fire brigade charges

celtictiger32

ok not sure where to put this so AH it is.

for a brief back story; her indoors had her car stolen a few weeks back, predictably it ended up burned out. when i rang the emergency services for a fire brigade they told me that someone had called already and one was on the way. they came, fire out, job done.

back to the present; today she received a letter in the post billing her for 500 euro for the above service. i had heard this kind of system was being introduced for people who rang the fire service, but didnt think think it was already in place.
how can she get billed when she did not ring for the service? if they contact me, yes i did ring them but as i mentioned they had already received a call and it was that call that brought them out. for starters she wont be paying this bill and i certainly wont either. has anyone else experienced one of these letters and what did they do about it. on a side note wont this discourage people from ringing them in future and attempting to tackle fires on their own....thoughts

MrStuffins

I'm gonna start selling cats for €499 now.

It'll be cheaper to buy one from me than have yours rescued!

Trudiha

Mad idea, will the insurance company pay the bill?

McDermotX

But it was her car that received the service, yes ??

hfallada

Im pretty sure they always charged for the fire services here in Ireland. €500 is very steep for a service paid for by the tax payer considering you didn't do something shut like leave the chip pan on while going to the shop.

I would find out if the insurance company will pay. If not offer them €200 say you can't pay anymore

Airitech

Most counties have some kind of charge for the fire service.

The beneficial owner of the property involved is the always the one billed. They got the benefit of the service.

If they always billed the caller no one would ring the fire service. If your house was on fire or you were unconscious in your car after a car crash you would want someone to ring the fire brigade wouldn't you?

Mint Sauce

McDermotX wrote: »

But it was her car that received the service, yes ??

I;m guessing this was the reason why as well OP, it was yourfriends car that was on fire, so you/they get billed.

I rang the fire brigade a few years ago, for a neighbouring building that was on fire. I'm guessing they got billed, as I didn't, and wouldn't ring, it I thought I would be. Am guessing alot wouldn't ring either, it thats the way the system worked.

B.A._Baracus

Emergency services should be free. Charging people is a joke. We all pay tax... tax funds their budgets ... etc.

Airitech

hfallada wrote: »

Im pretty sure they always charged for the fire services here in Ireland. €500 is very steep for a service paid for by the tax payer considering you didn't do something shut like leave the chip pan on while going to the shop.

I would find out if the insurance company will pay. If not offer them €200 say you can't pay anymore

I'd imagine €500 euro wouldn't cover the full cost of a fire brigade call out. It's still a subsidised service.

Mint Sauce

B.A._Baracus wrote: »

Emergency services should be free. Charging people is a joke. We all pay tax... tax funds their budgets ... etc.

In the UK the council tax covers it. I doubt our new property tax will.

SB2013

B.A._Baracus wrote: »

Emergency services should be free. Charging people is a joke. We all pay tax... tax funds their budgets ... etc.

Unfortunately when they are free they are abused. The ambulance service is more like a taxi service in this country.

Cookie_Monster

just pass it on to your insurance company

celtictiger32

Trudiha wrote: »

Mad idea, will the insurance company pay the bill?

not too sure, hard enough trying to get them to pay up for the car.

McDermotX wrote: »

But it was her car that received the service, yes ??

it was, but she didnt ask for the service, they came due to a call from somebody else. i know if my car is on fire in the future ill be letting it burn, wont be ringing for a 500 quid bill.

btw they also had a price list on the letter in question. most fires were 500, road traffic accidents were i think 650. every extra hour worked out at 450 approx and water and foam etc used on fire was charged per gallon.

humbert

Surely it's the person responsible for the fire that gets billed, not necessarily the owner of the object on fire. Any alternative would be sheer idiocy.

3rdDegree

celtictiger32 wrote: »

not too sure, hard enough trying to get them to pay up for the car.



it was, but she didnt ask for the service, they came due to a call from somebody else. i know if my car is on fire in the future ill be letting it burn, wont be ringing for a 500 quid bill.

btw they also had a price list on the letter in question. most fires were 500, road traffic accidents were i think 650. every extra hour worked out at 450 approx and water and foam etc used on fire was charged per gallon.

