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Conflicting opinions on joining the British Army

  • 22-04-2013 2:15am
    #1
    Registered Users Posts: 1,269 ✭✭✭


    Hi all,
    I'm 19 years old and for the past few months I've been considering applying to the British Army, and to a lesser extent, the Royal Navy, possibly in the summer. I've been focusing mainly on the positives of joining, eg. a good salary, gaining new skills, making new friends, getting to work outdoors, a chance to see the world and just the idea in itself of being a soldier in one of the world's best armies. Most of my family though are opposed to the idea, my parents in particular. Not really for any anti-British reasons, but mainly of the worry of the army mentally destroying me, being singled out for abuse, getting shouted and screamed at, being killed in Afghanistan... I could go on. (Being targeted by the IRA even came into it!) They're only giving negative reasons. My father also told a few stories of people he's worked with who joined the Irish DF and came out mentally destroyed.

    All this has put significant doubt in my head over what I should do, and that joining could turn out to be a very bad idea because all the negative reasons my dad talked about. Looking for some advice on this and also asking any Irish people on here who are/were in the British Army what it was like for them, what they experienced and what they thought of it? Thanks a million in advance.


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Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 5,504 ✭✭✭tac foley


    I'm only half Irish, so I suppose that you could divide the thirty-three years that I spent in the British Army in two.

    Apart from advising you to read back through the thousands of posts from previous and current serving personnel who chose to join the British Amed Forces, and not the Israeli Defence Force [I was only a reservist while doing my three years 'aliyeh' on a kibbutz] I never saw ANY of the things that you describe as being part of the nature of the British Army. Perhaps if I'd stayed in, and risen higher than Lt Col it might have been evident, but I can advise you that having been every rank from Private to Warrant Officer 1st Class, and then 2nd Lt to Lt Col, all I can say is that I must have missed out on the abuse, being singled out, getting picked to get killed - what total sh1te you are being handed here, at second, third or even fourth hand. I, my friend, was the triple definitive 'target' for any abuse that might have been going around - red-headed [ginger], half-Irish and Jewish.

    What happened to me?

    Nothing.

    Getting shouted at and screamed at is part of your basic training - and if you can figure out a valid way of passing on orders under fire in a genteel and refined whisper, please let the Ministry of defence know abut it.

    I hope that the members of this board who are still in - Mornin', All - chime in at this point - I'm off for my morning run.

    I'll look in later to see if anybody else has joined us.

    tac


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,138 ✭✭✭snaps


    You need to have a good read through some of these threads.

    If you want to see the world, play with some big toys, be part of a well oiled team, have people respect you and watch your back, perhaps even have a little fun on the way..........join the navy.

    If you don't fancy all that and a bit (a lot of hard graft) then don't join.

    I know lots of irish people in various British forces and security forces, had their doubts, but they haven't looked back since. Its hard to get them back here for holidays as they've settled in so well with their "new family"


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,269 ✭✭✭Garzard


    To start off, thanks lads for the replies!
    tac foley wrote: »
    I never saw ANY of the things that you describe as being part of the nature
    of the British Army. All I can say is that I must have missed out
    on the abuse, being singled out, getting picked to get killed
    - what total sh1te you are being handed here

    I thought so myself. I was even told to ignore what the BA Website says, as according to my parents, they'll try and reel you in by making it look like a brilliant job, and the reality is getting abuse, being bullied, being turned into a robot, blah blah blah. I was fairly annoyed at such a negative attitude.
    Getting shouted at and screamed at is part of your basic
    training -
    and if you can figure out a valid way of passing on orders
    under fire in a genteel and refined whisper, please let the Ministry of defence
    know abut it.

    Are you saying most of this ends after finishing basic training?


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,504 ✭✭✭tac foley


    Garzard wrote: »
    To start off, thanks lads for the replies!



    I thought so myself. I was even told to ignore what the BA Website says, as according to my parents, they'll try and reel you in by making it look like a brilliant job, and the reality is getting abuse, being bullied, being turned into a robot, blah blah blah. I was fairly annoyed at such a negative attitude.



    Are you saying most of this ends after finishing basic training?

