More than one person can't use same Leap Card for DART?

No Pants

When I get on the bus, I can interact with the driver and pay for travel for the missus and I. However, I don't seem to be able to do the same on the DART. Is this correct?

Amirani

No Pants wrote: »

When I get on the bus, I can interact with the driver and pay for travel for the missus and I. However, I don't seem to be able to do the same on the DART. Is this correct?

Same for Luas.

ProudDUB

When you use the Leap card, it is tagged on when you get on the train and tagged off when you get off. That way it knows what to charge you for the journey you have just taken. You can't tag on, and then tag someone else on, as it will confuse the system. You need to buy her her own ticket for the Dart, just as you do on the bus.

coylemj

ProudDUB wrote: »

You need to buy her her own ticket for the Dart, just as you do on the bus.

On the bus you can ask the driver for a ticket for your travelling companion and he/she will issue you with a paper ticket which is deducted from your Leap balance, you can't do that on the Dart or Luas.

AlekSmart

coylemj wrote: »

On the bus you can ask the driver for a ticket for your travelling companion and he/she will issue you with a paper ticket which is deducted from your Leap balance, you can't do that on the Dart or Luas.

The Bus based multiple use facility of Leap is one of it's unsung (and unpublicised) benefits.

It is,to me,almost criminal to see just how little active promotion of Leap is being undertaken.

The easy conversions have now been exhausted,as in the smarter folks have all accquired theirs and are using them.

What is now left is a large surly rump of the usual suspects,who have an inbuilt distrust of everything,allied to a willingness to pay more simply as it gives them something to whinge interminably about.

Leapcard really have their work cut-out now if they are to impact upon this grim grouping.

I would suggest that the only effective way is to now make cash fares FAR more expensive than Leapcard.

Abolish the €1.65 and €2.15 Cash Fares,leaving only €2.40 and €2.80 as Cash alternatives.

Give the reluctant sceptical non-conformists a choice between €1.40/€2.10 Leapcard and €2.40 Cash,that will soon percolate down through their consciousness,although the moaning and whining on LiveLine will be ear splitting.

Currently Leapcard mention some 220,000 Leapcard users,a figure I contend,is well below what it should be.

I regard 400,000 as a viable target figure upon which the NTA should be targetting their marketing drive.

The alternative,as currently favoured,is the soft touch approach,which threatens to see us forever plauged with a 50/50 split in the traditional Irish fencesitting mode.

No Pants

I see the difference between the bus and the others, so why can't I use the card to buy a ticket at the TVM for the other passenger? I have the necessary balance on the card, but now I have to fish for coins to buy a regular ticket too.

On a sidenote, the chap behind the counter in Bayside yesterday was insistent that I couldn't buy a ticket on the bus in the manner described above. Really insistent to the point of getting narky.

devnull

No Pants wrote: »

I see the difference between the bus and the others, so why can't I use the card to buy a ticket at the TVM for the other passenger? I have the necessary balance on the card, but now I have to fish for coins to buy a regular ticket too.

There are obvious revenue protection reasons for it.

Think about the way you enter and leave Irish Rail stations and how this can be abused.

No Pants

devnull wrote: »

There are obvious revenue protection reasons for it.

Think about the way you enter and leave Irish Rail stations and how this can be abused.

Sorry, I'll have to ask you to help me out here. I'll have a card to scan out and she'll have a paper ticket. Just as it is now, only both have been purchased using my leapcard.

Victor

No Pants wrote: »

why can't I use the card to buy a ticket at the TVM for the other passenger?

I'm not sure it is a method that had been contemplated.

On a sidenote, the chap behind the counter in Bayside yesterday was insistent that I couldn't buy a ticket on the bus in the manner described above. Really insistent to the point of getting narky.

It is little known.

bk

I do think it is a good idea to allow the Leap card to be used in the TVM's to buy extra "paper" tickets.

AlekSmart

bk wrote: »

I do think it is a good idea to allow the Leap card to be used in the TVM's to buy extra "paper" tickets.

I'm afraid bk that the OP's issue is not actually with Leapcard itself,which remains THE greatest opportunity for Public Transport Advancement we have seen in decades.

What the OP's situation underlines is the sheer lack of comprehension at the highest levels of the POTENTIAL of LeapCard.

