Unemployed & no commitments? Why don't you come to China?

Mr. Loverman

I live in Beijing. There are tons of jobs here for English teachers. The money is very good (middle management wage) and it's a relatively easy, stress free job.

If you don't want to come to Beijing (pollution, etc., I understand), you could pick anywhere else in China.

The country is very interesting (pretty much the exact opposite of Ireland) and you'll be treated very well. There is a weird reverse racism against white people here.

Why don't you consider it?

I'll try to answer any of your questions.

Tigger

do i need to speak mandiran(sp?)
do i need to be qualified to teach
what's cost of living/healthcare like
do i need a visa

RDM_83 again

I know this is the height of lazyness (as I should look up links) but are teaching qualifications/experience expected I've a Bsc and an MA but no teaching experience, also whats the work situation like for people that do not hold degree's as my OH hasn;t got one but does have years of good experience (including work for multinationals) in a financial/clerical field (payroll)
Which links and websites did you find useful?

Mr. Loverman

You don't need to speak Mandarin. In fact, they don't really want teachers who can speak Mandarin.

On a day to day level obviously it is good to have some Mandarin. I'm terrible at it but I can get by.

The only requirement is a degree, but if you know the right agency you can get a work permit without a degree. Or you can get a "business visa" which sort of allows you to work and has no education requirements. If you were a dishonest sort you could just pretend you have a degree. Obviously I don't recommend this.

Cost of living here is as cheap or as expensive as you want. On a teachers wage you can live very comfortably and save money each month.

There are also loads of non-teaching jobs too.

Have a look at www.thebeijinger.com

RDM_83 again

So Tefl if you don't have a qualification is not really worth getting, in relations to the agencies is there any scams and poor practices that you need to watch out for, or simply where is the most reputable source of agencies?
I presume the Hong Kong situation is rather different to mainland china still as well in relation to visa's and gaining employment as an english speaker
(again sorry for the lazyness I know google should be my friend)

Mr. Loverman

No problem on the laziness Getting an Irish perspective is probably better.

HK and Macau are totally different than mainland China. They are much nicer and better in nearly every way, but they are proper cities. HK for example is like London or New York.

Don't bother with agencies. Just come here on a tourist visa and find a job. You will get better pay and can find something immediately if you want. If you come on a standard tourist visa (90 days) you have loads of time.

Don't bother with any TEFL nonsense unless you are low in confidence and would feel better with a bit of training. (Nothing wrong with that btw).

Mr. Loverman

No problem on the laziness Getting an Irish perspective is probably better.

HK and Macau are totally different than mainland China. They are much nicer and better in nearly every way, but they are proper cities. HK for example is like London or New York.

Don't bother with agencies. Just come here on a tourist visa and find a job. You will get better pay and can find something immediately if you want. If you come on a standard tourist visa (90 days) you have loads of time.

Don't bother with any TEFL nonsense unless you are low in confidence and would feel better with a bit of training. (Nothing wrong with that btw).

RDM_83 again

Yeah the reason I ask about Hong Kong is because with the financial stuff and multinationals the OH half might have an easier time of it, just looking at the wikipedia page for Macau now seems pretty interesting place. thanks for the info anyway, going to check out that link.

Mr. Loverman

Shanghai is nice. It's the financial centre of mainland China.

Hong Kong is a sort of alpha male playground. I'm not sure if it really suits the Irish psyche.

RandolphEsq

How much money should one arrive in Beijing with to live for a month or two in order to apply for, get set up in, a job?

Mr. Loverman

RandolphEsq wrote: »

How much money should one arrive in Beijing with to live for a month or two in order to apply for, get set up in, a job?

You probably will be paid monthly, and you'll need to pay a deposit for a flat, so I would think something like 1.5k is a safe figure. Obviously if you can go higher than this, great.

Note 1.5k is a normal, middle class Chinese style existence. I am assuming you are not living a completely western lifestyle.

EDIT: Maybe 2k

jkell061

Mr loverman,
I'm an engineer graduate n eager to get out of Ireland, I'm having no luck on the job front, and China does kind of appeal to me. U mentioned earlier not to bother with the tefl, but I assume that's to ur fellow English teachers, would u recommend I do the course asap and go for it? Looking at thebeijing website u mentioned and there's loads of jobs on it for that. Would it be worth my while or are only qualified teachers sought? I wanna get back into travelling n exploring n when I saw the name of ur thread I see an opportunity, thanks..