I don't have a problem with a call out charge of say €200 or something, but the above sounds insane.

Apparently they don't charge if there is a fatality. Now that's just going to give people bad ideas.

McDermotX

humbert wrote: »

Surely it's the person responsible for the fire that gets billed, not necessarily the owner of the object on fire. Any alternative would be sheer idiocy.

But ultimately its the person liable for the property/vehicle that's providing a danger to others, such as in the case of fire, that is the final 'go-to' person.
Regardless of how a fire started, whether it was theft, mechanical or accidental, the owner is gonna be responsible.

Now, whether or not the insurance crowd will foot the bill is an entirely different manner.......I would imagine they do in the case of a properly insured car being stolen and burned out, but maybe someone with an actual 'experience' in this regard could clarify.

Seems unfair if faced with a bill, but those are the breaks. I mean, if your next door neighbor's empty house had a fire brewing and you made the call fearing for their house, not to mention it endangering your own, would you think its right that you face the bill ?

JustAThought

3rdDegree wrote: »

I don't have a problem with a call out charge of say €200 or something, but the above sounds insane.

Apparently they don't charge if there is a fatality. Now that's just going to give people bad ideas.

Y - have to say I find this really worrying . Few years back heard terrible screaming late at night ; looked out the window & the house down the way an inferno : family out the attic window screaming.
rang the fire brigade instantly.

Last year watched plonker neighbour of my parents try to cut open an oil tank hoisted onto his roof with a chainsaw ( yes!) he and the tank exploded into flames ; him rolling in the roof with chainsaw trying to put flames on jacket out while oil tank kept burning to 30ft & fanning electricity cable ; hysterical screaming argument ensued over calling the fire brigade because of the charge. ( we called after about 1 minute of hysterical financial what iffs). ( note the row was between my mother & I -she didn't want the e1000 fee & said his wife would call - while I said he was working alone & we had no way of knowing she was in). I was upstairs watching this unfold shouting down at her to use their house phone & call. She did call.

Whatever about cars that are covered by insurance this call out fee certainly stopped me from ringing instantly. I would never have felt that i would have needed to ask permission in someone elses house or to hesitate before. I have no doubt that this will be the consequence for others too in " real" ( fire) situations. Having watched a neighbours house turn into a fireball in front of my eyes within an unspeakable 3 or 4 minutes; I have no doubt that this new tax will cost lives.

( send the bill to your insurance company - that's what it's there for. )

Oranage2

I think its very steep too.

I heard a few stories bout people ringing the fire brigade say they had a fire and the fire brigade telling them it will cost 500e the home owner said they'll put it out themselves.

Also heard a guy say he thinks the house next door is on fire, the fire brigade told him to knock in and ask them to ring.

As something as serious as a fire I think it should be free.

Victor

Free services get abused. A certain level of personal responsibility is required.

And it isn't as if they ask for the money before dealing with the fire.

celtictiger32 wrote: »

i know if my car is on fire in the future ill be letting it burn, wont be ringing for a 500 quid bill.

And if your car is next to your house?

Spook_ie

celtictiger32 wrote: »

ok not sure where to put this so AH it is.

for a brief back story; her indoors had her car stolen a few weeks back, predictably it ended up burned out. when i rang the emergency services for a fire brigade they told me that someone had called already and one was on the way. they came, fire out, job done.

back to the present; today she received a letter in the post billing her for 500 euro for the above service. i had heard this kind of system was being introduced for people who rang the fire service, but didnt think think it was already in place.
how can she get billed when she did not ring for the service? if they contact me, yes i did ring them but as i mentioned they had already received a call and it was that call that brought them out. for starters she wont be paying this bill and i certainly wont either. has anyone else experienced one of these letters and what did they do about it. on a side note wont this discourage people from ringing them in future and attempting to tackle fires on their own....thoughts

I'm a little confused, if the car was stolen how did you know it was on fire?

