Aer Lingus to base 757s at Shannon ???

Aerohead

Listening to Morning Ireland today there was a guy on the radio who said Aer Lingus will shortly announce new routes from Shannon to the US including a daily year round Shannon to Boston, he also said Aer Lingus were looking at possibly baseing two 757s at Shannon, Ryanair will announce new routes from Shannon in the coming weeks and yesterday they said they were looking at opening a maintenance base at Shannon.

Fantastic news for Shannon if it all comes together.

Merl1n

They must be planning a new aircraft as currently they dont have any 757s

cson

There's a big thread on this somewhere.

2 ex Finnair 757s iirc.

Peregrine

See this thread, the rumour was discussed as it unfolded a few weeks ago.

They will be wet leased from Air Contractors I believe.

Jamie2k9

The new Aer Lingus routes will not be from SNN to the US, they will be two routes from Dublin.

donvito99

Jamie2k9 wrote: »

The new Aer Lingus routes will not be from SNN to the US, they will be two routes from Dublin.

Canada + West Coast.

Fingers crossed.

Any confirmation Jamie of the beefing up of routes ex-SNN?

Plowman

This post has been deleted.

roundymac

Plowman wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

It would also mean that Boston ex Dublin would fly direct instead of a stopover at SNN. .

Bessarion

roundymac wrote: »

It would also mean that Boston ex Dublin would fly direct instead of a stopover at SNN. .

SNN stopover flights were stopped a few years ago.

Smaller aircraft would allow 2 daily departures from SNN (JFK and BOS)
This would free up an A330 to operate a West Coast route from DUB.
A rumoured 3rd B757 could operate to Canada 3-4 times a week.

The Winter charters with the A330 were mentioned in the 2012 financial results. This would be as a result of the lowever intensity schedule than any route juggling. (ie. EI have 7 A330, but in Winter the schedule only needs 6)

basill

Expect more charters or ACMI deals as per the prelim announcement. Basically we will be looking at flying for anyone so long as there is a buck to be made.

Chop Chop

So does this mean the 757's will be in service this summer rather than October ?

Jamie2k9

Chop Chop wrote: »

So does this mean the 757's will be in service this summer rather than October ?

It will be the start of the winter schedule before any 757 operate flights.

RadarControl

If they timed it correctly and used an A330 to Canada instead of 757 they could get a good few transfers from Etihad using codeshare or joint venture. Etihad are looking to expand number of flights to Canada but cannot get any more rights.

Tenger

I'll go out on a limb and guess that the Ethiad connections may be a factor in any new route decision making by EI.


Share price is up over the last few days.....investors are obviously getting info and are happy with the direction that EI are taking.

basill

Yep and the other factors will be the feed from the UK via regional. Can't see an A330 being used to prove a route such as Canada. Ideally I think Mueller would love to have the A321NEO now to throw at places like Canada and SNN to the East Coast. Its low risk stuff as they can be pulled off and sent across Europe or to the Canaries if any new routes don't work out. Whereas getting hold of additional A330s is a massive capital/leasing outlay.

cuterob

6500 visas for Canada went in three days here.. i think there will be a bit of business for Canada from Ireland

basill

And that is the sort of short term logic that got AL into the poo poo over the years.

The current management wouldn't launch a 330 onto a route so it can fly Irish economy class pax 1 way at rock bottom prices. People that are heading for the hills (oz, Canada etc) don't care about direct or 1 stop flights. They want to pay next to nothing. That is not the sort of pax AL wants.

brandon_flowers

I agree with you basill but there is no cheap way to Canada from Ireland at present. It is a minimum €500 every way you look at it. You need to take a flight from DUB to another expensive hub like LHR, AMS, CDG and then fly to Canada or fly with EI, UA, US to an East Coast hub and then onwards from there.

Surely EI could run a 757 from DUB to Montreal or Toronto at €500 a seat and turn a profit. The demand for Canada would be on an even keel with the demand from SNN to East Coast I would think at this stage.

Agree re: the 330 though, that would be madness.

Jamie2k9

I agree with you basill but there is no cheap way to Canada from Ireland at present. It is a minimum €500 every way you look at it

Don't agree just booked return flights direct with Air Transit for 714. Air Canada slightly more but there flights are very full for my dates.

brandon_flowers

I meant €500 return or is your 714 a typo?