Mr. Loverman

I'm not actually an English teacher, but my friends are.

I would only advise you do a TEFL course if you feel you genuinely need it (you probably don't) or think it would help your confidence. In China the most important thing is you are white and possibly a native English speaker. Dressing well and not being fat help too. (Sorry if that sounds harsh, but China puts a lot more emphasis on physical appearance than Ireland).

If you go to one of the smaller cities, you could get a job even if you have one leg and aren't a native speaker. They can't get teachers.

The schools will probably say they want X amount of experience, but that doesn't really mean anything. They will meet you anyway and if they like the look of you, you will get the job.

jkell061

I'd have a good enough grasp of the English language, grammar, spelling etc, so I wouldn't be low in confidence about that, its just if i thought if I needed the tefl course i'd just do it and have it done.

Ok, would u mind suggesting a few of the smaller towns u might have been or that u know are good places? I might go over on the 90day visa and have a scout around. I've done a bit of travelling but never Asia so u have me intrigued now, and China hasn't been until now a place I've really considered for work/travel this time around, so thanks again.

markfinn

Mainly because I just got home after 8 years there.

But yeah, Easy enough work as long as you're not a complete waster, decent living money (forget about sending any significant amount home though, the exchange rate/cost of living difference is brutal), most mod cons available.

It can get lonely though. Be warned of that.

Mr. Loverman

Hangzhou is a nice city. Chengdu is nice too. Chongqing (largest city in the world?) actually has a good vibe and is quite cheap.

It might be worth your while to come here on a long holiday, travel around a big and find which place you like.

Obviously if you want to avoid harsh winters you need to avoid the north. Even Beijing has 6ish month winters where it is always -5 or whatever.

Oranage2

I arrived in China and got a job after 3 days. its definitely not stress free teaching kids at the start. I teach in a small town, 6 million, get 900e a month, not that great Irish standard but you could save over half without trying.

Mr. Loverman

Oranage2 wrote: »

I arrived in China and got a job after 3 days. its definitely not stress free teaching kids at the start. I teach in a small town, 6 million, get 900e a month, not that great Irish standard but you could save over half without trying.

You don't have to teach kids though. My friends do corporate English teaching. Better pay but not as easy to come by as teaching kids.

markfinn

I found the corporate stuff more hassle than the kids tbh.

Of course, the Kids stuff was pretty straightforward and simply being white and in fact natively English speaking was all the quality control they needed. The corporates wanted way more "Feedback". Ick

snubbleste

Do you need BBC English? :pac:

markfinn

snubbleste wrote: »

Do you need BBC English? :pac:

Depends on the location and work you're doing, but outside Hong Kong, no, certainly not.

I've known a few teachers whose English was bad enough to have other teachers complaining about not being able to understand them.

Most recently an Icelandic guy who could read and write English, but insisted on using "morely formalistic" Icelandic grammar and pronunciation.

As far as I know he's still working in the school.

scopper

Sounds interesting, but surely a risk to simply jump over to China and hope to land a position?

Oranage2

scopper wrote: »

Sounds interesting, but surely a risk to simply jump over to China and hope to land a position?

You can apply first and do a skype interview and then arrive after you get offered a job.

markfinn

scopper wrote: »

Sounds interesting, but surely a risk to simply jump over to China and hope to land a position?

Somewhat, and also quite illegal.
Bribery, workarounds and general avoidance of the law is the law of the land in China. Doesn't mean it's a good idea to start off that way.

Apply from home, talk online/phone/skype, get an offer and then head out.

Schools desperate enough to hire people off the street may or may not be all that reliable as employers. Admittedly this is true of schools that do the paperwork properly too, but if things do go pear shaped, it's nice to know you can get consular/legal assistance without having to go the whole "web of lies" routine.

Mr. Loverman

scopper wrote: »

Sounds interesting, but surely a risk to simply jump over to China and hope to land a position?

It is absolutely normal for people to apply for jobs in China.

If you think the risk is not finding a job, there is no risk of that unless you are a world class freak.

