads are banishing criticism to a thread where mainly the extremists on both sides with their mono obsession soapbox and shout over each others heads, and the rest of us can avoid.

Yes, you could argue that, and you probably would not be far wrong.

ecowise2 wrote: »

I think if you read my post I was pretty clear I don't agree with banishing criticism at all as you call it. Quite the opposite in fact. I know quite a few sub forums that are more popular and heavily used than main forums. A sub forum is not banishing anything. If you think it is, then by all means make the main forum "Criticism, doubts and queries about Christianity" forum and Christianity can have a sub forum for shared Christian faith, where anyone making claims like "all non believers are inherently evil" can be modded, just like anywhere else.

Meh, I don't really care. Benny asked for suggestions and I gave not. Not really looking for an argument on the topic. And as I said before, the comment about non-believers being evil was tongue in cheek, but please feel free to hold onto that and keep repeating it as if it means something.

ecowise2 wrote: »

I'm merely trying to find ways where it's easier for moderators to police the following forum charter "This forum has the additional purpose of being a point on Boards.ie where Christians may ask other Christians questions about their shared faith. In this regard, Christians should not have to defend their faith from overt or subtle attack.", this seems to have proved impossible with the present arrangement.

So am I.

Right, now I'm off to the gay mega-thread to to post some more of my extremist anti-discrimination views.

MrP

Dades

MrPudding wrote: »

Jernal wrote: »

Have the [Christian Based replies only] tags been forgotten about? They seemed to be very effective in culling what directions threads would go?

They were deemed as not allowable... I think the admins may have had an issue with them.

This has been rejected at the highest level, which is a pity. Personally I feel tags could work. But best to move on on the basis that they ain't gonna happen. (Similarly I don't believe any type of restricted sub-forum will ever be sanctioned).

antiskeptic

Zombrex wrote: »

A lot of regular Christians have left this forum lately. Why is anyone's guess, theories range from them getting sick of arguing with non-Christians, to atheists causing so much doubt in them that they left to either re-evaluate their faith or shield themselves from such questions.

I found that:

- the number of atheists you can debate with whittles down in time, it getting wearisome dealing with the 'old chestnut' objections that prove fodder for entry level participants.

"What about God condoning rape in Numbers?"


- deeper discussions become hard to hold on the rails, the tendency being for them to grow and expand and incorporate side tracks which lead both parties away from the point to hand. The written word has the advantage of being pared and trimmed to tighten meaning but it's a cumbersome means of splitting very necessary hairs. An inordinate amount of time seemed to be spend trying to reel someone back from a miscomprehension made (the fault often lying with the writer) that saw them draw conclusions (and give rebuttal) that shouldn't have been drawn. It's hard to progress forward when there is a large degree of need to backtrack to rectify and clarify progress to date.

The posts inevitably become too-long-to-manage bowls of impossible-to-unravel spaghetti.

There used to be a lot of complaints that atheists had taken over this forum but the mods have been very good at restricting common themes to a handful of threads, so Christians are really free to discuss what they like. But that hasn't happened. Perhaps there are other online sites that are better suited to Christian discussion and people have left to go there.

The C2C side of things seemed take a turn towards all things R.Catholic which, with a few exceptions, seemed to see its proponents approach 'debate' from a "the Magisterium says it, I believe it, that settles it" point of view.


I'm not at any other religion/philosophical forum and wouldn't envisage being so much again. There's unlikely to be anything new under the Sun to be found (what with maybe 10,000 posts over all sites)?

Benny_Cake

Dades wrote: »

This has been rejected at the highest level, which is a pity. Personally I feel tags could work. But best to move on on the basis that they ain't gonna happen. (Similarly I don't believe any type of restricted sub-forum will ever be sanctioned).

A "Christians-only" forum has been ruled out in the past and no bad thing in my view, as it would be pretty much unworkable. I also think tags would work but the powers that be don't support that.

Zombrex wrote: »

Any problem with "troll" discussions can be moved/branched into this sub-forum. This gives people a place to argue about things like the believability of the Bible, the existence of an historical Jesus, the dangers of homosexuality, the truth of the Genesis account etc etc leaving the main forum free to discuss Christian topics that are more theological in nature from the context of belief.

With regard to a Skeptics subforum, what would it offer that isn't provided for by A&A, Humanities, or the Atheism / Existence of God megathread? Genuine question - I'm not opposed to it in principle, and if there is a feeling it would help matters a request could be made for such a forum on Forum Requests. I'd be happy to throw my +1 onto that if the demand was there.

MrPudding wrote: »

I can understand why some christians might be put off form posting, but at the same time I think there is great value in discussing these beliefs, and discussing them critically. Perhaps a "mirror" thread might be an option? So where there is a thread started by a christian discussing a particular point, perhaps someone interested in the counterpoint could open a new thread, named in such a way as to identify its purpose, where those interested in discussing, more critically, the points raised in the original thread could do so without derailing the original discussion.

The idea of mirror threads is an interesting suggestion, although there could well end up be cases of people cross-posting which could get messy quite quickly and be a bit of a PITA to moderate (my problem, not yours!). Worth considering though.