Edit: Forgot Air Transat flew direct actually, they didn't back in the days I worked in Canada.

Jamie2k9

brandon_flowers wrote: »

I meant €500 return or is your 714 a typo?

No currently Air Transit and Air Canada are between 400-450 out and 370-450 back. The flights I'm on have 85% of seats sold already so I expected to pay more and its end of July/early August which would be one of the bussiest travel weeks in the year.

I also looked at EI via ORD around 100 more, KLM via AMS around 200 more, LH via FRA around 100 more, AC via LHR around 600 more. I think its a good deal considering its direct and the time when you look at connecting which is more.

Aer Lingus with the B757 on the route will bring some comp but I don't expect a major change in fares. Just on the topic of the A330 going to YYZ not for now but I wouldn't rule it out for the peak season in future. Air Canada and Air Transit have no problems filling the A330, A310 and B767 even with high fares but EI could make it work for peak but with the A332, the B757 is ideal for year round which is needed. Air Transit had planned a year round service which would be operating now but they pulled it before it went on sale.

donvito99

Aer Lingus will charge what they can. Yields, yields and yields. Eliminate that consumer surplus.

cuterob

basill wrote: »

And that is the sort of short term logic that got AL into the poo poo over the years.

The current management wouldn't launch a 330 onto a route so it can fly Irish economy class pax 1 way at rock bottom prices. People that are heading for the hills (oz, Canada etc) don't care about direct or 1 stop flights. They want to pay next to nothing. That is not the sort of pax AL wants.

I was more thinking 757 from dublin to toronto.. A lot of people wont be leaving straight away..some people have two years before they can enter canada and some have one year also there will be another 6500 visas given out next january too.. Surely with people visiting family etc would add a lot of business to it

Also as regards flights to Canada.. I got a flight with BA one way.. Dub-Heathrow-Vancouver for 350e ! not bad at all I thought

Fattes

Have flown to Canada direct from Dublin and Via London and the most expensive ticket I have bought was €550, have gottent them for as little as €350

Matthew Gleeson

OK first of all folks the hole 757 thing is just chit-chat here on Boards. No one has actually come out with anything concrete about it. Also EI will only use the A330 for any long haul ops until they get the NEO. Air Contractors don't have 757's either. Until I there is a release statement on the EI website or from a descent news source its just someone trolling!

Skuxx

Matthew Gleeson wrote: »

OK first of all folks the hole 757 thing is just chit-chat here on Boards. No one has actually come out with anything concrete about it. Also EI will only use the A330 for any long haul ops until they get the NEO. Air Contractors don't have 757's either. Until I there is a release statement on the EI website or from a descent news source its just someone trolling!

Well I know that Aer Lingus have been in talks with Shannon Aerospace about supplying line maintenance for the 757's so there must be some truth in it!

charliehotel

Matthew Gleeson wrote: »

OK first of all folks the hole 757 thing is just chit-chat here on Boards. No one has actually come out with anything concrete about it. Also EI will only use the A330 for any long haul ops until they get the NEO. Air Contractors don't have 757's either. Until I there is a release statement on the EI website or from a descent news source its just someone trolling!

See this: http://www.ittn.ie/bulletins/aer-lingus-to-expand-flights/

The 757 aircraft are to come from Finnair but will be operated under an ACMI lease from Air Contractors for 3 years

Matthew Gleeson

Says who? EI use an all Airbus fleet. I get that they have least an MD11 and L1011 in the past but I just can't see this one happening. I'll have to see it to believe it. The one argument I do see for this hole 757 thing is that they are cancelling their A350 orders in favor of NEOs for Trans-Atlantic Ops.

Matthew Gleeson

charliehotel wrote: »

See this: http://www.ittn.ie/bulletins/aer-lingus-to-expand-flights/

The 757 aircraft are to come from Finnair but will be operated under an ACMI lease from Air Contractors for 3 years

This link has a picture from Flight simulator.....hardly evidence worth investing your selves in.

Peregrine

Matthew Gleeson wrote: »

Says who? EI use an all Airbus fleet. I get that they have least an MD11 and L1011 in the past but I just can't see this one happening. I'll have to see it to believe it. The one argument I do see for this hole 757 thing is that they are cancelling their A350 orders in favor of NEOs for Trans-Atlantic Ops.

Having an all Airbus crew doesn't matter though, they're not type rating their own pilots or engineers. An ACMI lease would mean ACL would supply their crew and maintenance experties.

Matthew Gleeson

Nimrod 7 wrote: »

Having an all Airbus crew doesn't matter though, they're not type rating their own pilots or engineers. An ACMI lease would mean ACL would supply their crew and maintenance experties.

Oh cool. Thanks for clearing that up. Any word on if they are refitting the cabins on these 757s to EI economy standard?

charliehotel

Matthew Gleeson wrote: »

Says who? EI use an all Airbus fleet. I get that they have least an MD11 and L1011 in the past but I just can't see this one happening. I'll have to see it to believe it. The one argument I do see for this hole 757 thing is that they are cancelling their A350 orders in favor of NEOs for Trans-Atlantic Ops.

Numerous sources from within EI. This is 100% happening by the way. The 757s are being sourced only because A321NEOs are not currently available. It's only happening now because transatlantic operations have been performing very strongly and management is confident of this strategy.

EI cancelling A350 orders in favour of NEOs?? Give a source for this

Matthew Gleeson

charliehotel wrote: »

Numerous sources from within EI. This is 100% happening by the way. The 757s are being sourced only because A321NEOs are not currently available. It's only happening now because transatlantic operations have been performing very strongly and management is confident of this strategy.

EI cancelling A350 orders in favour of NEOs?? Give a source for this

Fantastic! Didn't know this. Will they repaint them?

I was under the impression that the A321NEOs were to be used instead of the A350 from SNN?

charliehotel

Matthew Gleeson wrote: »

Fantastic! Didn't know this. Will they repaint them?

I was under the impression that the A321NEOs were to be used instead of the A350 from SNN?

Full EI colours but the situation regarding the cabin interiors is thus far unclear. A321NEOs will be from SNN and DUB at least. A350s aren't being cancelled, just their initial slots are being swapped for A321NEO slots. EI will be the first carrier to have A321NEO ETOPS approval for transatlantic operations.

The A350s will come. The A330s will need replacement eventually.

Matthew Gleeson

charliehotel wrote: »

Full EI colours but the situation regarding the cabin interiors is thus far unclear. A321NEOs will be from SNN and DUB at least. A350s aren't being cancelled, just their initial slots are being swapped for A321NEO slots. EI will be the first carrier to have A321NEO ETOPS approval for transatlantic operations.

The A350s will come. The A330s will need replacement eventually.

Ah excellent. I was worried we wouldn't see the A350 flying the green shamrock! Hopefully they stick IFE on those 757s!:D

Zonda999

EI have A350 delivery slots in 2018 hopefully they will hold onto these and get that aircraft when any possible issues with the plane at launch are all cleared up.

As well, do people see EI purchasing more A330's in the meantime? Two of the three A332's are getting on a bit

lord lucan

Maybe just airport gossip/rumour, but heard this morning in work that EI DUB - SFO will return in the autumn.

donvito99

lord lucan wrote: »

Maybe just airport gossip/rumour, but heard this morning in work that EI DUB - SFO will return in the autumn.

Yes, it think Basill or one of our EI insiders alluded to this, as well as a Canadian route.

Were SFO/LAX year-round in the good old days?

cson

Matthew Gleeson wrote: »

Ah excellent. I was worried we wouldn't see the A350 flying the green shamrock! Hopefully they stick IFE on those 757s!:D

Doubtful we'll see IFE on the 757s bar J Class. In any event, and I think its been referenced a few times on this forum already with Cathay Pacific as an example, the trend appears to be heading toward in flight power sockets for personal tablets with wifi/downloadable content being the revenue driver here for Y class. A refit with IFE would be very expensive for leased aircraft that are almost certainly going to be on operating leases.

Zonda999 wrote: »

EI have A350 delivery slots in 2018 hopefully they will hold onto these and get that aircraft when any possible issues with the plane at launch are all cleared up.

As well, do people see EI purchasing more A330's in the meantime? Two of the three A332's are getting on a bit

Only EI-LAX and EI-DAA are > 5 years old. So no major fleet replacement programmes need to be ramped up yet. Even then, typical economic life of an aircraft is 25 years and LAX and DAA are 14 and 12 respectively so they are some time away from the scrapheap. Obviously maintenance costs go up with age and performance characteristics are magnified by improvements in newer aircraft but overall you'd imagine that LAX and DAA will operate with EI possibly up to the first deliveries of the A350 if they take them. Which is 2018 or thereabouts.

Peregrine

Silicon Republic reported on this today..

“Our transatlantic schedule for 2014 will not be finalised until June of this year, at the earliest,” a spokesman told Siliconrepublic.com.

“No decision has been made at this point in time.”

Full article

It's weird that they would report something like AL routes but I guess it's because of the IT giants companies in SF.

Neworder79

An Irish tech company owner based in US tweeted that a member of EI staff had told them SFO back from October. I think that's where it started.

Neworder79

More in the Indo...

http://www.independent.ie/business/irish/aer-lingus-plotting-return-of-san-francisco-service-29170397.html

Zonda999

http://www.routes-news.com/news/1213-aer-lingus-united-codeshare-expands

Didn't see this mentioned anywhere else on the forum. EXpanding the United codeshare to include the United DUB to IAD and SNN to ORD flights

martinsvi

airbus 321 neo max range is 3200nm - it's almost the same as distance from DUB to JFK... no operator ever on their right minds would use a jet on transatlantic operations that barely can make it to the destination.. even if you use it on SNN-BOS route - it still would end up in Gander refuelling most of the time because of strong headwinds...

Tenger

martinsvi wrote: »

airbus 321 neo max range is 3200nm - it's almost the same as distance from DUB to JFK... no operator ever on their right minds would use a jet on transatlantic operations that barely can make it to the destination.. even if you use it on SNN-BOS route - it still would end up in Gander refuelling most of the time because of strong headwinds...

Well the A321NEO has not even flown yet. So any rumours of its acquisition are just that until Airbus provides concrete figures on range/cost/efficiency. While the logic for EI getting some is sound lets not be getting ahead of ourselves and writing off the A350 order just yet.


P.S. not sure where you are getting your figures from martin but the A321NEO has the legs for UK-USA East Coast. Whereas the B757 can operate from N-W Europe to USA East Coast.

martinsvi

Tenger wrote: »

not sure where you are getting your figures from martin but the A321NEO has the legs for UK-USA East Coast. Whereas the B757 can operate from N-W Europe to USA East Coast.

from the back of my head...

just checked - Airbus website says your typical A321 does about 3000NM depending on config and NEO will add 590NM.. add those together and you get something similar to what wikipedia says - 3650NM B757 with winglets does 4100NM

I guess with 3650NM transatlantic operations might be possible. I would love to hear pilot opinions on this..

basill

It's pointless debating the range as its to early in the design. AL are stating the business case for the east coast to airbus and offering to take the lead on etops certifications. In order to do so Airbus will need to increase the range. The balls in their court but its a waste of time worrying about what Wikipedia is stating its legs are.

Kumsheen

martinsvi wrote: »

airbus 321 neo max range is 3200nm - it's almost the same as distance from DUB to JFK... no operator ever on their right minds would use a jet on transatlantic operations that barely can make it to the destination.. even if you use it on SNN-BOS route - it still would end up in Gander refuelling most of the time because of strong headwinds...

Don't know where you got that figure from. It's planned to have 3600nm range and should easily make Ireland - East Coast USA/Canada with reserves.

3200nm is more like the current HGW variant of A321 that some of the charter operators are using at the moment.

martinsvi

Kumsheen wrote: »

Don't know where you got that figure from. It's planned to have 3600nm range and should easily make Ireland - East Coast USA/Canada with reserves.

3200nm is more like the current HGW variant of A321 that some of the charter operators are using at the moment.

read the whole thread, will ya? I made a booboo and did set it right..

McWotever

EIN1436 just landed at DUB. A 757 owned by Titan, G-ZAPX. Is EI going ahead with the 757 plan?

No route plan according to PF.

b757

McWotever wrote: »

EIN1436 just landed at DUB. A 757 owned by Titan, G-ZAPX. Is EI going ahead with the 757 plan?

No route plan according to PF.

Titan are only used by EI and others as ad-hoc charters to cover some of their flights due to technical or operational reasons.

No announcement yet regarding the 757's.