lots of mortalities??

kevthegaff

Lads i lost a heifer last week:mad:, found her that evening. Ive been lucky so far with mortalitys between calving and cows even tho some heifers are a little on the light side even though theyre on meal. Anyway the knackery lad was telling me theyre collecting ridiculous amounts of cattle, heard of one farmer with cows down and alot of losses. Is it affecting yer area as much?

pakalasa

I dropped a dead calf to knackery in Limerick last week. They said they were taking in about twice the normal rate. "Worn out" from it, they said.
I had a crap year too. Heifers throwing calves, young calves dying. Nothing you could link to the weather, but too much of a coincidence for me.

maxxuumman

Touch wood, so far so good. Better than most years. Lost 2% calves born dead and less than 2 % to crypto. No cows down, and only 1 cow dead due to a number of issues. But there is still a bit to go yet.
I would say that hunger and very bad silage is an issue on alot more farms than we realise. The 2 knackeries here have never had such a busy year. They have been busy since Jan. Young stock and old cows are the main customers.

kevthegaff

hastings in roscrea are collecting 100 animals a day around nrth tipp, 1000 a week sometimes:eek:, and theyre not the only knackery in Nrth tipp!

simx

john styles told me the other day he is up 40% on last year:eek:

whelan1

touch wood running the same or a bit below normal... hope it stays that way... our local knacker is flat out too, but will make time to come if its an emergency

blue5000

kevthegaff wrote: »

hastings in roscrea are collecting 100 animals a day around nrth tipp, 1000 a week sometimes:eek:, and theyre not the only knackery in Nrth tipp!

They collect for me too, said last week that he is getting a bigger truck. The old ppl round here still talk about black '47, the year that hastings bought a new car, it didn,t go down well.

cowbox

Heard on the radio the other day there was 50,000 deaths recorded since january. Mainly cows with many having to be shot cause they were so thin and weak from lack of feed or more going down after calving cause they were run down. the knackers yards have cattle everywhere these days packed to capacity.

Richk2012

What happens to the dead animals when they reach the knackery ???
The driver out our way said they were shipped to Germany and incinerated .

Found that hard to believe though .
Are they incinerated here in this country???

epfff

Richk2012 wrote: »

What happens to the dead animals when they reach the knackery ???
The driver out our way said they were shipped to Germany and incinerated .

Found that hard to believe though .
Are they incinerated here in this country???

Rendered to meat and bone meal here and powder is incinerated in Germany
I think

kevthegaff

should be used for dog nuts or something like that, some waste

greysides

I saw a sight recently that summed up the whole situation for me:

Dairy cows out on a field with no grass. Farm yard manure dumped in the middle of it waiting to be spread.

Cows rummaging through the heap looking for something to eat.


Think "slum children".

whelan1

was at the mart today, was assuming there would be loads of starving cattle, there wasnt... passed by a field on the way home with sheep and lambs in it, seriously they had to be eating clay... no sign of a hay rack in the field

Muckit

Reading stories here and finding them hard to believe. Would lads not sell cattle if they couldn't feed them? They cost you money dead. Is it lads egos or what? And surely the same rules apply to farmers re cruelty to animals and ISPCA.

I think a lot of pub chat and bs

Dampintheattic

All this pub talk about dead cattle piled high in knackeries, reminds me if the "slug" infested silage harvest of last year.

I'm sure there are some problems here and there, but it would nice to get a factual picture, year on year!
What is the throughput of the knackeries this year versus same period past few years?
Bet that info is available from some source, and I expect it is somewhat higher than previous years. Not much though, I'd expect.

Dampintheattic

Muckit wrote: »

Reading stories here and finding them hard to believe. Would lads not sell cattle if they couldn't feed them? They cost you money dead. Is it lads egos or what? And surely the same rules apply to farmers re cruelty to animals and ISPCA.

I think a lot of pub chat and bs

Exactly. And you know the crazy thing is, some of the purveyors, of these BS stories, are giving profound advice and information, on other threads about all matters farming.

Muckit

cowbox wrote: »

Heard on the radio the other day there was 50,000 deaths recorded since january. Mainly cows with many having to be shot cause they were so thin and weak from lack of feed or more going down after calving cause they were run down. the knackers yards have cattle everywhere these days packed to capacity.