In a sense that is why the megathreads were introduced. Where a lot of posters had a strong opinion about a subject (homosexuality or abortion, for example), they would introduce it into unrelated threads generating something of a flamewar. The megathreads have solved that, but the downside is that it makes it rather more difficult for Christians to have a conversation regarding whether gay marriages should be performed in churches, for example (which I've seen dismissed as irrelevant on a number of occasions on the megathread - it is relevant to many Christians though).

I'm going to try to dig out the reasons as to why tags weren't allowed as I know there was a thread on it. Thanks all for your contributions and I'll try to get back to this in the coming days. Work and the good weather have been conspiring to keep me away from Boards, the latter issue appears to have been solved.

Turtwig

The tags is a pity. The only other I can think of to avoid the more obvious trolls is a soccer forum like access system. Minimum post count required and folks have to apply for access. They also have to reapply after being forum banned. It wouldn't get rid of timesinks but it might make them less inclined to post if there's more effort required for them to be able to post in the Christianity forum.

I'd suggest having well known bible quote paraphrased in the charter but leave out a few key words. Most Christians wouldn't even have to research the quote to know the access words to sends to the mods. That might not cull the Christian trolls though. Maybe a mixture of Non Christian quotes and christian quotes?

That's putting more time and requirements on the mods here though.:(

Fanny Cradock

Benny_Cake wrote: »

I'm going to try to dig out the reasons as to why tags weren't allowed as I know there was a thread on it.

You can PM me if you want to know more.

Sierra 117

Fanny Cradock wrote: »

You can PM me if you want to know more.

That sounds so innocent... and yet sinister at the same time.

Fanny Cradock

Nothing sinister. I happened to moderate the forum around the time in question.







(In reality I just wanted to reminisce about the thrill of wielding the ban-hammer. )

Geomy

Fanny Cradock wrote: »

Nothing sinister. I happened to moderate the forum around the time in question.







(In reality I just wanted to reminisce about the thrill of wielding the ban-hammer. )

If I can remember your moderation it was quite moderate ;-)

Zombrex

Benny_Cake wrote: »

With regard to a Skeptics subforum, what would it offer that isn't provided for by A&A, Humanities, or the Atheism / Existence of God megathread? Genuine question - I'm not opposed to it in principle, and if there is a feeling it would help matters a request could be made for such a forum on Forum Requests. I'd be happy to throw my +1 onto that if the demand was there.

Well it makes sense that the Christianity forum is where you discuss Christianity. For example you could discuss problems with the paranormal in the science forum, but it makes more sense to discuss them in the paranormal forum.

There is plenty to discuss with relation to Christianity that doesn't have to come from the point of view of a believer. All of those issues could be discussed in other forums, but that could be said about any forum really.

Geomy

Zombrex wrote: »

Well it makes sense that the Christianity forum is where you discuss Christianity. For example you could discuss problems with the paranormal in the science forum, but it makes more sense to discuss them in the paranormal forum.
I
There is plenty to discuss with relation to Christianity that doesn't have to come from the point of view of a believer. All of those issues could be discussed in other forums, but that could be said about any forum really.

The thing about the Christianity forum is when you get the better of them or point out flaws and contradictions, a trap is set up and your either banned or the thread fades into history. ..

Benny_Cake

Geomy wrote: »

The thing about the Christianity forum is when you get the better of them or point out flaws and contradictions, a trap is set up and your either banned or the thread fades into history. ..

That's very unfair. On this forum we have a thread dedicated to discussion of atheism and agnosticism that has clocked up nearly 7000 posts, and I'd say that over half those posts were made by non-Christians. If a thread fades into history, it does so because people aren't interested in posting on it. I have neither the time or the inclination to set up elaborate sting operations to trap anyone, and as for bans, they are only handed out for charter violations. Banned users have recourse to Dispute Resolution which can (and do) overturn bans or shorten them.

Geomy

Benny_Cake wrote: »

That's very unfair. On this forum we have a thread dedicated to discussion of atheism and agnosticism that has clocked up nearly 7000 posts, and I'd say that over half those posts were made by non-Christians. If a thread fades into history, it does so because people aren't interested in posting on it. I have neither the time or the inclination to set up elaborate sting operations to trap anyone, and as for bans, they are only handed out for charter violations. Banned users have recourse to Dispute Resolution which can (and do) overturn bans or shorten them.

Well there's always new comers to these boards and not everyone can read through old post's to see if a sisimilar subject or discussion came up previously.

Uninteresting....Yeah maybe your right

And you're right it's not fair the way it goes here, thanks for the reply. ..

lmaopml

Geomy wrote: »

Well there's always new comers to these boards and not everyone can read through old post's to see if a sisimilar subject or discussion came up previously.

It is not unusual on boards.ie to recommend the 'search' facility on any forum about any topic that one may see as brand new - It's there, most likely people recommend it because it avoids the need to go over old territory and inform new posters to a forum that they are not alone, and there is a wealth of information available through the search facility. It's not a rude gesture, but a friendly one.

