Should I buy a diesel car?

longhorn2013

Hi folks

Currently driving a 01,1.4lt, 5 door Ford focus with 160k miles on it. My weekly drive would be around 450 miles, which would include motorway and national roads mainly and am spending 60-80 euro a week on petrol. The car is in great shape and flew through the NCT recently and never gives me any trouble.

Just wondering if you would advise on keeping this car while it is going well or am I crazy to be spending this amount each week on petrol and should I upgrade to a newer diesel.

Thanks

biko

You need to figure out if a diesel would be cheaper in your particular case.
You can do calculations here, of course you'll need the mpg of the car you'd like to upgrade to.
http://www.choozer.co.uk/tripcostcalculator.php

Got a trip computer in your car or the average mpg of your vehicle? Able to find out the distance and fuel consumption along the trip? Enter in the values here, and accurately find out how much you are really spending on petrol, diesel, or even LPG fuel whether on a local trip or long distance journey.

Did you have a diesel in mind?

Duckjob

450 miles per week is over 23k miles per year, which would put you well into diesel territory by the reckoning of most.

Also, 1.4 Focus is renowned for being too weak an engine for it's weight, and with a lot of motorway milage, that engine is going to be working hard. I would say MPG could be a lot worse than even a larger petrol, let alone a diesel.

longhorn2013

Thanks for replies

BIKO - I had posted before where I had been looking at a 3 series coupe diesel but am thinking now that I might not splash out that much and get a cheaper version. Maybe a budget of 8-10k now instead. Any suggestions?!

bazz26

If this is genuine then it seems like alot of car for the money:


http://www.driving.ie/used-cars/Alfa-Romeo/159/1.9JTD-SPORTIVO/34413649877262800/

biko

drool

dh0011

http://www.carzone.ie/search/Volkswagen/Passat/6speed-c/201306212363500/advert?channel=CARS
would be the kind of car i would go for if i was you. One thing to note some diesels have expensive flywheels and diesel particle filters which can be very expensive if they go wrong - thats why i stick with a petrol car.

dh0011

just noticed that that car is on english plates so would have to add on vrt - but something like this on irish plates could work

colm_mcm

And its the 2.0 not 1.9 which is funny when you look at you being cautious over things going wrong.

An early passat 2.0 TDI isn't a great idea.

Dr.Rieux

dh0011 wrote: »

http://www.carzone.ie/search/Volkswagen/Passat/6speed-c/201306212363500/advert?channel=CARS
would be the kind of car i would go for if i was you. One thing to note some diesels have expensive flywheels and diesel particle filters which can be very expensive if they go wrong - thats why i stick with a petrol car.

VRT still due on that. No mention of service history so I'd say there's a small chance that mileage is genuine. Not a comfortline model either. That's a uk se spec, comes without the dual zone climate and seemingly without the fake wood trim across the dash.

dh0011

colm_mcm wrote: »

And its the 2.0 not 1.9 which is funny when you look at you being cautious over things going wrong.

An early passat 2.0 TDI isn't a great idea.

i missed that too - i must have been half asleep

Idbatterim

waht ever about the diesel / petrol argument etc. Doing that mileage in a 1.4 litre focus would kill me!!!

http://cars.donedeal.ie/for-sale/cars/4840250

http://cars.donedeal.ie/for-sale/cars/4349525

the above has already been converted to lpg...

@80

OP how much is it going to cost to upgrade and how many years of petrol would that get you ?

If you get 40 mpg in the Focus and get 55 mpg in a diesel that's 5.4 kms extra in the diesel per litre.

You could convert your Focus to LPG and almost half your fuel costs doing that mileage would pay for itself in 6 months. @80 C/L

Of get a Prius, see below

http://cars.donedeal.ie/for-sale/cars/4658342



You would easily get 55 mpg. 60-65 more than possible, or get the MK III 09+ and get 70 + mpg.

Or convert the Prius to LPG and your fuel costs would more than half. @ 80 C/L

All depends on what you are willing to spend, if it's purely to save money then keep the Focus and convert if you can get the fuel, where are you located ?

