How do you stop cheating?

tayto lover

Was told of an instance of cheating. Apparently two members of the same family and a friend had the same 3 ball for every stroke competition. They did this by putting themselves down at the same computerised timesheet on the same line for every big competition. They had a high success rate of wins but were poor in club competitions. Someone in the clubhouse watched them play a particular hole and counted the shots of the man who won the competition. The guy put himself down for a 5 when he had a 7 on the particular hole.

To stop this kind of cheating i would suggest that the same players should be mixed up and put out in different company every 3 weeks especially for the bigger stroke play competitions.
The man said he made a legit mistake but was suspended for a month and given a warning.

Any other suggestions.

Ilik Urgee

They all left the club and rejoined elsewhere.
The marker on the green had his back turned to the player while the player hacked twice from the greenside rough, unknowingly to the marker.
The very same comp another member disqualified himself by phone an hour after leaving the course for putting down a wrong score on a hole-he would've won it on countback!

Very true story but it's probably not an isolated incident.

realgolfgeek

club and players should be named and shamed by the GUI

gorfield

Careful now

frost53

What club....

Ilik Urgee

gorfield wrote: »

Careful now

Not saying boo.

Keano

Can they ever stop it? No

Does it bother me? No

Why? If they want to win a voucher or whatever the prize is that bad then off with them. When they buy something with said voucher or look at the prize, they'll always know they cheated to win it!!

kiers47

I know of someone from a nearby club(not my own club) given a 2 (maybe it was 3) year ban from all competitions for cheating. And his marker was given a 1 year ban. People knew he was cheating for years but he was a guard in a nearby town and no one said as they were afraid of him holding a vendetta against them. A month after he retired boom he was found out. (How convenient).
1 of his many ways of cheating was to pick his ball on the green then move in further to repair a pitch mark and drop his marker there. Funny what people will do to have people believe they are better players.

Kevinmarkham

Keano A Legend wrote: »

Why? If they want to win a voucher or whatever the prize is that bad then off with them. When they buy something with said voucher or look at the prize, they'll always know they cheated to win it!!

Sadly, I don't think people see it this way. There are golfers who cheat because they want to win prizes, and there are golfers who cheat who will justify to themselves that "it's not really cheating". Whichever one of these wins the prize won't care whether they cheated or not. Unless people are found out and named it will simply carry on.

stockdam

You can only stop this by mixing up the fourballs. I even saw it in Juvenille competitions where people would blatantly cheat to win and threaten the fourball if they said anything about it.

GreeBo

The ladies club in Grange only allow you to put 2 names on the timesheet (your own +1). This means that there is always someone new on the line and encourages mixing and also discourages people trying this sort of thing.

I reckon a lot of cheating is people innocently not knowing the rules, but there is always a few who will push the boundaries in any scenario.

spacecoyote

Yeah, you're always going to have dubious scoring etc... when they is a prize involved unfortunately.

In my place, the only random pairings done are for the Big Events of the year.

The medals are not included in this, you can play with whoever you want.

Most frustrating ones for me are the guys you see tear up the course in the medals/ GOY qualifying events, who are shooting net 5-6 under in stroke play, then spend the next 3 weeks shooting 8/9 down in a v-par or 20-25 points in a stableford comp. Then suddenly find their form again at the next medal.

What can you do though, its supposed to be a mainly self regulated game of honour, unfortunately there will always be guys who abuse this fact

L.O.F.T

stockdam wrote: »

You can only stop this by mixing up the fourballs

It's a valid point stockdam however the problem then is lads who plan to play together as friends on a weekend for the weekly banter and take in the weekly comp can't. You then end up discouraging players from playing in the weekly comps and friends will simply stay off the timesheet and play for the fiver after comp times. The guys you are targeting are not the only ones to suffer even though your intentions are honest.

saintastic

I played in a scratch cup recently at a club that I won't mention and I met one of the members who I know quite well.