Uninteresting....Yeah maybe your right

Well quite obviously you are not uninterested, but are very interested and have interests you want to share here on the Christianity forum, so I guess that's the point.

J C

I think that the paucity of Christians on the forum (by this I presume the OP means Christians who openly identify themselves as Christians and defend Christian orthodoxy and beliefs as distinct from lurkers or people who don't identify themselves as Christian) reflects the rarety of such people in society in general.

I have no problem with the ruling that the forum is open to people of all religions and none - Christianity doesn't need 'protection' from argument for its ideas or its mission.
Christianity is the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth ... and its beliefs are therefore capable of defense and analysis by objective and/or logical means.
We go forth to teach all nations, baptising them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit.
This necessarily involves us, as Christians, in conversing (with respect and love) with people who aren't Christian ... even people who are anti-Christian ... and this forum merely reflects this reality.

I welcome the contributions of non-Christians to this forum for many reasons, including the truism that there is no point in always talking to the converted.

Benny_Cake

Mod note: This thread is for feedback and suggestions on how the forum can be improved only. Don't feed the trolls.

tommy2bad

I think the problem is that Christians pretty much agree on the basics, creationists aside, theirs not much to discuss so we end up justifying ourselves to the non believers.
And tbh a lot of the Christians here seem to have a 'our way or the highway' attitude to questions. Yes you'll get an answer but not a discussion. Which is a pity because not everyone is as firm in their faith or as knowledgeable as everyone else.
Hi Fanny, another shippy here!

Onesimus

I don't come here anymore because the place is just run by and even funded by the anti church crowd who are aggressively secular. In any other Christianity forum you can post a simple link to an online petition to do with abortion and not have it snipped or taken down. I say that because I saw some woman or man post it here and just read it. However it's just but one proof of how this is not a Christianity forum but one that is aggressively controlled by a secular force.

I come here only once in a blue moon. Last time I was here was months ago. Don't waste your time with this forum and go elsewhere if your serious about learning Christianity.

Geomy

Onesimus wrote: »

I don't come here anymore because the place is just run by and even funded by the anti church crowd who are aggressively secular. In any other Christianity forum you can post a simple link to an online petition to do with abortion and not have it snipped or taken down. I say that because I saw some woman or man post it here and just read it. However it's just but one proof of how this is not a Christianity forum but one that is aggressively controlled by a secular force.

I come here only once in a blue moon. Last time I was here was months ago. Don't waste your time with this forum and go elsewhere if your serious about learning Christianity.

I think you're right,im better off with my own kind I just had a load of posts deleted and so has so many others had their post's deleted too.

I don't even think the moderator is Christian to be honest :-(

Doctor DooM

Onesimus wrote: »

I don't come here anymore because the place is just run by and even funded by the anti church crowd who are aggressively secular. In any other Christianity forum you can post a simple link to an online petition to do with abortion and not have it snipped or taken down. I say that because I saw some woman or man post it here and just read it. However it's just but one proof of how this is not a Christianity forum but one that is aggressively controlled by a secular force.

I come here only once in a blue moon. Last time I was here was months ago. Don't waste your time with this forum and go elsewhere if your serious about learning Christianity.

Yes, it's terrible the way everyone is allowed have a voice.

Boards has a long standing tradition of taking down petitions/questionaires etc. if they're not from established poster and haven't received permission from the local mod. the place would frankly be unusable and flooded if they didn't. It's nothing to do with religion.

Onesimus

Geomy wrote: »

I think you're right,im better off with my own kind I just had a load of posts deleted and so has so many others had their post's deleted too.

I don't even think the moderator is Christian to be honest :-(

Of course. My advice is to hop over to catholic answers or anywhere but this place. The less Christians who come here the better. And you are right, the mods mostly are not Christian either and are very selective. Just leave and don't come back. Take the cue of the many Christians who don't come here. Last time I was here was months and months ago and mostly out of boredom of the extreme.

See ya

Benny_Cake

Geomy wrote: »

I think you're right,im better off with my own kind I just had a load of posts deleted and so has so many others had their post's deleted too.

I don't even think the moderator is Christian to be honest :-(

Posts were deleted as a result of one particular trollish post which triggered a flurry of replies. If a mod leaves posts up, they're at fault, of they delete them, they're at fault. Can't win I suppose.

The purpose of this year is to facilitate feedback, not to question the faith of other posters. Unless you can actually offer a recommendation of some description, I'd suggest you don't post here.

Benny_Cake

Onesimus wrote: »

Of course. My advice is to hop over to catholic answers or anywhere but this place. The less Christians who come here the better. And you are right, the mods mostly are not Christian either and are very selective. Just leave and don't come back. Take the cue of the many Christians who don't come here. Last time I was here was months and months ago and mostly out of boredom of the extreme.

See ya

It's my view that a Christian forum on a site such as Boards.ie will never be able to compete with the likes of Catholic Answers or Ship of Fools (where I lurk on occasion).

Ultimately it is the posters who define what the forum will be - if more Christians post here then it could only be a good thing. If you don't want to post here that is your perogative but I would hope that with the help of other users,we can improve the overall atmosphere here.