    Obviously not if you are in the infantry or gunners or engineers where there is a LOT of shouting going on, simply to make yourself heard above the noise - most things military are quite noisy, y'know - bangs, booms, rattles, that kind of thing. If you join the infantry then you can bet that it's going to be rather noisy, mainly emanating from the tools you are using at the time. Sorry, can't be helped. The opposition tend to be rather noisy with their equipment, and the Air Force who come and help out somewhat have habit of dropping large amounts of serious noise-making devices, often to a place near you. So if you are allergic to noise in large amounts, then perhaps a quieter occupation might suit you better.

    Anyhow, if you've ever watched Army foot drill on the TV, or the Trooping the Colour, or any parade on Ireland's National Day, for instance, you'll have realised that much that goes on in the Teeth Arms of the military tends to be accompanied by shouting - the senior person shouting at the junior ones. This is not intended to be insulting or demeaning in any way, simply the way that orders are given to a large bunch of people at once.

    Do you actually have an overly-sensitive hearing problem?

    As for THIS - 'I was even told to ignore what the BA Website says, as according to my parents, they'll try and reel you in by making it look like a brilliant job, and the reality is getting abuse, being bullied, being turned into a robot, blah blah blah.'

    I'm very glad that you have your own mind made up that, whilst not wishing to undermine your parents in any way - after all, you are their child and they care about you - I earnestly suggest that you read some of the posts here about folks who have done what you are thinking about doing, and not rely on second-hand rumours. Of course the British Armed Forces are not going to advertise by saying 'Come and join us, and get fecked around 24/7, abused and vilified because you are not English, sent out armed only with your blunt spoon to take on a thousand screaming dervishes because you're one of those hated scumbag paddies who come over here and steal our jobs and wimmin...' What total garbage.

    My dad, as a young man, had an interesting career involving the explosive demolition of crown property - a very popular occupation at that time, and had the good sense to pass on his experiences to me, as well as his good Irish name. He had subsequently joined the FSA, and went through the Civil War hoping that he would never meet his older brother, who held 'the other' view of the Treaty. So when I told him that I was going to join the Army in UK, and not in Canada or Ireland, what did he say to me except wish me good luck and wave me off.

    And when I got to the basic training depot, way back in late 1967, did being even partly-Irish get used as an excuse to bad treatment? Did a training corporal scream at me 'Oi, you, you half-Irish $£^&£**&, get your half-Irish ass over here, NOW!!!' Did I ever get called Paddy or Mick? Nope. Never happened. Ever.

    And by the way - just under 11% of ALL personnel in the British Army are not British.

    How many non-Irish are there in the PDF?

    tac

    PS - it occures to me, rather belatedy, that you don't actually mean the Israeli Defence Force [IDF], what you mean is the PDF, the Permanent Defence Force of the Republic of Ireland. Sorry 'bout that.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,049 ✭✭✭discus


    I have a lot of time to write this post, as I'm on post-operation leave... No, not from afghan, but from a surgical table :P

    Mate, it was only last night that my dad pointed out something... "From all the ****e that you hear about Irish lads getting treated like ****e, given the ****e jobs, singled out and bullied, you get treated so well". There's very little anti-irish sentiment out there, and the same applies to the British Armed Forces. Before I joined, my parent said the same things - they were worried I'd be singled out to walk across a minefield in afghan day-in, day-out until I was killed, because I would be a paddy in the British Army.
    Obviously not if you are in the infantry or gunners or engineers where there is a LOT of shouting going on, simply to make yourself heard above the noise - most things military are quite noisy, y'know - bangs, booms, rattles, that kind of thing. If you join the infantry then you can bet that it's going to be rather noisy, mainly emanating from the tools you are using at the time. Sorry, can't be helped. The opposition tend to be rather noisy with their equipment, and the Air Force who come and help out somewhat have habit of dropping large amounts of serious noise-making devices, often to a place near you. So if you are allergic to noise in large amounts, then perhaps a quieter occupation might suit you better.

    In my experience so far, in general, the shouting ends once you finish training. Even when I was on the All Arms Commando Course, there was very little. Of course, when you're practising contact drills, or doing battle pt (physical training) there's tons of aggression and shouting, but day to day, when you're working in the hanger or doing phys with your unit, there's little need for anyone to shout unless there's a problem communicating.