I asked how he was playing. He has drifted from 8 to 11, exact being 10.5 and told me how he is hitting the ball really well nowadays. He said that he played on the Saturday in the morning and he said the following to me

"I could have had 40pts, I was hitting the ball that well. But I was playing a matchplay in the afternoon and it was only a sh1tty singles stableford competition. I was rolling the ball up to the hole instead of putting my putts for the last few holes. I didn't want to lose that shot for the afternoon (match). And also, next Saturday is the President's Prize".

I was absolutely shocked that he said this to me. I didn't know what to do. I felt that I should have reported him to the club. He won his matchplay and finished 7th in the President's Prize.

Wichita Lineman

Common problem in many clubs and it's almost impossible to do anything about as it's essentially down to the players own integrity. 'Witnesses' are still very shy about coming forward and informing handicap committee of such instances but thats basically what should be done. There are far too many stories about fella's minding their handicap like that instead of just playing the best that they can every time.

Rikand

saintastic wrote: »

I was absolutely shocked that he said this to me. I didn't know what to do. I felt that I should have reported him to the club. He won his matchplay and finished 7th in the President's Prize.

hearsay and conjecture

or something like that.

He can always say he was just messing with ya, talking sh!te.

big_drive

There are also guys at the other end of things, trying to keep their handicaps low and avoid .1's

I've my suspicions about someone in my club, pretty sure he played in the last monthly medal as I saw him on the course. However his name didn't appear on the results sheet. I think he's not signing into computer before round and if he's score would mean a .1 back he does not enter it after round. If score would get in buffer he enters score. All to try keep handicap low. Of course I could be totally wrong but I must keep an eye on it, think something seems odd about it

Russman

saintastic wrote: »

I was absolutely shocked that he said this to me. I didn't know what to do. I felt that I should have reported him to the club. He won his matchplay and finished 7th in the President's Prize.

Report him for what though ?
Rightly or wrongly this is commonplace in clubs and will never be stamped out as long as human nature exists. Best not to let it interfere with your own enjoyment of the game and console yourself with the fact that the vast, vast majority of people like this aren't good enough to play well on demand, that why they're amateurs.
Plus there's usually an element of "big talk" in saying he could have had 40 pts, chances are he couldn't (in reality).

Russman

big_drive wrote: »

There are also guys at the other end of things, trying to keep their handicaps low and avoid .1's

I've my suspicions about someone in my club, pretty sure he played in the last monthly medal as I saw him on the course. However his name didn't appear on the results sheet. I think he's not signing into computer before round and if he's score would mean a .1 back he does not enter it after round. If score would get in buffer he enters score. All to try keep handicap low. Of course I could be totally wrong but I must keep an eye on it, think something seems odd about it

This has been beaten to death on here. It's a massive problem, guys with artificially low handicaps, not returning cards, effecting the CSS, stopping others qualifying for Championships etc etc. There's no real appetite to deal with it in the GUI (an ex-official I know confirmed as much to me), too much hassle for what it's worth.

Danny dyers double

I'm not a member of a club but would play within a group of 8 friends and we would roughly all be at the same level (20-28 ) HC . And the odd time we might throw a fiver or 10 in the pot for interest .

We all mark our own cards well we did till recently till a certain member of the group was scoring a lot better then he was playing . A few of us noticed this and I said I'd keep an eye on him next round , So after every hole I was ask him his score and I marked it on my own card also , Now this guy was playing off 28 so getting a few shots over most .

Anyway on walk back to the clubhouse we all called out our scores and this guy shouts out 28 , now he was not going win with this score but I at this point was fuming as his real score was 20 . Now I hate cheating in golf it really boils my blood . I didn't say anything to him because I didn't want to start trouble on the day . I know some will say I'm just as bad for not highlighting it to him , but it wasn't the right time .