Cock and bull

bbam

Muckit wrote: »

Cock and bull

Its less than 600 a day. And judging by the numbers being reported into our local knackery I'd say it's conservative enough.
Cows only fed last summers silage faired poorly over the winter. For many calving is the last straw and they're just done!!

mf240

bbam wrote: »

Its less than 600 a day. And judging by the numbers being reported into our local knackery I'd say it's conservative enough.
Cows only fed last summers silage faired poorly over the winter. For many calving is the last straw and they're just done!!

Was reported in independent two weeks ago that dead animal collections are up 20% this year.

pakalasa

"Figures released by the Department of Agriculture's animal identification and movement system (AIM) reveal that 55,249 cattle died on Irish farms in January and February alone – an increase of 20pc on last year."

http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/farmers-selling-their-cattle-early-to-save-them-from-starving-to-death-29159887.html

Hardly BS now is it?

Dampintheattic

pakalasa wrote: »

"Figures released by the Department of Agriculture's animal identification and movement system (AIM) reveal that 55,249 cattle died on Irish farms in January and February alone – an increase of 20pc on last year."

http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/farmers-selling-their-cattle-early-to-save-them-from-starving-to-death-29159887.html

Hardly BS now is it?

20% increase is a fair increase, but from the comments above, you would think 200%.
By the way, isn't the national herd also a lot bigger than last year according to stats issued a few months ago.

mf240

Dampintheattic wrote: »

20% increase is a fair increase, but from the comments above, you would think 200%.
By the way, isn't the national herd also a lot bigger than last year according to stats issued a few months ago.

20% nationally but in areas of poor land this would be a lot higher whereas in the likes of Meath deaths would be the same.

jimmydkid

Local knackery guy said they were 50% up on this time last year and judging by the pile of livestock in his yard I would beleive him!

Butcher Boy

would a lot of it be down to pi bvd stock.

keep going

it seems to be in some yards and not others-escaping away good enough myself(abortions aside)but have seen a couple of horror stories in other yards-they just didnt realise their cows were in trouble until too late and resulted in alot of problems

kevthegaff

id say sucklers and small dairy farms are same as, but dairy farmers who expanded and are under pressure financially, feed wise are losing more but i may be wrong so dont lambast me!

greysides

pakalasa wrote: »

"Figures released by the Department of Agriculture's animal identification and movement system (AIM) reveal that 55,249 cattle died on Irish farms in January and February alone – an increase of 20pc on last year."

As this winter goes on the effects are likely to worsen the percentage increase for the next two months. Many suckler cows will be two months heavier in-calf and the silage two months less too.

As an observation, I'd say most dairy farms are maintaining their cows in good condition, with a few a little worse than normal.

stand on!!

Local knackery here cant keep it done they have four lorries on the road. alot of the PI calves there to this year

Western Pomise

Had a ewe collected few weeks back,Knackery man said business up by a third on average,lots of ewes with mineral deficiencies/lack of grass dying and cattle weak from poor silage.Personally I think that the lack of sunshine last summer is also a major factor....lot of ewes around here aborted a few weeks pre lambing time....most men with a fair few ewes are talking at least 10 to 15 % mortality and far higher in cases......may leave lambs dearer in summer as there will be far less of them for marts!!!

whelan1

notice how none of them have put their prices down, they must be making a fortune:cool: our vet always says the dry cow needs a rising plain of nutrtion coming up to calving, also needs energy in the diet....alot of the deaths are probably down to the silage from last year not having the same "energy" or nutrients as other years, it got very little sun

bbam

whelan1 wrote: »

notice how none of them have put their prices down, they must be making a fortune:cool: our vet always says the dry cow needs a rising plain of nutrtion coming up to calving, also needs energy in the diet....alot of the deaths are probably down to the silage from last year not having the same "energy" or nutrients as other years, it got very little sun

And all that poor silage is on the back of a summer of poor washed out grass which in itself was low in essential minerals and trace elements.

reilig

mf240 wrote: »

20% nationally but in areas of poor land this would be a lot higher whereas in the likes of Meath deaths would be the same.

Would it?

The people in the previous posts are talking about places like Tipperary, Cork etc. You'll find that places with poorer land are better prepared for bad weather with sufficient fodder, housing, minerals etc - because this is something that they have to be prepared for on a regular basis.