Idbatterim

Idbatterim wrote: »

waht ever about the diesel / petrol argument etc. Doing that mileage in a 1.4 litre focus would kill me!!!

http://cars.donedeal.ie/for-sale/cars/4840250

http://cars.donedeal.ie/for-sale/cars/4349525

the above has already been converted to lpg...

A bigger higher fuel consuming car isn't going to save much over the focus despite running on LPG, the Idea would be to convert the highest MPG petrol such as a prius and save a lot more.

colm_mcm

Deleted User wrote: »

OP how much is it going to cost to upgrade and how many years of petrol would that get you ?

If you get 40 mpg in the Focus and get 55 mpg in a diesel that's 5.4 kms extra in the diesel per litre.

You could convert your Focus to LPG and almost half your fuel costs doing that mileage would pay for itself in 6 months. @80 C/L

Of get a Prius,



You would easily get 55 mpg. 60-65 more than possible,

If you drive a diesel as carefully as you'd need to drive a Prius getting 60mpg, you'd get a lot better than 55mpg.

If the OP is doing mainly national roads and motorway, and keeping up with traffic, I can't see him getting your mpg, I've had them from work and never got near that.

Idbatterim

A bigger higher fuel consuming car isn't going to save much over the focus despite running on LPG, the Idea would be to convert the highest MPG petrol such as a prius and save a lot more.

I agree, just initially the OP said he was interested in E92 coupe, so thought he might like to stick with the bm's. Honestly and personally doing that mileage in a 1.4 focus, with the lack of power, high rpm's, with that cabin noise and no cruise control etc, I would put a high value on a comfie car... There isnt really a silver bullet. If you want luxury and economy, you pay the diesel premium or you get the larger petrol cars for nearly half the price, and pay it through increased fuel and tax... OR you get economy from the likes of a prius, without the luxury...

colm_mcm

colm_mcm wrote: »

If you drive a diesel as carefully as you'd need to drive a Prius getting 60mpg, you'd get a lot better than 55mpg.

If the OP is doing mainly national roads and motorway, and keeping up with traffic, I can't see him getting your mpg, I've had them from work and never got near that.

No driving the prius properly I can easily get 60-65 mpg, but recently that has dropped because I'm on F rated winter tyres, my other winter tyres I got 60-65 mpg. So I'm dying to try out proper B rated tyres I've ordered.

But the MK III Prius does way better 70+ mpg can be got.

And I drive mainly national, motorway, but it's the over all mpg per tank that matters, there are plenty of opportunities along the way I can use the hybrid system to the max. The motorway doesn't end at my door.

The main reason I suggested the Prius for the OP anyway was for proven bullet proof reliability and with very good MPG. And no major maintenance required for it's life.

If I had known about LPG when I got the Prius I would have converted it and saved a fortune. Would work out way cheaper than any diesel !

Idbatterim

Idbatterim wrote: »

I agree, just initially the OP said he was interested in E92 coupe, so thought he might like to stick with the bm's. Honestly and personally doing that mileage in a 1.4 focus, with the lack of power, high rpm's, with that cabin noise and no cruise control etc, I would put a high value on a comfie car... There isnt really a silver bullet. If you want luxury and economy, you pay the diesel premium or you get the larger petrol cars for nearly half the price, and pay it through increased fuel and tax... OR you get economy from the likes of a prius, without the luxury...

Prius ain't a bad car, it's no luxury vehicle though but it will give far less trouble than most luxury brands and costing far less to maintain through it's life. It's not just about fuel economy.

If the OP is doing 450 miles a week then even a cheap 2-3 litre car won't take long to end up costing thousands in petrol and that thousands adds up.

If it's savings he wants then no other car will save him more than a Prius on LPG.

Sure he could get a 30 mpg car and convert it to LPG either and at 80 C/L it will cost him the same or maybe a little more than a 60 mpg Diesel. But that still costs a lot more than a Prius on LPG.

draiochtanois

This post has been deleted.

draiochtanois

draiochtanois wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

That's what I said, but he says it's giving him too much trouble and starting to cost him.

Though maybe spending money on it to get it right would still end up cheaper, and then convert to LPG.

But there comes a time when you got to let an old car go, some just last a lot longer than others.

Zubeneschamali

draiochtanois wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

But it's a 1.4 Focus! And he's spending maybe 500 hours a year in it!