Over a few pints in the bar I suggested we mark each others cards in future . This guy was out every weekend playing with us up till then but since that day has not being out one , Dirty cheating p....k

Rikand

big_drive wrote: »

There are also guys at the other end of things, trying to keep their handicaps low and avoid .1's

I've my suspicions about someone in my club, pretty sure he played in the last monthly medal as I saw him on the course. However his name didn't appear on the results sheet. I think he's not signing into computer before round and if he's score would mean a .1 back he does not enter it after round. If score would get in buffer he enters score. All to try keep handicap low. Of course I could be totally wrong but I must keep an eye on it, think something seems odd about it

uh-oh! They're onto me!

DeanAustin

Andy Dunne11 wrote: »

Common problem in many clubs and it's almost impossible to do anything about as it's essentially down to the players own integrity. 'Witnesses' are still very shy about coming forward and informing handicap committee of such instances but thats basically what should be done. There are far too many stories about fella's minding their handicap like that instead of just playing the best that they can every time.

I was once approached regarding a playing partner of mine (who I didn't know personally) who was accused of changing his score on the card after I'd signed it. Suspicion was aroused because he said he had one score and then the board showed he had one less.

Looking at the card, a hole had been changed to one stroke lower. I could remember every shot he hit on it and knew he'd changed it (the writing and initials weren't mine). I then remembered that he approached me afterwards and asked me my name pretending that he just wanted to know in case we ran into each other again. It then dawned on me that he couldn't read my signature (it's a scribble) and wanted to initial the change.

Anyway, I signed a statement 100% stating that the card had been altered by someone else and that the individual in question had a score one higher than what was recorded and that he had asked me my name afterwards.

It went nowhere. The committee involved sought legal advice and were told that because no-one had actually seen him change the card, that they were wide open if they took action.

I don't regret what I did, I'd do it again in a heartbeat, but it's a very dodgy situation unless someone is caught 100% red-handed.

Johnny_Fontane

DeanAustin wrote: »

I was once approached regarding a playing partner of mine (who I didn't know personally) who was accused of changing his score on the card after I'd signed it. Suspicion was aroused because he said he had one score and then the board showed he had one less.

Looking at the card, a hole had been changed to one stroke lower. I could remember every shot he hit on it and knew he'd changed it (the writing and initials weren't mine). I then remembered that he approached me afterwards and asked me my name pretending that he just wanted to know in case we ran into each other again. It then dawned on me that he couldn't read my signature (it's a scribble) and wanted to initial the change.

Anyway, I signed a statement 100% stating that the card had been altered by someone else and that the individual in question had a score one higher than what was recorded and that he had asked me my name afterwards.

It went nowhere. The committee involved sought legal advice and were told that because no-one had actually seen him change the card, that they were wide open if they took action.

I don't regret what I did, I'd do it again in a heartbeat, but it's a very dodgy situation unless someone is caught 100% red-handed.

Fair dues to you....this is what people need to do......I havent seen it that blatantly but if I ever do, I will do exactly what the above poster did. and then follow up with the committee. I would also ring the guy directly aswell, midweek to ask him a few questions. Might take five minutes out of my day, but it'd be worth it.

DeanAustin

Johnny_Fontane wrote: »

Fair dues to you....this is what people need to do......I havent seen it that blatantly but if I ever do, I will do exactly what the above poster did. and then follow up with the committee. I would also ring the guy directly aswell, midweek to ask him a few questions. Might take five minutes out of my day, but it'd be worth it.

I did have another instance where a playing partner moved his ball about a foot in front of his marker and I did nothing. I've always regretted that but I suppose it's harder to instigate the accusation than have someone come to you like I did in my original post.

That doesn't make what I did(n't do) right though.

mag

DeanAustin wrote: »

I was once approached regarding a playing partner of mine (who I didn't know personally) who was accused of changing his score on the card after I'd signed it. Suspicion was aroused because he said he had one score and then the board showed he had one less.