While mortality rates on bad land are up, I'd imagine that they don't compare to the increase in mortality rates on good land where the farmers and farms had little or no preparation for bad weather, long winters etc. because they rarely had a need to be prepared for this kind of stuff in the past!

whelan1

cant get my head around this , surely if cattle are starving you either sell them OR buy food for them you dont let them die ... heard of a lad that the dept shot 6 of his cows and a load of sheep as they where starving:eek:

pakalasa

Cattle dying from straight starvation is a different thing altogether. There were far more deaths from indirect things like reduced immunity. The last straw that broke the camels back, as it were.

Muckit

pakalasa wrote: »

reduced immunity

Reduced immunity to what????? And what causes this reduced immunity??

reilig

Muckit wrote: »

Reduced immunity to what????? And what causes this reduced immunity??

Lack of minerals and vitamins in grass at the last back end had a big impact on immune systems. Vast majority of farmers in the country are not feeding mineral supplements. Bad silage had low mineral content. Many farmers fed straw without minerals. People restricted silage and fed fodder stretcher without minerals. All had a big impact on immune systems (ie. lowered resistance). Cattle that should be on grass a month now have gotten very little and have been eating supplemented lower quality fodder. It's most of the problem.

Richk2012

Muckit wrote: »

Reduced immunity to what????? And what causes this reduced immunity??

Well i suppose the less the animal is being fed the weaker it gets .

The weaker it gets , the weaker its immune system becomes .

If it has a weak immune system it would pick up any sort of disease thats goin and wont have any resistance .


The oul lad tlkn to a friend of his who is a livestockhaulier , and was tellin him he got a run of ewes and lambs to Carnaross last week .
Said he'd take his time as he didnt think there be many there , and no need to be too early .
When he got there the lads said leave load on the truck , no room in pens .
The place was jammed with ewes and lambs at foot .

Alot of lads under financial pressure and forced to sell some stock in order to feed the rest

whelan1

reilig wrote: »

Lack of minerals and vitamins in grass at the last back end had a big impact on immune systems. Vast majority of farmers in the country are not feeding mineral supplements. Bad silage had low mineral content. Many farmers fed straw without minerals. People restricted silage and fed fodder stretcher without minerals. All had a big impact on immune systems (ie. lowered resistance). Cattle that should be on grass a month now have gotten very little and have been eating supplemented lower quality fodder. It's most of the problem.

it still boils down to you either sell them or feed them properly, whats the point in paying the knacker

pakalasa

It was the vet that was saying it to me, towards the end of last year. It's no different to humans - if you don't eat right, you're more likely to get sick. Suckler cows, to some degree, live off their backs during the winter. Last year you had a double whammy, they went into the winter in poor condition and then poor silage to eat after that.

Conmaicne Mara

mf240 wrote: »

20% nationally but in areas of poor land this would be a lot higher whereas in the likes of Meath deaths would be the same.

I can safely say I farm in an area of "poor land".

My ewes never wintered as well, and never went into lambing in as good condition. Had 0 abortions, only pulled one lamb due to big horns. Having strong, lively, quick to get up lambs. No lack of milk in any ewe. More twins than last year.

Have some grass, but I would have a lot more had I followed my usual management plan. Fed hay (unusual) in addition to the usual amount of 18% ewe & lamb ration.

I've not seen the knackery truck around in ages, not heard any horror stories from any quarter and I'd talk to a fair few farmers regularly. Lost 3 lambs to foxes - as they were being born, 3 out of two sets of twins :rolleyes:, lost 1 more lamb I found lying in a puddle, presume the ewe had twins and lambed that one into it. - If I had my sheep tunnel I would have 0 lamb losses.

All things considered we escaped the worst of the weather and anyone with their eye on the ball has done OK. I'm actually quite happy with my lambing for 2013 so far.

Stories of our demise have been greatly exaggerated

Muckit

reilig wrote: »

Lack of minerals and vitamins in grass at the last back end had a big impact on immune systems. Vast majority of farmers in the country are not feeding mineral supplements. Bad silage had low mineral content. Many farmers fed straw without minerals. People restricted silage and fed fodder stretcher without minerals. All had a big impact on immune systems (ie. lowered resistance). Cattle that should be on grass a month now have gotten very little and have been eating supplemented lower quality fodder. It's most of the problem.