OP, for the sake of your sanity, find something that's nicer to sit in and drive.

Zubeneschamali

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

But it's a 1.4 Focus! And he's spending maybe 500 hours a year in it!

OP, for the sake of your sanity, find something that's nicer to sit in and drive.

It's all down to what he can afford or is willing to spend.

remember you still have to spend thousands to fuel a year.

That's why someday I want a leccy car, so I can have a newer car, cool gadgets and not spend on fuel. I'd rather spend it on the car than pump petrol into older and older cars.

mickman

Guys

I'm doing 400 miles per week and I want to cut my running costs to zero !!

Is prius and lpg the way to go ???looks don't bother me, it just can't be terribly uncomfortable

Any stations in north cork for lpg? My commute is mallow to limerick

mickman

mickman wrote: »

Guys

I'm doing 400 miles per week and I want to cut my running costs to zero !!

Is prius and lpg the way to go ???looks don't bother me, it just can't be terribly uncomfortable

Any stations in north cork for lpg? My commute is mallow to limerick

The Prius isn't uncomfortable but do make sure it's got a full toyota service history, there have been a few recalls. It's not a bad long distance cruiser.

http://www.ilpga.ie/autogas-outlets.php#Cork

These might be more expensive, but keep looking.

I honestly can't see a cheaper to run car, apart from electric as that would cost 12-14 euros for 400 miles on night rate leccy.

But Prius LPG or especially Prius MK III is the way to go and no diesel problems like dmf or dpf to worry about, no timing belt either.

Test drive one.

mickman

[Deleted User] wrote: »

The Prius isn't uncomfortable but do make sure it's got a full toyota service history, there have been a few recalls. It's not a bad long distance cruiser.

http://www.ilpga.ie/autogas-outlets.php#Cork

These might be more expensive, but keep looking.

I honestly can't see a cheaper to run car, apart from electric as that would cost 12-14 euros for 400 miles on night rate leccy.

But Prius LPG or especially Prius MK III is the way to go and no diesel problems like dmf or dpf to worry about, no timing belt either.

Test drive one.

Thanks. What is the prius mk 111?

If I didn't convert or could not get a fill up, what would I get from the prius? 50 mpg?

I would be aiming to buy a 2009 one

Matthewjohn

A prius 111 is a third generation prius which was released in 2009.

dh0011

Deleted User wrote: »

The Prius isn't uncomfortable but do make sure it's got a full toyota service history, there have been a few recalls. It's not a bad long distance cruiser.

http://www.ilpga.ie/autogas-outlets.php#Cork

These might be more expensive, but keep looking.

I honestly can't see a cheaper to run car, apart from electric as that would cost 12-14 euros for 400 miles on night rate leccy.

But Prius LPG or especially Prius MK III is the way to go and no diesel problems like dmf or dpf to worry about, no timing belt either.

Test drive one.

There is a spot in mallow on the road to the racecourse selling LPG. I drive charleville cork a lot and thought about converting my avensis to LPG. Decided against it as it seems the valves in some toyota can give trouble if run on LPG. Make sure you do your homework before converting to LPG

The Red Ace

A car that you may not have even thought about but which is not overpriced when a few years old is the diesel X type Jag, we have one that returns up to 62mpg , all running gear Ford.

mickman

Are the prius good for 160k miles if serviced?

mickman

mickman wrote: »

Thanks. What is the prius mk 111?

If I didn't convert or could not get a fill up, what would I get from the prius? 50 mpg?

I would be aiming to buy a 2009 one

Prius gets around 10 mpg more than the MK II, but you will pay a few grand more to buy one.

Don't worry about valves on lpg, you can get flashlube and is good for over 10,000 miles or so and costs around 10 euro a bottle.

I don't think I've got lower than 55 driving it hard, fairly hard.

But if you want to learn the tips if you get one I can tell you. But I can get 60-65 but my tyres have ruined that the last few months. You got to get B or better rated tyres for the Prius because it makes a difference when using the hybrid to the max. I've never driven mine with B rated tyres and I've some ordered Dunlop Blue response 100 a tyre, not more than I spend on any tyre. I don't skimp on tyres.

mickman

mickman wrote: »

Are the prius good for 160k miles if serviced?

Absolutely. And have been known to go 400,000 miles.