Looking at the card, a hole had been changed to one stroke lower. I could remember every shot he hit on it and knew he'd changed it (the writing and initials weren't mine). I then remembered that he approached me afterwards and asked me my name pretending that he just wanted to know in case we ran into each other again. It then dawned on me that he couldn't read my signature (it's a scribble) and wanted to initial the change.

Anyway, I signed a statement 100% stating that the card had been altered by someone else and that the individual in question had a score one higher than what was recorded and that he had asked me my name afterwards.

It went nowhere. The committee involved sought legal advice and were told that because no-one had actually seen him change the card, that they were wide open if they took action.

I don't regret what I did, I'd do it again in a heartbeat, but it's a very dodgy situation unless someone is caught 100% red-handed.

thats a strange one.

theres a pretty well known case of a top amateur golfer doing exactly this (altering their own card after the fact) at one of the provincial tournaments. their playing partner noticed that the score they had posted was less than what was signed for and reported this. the player was given a year ban.

i wonder why the committee in your club couldnt follow the same protocol?

DeanAustin

mag wrote: »

thats a strange one.

theres a pretty well known case of a top amateur golfer doing exactly this (altering their own card after the fact) at one of the provincial tournaments. their playing partner noticed that the score they had posted was less than what was signed for and reported this. the player was given a year ban.

i wonder why the committee in your club couldnt follow the same protocol?

Yeah I would have thought twas open and shut but yer man had the brass neck to insist that he never made the change despite the fact he obviously did.

This gave the club cold feet and when the legal people told them that because he hadn't been caught red handed (and the evidence was circumstantial in a way), they could be sued if they branded him a cheater. Couldn't believe it myself. I've seen the guy since but have never acknowledged him.

GreeBo

You cant really ban someone based on one other persons testimony, if that was the case I could accuse anyone I didnt like and get them banned. There has to be evidence or you are opening the door to legal proceedings and an expensive day out.

Rikand

Video evidence is the only real way to stop it. Irrefutable proof.

Otherwise the cheater can take you for defamation of character and take your house and everything from you.

chud1234

i knew someone who could shoot level par at golf but never once in his life went under 10 of a handicap . he didn't enter captains prize or any of the big club comps . he was on a team and was happy with that . from what I know
people getting on a team and then keeping there handicap for that team is the biggest problem with cheating in golf .

mag

DeanAustin wrote: »

Yeah I would have thought twas open and shut but yer man had the brass neck to insist that he never made the change despite the fact he obviously did.

This gave the club cold feet and when the legal people told them that because he hadn't been caught red handed (and the evidence was circumstantial in a way), they could be sued if they branded him a cheater. Couldn't believe it myself. I've seen the guy since but have never acknowledged him.

were you in a twoball?

DeanAustin

mag wrote: »

were you in a twoball?

3 ball but the third fella was never involved as far as I know and would probably not have remembered what score yer man had on the hole in question anyway.

Either way, with yer man denying he made the change, it made no difference. Unless someone saw him actually change the card, or had solid proof of it, as long as he kept denying it, it didn't matter that we all knew he had cheated.

ssbob

Personally I couldn't live with the cheating....even when playing a few holes on my own, I always record the Golfshot as I had played it.

I would like to think if I ever came across a case of it that I would speak up about it.

Addictedtogolf

I organise and run some big international golf events and have seen some guys cheating such as picking up a ball from off the green and dropping it on the green. One of the other players playing another hole saw this but I did not want to involve him. So when the cheating player returned their 2 ball better ball score card one of the players had scored on 17 of the 18 holes. 46 points.

I went through the card and found 2 incorrect scores, 1 signature missing and some other bits and pieces. Disqualified them on the score card problems.
You can nearly always find a way of disqualifying a player if you really need to as most amateur golfers break a rule playing 18 holes or filling in their card.

The next day I was willing to follow this 2ball for the full 18 holes to see them break a rule of golf as they were only interested in winning how ever they could.