Ms. Pingui

I used to work for an old lady whos neighbours called the fire brigade to her house as they thoght they could see the whole house filling with smoke through the windows. Actually it was stream, she was boiling a ham!
She got a bill for 500, which she had to pay, understandibly she was raging over it.

JustAThought

JustAThought wrote: »

Last year watched plonker neighbour of my parents try to cut open an oil tank hoisted onto his roof with a chainsaw ( yes!) he and the tank exploded into flames ; him rolling in the roof with chainsaw trying to put flames on jacket out while oil tank kept burning to 30ft & fanning electricity cable ; hysterical screaming argument ensued over calling the fire brigade because of the charge.

More info on this!

AudreyHepburn

OP there's generally some cover on your household insurance policy for fire brigade charges, albeit with a limit on what they pay.

I don't understand why people are expecting those in the emergency services to do their jobs for no pay. None of the rest of us would work for nothing, why should they?

They do jobs most of us would balk at, why should they not be paid accordingly?

Frynge

We Had a small fire in work before Christmas. One exterior room about 16^2 ft not too much damage. €6000 for the fire brigade.

In fairness there was five units on site within a matter of minutes and the fire was out within an hour.

Gosub

AudreyHepburn wrote: »

OP there's generally some cover on your household insurance policy for fire brigade charges, albeit with a limit on what they pay.

I don't understand why people are expecting those in the emergency services to do their jobs for no pay. None of the rest of us would work for nothing, why should they?

They do jobs most of us would balk at, why should they not be paid accordingly?

I don't think anyone's expecting that. The emergency services are paid from our taxes. Of course, they aren't paid as much as those gobsh¡tes in government or the other gobsh¡tes in banking. Maybe that's the real problem here; the wrong people are getting our tax money.

munchkin_utd

B.A._Baracus wrote: »

Emergency services should be free. Charging people is a joke. We all pay tax... tax funds their budgets ... etc.

BTW, its no different abroad in many cases.
If you have a ski accident in the mountains and you need to be rescued you'll get a bill in the post a while later from the mountain rescue.
And if theres a helicopter involved (regardless of whether you asked for it or not) it'll be a really saucy bill

Normal Ambulances also bill per incident. Cant say about fire services BUT on the continent (and USA?) their provision is covered by your local taxes paid to your city so it sorta depends on whether you pay enough local taxes as to whether the cost is passed on.

Bullseye1

The car was robbed and burnt out. Unless the owner was negligent in leaving the keys in the ignition what more could they have done to prevent said robbery? On that basis if the car was involved in an accident or robbery the car owner would be responsible.

The fire service should be included in the property tax. How is it free then? People wasting the emergency services should be dealt with severely but why punish those who legitimately require it.

Have to say alittle tired of all of this "free services" nonsense. It's all paid for through general taxation.

Victor wrote: »

Free services get abused. A certain level of personal responsibility is required.

And it isn't as if they ask for the money before dealing with the fire.

And if your car is next to your house?

Bullseye1

AudreyHepburn wrote: »

OP there's generally some cover on your household insurance policy for fire brigade charges, albeit with a limit on what they pay.

I don't understand why people are expecting those in the emergency services to do their jobs for no pay. None of the rest of us would work for nothing, why should they?

They do jobs most of us would balk at, why should they not be paid accordingly?

The emergency services don't get paid? Please.

corktina

if your water tank burst would you expect a plumber not to charge you for an emergency call out?

No . you'd get your Insurance to pay for him.

If Fire calls were free, then instead of paying "enough" tax, we'd all be paying a little bit more for a service we might never use.

qwerty93

I heard before that If you contact the Gardai about a fire, they would be obligated to ring the fire brigade and there would be no charge for the houseowner as a result...does anyone know if theres any truth to this?

Plazaman

Spook_ie wrote: »

I'm a little confused, if the car was stolen how did you know it was on fire?

