Starting to teach kettlebell classes

ChangeNeeded

I am thinking of starting to run kettlebell classes two evenings a week as a way to earn an extra few bob. I do not currently have a kettlebell teaching qualification but I do have a higher certificate in Strength and Conditioning from Setanta College and am currently completing the degree.

I would be greatful if anyone could give me advice on the following:

Kettlebell teaching qualification – I was thinking of just doing the cheapest course possible seeing as I’d consider myself capable of teaching a class as it is due to past coaching experience and my own ability to use kettlebells as well as having attended various different classes before myself. Is this the right way to look at it or is there a gold standard in kettlebell qualifications?

Set Up costs – What sort of overheads does anyone think I would be looking at? There would have to be an initial investment by myself
*how many kettlebells?
A problem I found with one particular kettlebell class that I attended for a few sessions before is that there was an awful lot of the lighter kettlebells that were only suitable for girls starting off and the class did not allow for these same girls progressing in weight. The same was true for fellas.
* How much is reasonable to pay for Kettlebells?
* If it’s a public hall, should I buy mats?
* What sort of insurance cover would I need to get?

Advertising - how do you go about advertising something like this so that you attract paying customers? I can’t imagine that its as simple as putting up a poster and loads of people will just come. The classes I am thinking of setting up are in a small enough sized county with two other people already doing classes but in different locations and a good journey from where I would be starting up.

Is there anything else I might not be thinking of, if there is please don’t hesitate to let me know.

Zamboni

ChangeNeeded wrote: »

Is there anything else I might not be thinking of, if there is please don’t hesitate to let me know.

The Revenue Commissioners.

boxercreations

I go to a kettlebell class regularly - the routine changes weekly and this dictates which kettlebells are used most. Normally I have a 12 or 14 kg for swings, a 10 kg for floor work and an 8kg for arms - most people in my class also use 2 or 3 different kettlebells depending on what we are doing.
For a class of 12 people there is 2 - 16kg kettlebells 2 - 14kg kettlebells 2 - 12kg kettlebells 6 - 10 kg kettlebells 4 - 8kg kettlebells 6 - 6kg kettlebells and 6 - 4kg kettlebells. Plus a couple of people have one of their own.
You would need the cast iron kettlebells and it's a significant outlay. I know some places give discounts on bulk orders but I paid €40 for my own 10kg one. I'm not sure you'd make money trying to just set up and run a KB class on your own. I've seen KB classes on things like groupon for less than €20 for a set of classes as well - so you need to know that you have a market.
You'd need public liabilty insurance - mine was €400 a year (I think I got a quote for €250 after a year) and I used to teach people to make cards, so death by a thousand paper cuts was unlikely - so I'd hazard that KB instructor would be more.

ChangeNeeded

Zamboni wrote: »

The Revenue Commissioners.

Thanks for the reply. I had thought of this I just forgot to include it in my original post. I have not a great knowledge of tax so bear that in mind when you read the statements that follow

I was thinking that because I may have a big outlay on equipment, hall hire etc the result would be that this would help to ensure that I had very little tax to pay the first year?

I also would have thought from an accounting point of view because transactions would be limited as in I would just have to keep account of nightly income and then expenditure that there would not be a whole lot to it?

I am quite likely talking through my arse but hopefully someone more knowledgeable can correct me if I am.

ChangeNeeded

boxercreations wrote: »

I go to a kettlebell class regularly - the routine changes weekly and this dictates which kettlebells are used most. Normally I have a 12 or 14 kg for swings, a 10 kg for floor work and an 8kg for arms - most people in my class also use 2 or 3 different kettlebells depending on what we are doing.
For a class of 12 people there is 2 - 16kg kettlebells 2 - 14kg kettlebells 2 - 12kg kettlebells 6 - 10 kg kettlebells 4 - 8kg kettlebells 6 - 6kg kettlebells and 6 - 4kg kettlebells. Plus a couple of people have one of their own.
You would need the cast iron kettlebells and it's a significant outlay. I know some places give discounts on bulk orders but I paid €40 for my own 10kg one. I'm not sure you'd make money trying to just set up and run a KB class on your own. I've seen KB classes on things like groupon for less than €20 for a set of classes as well - so you need to know that you have a market.
You'd need public liabilty insurance - mine was €400 a year (I think I got a quote for €250 after a year) and I used to teach people to make cards, so death by a thousand paper cuts was unlikely - so I'd hazard that KB instructor would be more.

Thank you for taking the time to reply. Yeah your right I'd imagine that the outlay on kettlebells would be quite large. I also think that I would like to get a few of the bigger sizes from my experience there are not enough heavier ones in classes as the weights go up as the majority of the kettlebells are at the smaller weight.