It is as if somebody had installed a fully-fitted modern kitchen into a stone age cave-dwellers abode and then left it to them to operate.....:o

By far and away the most frustrating element for me,as a major beneficiary of the system,is the lack of ownership of LeapCard.

Nobody wants to say they are responsible for it's operation and/or handling operator feedback.

My great fear is that the growing negativity being exhibited by the surly vocal "rump",will threaten the positives which the "Silent" users are experiencing.

Dravokivich

No Pants wrote: »

On a sidenote, the chap behind the counter in Bayside yesterday was insistent that I couldn't buy a ticket on the bus in the manner described above. Really insistent to the point of getting narky.

A lot of what irish rail staff say is to be taken with a grain of salt. Ive seen'em in many stations dismiss their own issues and fob users off to the leap card people. Even for information as simple as tagging off to cancel a fair when a train has been delayed. "No ring leap card they'll refund you." The funny thing is this advice costs Irish rail more money than telling you to simply tag off. But as alek said above, they don't want to appear to have ownership over how its been implemented.

coylemj

No Pants wrote: »

On a sidenote, the chap behind the counter in Bayside yesterday was insistent that I couldn't buy a ticket on the bus in the manner described above. Really insistent to the point of getting narky.

I understand your frustration but what exactly do you hope to achieve in quoting what you can and can't do on a Dublin Bus to a fellow at a Dart station ticket office?

No Pants

Can I add here that I really like the Leap card. Now that I know that I can top up in my local Spar and DART TVMs as well as the Luas TVMs, I don't need to use their website anymore. I deliberately didn't go with the personalised card as I want myself and the missus to be able to share the card. They really should sort out this multiple traveller piece and then I can forget about cash for public transport.

No Pants

coylemj wrote: »

I understand your frustration but what exactly do you hope to achieve in quoting what you can and can't do on a Dublin Bus to a fellow at a Dart station ticket office?

I was illustrating what I was hoping to achieve and why. Nothing more.

AngryLips

Seriously, the IR ticket agent was right to have zero time for you if all you did was waste his time giving out about a little-used feature on Leap that is secondary to the card's entire purpose being unavailable on two out of three service providers in the city. To be honest, I'm not sure why they even allow it on DB given that it undermines the intent to get everyone using their own Leap card. Does the second passenger get charged leap fares or cash fare?

Victor

No Pants wrote: »

I deliberately didn't go with the personalised card as I want myself and the missus to be able to share the card.

You could just get another card and maybe a few spares if you regularly have visitors who wouldn't have them.

AngryLips wrote: »

Does the second passenger get charged leap fares or cash fare?

Second and subsequent passengers are also charged at Leap Card fares.

No Pants

AngryLips wrote: »

Seriously, the IR ticket agent was right to have zero time for you if all you did was waste his time giving out about a little-used feature on Leap that is secondary to the card's entire purpose being unavailable on two out of three service providers in the city. To be honest, I'm not sure why they even allow it on DB given that it undermines the intent to get everyone using their own Leap card. Does the second passenger get charged leap fares or cash fare?

Let me clarify again. No one gave out to anyone. I only approached him because I couldn't see a way to purchase a ticket for a second passenger using the Leap card. I used Dublin Bus as an illustrative example. The only point where it got a bit funny was when the guy said that I couldn't do what I've been doing on Dublin Bus for several months. Then I stopped the interaction, pulled out some coins and bought a second ticket.

I'm not sure how little used this feature is. I see people travelling together all the time. Some of them are bound to have Leap cards and some of them might buy tickets on behalf of others. If Dublin Bus want to go cashless, this should be encouraged.

AlekSmart

AngryLips wrote: »

Seriously, the IR ticket agent was right to have zero time for you if all you did was waste his time giving out about a little-used feature on Leap that is secondary to the card's entire purpose being unavailable on two out of three service providers in the city. To be honest, I'm not sure why they even allow it on DB given that it undermines the intent to get everyone using their own Leap card. Does the second passenger get charged leap fares or cash fare?

Angry Lips,I feel you are missing the central issue here of Leapcards profile being lower than a snakes belly-button amongst those who really would benefit from it.