In a recent tournament I had 12 out of 16 first round score cards with mistakes on them. Amazing what you can find when you need to.

Miley Byrne

Addictedtogolf wrote: »

I organise and run some big international golf events and have seen some guys cheating such as picking up a ball from off the green and dropping it on the green. One of the other players playing another hole saw this but I did not want to involve him. So when the cheating player returned their 2 ball better ball score card one of the players had scored on 17 of the 18 holes. 46 points.

I went through the card and found 2 incorrect scores, 1 signature missing and some other bits and pieces. Disqualified them on the score card problems.
You can nearly always find a way of disqualifying a player if you really need to as most amateur golfers break a rule playing 18 holes or filling in their card.

The next day I was willing to follow this 2ball for the full 18 holes to see them break a rule of golf as they were only interested in winning how ever they could.

In a recent tournament I had 12 out of 16 first round score cards with mistakes on them. Amazing what you can find when you need to.

I don't know about this. There might be a mistake in them but not all mistakes can lead to a DQ. Once the card is signed by player & marker (in the appropriate place), once the correct strokes for each hole are on the card and the player's handicap is correct I don't think anything else can result in a DQ.

Date of comp absent, name of comp absent, points wrong, strokes totalled wrongly cannot result in a DQ as far as I know

DeanAustin

denisoc16 wrote: »

I don't know about this. There might be a mistake in them but not all mistakes can lead to a DQ. Once the card is signed by player & marker (in the appropriate place), once the correct strokes for each hole are on the card and the player's handicap is correct I don't think anything else can result in a DQ.

Date of comp absent, name of comp absent, points wrong, strokes totalled wrongly cannot result in a DQ as far as I know

Dunno, I've often had my card handed to me with an unclear number or a number written over another number and/or no initials. And this by fellas you'd expect better from too.

mag

DeanAustin wrote: »

Either way, with yer man denying he made the change, it made no difference. Unless someone saw him actually change the card, or had solid proof of it, as long as he kept denying it, it didn't matter that we all knew he had cheated.

yep, true.
youd need some neck to deny against two playing partners but i guess youd need some neck to be changing your own card in the first place! amazing...

DeanAustin

mag wrote: »

yep, true.
youd need some neck to deny against two playing partners but i guess youd need some neck to be changing your own card in the first place! amazing...

It was incredible. I wanted to smack the arrogant little sod. It was bad enough what he did but how he did it was so underhanded in every way. To then be caught and know he was caught and still not admit it soured me big time.

con___manx1

I ONCE PUT DOWN THE WRONG SCORE ON THE COMPUTER AFTER HANDING IN MY CARD. THE COMPUTER SCORE WENT ON THE MEMBERS BOARD 38 POINTS. I LUCKILY AVOIDED EMBARRASSMENT AS I LOST MY CLASS ON BACK NINE. NO PRIZE THANK GOD. IF I HAD OF GOT A PRIZE I WOULD HAVE OWNED UP STRAIGHT AWAY. THEY SHOULD HAVE CHECKED MY CARD 37 POINTS. GOT CUT FOR MY STUPIDITY

Deise Vu

The players who keep their handicaps down by 'forgetting' the occasional topped shot or bad putt on the grounds that they 'didn't mean it' or 'they are better than that' are just deluded cretins (not excusing it mind). However, I hope there is a special place in the 7th circle of hell for players who maintain high handicaps in order to form dynamite classic teams. Do they even realise that the handicap system is supposed to even things out and there should be no such thing as a 'great' high handicapper?