    Could I point something out though, you're 19. I'd recommend getting some sort of qualification before you join. Something that'll make you stand out.
    Being targeted by the IRA even came into it!

    Well, your parents have to live with that threat. My parents came around eventually, but were quite scared for some time. I was nearly about to give up on the idea, until they gave me the support.

    All in all, over the space of 4 years, it has changed in my household from my parents attempting to hide up any mail that came that they thought would be army related, to them supporting me 100% once they saw how I loved the job.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 5,504 ✭✭✭tac foley


    Discus - hope you get better soon, bro! Anyhow, a good post, yours, although I DID actually write - 'the senior person shouting at the junior ones. This is not intended to be insulting or demeaning in any way, simply the way that orders are given to a large bunch of people at once.'

    My point was that ORDERS are given in a loud voice, simply to get over the distance and other noises around you. The OP seems fixated on getting shouted at in an insulting manner, or that's how it seems to me. As you and I have pointed out, at length, shouted communications are usual, but not shouted insults.

    Save the grapes, they're not natural, but eat all the health-giving chocolate you can lay your hands on.

    tac


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,232 ✭✭✭neilled


    The Royal Irish WERE the largest regiment in the british army. With the home service battalions stood down, its one of the smallest, and in my mind, potentially one of the more vunerable for the chop.


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,504 ✭✭✭tac foley


    neilled wrote: »
    The Royal Irish WERE the largest regiment in the british army. With the home service battalions stood down, its one of the smallest, and in my mind, potentially one of the more vunerable for the chop.

    :O

    tac


  • Registered Users Posts: 27 ricky_spanish


    currently two thirds of the way through RM training , 99% have no problem with the irish .. during my experience in training you ll find lads you just cant click with .. they don't get your humour you don't get theirs etc depending where your from .. people might have a big problem understanding you which is funny but at times wears a bit thin ... the lads are sound and a good laugh but any irish recruit ive spoken to agrees its just not the same as the banter youd have back with lads from your own local area back home because you might not think it but we are different ... im also fortunate enough to have a Cpl hate me and I mean hate me ha due to the fact im irish .. its a fact that you ll get the odd knobber scattered here and there who will take a very personal dislike to lads sometimes justified sometimes not .
    that's the negatives
    have enjoyed training so far , met a lot of sound lads and don't regret my decision at all .. you meet **** in all walks of life you just have to get on with it :)


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,504 ✭✭✭tac foley


    Jock the Scot, Taff the Welshman and Paddy the Irishman. They are all the way through the British Army, more of them than any other ethnicity that includes Tongans, Fijians, Caribbeans of all kinds [the VC Holder Cpl Johnson Beharry is from Grenada], and all shades of Commonwealth and associated nationalities and religions. All in it together, and for each other.

    Patriotism? Naw.

    Queen and Commonwealth? Nope. again.

    All that really matters in the end is the loyalty from you to the others, and back to you.

    23-year old L/Cpl James Ashworth, 1st Bn Grenadier Guards, recently awarded a posthumous Victoria Cross, probably had nothing else but the safety of his fellow soldiers in mind when he threw his body on top of the grenade that killed him. 'Greater love hath no man than this, that he lay down his life for a friend.' Not for his Queen, not even for his country, but for his mates, he gave everything he had, including his entire future.

    tac


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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,269 ✭✭✭Garzard


    Well, your parents have to live with that threat. My parents came around
    eventually, but were quite scared for some time. I was nearly about to give up
    on the idea, until they gave me the support.

    All in all, over the space of 4 years, it has changed in my household from my
    parents attempting to hide up any mail that came that they thought would be army related, to them supporting me 100% once they saw how I loved the job.

    I've heard of it happening. One of the older lads in my college class who I was having a chat with about the idea - his family has quite a bit of military history, this guy applied to the Air Corps as a technician a few times, British Army as well, and also has a brother in the French Foreign Legion. To get to the point, he said his father in 1982 was looking at joining the Ulster Defence Regiment in NI and later recieved a bullet in the post, which put him off the whole idea.

