What Is The Best Value For Money Public Transport

bk

This is a difficult question to answer as it really depends on where you are going.

Ryanair if you get an early cheap ticket is probably one of the best value for money. This weekend I was in Poland for €50 return, that is €0.021 per km!!

The intercity bus services also offer superb value for money at around €0.04 per km

Dublin City Bike service is an absolute steal at just €10 per year!

Walking is obviously the ultimate in cheap travel.

A bike is also fantastic value for money. With the cycle to work scheme it can work out even less.

Bike + Dart for longer distances is pretty good value.

BenShermin

MGWR wrote: »

That's a distance of 1.24 miles. If DB is trying to get more commuters to use the bus versus driving, having the buses jammed up with short-distance passengers (and hence slowing down the bus' average speed in an already-congested city) won't leave a space on board for that market segment.

If anything buses not having double doors and very slow Leap card response times from the drivers ticket machine are more responsible for slowing down average speeds. On the cross city routes especially you have many people boarding and alighting at each of the city centre stops, one or two city centre fare users isn't going to slow things down too much in the grand scheme of things.

Problems with the 7b could be sorted out if Dublin Bus made some effort to make some buses express only. The farce that is Xpresso shows that the will just isn't there.

Vahevala

bk wrote: »

Of course, but ticket pricing (and bus stops serviced) can be designed to encourage/discourage certain types of travel.

For instance that is why the Luas is relatively expensive for short journeys. To discourage them and instead encourage long distance travel on it.

Typically with public transport systems you want to encourage long distance travel, while instead encouraging people to walk or cycle for short distances.

Safety on the street should be an issue for the Gardai and City Council to solve, not public transport.

Who are you to say how people should travel? If I want to get on for 3 stops and I have a valid ticket, why should I not travel. It is public transport and there for a reason.

Not everyone is fit enough to be able to use a bike or feel comfortable to do so. 50/55 cent to hop around Dublin city centre is a good option for many.

bk

Vahevala wrote: »

Who are you to say how people should travel? If I want to get on for 3 stops and I have a valid ticket, why should I not travel. It is public transport and there for a reason.

Yes and as I said you are fully entitled to do so.

But the people who design and run public transport systems are also entitled to design the system in such a way that is discourages short distance travel.

And discouraging short distance travel is considered best practice in the public transport sector.

Vahevala wrote: »

Not everyone is fit enough to be able to use a bike or feel comfortable to do so. 50/55 cent to hop around Dublin city centre is a good option for many.

Elderly and disabled persons get free travel anyway. Everyone else should be more then capable of walking/cycling.

markpb

Vahevala wrote: »

Who are you to say how people should travel? If I want to get on for 3 stops and I have a valid ticket, why should I not travel. It is public transport and there for a reason.

Save the outrage - he's not saying you shouldn't be allowed, just that it shouldn't be encouraged. If DB want to encourage or discourage custom from a particular type of passenger, they have every right to do so.

Vahevala

bk wrote: »

Yes and as I said you are fully entitled to do so.

But the people who design and run public transport systems are also entitled to design the system in such a way that is discourages short distance travel.

And discouraging short distance travel is considered best practice in the public transport sector.



Elderly and disabled persons get free travel anyway. Everyone else should be more then capable of walking/cycling.

Some doctors may disagree with you. Not everyone will be able to cycle, which is a fact. Don't they say that you should visit your doctor, before embarking on an exercise regime. Not everyone would feel safe (including me) to cycle a bike and don't wish to lose their life doing so..

You may feel well able to ride a bike, other people are not happy doing so, for instance, I find it particularly dangerous and feel vulnerable on a bike, so I think I will stick to my Dublin Bus for the short distances

Tazz T

Pick any date during June Dublin to Stansted with Ryanair at the moment and it's €40 return, which beats Sail & Rail hands down.

BenShermin

Vahevala wrote: »

Some doctors may disagree with you. Not everyone will be able to cycle, which is a fact. Don't they say that you should visit your doctor, before embarking on an exercise regime. Not everyone would feel safe (including me) to cycle a bike and don't wish to lose their life doing so.

Cycling a short distance is not an exercise regime, it's a means of transport. An average of 5,000 trips are taken on a Dublin Bike everyday and none of them trips turn into fatality.

BenShermin

Tazz T wrote: »

Pick any date during June Dublin to Stansted with Ryanair at the moment and it's €40 return, which beats Sail & Rail hands down.

I assume that's also covering your Stansted Express to London and all the luggage you want?

bk

Vahevala wrote: »

Some doctors may disagree with you. Not everyone will be able to cycle, which is a fact. Don't they say that you should visit your doctor, before embarking on an exercise regime. Not everyone would feel safe (including me) to cycle a bike and don't wish to lose their life doing so..

This is advise to people thinking of taking up serious long distance, high speed cycling (or any similar high impact activity or sport).

The Dublin Bus City Fare zone covers an area of only 1.6km

That isn't exercise on a bike, certainly not a Dublin Bike type bike.