My most gob-stopping moment of witnessing these clowns in action was a guy, full as a tic, thanking the organisers of one particular well-funded outing on one of our more prestigous courses. He didn't bat an eyelid telling the other 49 teams that they were very proud to have won the competition for the third year in a row!! There was a golf-nerd 2 handicapper on my team. When I inadvertently let out a snort of derision at this news, my team-mate informed me that you would see the same lads winning classics all over the country every other week. I made a point of congratulating the fella afterwards and telling him the odds on one team winning three years in a row were 117,649, a truly unbelievable achievement, I said. He just thanked me but one of his mates did look a little uncomfortable!

mike12

The 6th hole at our club I have seen 6/7 rule breaking drops in the last month. I’m pretty sure 100% are out of pure ignorance of the correct rule. Worse thing is that the whole 4 ball must be as bad as the person actually dropping the ball.
I have see guys dropping the ball on the green when taking relief from a sprinkler as they were no nearer the hole thinking it was fine.
I've seen guys give themselves penalties for moving the ball or marker when replacing/marking their ball because Poulter got a penalty for dropping his ball on his marker which is something different.
Are guys breaking rules that they don't now about and winning prizes any better than the guys who are doing it on purpose? Is ignorance a good enough excuse?

Mike

alxmorgan

mike12 wrote: »

The 6th hole at our club I have seen 6/7 rule breaking drops in the last month. I’m pretty sure 100% are out of pure ignorance of the correct rule. Worse thing is that the whole 4 ball must be as bad as the person actually dropping the ball.
I have see guys dropping the ball on the green when taking relief from a sprinkler as they were no nearer the hole thinking it was fine.
I've seen guys give themselves penalties for moving the ball or marker when replacing/marking their ball because Poulter got a penalty for dropping his ball on his marker which is something different.
Are guys breaking rules that they don't now about and winning prizes any better than the guys who are doing it on purpose? Is ignorance a good enough excuse?

Mike

I hear what you are saying Mike but I do think there is a difference to be fair. That's not excusing ignorance of the rules. But someone changing a score as above is in a different league altogether IMHO.

GreeBo

con___manx1 wrote: »

I ONCE PUT DOWN THE WRONG SCORE ON THE COMPUTER AFTER HANDING IN MY CARD. THE COMPUTER SCORE WENT ON THE MEMBERS BOARD 38 POINTS. I LUCKILY AVOIDED EMBARRASSMENT AS I LOST MY CLASS ON BACK NINE. NO PRIZE THANK GOD. IF I HAD OF GOT A PRIZE I WOULD HAVE OWNED UP STRAIGHT AWAY. THEY SHOULD HAVE CHECKED MY CARD 37 POINTS. GOT CUT FOR MY STUPIDITY

Soooo you cheated?
You got cut for more than you should have yet you did nothing about it?

Also, please dont type in all capitals, its painful to read.

OilBeefHooked2

Deise Vu wrote: »

The players who keep their handicaps down by 'forgetting' the occasional topped shot or bad putt on the grounds that they 'didn't mean it' or 'they are better than that' are just deluded cretins (not excusing it mind). However, I hope there is a special place in the 7th circle of hell for players who maintain high handicaps in order to form dynamite classic teams. Do they even realise that the handicap system is supposed to even things out and there should be no such thing as a 'great' high handicapper?

My most gob-stopping moment of witnessing these clowns in action was a guy, full as a tic, thanking the organisers of one particular well-funded outing on one of our more prestigous courses. He didn't bat an eyelid telling the other 49 teams that they were very proud to have won the competition for the third year in a row!! There was a golf-nerd 2 handicapper on my team. When I inadvertently let out a snort of derision at this news, my team-mate informed me that you would see the same lads winning classics all over the country every other week. I made a point of congratulating the fella afterwards and telling him the odds on one team winning three years in a row were 117,649, a truly unbelievable achievement, I said. He just thanked me but one of his mates did look a little uncomfortable!