    That was then, but it likely nowadays for the same thing to happen or to be threatened by the IRA for example, or is this said to just to scare people off? I wouldn't have really thought so until the other night when my dad and brother were saying there would a high chance of myself or the family recieving threats. They could have been taking the piss for all I know but it certainly seems unnerving.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4 J12345


    tac foley wrote: »
    Jock the Scot, Taff the Welshman and Paddy the Irishman. They are all the way through the British Army, more of them than any other ethnicity that includes Tongans, Fijians, Caribbeans of all kinds [the VC Holder Cpl Johnson Beharry is from Grenada], and all shades of Commonwealth and associated nationalities and religions. All in it together, and for each other.

    Patriotism? Naw.

    Queen and Commonwealth? Nope. again.

    All that really matters in the end is the loyalty from you to the others, and back to you.

    23-year old L/Cpl James Ashworth, 1st Bn Grenadier Guards, recently awarded a posthumous Victoria Cross, probably had nothing else but the safety of his fellow soldiers in mind when he threw his body on top of the grenade that killed him. 'Greater love hath no man than this, that he lay down his life for a friend.' Not for his Queen, not even for his country, but for his mates, he gave everything he had, including his entire future.

    tac

    Didn't throw himself on a grenade, he was shot in he head posting one. Grenade went off underneath him. I was on the ground that day as I deployed with the Gren Guards on H16. Not taking anything away from what he did, he was a very brave and all round nice guy.

    I've never had any problems, just be a decent guy and you will be fine!


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,319 ✭✭✭JustAThought


    Would you not be concerned about being deployed to Iraq or Afghanistan as will probably happen & being mutilated or maimed? The stats on army amputees are not being recorded "properly" & are not allowed to be reported - & once you are badly injured you are in time typically discharged . From what I was reading the other day most amputees are double or triple limb amputees with genitary & urinary complications. Is this the life you want?
    The help for Heros website has some grim pictures for "reading " on it - along with optimistic stories. All tak about having financial support from this charity has been invaluable as they have no resources. Many of these guys are now discharged from the army and hoping to compete is adapted special sports events. Being shouted at is one thing, but being blown apart, discharged from your job & left with major life restricting & changing injuries with no income or medical support is something totally else.

    Maybe this is what your folks are worried about.


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,786 ✭✭✭munchkin_utd


    A close relative of mine is now with the British Army and has no problems with being Irish.
    It was one of the questions that I had to ask him, as your instinct might tell you there could be a problem, but no, its all good.
    I suppose it helps that the current soldiers are of a generation that didnt grow up through the troubles so dont see the Irish as being at war with the UK.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,269 ✭✭✭Garzard


    Could I point something out though, you're 19. I'd recommend getting some sort of qualification before you join. Something that'll make you stand out.

    I'm aware of this and so have also thought about doing a Mechanics course for a year and apply sometime next year after completing it. Another thing I had in mind was continuing with college for the next 3 or 4 years and in the meantime joining the Reserve Defence Forces to get an idea of what the army is like. My parents suggested this and recommend the RDF supposedly because it's more relaxed and therefore better to start with, and if I'm still interested after a few years, then join the BA. I'd also have good qualifications under my belt.

    It's an idea but I'm aware that there's an embargo on recruitment to the RDF?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 20,297 ✭✭✭✭Jawgap


    tac foley wrote: »
    Jock the Scot, Taff the Welshman and Paddy the Irishman. They are all the way through the British Army, more of them than any other ethnicity that includes Tongans, Fijians, Caribbeans of all kinds [the VC Holder Cpl Johnson Beharry is from Grenada], and all shades of Commonwealth and associated nationalities and religions. All in it together, and for each other.

    Patriotism? Naw.

    Queen and Commonwealth? Nope. again.

    .......

    "Ayo Gurkhali!"

    Can't believe you left out the Gurkhas, between that and being a ginger your posts are being devalued :)


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,504 ✭✭✭tac foley


    Jawgap wrote: »
    "Ayo Gurkhali!"

    Can't believe you left out the Gurkhas, between that and being a ginger your posts are being devalued :)


    Hangs head in abject shame. That's 'former ginger', BTW, apart from a bit around the edge and bits of eyebrow, my hair has faded way at the same rate as my memory.................

    tac, apologising to the entire Brigade of Gurkhas reading this post.