Just get the gearbox oil changed at 100,000 miles, if it has not being done. Make Toyota do it. Don't ask them, tell them. Every 100,000 miles. And get a receipt. Mine is due in a few thousand miles.

http://notpetroleum.com/2012/04/13/reconditioning-a-toyota-prius-changing-the-cvt-transmission-fluid/

mickman

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Prius gets around 10 mpg more than the MK II, but you will pay a few grand more to buy one.

Don't worry about valves on lpg, you can get flashlube and is good for over 10,000 miles or so and costs around 10 euro a bottle.

I don't think I've got lower than 55 driving it hard, fairly hard.

But if you want to learn the tips if you get one I can tell you. But I can get 60-65 but my tyres have ruined that the last few months. You got to get B or better rated tyres for the Prius because it makes a difference when using the hybrid to the max. I've never driven mine with B rated tyres and I've some ordered Dunlop Blue response 100 a tyre, not more than I spend on any tyre. I don't skimp on tyres.

What year is yours?

Do share the tips with me please !

So literally it looks like I can my commute 400 miles for 30 quid on lpg, too good to be true ???

colm_mcm

Deleted User wrote: »

I don't think I've got lower than 55 driving it hard, fairly hard.

What mpg do you get at 120-130kmph with the cruise control on?

Maybe I was doing it wrong.

colm_mcm

colm_mcm wrote: »

What mpg do you get at 120-130kmph with the cruise control on?

Maybe I was doing it wrong.

That's all my driving combined lately with those damn F rated winter tyres is 55-58 mpg. That includes (included) driving 52 miles from here to Dublin and back. Over 100 miles on motorway and older national routes.

By the way cruise isn't the most efficient way to drive, driving with a constant throttle position, something cruise can not do.

As I keep telling people you do not measure your MPG per trip, ideally you measure at the same pump filling to the brim, usually I fill until the click and round it off when I want to take calculations.

But you reset your trip computer after every fill of petrol/diesel. Or ideally never reset your trip computer as that will give the best over all mpg of your car.

It makes 0 sense to reset the trip computer after every trip or just before a trip or when the car is already warm, I could easily say I get over 150+ mpg in the prius when using a blend of engine and leccy, but that's equally as useless as saying my diesel gets 55 mpg at 120 kph down the motorway.

mickman

mickman wrote: »

What year is yours?

Do share the tips with me please !

So literally it looks like I can my commute 400 miles for 30 quid on lpg, too good to be true ???

I wouldn't say 30 I'd add another 5 just for inefficiencies.

If you do it make sure the conversion you get switches over to LPG always after the engine shuts off and back on as it does it a lot in the prius.

Some kits switch back to petrol and then LPG so you would use more petrol that way.

Shop around and get someone who knows what they are at to do it, the Polish have been doing it for a long time and they seem to know what they are at. If you have to travel to get it done right do it.

You could always buy a yaris for 2 grand and convert that 3 grand total that would save you more and they yaris go forever.

3 grand V 8-9 grand, 6 grand will buy you a lot of LPG !

mickman

Deleted User wrote: »

I wouldn't say 30 I'd add another 5 just for inefficiencies.

If you do it make sure the conversion you get switches over to LPG always after the engine shuts off and back on as it does it a lot in the prius.

Some kits switch back to petrol and then LPG so you would use more petrol that way.

Shop around and get someone who knows what they are at to do it, the Polish have been doing it for a long time and they seem to know what they are at. If you have to travel to get it done right do it.

You could always buy a yaris for 2 grand and convert that 3 grand total that would save you more and they yaris go forever.

3 grand V 8-9 grand, 6 grand will buy you a lot of LPG !

yaris though ! i need to have some bit of a normal car :-)

mickman

would get it done by these guys

http://www.autogasireland.ie/

Can you do this to a diesel car ?

mickman

mickman wrote: »

would get it done by these guys

http://www.autogasireland.ie/

Can you do this to a diesel car ?

Don't think you can convert diesel. Why would you want to anyway ?

Autogas 79 C/l ? that's good. Last time I checked they were over 1 Euro ?

Again make sure if you convert the Prius to get the kit that when the engine is warmed up it will (ONLY) switch back and forth only on LPG.

mickman

Deleted User wrote: »

Don't think you can convert diesel. Why would you want to anyway ?