One has to wonder, would there be so much cheating if the prizes were not as good, IMO there wouldn't be so in that regard the clubs that provide such "great prizes" for these classic are as much to blame as the handicap minders and afaik the RANDA have very clear guide lines about that.

mike12 wrote: »

The 6th hole at our club I have seen 6/7 rule breaking drops in the last month. I’m pretty sure 100% are out of pure ignorance of the correct rule. Worse thing is that the whole 4 ball must be as bad as the person actually dropping the ball.
I have see guys dropping the ball on the green when taking relief from a sprinkler as they were no nearer the hole thinking it was fine.
I've seen guys give themselves penalties for moving the ball or marker when replacing/marking their ball because Poulter got a penalty for dropping his ball on his marker which is something different.
Are guys breaking rules that they don't now about and winning prizes any better than the guys who are doing it on purpose? Is ignorance a good enough excuse?

Mike

Hi Mike, common sense would say that ignorance of the rules is a defence in certain cases.
Common sense also would say when you see something that you believe to be 100% ignorance of the rules, then if it's appropriate you should voice your opinion there and then, otherwise have a quiet word later in the round or after the round has finished.
Afaik the rule giving free relief and dropping no nearer the hole doesn't make any distinction between rough, fairway and green.

spacecoyote

david-k wrote: »

Hi Mike, common sense would say that ignorance of the rules is a defence in certain cases.
Common sense also would say when you see something that you believe to be 100% ignorance of the rules, then if it's appropriate you should voice your opinion there and then, otherwise have a quiet word later in the round or after the round has finished.
Afaik the rule giving free relief and dropping no nearer the hole doesn't make any distinction between rough, fairway and green.

I'm suffering from a bit of ambiguity here on this. Was playing earlier in the year when there was lift clean & drop in the rough in play. I'd hit my drive beyond the first cut of rough & just about into the heavy rough.

I marked my ball, lifted & dropped back into the heavy stuff, but after hacking out my playing partner said as I was within 6 inches of the first cut I could have dropped there & improved my lie.

Anyone know what the official rule is for that as it sounded a bit dubious to me?

OilBeefHooked2

spacecoyote wrote: »

I'm suffering from a bit of ambiguity here on this. Was playing earlier in the year when there was lift clean & drop in the rough in play. I'd hit my drive beyond the first cut of rough & just about into the heavy rough.

I marked my ball, lifted & dropped back into the heavy stuff, but after hacking out my playing partner said as I was within 6 inches of the first cut I could have dropped there & improved my lie.

Anyone know what the official rule is for that as it sounded a bit dubious to me?

You were right, you have to drop as close as possible to where the ball came to rest, in your example if that was in the long stuff then dropping in the lighter rough would be an abuse of the rule.

Russman

Was it lift, clean and drop within one clublength though ?

spacecoyote

Russman wrote: »

Was it lift, clean and drop within one clublength though ?

Yeah, was within a club length allowed, I just wasn't sure if you can improve your lie in that way even with a lift & drop, ie, if I was in 1st cut but 6 inches from fairway, can I technically drop it in the fairway?

Russman

spacecoyote wrote: »

Yeah, was within a club length allowed, I just wasn't sure if you can improve your lie in that way even with a lift & drop, ie, if I was in 1st cut but 6 inches from fairway, can I technically drop it in the fairway?

I think if one clublength not nearer the hole gets you back to the fairway that's your good luck. Can't think why not, but open to correction.

tayto lover

Russman wrote: »

I think if one clublength not nearer the hole gets you back to the fairway that's your good luck. Can't think why not, but open to correction.

That's correct. Some rules help you.

Barnaboy

IMHO the most abused rule is where people take a drop after entering a water hazard. The amount of times I've seen drops well back from the edge despite presence of red stakes and generous interpretations of the point of entry...

For the record I do pull people up on it- even during casual games!

OilBeefHooked2

Russman wrote: »

Was it lift, clean and drop within one clublength though ?

spacecoyote wrote: »

Yeah, was within a club length allowed, I just wasn't sure if you can improve your lie in that way even with a lift & drop, ie, if I was in 1st cut but 6 inches from fairway, can I technically drop it in the fairway?

Are ye sure?, because I thought they did away with that years ago and replaced it with the worded "as near as possible", because some fellas were taking the piss.