  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 2,688 Mod ✭✭✭✭Morpheus


    mathepac wrote: »
    OP, you might want to view recent Channel 4 and BBC documentaries on the numbers of BA ex-servicemen in prison for serious crimes up to and including murder. One man serving life for murder in Scotland spoke of being discharged but not "de-commissioned" for civilian life.

    I also think it is a mistake to join young as it may shape your outlook on civilian life if the only experience you have as a young adult is military life

    [MOD]
    WARNING TO ALL: Whilst Im not condeming this comment, be very careful here.

    I dont want to start issuing cards or bans for statements that are deemed to be trolling or simply not fact. Dont post any comments here which insinuate a direct link with being in an army and the tendency for violent crime afterwards - unless you use facts , urls, links or articles to back up your opinion / information.
    [/MOD]


  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 2,688 Mod ✭✭✭✭Morpheus


    Well holy God, if that doesn't bate Bannagher. I post a completely innocent well-meaning couple of sentences directed at a young man considering a military life, and I get taken to task because an ex-squaddie becomes defensive and takes my post personally and a mod goes completely OTT.

    No, this is not correct. I did not go OTT. I did not direct my comment straight at you, I did use your post as an example of a sweeping statement which could be mistaken for trolling or which imply certain things like this...
    OP, you might want to view recent Channel 4 and BBC documentaries on the numbers of BA ex-servicemen in prison for serious crimes up to and including murder.

    Unless you were going to the effort of backing it up with some article, link, etc. Thank you for following up like that with links, which allow intelligent discussion and debate rather than name calling and banning.

    As for my going OTT... Moderation is not an easy job, if you have an issue with how we moderate the forum and wish to dicuss it, please feel free to read the charter, then to pm me or to go follow due process to make a complaint about me.

    Next unfounded comment (publicly) about a Mod, by anyone - and they will be... "moderated". Play nice.

    There is reasonable ground to discuss the numbers of soldiers in any country currently within the prison system of that country and I for one would be interested to know the stats on ex military here in prison also, I will split the thread now to move all relevant prison related posts to a new thread as we are way off topic.


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,504 ✭✭✭tac foley


    J12345 wrote: »
    Didn't throw himself on a grenade, he was shot in he head posting one. Grenade went off underneath him. I was on the ground that day as I deployed with the Gren Guards on H16. Not taking anything away from what he did, he was a very brave and all round nice guy.

    I've never had any problems, just be a decent guy and you will be fine!

    Ah, misinformation abounds. I live not far away from his former home, and our gun club is situated in that county. I've suggested that we dedicate the new range building in his memory and the committee are giving it some consideration. Quite a few of us in the club are either serving or former serving personnel in one of the three Armed Forces - so it seems a good plan.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 7,752 ✭✭✭pablomakaveli


    Going to weigh in here with my two cents.

    OP if its what you want to do go for it. My parents were pretty angry when i first told them of my intent to join the BA. More out of fear of me being killed in Afghan than anything. But when they saw that i was determined to do it and that i really wanted it they came round and fully supported me. Having them come over for my pass out parade from Phase 1 and see me all kitted out in my 2's for the first time gave me an immense feeling of pride.

    As for being Irish in the BA you will get slagged a lot especially if your not in a Irish reg but its only ever good natured banter and you give back as much as you get. In a way i find people might take the piss out of my accent a lot but i find people tend to be nicer to me as well for it. The army takes discrimination very seriously and if someone is genuinely discriminating against someone than they can get into very serious trouble.

    As for the job itself its not as glamorous as its sometimes made out to be. It can be very boring and crappy sometimes and there are somedays i hate the job. But when its good its great. Ive gotten to travel and see new places. Met people from lots of different places and backgrounds. And ive done and experienced stuff id never get to do in civvy street. (Just yesterday i got to get winched onto a Seaking helicopter and got taken for a ride on it while standing by the open door looking out as we flew around). I feel ive lived more in the last year since i joined than i had in the 5 years previous to that.