I'm really just teasing it out at the minute and I am greatful for the replys. I currently have a job but like the rest of the country money is tight. I had it in my head that with a loan from the credit union I could start up a small business that could repay the loan possibly in the first year and give us some extra income in the long run. I like coaching and helping people achieve goals and its something I believe that I am good at.

Zamboni

ChangeNeeded wrote: »

Thanks for the reply. I had thought of this I just forgot to include it in my original post. I have not a great knowledge of tax so bear that in mind when you read the statements that follow

I was thinking that because I may have a big outlay on equipment, hall hire etc the result would be that this would help to ensure that I had very little tax to pay the first year?

I also would have thought from an accounting point of view because transactions would be limited as in I would just have to keep account of nightly income and then expenditure that there would not be a whole lot to it?

I am quite likely talking through my arse but hopefully someone more knowledgeable can correct me if I am.

A lot of people start off small business thinking along these lines.
But they fall into the trap of getting used to the income and leaving the taxman on the long finger resulting in evasion and false declarations.
Best off to start from the start.
Either learn about your obligations or add in the cost of an accountant to advise you.
Pleading ignorance does not fare well.

I have it on good authority that the Revenue Commissioners are currently on a manhunt for personal trainers, yoga instructors, bootcamp operators etc.

boxercreations

ChangeNeeded wrote: »

Thank you for taking the time to reply. Yeah your right I'd imagine that the outlay on kettlebells would be quite large. I also think that I would like to get a few of the bigger sizes from my experience there are not enough heavier ones in classes as the weights go up as the majority of the kettlebells are at the smaller weight.

I'm really just teasing it out at the minute and I am greatful for the replys. I currently have a job but like the rest of the country money is tight. I had it in my head that with a loan from the credit union I could start up a small business that could repay the loan possibly in the first year and give us some extra income in the long run. I like coaching and helping people achieve goals and its something I believe that I am good at.

What you have to remember is people are quite fickle, run with the latest trend type of beings - not long ago you could have spent your money on setting up on zumba classes and now they are virtually non existent.
The trendy crowd have already ploughed through kettlebells, crossfit and trx, and looking for the next fitness craze.
Meanwhile people who want to get fit are willing to try anything - but most join a gym or leisure centre and most are offering free classes as part of the membership.
I am not trying to put you off - just be very aware of who your target markets are. Personally I've seen older women (50 plus to over 70) going to class and they'd prob go again if targeted to them - they are also more likely to have disposable income. Mums and dads need weekend classes (back to back?) - so one of them is home to mind the kids etc
Good Luck with it all and there was ad on Done Deal selling a joblot of kettlebells a couple of months ago - might still be there ....

Will Heffernan

Zamboni wrote: »

A lot of people start off small business thinking along these lines.
But they fall into the trap of getting used to the income and leaving the taxman on the long finger resulting in evasion and false declarations.
Best off to start from the start.
Either learn about your obligations or add in the cost of an accountant to advise you.
Pleading ignorance does not fare well.

I have it on good authority that the Revenue Commissioners are currently on a manhunt for personal trainers, yoga instructors, bootcamp operators etc.

If there was an emoticon for applause...I'd use it.

Hanley

Teaching;
There's a lot of subtle nuances to KB lifting that most people don't get, and most coaches don't teach. Don't assume that just because you use a KB and the movements look like a KB movment should look like that you're doing it right

Tax;
Register with revenue using a TR1 form. First return won't be due until Sept 2014 at this stage due to the year 1 double period allowance

VAT;
Read up on it but given the scope if your ops you're unlikely to cross the threshold

Other;
Expect a shock with insurance. Getting a location that is financially viable will suck. Don't enter a race to the bottom on prices, you might win.

ted1

Zamboni wrote: »

The Revenue Commissioners.

If you going to earn less than 75k a year them they do't need to told , just at the end of the year fill in the any additional income part

Hanley

ted1 wrote: »

If you going to earn less than 75k a year them they do't need to told , just at the end of the year fill in the any additional income part

37.5k for service based biz and you need to register as a sole trader once activity commences.

Edit: and that's "turnover", not profit

Jarren

You must register for Value Added Tax (VAT) if your annual turnover exceeds or is likely to exceed the following annual limits: €75,000 in respect of the supply of goods or €37,500 in respect of the supply of services.

http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/employment/types_of_employment/self_employment/self_employment_as_an_individual.html

Hanley beat me to it

josip

Your significant initial outlay on the kettlebells cannot be accounted for as a business expense entirely in year 1. They have to be depreciated over 6 years.