Yes, I'm not understanding this. Plus I'm not understanding the fact that you were calling the Fire Brigade anyway. Someone else got there before you but you only knew this after you rang. Did you or did you not want the car fire to be put out?

I'm nearly sure the charge is levied on the person who receives the service and not the caller. Most county councils list the charges on their websites. There was problems last year with collecting these call out fees so I don't know if this has improved in anyway since.

smash

Your motor Insurance company will cover the charge.

Bullseye1

corktina wrote: »

if your water tank burst would you expect a plumber not to charge you for an emergency call out?

No . you'd get your Insurance to pay for him.

If Fire calls were free, then instead of paying "enough" tax, we'd all be paying a little bit more for a service we might never use.

You could apply that logic across the board. Most people will never need to visit a hospital or require social welfare (dole/jobseekers) yet those are the areas in which most of the tax is spent. And yet a very large section of the population are afraid to rely on the public health system and so take out health insurance.

syklops

Victor wrote: »

Free services get abused. A certain level of personal responsibility is required.

Where does common sense come into it? Surely the fire crew know the difference between an emergency blaze and a mundane, non-emergency? People really should not be debating whether or not to call the emergency services in an emergency because it might cost them 500 euro after. If your cat is stuck up a tree, it will cost 100 euro for a unit to come and get it down, you'd be better off trying a builder, or someone else with a long ladder.

There was a representative of fire fighters on Prime Time last night, and I have to say, if they are charging for their services as well as getting their normal public service wage then my sympathy for their 'plight' diminishes.

C.O.Y.B.I.B

corktina wrote: »

if your water tank burst would you expect a plumber not to charge you for an emergency call out?

No . you'd get your Insurance to pay for him.

If Fire calls were free, then instead of paying "enough" tax, we'd all be paying a little bit more for a service we might never use.

However if I had a dripping tap and a neighbour called an emergency plumber , I wouldnt expect to have to pay him If my car was on fire on a bit of wasteground after being stolen , I certainly wouldnt really care whether the fire was put out or not . I dont imagine too many vehicles are actually "saved" after being set on fire.
As a bit of an aside , does anyone know if they catch someone who robbed a car and burnt it out are they ever pursued (by insurance or otherwise) for costs e.g. Replacement car or fire brigade charges ?

donegal_road

there is no charge for the fire brigade in counties Cork, Waterford, Sligo, Monaghan and Kerry. If I ever need the fire brigade I'll call one of them..

seven_eleven

donegal_road wrote: »

there is no charge for the fire brigade in counties Cork, Waterford, Sligo, Monaghan and Kerry. If I ever need the fire brigade I'll call one of them..

As far as I'm aware, they only charge for "special" operations. So car crashes etc, but no fires. Thats in Waterford at least.

corktina

Bullseye1 wrote: »

You could apply that logic across the board. Most people will never need to visit a hospital or require social welfare (dole/jobseekers) yet those are the areas in which most of the tax is spent. And yet a very large section of the population are afraid to rely on the public health system and so take out health insurance.

indeed and when they require emergency hospital treatment, they get a bill , which they pass on to the VHI or equiv.

gallag

This has shocked me, you guys are already some of the highest taxed people in Europe, and still some of yous are saying "do you expect it for free?" Seriously, highest paid civil service in the world might be the problem? Fire, police and health services should come from income tax!

syklops

donegal_road wrote: »

there is no charge for the fire brigade in counties Cork, Waterford, Sligo, Monaghan and Kerry. If I ever need the fire brigade I'll call one of them..

So basically its the city/county councils fault. I still don't understand why we need over 50 councils who don't talk to each other to administrate 26 counties, or a total of 5 Million people. I'd also love to know where the money from the council rates goes to.

mike65

Waterford City and County do not charge, so I wonder if the service is abused to a greater level as some reckon.