It is also only a max 20 minutes walk. Again any able bodied person (remember disabled persons get free travel) should be able to easily do that journey on foot.

Vahevala wrote: »

You may feel well able to ride a bike, other people are not happy doing so, for instance, I find it particularly dangerous and feel vulnerable on a bike, so I think I will stick to my Dublin Bus for the short distances

There hasn't been a single fatal accident on the Dublin City bike scheme. Traffic is slow in the city center, it really isn't dangerous.

Please do keep using the service. All I'm saying is that I wouldn't be surprised when Dublin Bus scrap this cheap fare.

BenShermin

bk wrote: »

There hasn't been a single fatal accident on the Dublin City bike scheme. Traffic is slow in the city center, it really isn't dangerous.

Just reading into this. Unfortunately there was one fatality on Westmoreland Street last year:

http://www.irishtimes.com/news/cyclist-who-died-after-fall-was-not-wearing-helmet-court-told-1.533067

It seems it was one of the few cases where a helmet would have saved his life. If you feel that cycling is dangerous and makes you vunerable then you'd probably have a helmet on. There's also the fact that the cyclist was "not drunk, but not sober". Any cyclist that feels vunerable would not cycle with drink taken regardless. I sum up that this fatality wouldn't have happened to any nervous cyclist.

Vahevala

bk wrote: »

Please do keep using the service. All I'm saying is that I wouldn't be surprised when Dublin Bus scrap this cheap fare.

Don't worry I have a monthly ticket

MGWR

lxflyer wrote: »

Last time I checked, buses are a form of public transport and as such are there for all users no matter how far they're travelling.

I haven't noticed buses being particularly jammed with short distance travellers, but frankly the company is perfectly entitled to try and encourage use from any source

Then the one-to-three-stage fare is actually losing money for the company due to its availability versus actual use and the fact that is an extra accounting item. Even with companies with flat fares, passengers travelling about 1 to 2 miles pay the fare. From the perspective of a passenger, two things sell a bus service aside from a reasonably low fare, those being reasonably high frequency and a reasonably high average speed—in combination.

LXFlyer

The only low short fare journey is for city centre trips. That is hardly going to cause mass havoc.

It was designed so that shoppers could get from one side of the city centre cheaply. I really fail to see the issue here.

devnull

Agree completely, but when I used the bus regularly not long after the CC fare was brought in some drivers refused to issue it as they did not agree with it citing reasons that have been given above.

I'd hope that has been stamped out now since that is not a job of a driver. Have they also made the fare any easier to issue, rather than the few buttons it needs when it could be programmed for one?

BenShermin

lxflyer wrote: »

The only low short fare journey is for city centre trips. That is hardly going to cause mass havoc.

It was designed so that shoppers could get from one side of the city centre cheaply. I really fail to see the issue here.

Have to agree, one or two passengers getting city centre fares isn't going to slow the bus down, especially at off peak times. The real issue here is Dublin Bus's failure to introduce proper express routes at peak times, this would really speed up average journey times for the bread and butter 9 to 5 commuter. These are the people who you need to target to get out of their cars and grow the passenger base.

The best example of this is the minimum fare on the 66/67 routes at peak times to discourage people from Islandbridge and Chapelizod from using the service. Customers can use the 25/26 routes instead.

The worst example is scrapping the 78 route under Network Direct, this was well utilised in the morning and evening rush by Ballyfermot commuters who wished to avoid the James's Street and Kilmainham bottleneck and instead enjoy a quicker North Quay/N4 route home.

bikeman1

The minimum fare to discourage short hop journey on long routes at peak times is not really working anymore. A huge number of passengers now use pre paid cards such as 30 day rambler / travel 90, thus sailing past the driver on a minimum fare bus and then a few minutes into the journey. Ding and up they get!

I have seen this happen a few times on the 42 in the evening peak. Often leaving pax behind because there is no more room. I agree a better service needs to be introduced for such routes.

Cookie_Monster

Vahevala wrote: »

It is public transport, people are entitled to get whatever bus that they choose.

Indeed and with the current fair system they will continue to do so, it's up to DB to put restrictions on to encourage behaviour patterns. My point was simply that those few going a short distance on this particular bus (and many other routes) are actively depriving others of space on the only bus they can get despite there being far far more options for those travelling short distances.

lxflyer wrote: »

And what relevance has that to the city centre fare????

nothing (well 7b operates in the short hop zone too), but it's still relevant to short hop customers blocking longer trips customers from accessing a very limited bus

Vahevala wrote:

Not everyone would feel safe (including me) to cycle a bike and don't wish to lose their life doing so..

Do you feel safe in a car, it's far more dangerous after all...
That safety argument is one of the most ridiculous ones thrown up.

Polar101

Paid 1.45 cents/km on Ryanair two days ago. That is probably better value than my normal commute, which is around 30 cents/km on Dublin Bus (unless I walk).