The only risk as far as I can see it is you won't like China, so won't want to stay here. China isn't for everyone. There's a saying amongst expats here: China won't change for you; you have to change for China. So if you're a negative, uptight sort of person, you may not be suited for China as it is pretty much the opposite of Ireland, in good ways and bad ways.

Scram

you know what i dont have a Degree but im close to one and this sounds like such a great chance to leave this country.

Do i need an english degree? or just a general one? i.e a BSC in blah?

keithb93

What does the job entail? How do you teach people English if you can't speak mandarin?

EdenHazard

Links? I'm not that good at English but got a A2 in the LC in Higher. Would be interested maybe. Problem is I'm still in college, but any links would be awesome.

Tar.Aldarion

keithb93 wrote: »

What does the job entail? How do you teach people English if you can't speak mandarin?

Yeah, say you get a class of kids, nobody speaks English. Start pointing and saying words is it
What is the wage/range?

steveLFC24

Sounds interesting. I've actually spent 5 days in Shanghai, stopped there on the way back from Australia, fantastic city. Never knew there was such a big market for English teachers. Any links to good websites where jobs are posted?

Mr. Loverman

You don't need to speak Mandarin. In fact, they want teachers with no Mandarin. So don't worry about any language issues.

Regarding jobs, just come here on a tourist visa and get a job, or use google. You will get a much higher wage if you come here.

Any degree is fine.

jkell061

And what about just landing out there on your own and English being your only language, it must be difficult finding your feet and all at first. Is there English speaking communities that could be of help when ur finding your way? Pure ignorant I know!

monkey tree

Mr. Loverman you have truly excited me! Thank you

Blue Dreamer

what about other jobs apart from teaching english. banking and finance etc. have qfa and all that. many opprtunities in this line?

Villaboi!

Currently in the process of applying for jobs out in China at the moment as I graduate in June. I'm probably going to do a TEFL course myself personally would kind of prefer to have one.

What I'm wondering really is what would you estimate start up costs for a period abroad in China i.e Flights, Accommodation, Visa (if getting one) and money for getting by at the start???

Mr. Loverman

Many Chinese people speak OK English; you can't graduate university here unless you have a high level of English.

In general, asking a "college aged" person for help will work out well. Smiling and pointing works well too.

I have basic Chinese and can get by absolutely fine. When I arrived here I couldn't speak a word of it. I survived, no problems.

There are lots of non-teaching jobs too. In my experience, if you are in any way competent you will be far superior than the average expat. I don't know why, but China seems to have a lot of clueless foreigners. So there are opportunities here if you are smart.

Regarding start up costs, it really depends on your lifestyle.

Let's say you immediately move into a shared apartment in a nice part of Beijing.

EUR 300 per month for rent and bills.
EUR 300 as a deposit.
(Note rent is paid quarterly here, so your first rent bill will be EUR 900 + EUR 300)

Food can be as cheap as you want, unless you eat Western like I do.

Keep in mind the average Chinese person earns **** all and they survive fine, so you will be OK, don't worry.

banditmorris

Can i get a job in the field of science....i dont want to be teaching snotty kids....can i not get a good job related to my area..Im a man of science so id like to stick with that..are the international country english speaking friendly..or will i start and have to read my SOP's in mandarin..im fecked if thats the case.

banditmorris

EUR 300 per month for rent and bills.
EUR 300 as a deposit.
(Note rent is paid quarterly here, so your first rent bill will be EUR 900 + EUR 300)


Is this a single apartment or a shared accomadation?Its a bit expensive for china..with that money youd want to be staying in the emporers palace....:pac:

markfinn

banditmorris wrote: »

Can i get a job in the field of science....i dont want to be teaching snotty kids....can i not get a good job related to my area..Im a man of science so id like to stick with that..are the international country english speaking friendly..or will i start and have to read my SOP's in mandarin..im fecked if thats the case.

Not much of a chance there. You'd have to find an international company to employ you outside of China and then transfer you in. Or prove that you have some essential and unique skills that they can't source internally in their 1,400,000,000 citizens.

Given that you'd be expected to join a highly technical team all of whom but you spoke Mandarin, and communicate easily with them on technical matters pretty much continually, while most of them spoke little to no English...

Yeah, not going to happen.

markfinn

banditmorris wrote: »

EUR 300 per month for rent and bills.
EUR 300 as a deposit.