I suspected this to be the case Reilig. But I wanted the original poster to back up his post.

I'm sorry if I come across harsh, but I find the whole thing really inexcusable. Bags of loose general purpose mineral supplement can be bought relatively cheaply. http://nutribio.ie/nutrition-product/nutribio-cattle-general-purpose-25kg/

No need to feed to the manufacturer's recommendations, a little and often approach shook on silage is better than none at all. Any daw with a brain in their head would know that silage made last summer from grass standing up for weeks,has to be lacking in minerals. If feeding straw, that's a no brainer.

Like FFS, keeping animals alive is basic animal husbandry. What's the point of all these discussions groups etc if lads can't or are ignorant to the basics.

I think the IFJ openly advocating lads to not sell cattle, or only as a last resort to be totally Irresponsible.

Richk2012

whelan1 wrote: »

it still boils down to you either sell them or feed them properly, whats the point in paying the knacker

I know what your saying and im of the same opinion as yourself however id imagine whats happened in some suckler cases is that the cows have been in all winter , on average/poor quality silage and maybe straw mixed aswell to stretch the supply.
Getting no concentrates or minerals on the lead up to calving.

Cows slowly getting weaker and finally when her 9 months is up and she hasnt the energy or strength , to calve , and spring down which results in a downer cow.
At this stage its too late to intervene with added supplements and for farmers with tight spring calving patterns there faced with any of the older cows as prime candidates for the inevitable .

Its all coming to light now with so many casualties , however the farmer who never needed to feed additional supplements before was prob in that frame of mind until it was all too late to act , and has never found himself in this situation before .

whelan1

where are the ifa in all this?????????? i am getting texts a couple of times a week from teagasc, feck all from our national farming group-again-

1chippy

I was talking to knackery lorry driver and he did say things were a lot busier than usual. he says that getting paid for taking the animals away is the biggest issue at the moment .most lads are stretched and even the few quid for taking them away cant be got off some lads.

reilig

whelan1 wrote: »

it still boils down to you either sell them or feed them properly, whats the point in paying the knacker

I agree with you totally. But a lot of farmers don't see it this way!

Muckit

Teagasc are another crowd of daws. Running ads in the IFJ for the last couple of weeks about early spring turnout!!! Have they set foot outside the office door at all this year? WTF has cattle out... where is the grass FFS!!?? Even the 'better' farmers are selling silage among themselves!! Oh my blood pressure

whelan1

reilig wrote: »

I agree with you totally. But a lot of farmers don't see it this way!

is mental health a big issue also? i know my da said he can not remember not having cattle out by april 1st

bbam

Richk2012 wrote: »

I know what your saying and im of the same opinion as yourself however id imagine whats happened in some suckler cases is that the cows have been in all winter , on average/poor quality silage and maybe straw mixed aswell to stretch the supply.
Getting no concentrates or minerals on the lead up to calving.

Cows slowly getting weaker and finally when her 9 months is up and she hasnt the energy or strength , to calve , and spring down which results in a downer cow.
At this stage its too late to intervene with added supplements and for farmers with tight spring calving patterns there faced with any of the older cows as prime candidates for the inevitable .

Its all coming to light now with so many casualties , however the farmer who never needed to feed additional supplements before was prob in that frame of mind until it was all too late to act , and has never found himself in this situation before .

I'm not having a go with anyone but the birds in the trees were singing about the poor silage at the start of the winter. All the advice from every corner was test your silage and feed accordingly. We never tested before but got it done on the general advice.
I know lads that said that they'd know by the stock how good the silage was, now the knackery knows how good their silage was . Lads didn't heed the advice and act accordingly, and it's worked out poorly for many.

reilig

whelan1 wrote: »

is mental health a big issue also? i know my da said he can not remember not having cattle out by april 1st

I'd say it's not having had to deal with it before. We all know that farmers don't like doing something different!

Conmaicne Mara

reilig wrote: »

I'd say it's not having had to deal with it before. We all know that farmers don't like doing something different!

Another reason I'm looking forward to my first STAP meeting

Conmaicne Mara

Actually the one new thing I did do last Winter was put out mineral buckets on the hill with the ewes. I think that definitely helped them keep their condition and make better use of the available grazing. The neighbours got some benefit out of me, but sure no use in cutting off my nose to spite my face for a few €16 buckets.