The multi-fare facility is quite possibly THE most obvious user-friendly aspect of Leapcard (The actual discount remains too low for notivational purposes).

The availability of the Multi-fare actually acts as a stimulant to those,who'se fare is being LeapCarded,with the most commonly heard response in my experience being "Now,That's very handy is'nt it," or "Janey Mary,I never saw one o them before,showus it"....

I would agree with AngryLips that the penetration of Leapcard is far too low in comparison to what it should be,but added functionality such as multi-fare can only be a plus-point.

bigar

In all other cities I know that have a similar card, each is for use of one individual and I think this is logical if you want to use it with the tap on and tap off function. Just buy a Leap Card yourself if you want to use it, it is not that expensive.

LXFlyer

Alek you do bang on about the penetration, but frankly the project is phased and until you get to the point that cash fares become unaffordable, many people will just not switch.

More and more users will switch as the additional features go live such as capping, auto top-up, and multi-journey/multi-mode single fares, and certainly far more regular passengers will switch when the period passes are added to the card.

That is not going to happen overnight, but rather over a period of several years, as the various phases are rolled out. Better to do things gradually and sort out the problems with each phase than have a Big Bang and then potentially total chaos!

This process is planned out - and converting every ticket and every user all at once was never the plan. Slowly slowly catchee Monkey!!

AlekSmart

lxflyer wrote: »

Alek you do bang on about the penetration, but frankly the project is phased and until you get to the point that cash fares become unaffordable, many people will just not switch.

More and more users will switch as the additional features go live such as capping, auto top-up, and multi-journey/multi-mode single fares, and certainly far more regular passengers will switch when the period passes are added to the card.

That is not going to happen overnight, but rather over a period of several years, as the various phases are rolled out. Better to do things gradually and sort out the problems with each phase than have a Big Bang and then potentially total chaos!

This process is planned out - and converting every ticket and every user all at once was never the plan. Slowly slowly catchee Monkey!!

Lx,you do bang on about the phasing....;)

Sure the introduction of any such system has to be phased,however the ITS system and its manifestation on earth,Leapcard has had a gestation period to rival a wooly mammoth.

I'm not suggesting a BIG BANG,but I sure as hell would have preferred something a tad louder than the squib which Leapcard has turned out to be.

For example,I'm now getting a fair number of Leapcard users reverting to cash,as their LC is empty....when I enquire about this I'm usually told about the lack of agents and if I recommend Auto Top-Up,the responses tend to be VERY frosty indeed.

The group tasked with devising,constructing and implimenting our Integrated Ticketing System made a balls of it,largely by refusing to rationalize and simplify the constituent fare systems BEFORE superimposing Leapcard onto them.

Instead of Keeping It Simple,the ITS Implimentation Group,embarked upon a campaign of maintaining and encouraging complexity,then expecting Leapcard to continue in that vein.

Doh !!!!!!

bk

Meanwhile in Atlanta they introduced their equivalent of the Leap card 6 years ago and within 6 months they had introduced multiple tickets types on the card, capping and eliminated all cash fares!!

AlekSmart

bk wrote: »

Meanwhile in Atlanta they introduced their equivalent of the Leap card 6 years ago and within 6 months they had introduced multiple tickets types on the card, capping and eliminated all cash fares!!

WHAT..!....Nah,not possible...where's your PROOF !!!

Them darn Yanks may well have gotten to the moon,but the sheer complexity of re-integrating a Public Transport Ticketing System,requires far more time and dedication.....:)

Karen23

My Son has a leap card he uses for school. We're going out on Saturday and taking the bus with the two kids, can my son use his leap card and then pass it to my daughter for her to use as well. I'm not sure what the rules are around this but as we're still paying for her when the balance comes off his card I can't see that there will be a problem.

Dravokivich

Karen23 wrote: »

My Son has a leap card he uses for school. We're going out on Saturday and taking the bus with the two kids, can my son use his leap card and then pass it to my daughter for her to use as well. I'm not sure what the rules are around this but as we're still paying for her when the balance comes off his card I can't see that there will be a problem.

If your daughter is valid for child fares his card should be able to also purchase a companion ticket, once there is enough credit. The driver will print out a ticket for the additional fare. Theres no way to have multiple people just using tagging on unless youve an adult card with a family ticket.