Autogas 79 C/l ? that's good. Last time I checked they were over 1 Euro ?

Again make sure if you convert the Prius to get the kit that when the engine is warmed up it will (ONLY) switch back and forth only on LPG.

well im not converting - i want dual fuel so why wouldnt that work ? I dont think it should matter

mickman

mickman wrote: »

well im not converting - i want dual fuel so why wouldnt that work ? I dont think it should matter

Seems you can but it mainly runs on diesel. But your best bet is to convert a petrol, usually the highest mpg one you can get. Prius. Or cheapest good petrol you can get Yaris. The yaris will still to 45-50+ mpg

Or if you can get your focus in proper order, keep it.

As I said 8-9 grand for prius + conversion costs will buy years of LPG !

mickman

Deleted User wrote: »

Seems you can but it mainly runs on diesel. But your best bet is to convert a petrol, usually the highest mpg one you can get. Prius. Or cheapest good petrol you can get Yaris. The yaris will still to 45-50+ mpg

Or if you can get your focus in proper order, keep it.

As I said 8-9 grand for prius + conversion costs will buy years of LPG !

well mine is an audi 16 1.9 tdi - 1999

mickman

are the older prius any good ? 2005 /2006

mickman

mickman wrote: »

are the older prius any good ? 2005 /2006

Yeah the 04-09 are the MK II I have a 2007. Over 94 K miles now. No problems what so ever.

Basically if economics is the reason, add up the value of the Audi, V a Prius (or any car you intend to buy ) and add up how long you think the pay back would be in selling the audi.

If you do 450 miles a week @ 50 mpg in the Audi, that would cost you 65 Euros in Diesel.

55 mpg in the Prius without trying too hard @ 80 C/L = 29.60 euro's add maybe 5-10 % inefficiency =28 Euro's.

Again, the kit for the prius that when warm will only switch the engine on on LPG and not petrol and then back to LPG. It will make a difference.

mickman

Deleted User wrote: »

Yeah the 04-09 are the MK II I have a 2007. Over 94 K miles now. No problems what so ever.

Basically if economics is the reason, add up the value of the Audi, V a Prius (or any car you intend to buy ) and add up how long you think the pay back would be in selling the audi.

If you do 450 miles a week @ 50 mpg in the Audi, that would cost you 65 Euros in Diesel.

55 mpg in the Prius without trying too hard @ 80 C/L = 29.60 euro's add maybe 5-10 % inefficiency =28 Euro's.

Again, the kit for the prius that when warm will only switch the engine on on LPG and not petrol and then back to LPG. It will make a difference.

Yep i think i am pretty much set. I can pick up a 2006 Prius for 7k . 1k for conversion for 8k.

Plan to keep for 6 years.

Will save 1800 on car tax over the 6 years

Will save about 6000 per year on fuel savings.

So thats basically the car paid for !

mickman

plus im not getting 50 mpg from the audi

What are you getting ?

The best way to know is to reset the trip computer after a fill then calculate the litres You fill the next time, convert to imperial miles per gallon and divide by the miles driven.

Or reset the trip computer and see what it tells you at the next fill, try use as much of the tank you can.

mickman

[Deleted User] wrote: »

What are you getting ?

The best way to know is to reset the trip computer after a fill then calculate the litres You fill the next time, convert to imperial miles per gallon and divide by the miles driven.

Or reset the trip computer and see what it tells you at the next fill, try use as much of the tank you can.

I have calculated about 35. Must be something wrong with her

mickman

Lpg is 99 cent in mallow

71 cent in cork

Some difference

The_Honeybadger

mickman wrote: »

Lpg is 99 cent in mallow

71 cent in cork

Some difference

82 cent in clonmel last time I enquired. Price seems to vary a lot across the country. 99 does seem very expensive

mickeyk

mickeyk wrote: »

82 cent in clonmel last time I enquired. Price seems to vary a lot across the country. 99 does seem very expensive

35 mpg ? can't be right ? over 400 miles a week ?

Yeah the price varies a lot over the country, still cheaper than petrol or diesel.

If you really are only getting 35 mpg then it would be a no brainer converting a prius.