Its a bit expensive for china..with that money youd want to be staying in the emporers palace....:pac:

I don't know. Many of the nicer cities, 3000RMB is entry level for decent apartments that aren't in the middle of nowhere.

Fighting Irish

ifl

scopper

Thanks for the responses. One question: how can you tell a decent company from a bad one online i.e. if you go the route of looking for an offer before you get there? I presume the best companies are now well-known.

thiarfearr

What is actually involved in teaching English? How do you teach, what would a typical day/week be like?
Also, are there much opportunities in other English speaking jobs, say like customer service or editing or similar?

Mr. Loverman

banditmorris wrote: »

Can i get a job in the field of science....i dont want to be teaching snotty kids....can i not get a good job related to my area..Im a man of science so id like to stick with that..are the international country english speaking friendly..or will i start and have to read my SOP's in mandarin..im fecked if thats the case.

banditmorris wrote: »

Is this a single apartment or a shared accomadation?Its a bit expensive for china..with that money youd want to be staying in the emporers palace....:pac:

I recently started working for a multi-national in Beijing. I speak English at my job and do tech work. These jobs do exist, but it is easier to find work as an English teacher, and less stressful. The Chinese way of working is quite different to Ireland. (Their education system is 100% based on memorisation.)

Beijing is not a cheap city. There are other cities which are much much cheaper. EUR 300 for a room in an apartment would be a normal enough room in a middle class apartment.

Mr. Loverman

scopper wrote: »

Thanks for the responses. One question: how can you tell a decent company from a bad one online i.e. if you go the route of looking for an offer before you get there? I presume the best companies are now well-known.

This is a good question. Really the only way is to try to speak to people who work at the company.

From what I've heard, companies can have weird contracts (e.g. they keep half of your first months wage until after your contract is finished) because so many foreigners here are drunken idiots who take the piss and walk out of their job when a better offer comes along.

In general, if you are nice to Chinese people and treat them like an equal, they will treat you with kindness and respect.

But overall workers have less rights in China. The concept of suing your employer is probably non-existent.

Mr. Loverman

thiarfearr wrote: »

What is actually involved in teaching English? How do you teach, what would a typical day/week be like?
Also, are there much opportunities in other English speaking jobs, say like customer service or editing or similar?

It totally depends on the job. You could be teaching kids basic English for half a day each day, or you could be doing conversational one on one English with adults. In general you wouldn't teach more than 25 hours a week.

There are other English speaking jobs, but you'd need to have a skill. For example, I turned down a SEO job in an English speaking office.

Mr. Loverman

I've been to these Chinese cities if any of you are considering them and want my opinion. I've tried to order them by "easiest to live" to "hardest but maybe more interesting place to live".

Hong Kong
Macau
Shanghai
Beijing
Shenzhen
Guangzhou
Hangzhou
Suzhou
Tianjin
Qingdao
Chengdu
Chongqing
Nanjing
Zhengzhou
Changsha
Dandong

Qingdao is famous for it's fresh air and nature, if that would be your main concern. Chongqing is the world's largest city. (Yeah, no one else has heard of it either).

Weathering

Hi. I'm on an extended gap year atm. What other type of work could I get in to China with like bar work etc. Or would it even be worth what you'd earn a bar man. I need to leave Ireland asap cracking up ha

Maudi

im far to old to go but i just wonder about freedom of information re internet etc.i know it available but are their restrictions on it or any other restrictions we in the west take for granted? m

Lightbulb Sun

Maudi wrote: »

im far to old to go but i just wonder about freedom of information re internet etc.i know it available but are their restrictions on it or any other restrictions we in the west take for granted? m

Twitter, youtube and facebook are blocked amongst others. There's a wikipedia page where you can see all blocked websites. You can probably buy VPNs to get around this restriction. My cousin did this while living there briefly. Others may be able to expand on the internet issue. I haven't actually visited China.

Mr. Loverman

Weathering wrote: »

Hi. I'm on an extended gap year atm. What other type of work could I get in to China with like bar work etc. Or would it even be worth what you'd earn a bar man. I need to leave Ireland asap cracking up ha

You could get a job at an Irish bar, but the money wouldn't be good.

Teaching English pays a very high wage.

Have a look at thebeijinger.com for ideas on the types of jobs which are available.