    I hope this helps with your decision.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,269 ✭✭✭Garzard


    I want to ask again about this supposed IRA threat - is this just said to scare people out of joining the British military or is there more to it than that?


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 698 ✭✭✭belcampprisoner


    why would you want to go and die in Afghanistan etc,you don't get any usefull training,most troops around the world are unemployable
    wages are crap as are pensions


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,049 ✭✭✭discus


    why would you want to go and die in Afghanistan etc,you don't get any usefull training,most troops around the world are unemployable
    wages are crap as are pensions

    All based on your first hand experience,right?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 7,752 ✭✭✭pablomakaveli


    Garzard wrote: »
    I want to ask again about this supposed IRA threat - is this just said to scare people out of joining the British military or is there more to it than that?

    There is a threat of course. Just look at the recent plot to kill a Limerick lad in the BA. However that came about due to poor personal security. (I believe he got a friend request from an IRA member on facebook and accepted them and was posting his plans for home on facebook)

    Provided you look after your own personal security you'll be fine. Only my family and close friends back home know what i do for a living. I just tell strangers a lie if they ask me what i do for a living.


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,504 ✭✭✭tac foley


    why would you want to go and die in Afghanistan etc,you don't get any usefull training,most troops around the world are unemployable wages are crap as are pensions


    ...and you were in.........................uh, what, exactly?

    tac


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,269 ✭✭✭Garzard


    There is a threat of course. Just look at the recent plot to kill a Limerick lad in the BA. However that came about due to poor personal security. (I believe he got a friend request from an IRA member on facebook and accepted them and was posting his plans for home on facebook)

    Provided you look after your own personal security you'll be fine. Only my family and close friends back home know what i do for a living. I just tell strangers a lie if they ask me what i do for a living.

    So then it's just a matter of being careful of who you decide to tell, who you add on Facebook / Twitter etc and not sharing where you work on these sites? Though what's the deal if let's say the worst should happen and a soldier or their family recieves threats?

    I think it's genuinely sad in this day and age that an Irish person in the BA should have to duck and dive at home about what they do for a living, even when dealing with hardline republicans. I remember seeing this in the paper back in January: http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/dissidents-issue-chilling-threat-to-irish-in-the-british-army-28955163.html :(


  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 2,688 Mod ✭✭✭✭Morpheus


    [MOD]Keep comments civil and do not feed trolls, warning already issued to one person for trolling. [/MOD]


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,504 ✭✭✭tac foley


    Garzard wrote: »
    So then it's just a matter of being careful of who you decide to tell, who you add on Facebook / Twitter etc and not sharing where you work on these sites? Though what's the deal if let's say the worst should happen and a soldier or their family recieves threats?

    I think it's genuinely sad in this day and age that an Irish person in the BA should have to duck and dive at home about what they do for a living, even when dealing with hardline republicans. I remember seeing this in the paper back in January: http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/dissidents-issue-chilling-threat-to-irish-in-the-british-army-28955163.html :(

    Y'see, it's the sight of public 'parades' like this, made up of members of a proscribed paramilitary organisation held responsible for the most appalling atrocities and, from the banner being carried behind them, openly sponsored by one of your foremost Irish political parties, that put many people of my acquaintance off from ever visiting the RoI.

    It's rather like seeing a 'parade' of another terrorist organisation, ETA, being sponsored and accompanied by banner-carrying members of the Spanish Labour Party.

    THIS is the most appalling aspect of the whole shameful little episode, that it takes place EVERY year in January -

    Quote - 'Officers kept a close watch on participants of the Republican Sinn Fein parade through Limerick before the threat was made at the cemetery.

    They gathered initially at Bedford Row in the city at 2pm and were led by a piper and nine men in paramilitary uniform through the city centre.

    Participants marched along Henry Street, Sarsfield Street, William Street, Mulgrave Street and on to the cemetery.

    The event takes place each January and is closely monitored by gardai [sic]. End qiote.

    And the Gardaí keeping a close watch......? In other words, showing complicity by not arresting the 'parade participants'.

    Right. :mad:

    tac


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 20,297 ✭✭✭✭Jawgap


    ....... I just tell strangers a lie if they ask me what i do for a living.

    How do you explain the haircut?:D


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