Losty Dublin

Karen23 wrote: »

My Son has a leap card he uses for school. We're going out on Saturday and taking the bus with the two kids, can my son use his leap card and then pass it to my daughter for her to use as well. I'm not sure what the rules are around this but as we're still paying for her when the balance comes off his card I can't see that there will be a problem.

It depends on what sort of Leapcard your son uses. If it is a personalised card then the answer is no as the card is unique to him; if it is an under 12 card then the answer is yes as the card isn't ID tied to one user. If in doubt, ask the driver or pay cash for her.

Bear in mind that school flat fares don't apply on Saturday's after 13:30.

LXFlyer

If you are all going out together it may be worth loading a one day family rambler ticket onto your LEAP card, it costs €12.65 and is valid for 2 adults and up to 4 children, and offers unlimited travel for you all on Dublin Bus.

You can load the ticket at any payzone agent.

Dravokivich

Losty Dublin wrote: »

It depends on what sort of Leapcard your son uses. If it is a personalised card then the answer is no as the card is unique to him; if it is an under 12 card then the answer is yes as the card isn't ID tied to one user. If in doubt, ask the driver or pay cash for her.

Bear in mind that school flat fares don't apply on Saturday's after 13:30.

They cant both touch on with it. They'll need to purchase a companion ticket. Doesnt matter if its personalised as long as she is valid for child fares.

Losty Dublin

Dravokivich wrote: »

They cant both touch on with it. They'll need to purchase a companion ticket. Doesnt matter if its personalised as long as she is valid for child fares.

I double checked this and I was half right and half wrong. Leaps T+C state that it is one passenger per card per journey. The personalised card can't be used by anybody else; an ordinary card is.

Dravokivich

Losty Dublin wrote: »

I double checked this and I was half right and half wrong. Leaps T+C state that it is one passenger per card per journey. The personalised card can't be used by anybody else; an ordinary card is.

You are mixing things up again. The personalised card can be used to purchase extra tickets that are printed out by the driver.

Losty Dublin

Dravokivich wrote: »

You are mixing things up again. The personalised card can be used to purchase extra tickets that are printed out by the driver.

No, you are mixing things up. She asked if her son's leap card could be passed on to somebody else for their own use; I answered her query.

Dravokivich

Losty Dublin wrote: »

No, you are mixing things up. She asked if her son's leap card could be passed on to somebody else for their own use; I answered her query.

Im not, she was asking if both could use it at the same time.

Karen23

Ok, just to clarify it's not a personalised leap card. It's a regular child leap card

afatbollix

Surly you cant buy a load of tickets from one card? It would hit the daily limit after 5 people and you could get the rest of the bus on with out paying anymore?


If a revenue person got on and checked the leap card would they only see one journey or ticket? Would they be able to see the two tickets that were bought if not you would be fined even though you bought two tickets.

L1011

afatbollix wrote: »

Surly you cant buy a load of tickets from one card? It would hit the daily limit after 5 people and you could get the rest of the bus on with out paying anymore?


If a revenue person got on and checked the leap card would they only see one journey or ticket? Would they be able to see the two tickets that were bought if not you would be fined even though you bought two tickets.

Extra tickets don't count towards the cap and are printed on paper from the drivers machine. Only uses the leap to pay.

Dravokivich

Karen23 wrote: »

Ok, just to clarify it's not a personalised leap card. It's a regular child leap card

It doesn't matter. They still both can't use it at the same time.

foggy_lad

Tagging on or using the card reader on the bus you can only use either card(personalised or normal) for one passenger!

Using the drivers leap card reader with either card you can pay for as many other tickets as you want to for other passengers as long as you have enough credit on your card, These extra printed tickets do not count for your daily/weekly cap or any other ticket loaded on the card.

afatbollix

MYOB wrote: »

Extra tickets don't count towards the cap and are printed on paper from the drivers machine. Only uses the leap to pay.

Is the plan in the future to had contactless card payment via debit & credit cards to buy tickets?

L1011

afatbollix wrote: »

Is the plan in the future to had contactless card payment via debit & credit cards to buy tickets?

Not heard for certain in Ireland anyway; that is happening in London.