Also, a doctor acquaintance recently told me that they are seeing a lot of kettlebell related injuries. According to her, the "Give me 3 more!" approach, plus the significant load and often incorrect technique causes a lot of back issues. If that is the case, I suspect your insurance will be high, especially until you get a kettlebell-specific qualification.

ted1

Jarren wrote: »

You must register for Value Added Tax (VAT) if your annual turnover exceeds or is likely to exceed the following annual limits: €75,000 in respect of the supply of goods or €37,500 in respect of the supply of services.

http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/employment/types_of_employment/self_employment/self_employment_as_an_individual.html

Hanley beat me to it

Didn't realise service was treated differently than goods.

ucd.1985

josip wrote: »

Your significant initial outlay on the kettlebells cannot be accounted for as a business expense entirely in year 1. They have to be depreciated over 6 years.

Posts like this are why you should never consider taking tax advice from boards.ie

A deduction must be taken over 8 years.

I recommend you educate yourself on Revenue.ie or seek the help of a professional.

josip

Apologies for the incorrect advice. Ucd, was it ever 6 years? Back in 2000/2001 I wanted to depreciate laptops over 4 years and my accountants told me that unless I made a successful submission to revenue I would have to depreciate over the normal 6 years for capital items.

ChangeNeeded

Hanley wrote: »

Teaching;
There's a lot of subtle nuances to KB lifting that most people don't get, and most coaches don't teach. Don't assume that just because you use a KB and the movements look like a KB movment should look like that you're doing it right

Tax;
Register with revenue using a TR1 form. First return won't be due until Sept 2014 at this stage due to the year 1 double period allowance

VAT;
Read up on it but given the scope if your ops you're unlikely to cross the threshold

Other;
Expect a shock with insurance. Getting a location that is financially viable will suck. Don't enter a race to the bottom on prices, you might win.

Thanks for the advice. When you say "Don't enter a race to the bottom on prices, you might win." Could you expand a little. I presume that you mean don't think only charging a small fee for classes is a good idea?


"There's a lot of subtle nuances to KB lifting that most people don't get, and most coaches don't teach. Don't assume that just because you use a KB and the movements look like a KB movment should look like that you're doing it right "
Do you there is a particular course that is better than others where I could learn the subtle nuances to KB lifting?

ChangeNeeded

Also thanks to everyone that replied regarding tax.

• Does anyone know what sort of rate your charged at, say for argument sake I made €1000 profit over the year, how much of that is taxed?
  
• And regarding insurance has anyone an idea of what I might expect to pay?

Hanley

ChangeNeeded wrote: »

Thanks for the advice. When you say "Don't enter a race to the bottom on prices, you might win." Could you expand a little. I presume that you mean don't think only charging a small fee for classes is a good idea?


"There's a lot of subtle nuances to KB lifting that most people don't get, and most coaches don't teach. Don't assume that just because you use a KB and the movements look like a KB movment should look like that you're doing it right "
Do you there is a particular course that is better than others where I could learn the subtle nuances to KB lifting?

Race to the bottom - you got it. Charge a low rate, get less quality clients who aren't likely to buy in enough to generate the results you need to learn the biz.

Internationally, SFG or RKC seems to be the way to go. I'm doing the SFG this year. Nationally, only LIA have a great weekend course that's priced competitively. Ideally you should learn KB stuff off a KB lifter. Not just done certified bozo.

ChangeNeeded wrote: »

Also thanks to everyone that replied regarding tax.

• Does anyone know what sort of rate your charged at, say for argument sake I made €1000 profit over the year, how much of that is taxed?
  
• And regarding insurance has anyone an idea of what I might expect to pay?

Re tax: 2 bank accounts, transfer 20% of whatever you make monthly to the second one to cover end of year tax. Then after you do all the calcs you'll likely have "free money" since you'll hand over provided.

Re insurance: probs on the €150/year range.

ChangeNeeded

Hanley wrote: »

Re tax: 2 bank accounts, transfer 20% of whatever you make monthly to the second one to cover end of year tax. Then after you do all the calcs you'll likely have "free money" since you'll hand over provided.

Thanks for all your advice, you've be very good to take the time to reply.

Would the fact that I work a 9-5 job and pay tax in that affect the rate of tax I might pay from the a Kettlebell Class?

Hanley

ChangeNeeded wrote: »

Thanks for all your advice, you've be very good to take the time to reply.

Would the fact that I work a 9-5 job and pay tax in that affect the rate of tax I might pay from the a Kettlebell Class?

It depends on whether you've reached your marginal rate and stuff yet (ie depends on how much you're paid in your 9-5). There's a few things to consider, you should seek professional advice to be sure, or even pop a message on the boards accountancy forum.

Revenue.ie is a gold mine for this stuff too if you know where to look

There's actually an open day in LIA on May 18th where you could pick Jay's brains too.