SB2013

syklops wrote: »

Where does common sense come into it? Surely the fire crew know the difference between an emergency blaze and a mundane, non-emergency? People really should not be debating whether or not to call the emergency services in an emergency because it might cost them 500 euro after. If your cat is stuck up a tree, it will cost 100 euro for a unit to come and get it down, you'd be better off trying a builder, or someone else with a long ladder.

There was a representative of fire fighters on Prime Time last night, and I have to say, if they are charging for their services as well as getting their normal public service wage then my sympathy for their 'plight' diminishes.

They don't actually get the money you know.

o1s1n

Plazaman wrote: »

I'm nearly sure the charge is levied on the person who receives the service and not the caller. Most county councils list the charges on their websites. There was problems last year with collecting these call out fees so I don't know if this has improved in anyway since.

I would have assumed the person receiving the service would get the bill. Why in gods name would anyone ring the fire service for a neighbour if they were going to get a €500 bill? Makes no sense.

On a side note, if it did operate like that, all you'd have to do is ring from your mobile and hide your number...?

rubadub

Airitech wrote: »

If they always billed the caller no one would ring the fire service. If your house was on fire or you were unconscious in your car after a car crash you would want someone to ring the fire brigade wouldn't you?

If my BBQ was a bit smokey I would not want the neighbour ringing and me being charged.

Many people overreact to things, I remember having a mouse in my house and the parents heard and had all these numbers for exterminators for me. 2 days later the €1 mouse traps had him.

I know a person who called out the fire brigade for a house which looked like it was smoking, it was an overboiling water heater, the owners were out and the fire brigade broke in.

syklops wrote: »

Surely the fire crew know the difference between an emergency blaze and a mundane, non-emergency?

They know when they get there, but it still costs to get there, so who pays the callout fee, even if no work is done.

On a side note, if it did operate like that, all you'd have to do is ring from your mobile and hide your number...?

and people could maliciously do this if a neighbour they hated was having a BBQ, get them footed with the bill.

syklops

rubadub wrote: »

They know when they get there, but it still costs to get there, so who pays the callout fee, even if no work is done.
.

I was suggesting they bill if its not an emergency. If they go out somewhere and its not an emergency and it was inappropriate to call the fire brigade, then a hefty bill is sent to the person who rang them. If its an emergency the charge is waived.

They don't actually get the money you know.

Actually, I didn't know that. See my other comment, it seems this is coming from the city/county councils. People in this country complain about the government, but really the local councils need to be under more scrutiny.

Mr Benevolent

gallag wrote: »

you guys are already some of the highest taxed people in Europe

No we're not. Don't be ridiculous.

seven_eleven

gallag wrote: »

This has shocked me, you guys are already some of the highest taxed people in Europe, and still some of yous are saying "do you expect it for free?" Seriously, highest paid civil service in the world might be the problem? Fire, police and health services should come from income tax!

I'm all for Ambulance Services costing money. Its currently free in Ireland, but its so heavily abused (not just in Ireland) when its free. You get people calling 999 for sore throats & the flu because they don't want to make their own way to the hospital. You have people that ring them every single day for stupid things, and the second the ambulance services leaves their house, they call again.

People call complaining of "chest pain", because they know they're obliged to instantly respond.
If you need an ambulance, you won't be complaining about a small €300 bill.

Chips Lovell

Call out charges don't fund the fire brigade entirely. The rest of it comes from central funding.

No call out charges lead people to abuse the service a bit, such as using ambulances as taxis etc.

If it's your property, you'll get the bill, regardless of who made the call.

Your insurance will cover it.

Davidth88

irish-stew wrote: »

In the UK the council tax covers it. I doubt our new property tax will.

errrrrr , if you are in a car crash in the UK and get taken to hospital you will recv a bill.... which you pass onto your Insurance Co , OP , that is where this bill should go.

Dyr

What happens is you set fire to a fire engine?

o1s1n

Bambi wrote: »

What happens is you set fire to a fire engine?

The end of the universe?

Either that or just a burned out fire engine. I wouldn't chance it though :pac: