LRC slash pretend library

JavaSa

Personally im tired of the LRC, 3 floors and its still impossible to find a quiet spot to work on a project.

Between groups chatting with each other, others chilling out between classes, some taking time to enjoy their lunch and others sitting on the third floor mauling each other and the rest playing games.

For students like myself, who actually want to study and work on course work what are we meant to do, wear blinders, industrial ear plugs, ear phones with music so loud we cant think to block out the noise ???

Its has been brought to the attention of computer services, library services, and student services, none of them seem to give a damn and basically they all pass the blame to someone else.

I dont know about other students, but i have paid €2250 this year, im really pissed off, the college is not providing a suitable environment for students to study,

is the college going to take this into account when deciding our grades.

Meathlass

Isn't there a quiet room on the ground floor?

Artful_Badger

Bit of annoying all right. More of a recreation area than an actual library. The quiet room downstairs is nice but no good when you need a pc to work on.

So its up to the zoo to try and find a free pc that works, and a chair that hasnt been dragged over to the tables by large groups of noisy people on their lunch.

Then do your best to ignore the noise, pray the spare pc that opens up beside you isnt taken by 3-4 giggling idiots and try to get something done.

The college could at least make an effort to discourage the place being used for purposes that have a negative impact on those trying to use it for whats its for. It wouldnt take much really. An e-mail, a few signs and a walk through a couple times of day by security staff with a mind to keep noise down and stop people misusing the facilities.

entropi

I have had the same problems myself, guys, and know exactly what you are talking about. All I can suggest, is that if nothing is being done from the library staff, try contacting someone in the SU office, see if they can intervene in any way.

The college is for everyone, and we should be able to avail of the facilities in a reasonable manner.

Meathlass

I have to say I was surprised when I first arrived in the college to find there were lecture rooms in the library. All that foot traffic doesn't make it conducive to studying.

Genghiz Cohen

Maybe even get the top floor marked as a silent area.

Should free up a few computers too

NedNoodles

The LRC is a disgrace. It's a social area with some computers in it.

zeds alive

Yes it's getting beyond a joke now , I have a serious amount of projects to work on and trying to find a computer is hard enough , but then you have to deal with the massive groups of people hanging out , yesterday I counted 7 people around 1 PC looking at videos on youtube and roaring an shouting.
I did see the security guard break up a huge group at the back of the 3rd floor , I counted 22 people !!

This really needs to be addressed , but I doubt by the student union , they are totally useless.

Artful_Badger

zeds alive wrote: »

Yes it's getting beyond a joke now , I have a serious amount of projects to work on and trying to find a computer is hard enough , but then you have to deal with the massive groups of people hanging out , yesterday I counted 7 people around 1 PC looking at videos on youtube and roaring an shouting.
I did see the security guard break up a huge group at the back of the 3rd floor , I counted 22 people !!

This really needs to be addressed , but I doubt by the student union , they are totally useless.

I'm not exactly sure what the student union actually does. First week in and they were organising binge drinking sessions for freshers week. Then they organised meetings, letters and a protest about grants, soon as the grants came through it was rag week and more organised binge drinking.

Safe to say whatever their purpose its nothing to do with education. So they would probably take the opposite view of the LRC and try to keep it a social centre rather than a study facility.

Doff

Artful_Badger wrote: »

I'm not exactly sure what the student union actually does. First week in and they were organising binge drinking sessions for freshers week. Then they organised meetings, letters and a protest about grants, soon as the grants came through it was rag week and more organised binge drinking.

Safe to say whatever their purpose its nothing to do with education. So they would probably take the opposite view of the LRC and try to keep it a social centre rather than a study facility.

This is completely my view. They are useless in my opinion when it comes to things that actually matter.

Has anyone ever reported someone for noise in the Library? If so what happened?

Meathlass

Aren't student elections coming up soon? A good platform for someone to stand on.

oscillating wildely

Have any of you contacted Helena Johnson as she is suppose to be in charge of student support services.

It has been my experience that the students union are not interested in anything unless it involves a drinking session or there is a back-hander in it for them, which is also normally associated with drinking sessions. They seem to think that anything academic is beyond their remit.

Has anybody tried contacting the students union on twitter? Get it out there in the public domain and perhaps you will force them to address the issue.

zeds alive

What are the Student Union going to do? I can't see them going around the LRC telling student to act accordingly in a work area.
While we are on the subject of the Students Union , how are they funded? do they receive a portion of the fees I pay( I don't get a grant)

Meathlass

zeds alive wrote: »

What are the Student Union going to do? I can't see them going around the LRC telling student to act accordingly in a work area

No, but they could have meetings with the college and put in place procedures to deal with this sort of thing.

entropi

oscillating wildely wrote: »

Have any of you contacted Helena Johnson as she is suppose to be in charge of student support services.

Has anybody tried contacting the students union on twitter? Get it out there in the public domain and perhaps you will force them to address the issue.

These two options here sound like viable options. The first step though, is somebody actually doing this, to get the ball rolling.

Meathlass wrote: »

No, but they could have meetings with the college and put in place procedures to deal with this sort of thing.

Possibly, with some luck anyway if they are prepared to help out. They'll be canvassing for votes soon with the upcoming elections, I say try get them to earn your vote, their remit for office wont only stick to what they pledge beforehand.

Artful_Badger

Master of Nothing wrote: »

These two options here sound like viable options. The first step though, is somebody actually doing this, to get the ball rolling..

OP stated that it was brought to the attention of the computer services,library service and student services so I can only assume Helena is aware of the issue if she's head of student services. I'd imagine its something that comes up every year too with a new batch of students realising the library isnt really all they were told it was.

Hopefully enough people mentioned it on the student survey too to further highlight it to the powers that be that the environment is just woefully inadequate for study.

oscillating wildely

Somebody has to take the first step if you want something done and as I'm not a student I obviously cannot.

Contact Helena Johnson, also contact the Students Union and if possible get some form of petition together as they may view one voice as a moan but a collective obviously has more influence and indicates there is a swell of support for your proposal.

As to who funds the Students Union, it is the taxpayer and lets not forget the service that ex-Students Union chiefs are doing the country - Pat Rabbitte and Eamon Gilmore :rolleyes:

entropi

Artful_Badger wrote: »

OP stated that it was brought to the attention of the computer services,library service and student services so I can only assume Helena is aware of the issue if she's head of student services. I'd imagine its something that comes up every year too with a new batch of students realising the library isnt really all they were told it was.

Hopefully enough people mentioned it on the student survey too to further highlight it to the powers that be that the environment is just woefully inadequate for study.

True, I did read that. Maybe if more people brought it to her attention, she might be able to look in to the matter a bit more? I know they tried something last year, but it only worked for a few weeks or so.

Queenalocin

It might also be worth finding out is there a way to stop all of the secondary school students from using LRC. They all start piling into the place after Easter, take up room and make loads of noise.

patdshaker

I find that a certain section of the foreign exchange students(not the majority tbf) seem to take over the top floor running around making noise etc, perhaps they could be encouraged to use the SU or even the canteen when the SU is shut. As regards the 2nd level students, why don't the library staff stop them,when they walk in past the front desk

artanevilla

I went to DCU previously and the library in ITC is an absolute joke compared to it. I've gone in some nights and just had to leave ten minute later cause my head was melted listening to the gaggle of talking all around.

Place can be filthy as well with people leaving cup and rubbish around. I wouldn't be big against a cup of coffee or that in the library, but at least clean up after yourself.

I know DCU is a lot bigger, but they had someone walking around sorting people out who weren't doing college work or just chatting.

They also had a turnstile which you had to scan your student card with, this would stop any second level students coming in.

entropi

That turnstile thing is a good idea, I know that Trinity have that too for their libraries, and they are always quiet (and usually have someone posted out front by the turnstile making sure things will be as they should be). Would be worth submitting that idea to the student council, or student services themselves.

Meathlass

Meathlass wrote: »

Isn't there a quiet room on the ground floor?

True, but in all fairness shouldnt a library be a 'quiet room' in essence?
Although this almost politically correct term of 'KRC' perhaps gives a licence not to stay silent these times.

Meathlass wrote: »

I have to say I was surprised when I first arrived in the college to find there were lecture rooms in the library. All that foot traffic doesn't make it conducive to studying.

Thats true enough though it is mad it is probably not the biggest culprit of noise in truth but it is another potential cause. The college seem to have this obsession with keeping everything on site and therefore everything is clustered as much as possible wherever possible. Small as the site is by comparison to many other IT's/universities, there is lack of parking which really cant be remedied in the short term because there is space taken up with pitches. I mean surely they could have used one of the local clubs pitch or could have purchased land to build pitches in the past or correct me if im wrong? Perhaps with the sports courses in mind well in advance it was thought it best to keep all students on one campus if possible unlike DIT for example.
I suppose to be fair, back in 1970 when the IT was established i would doubt that initial management visualised a day where campuses would have such demands and therefore the site the IT was initially established on seemed huge with loads of room to build on

artanevilla wrote: »

I went to DCU previously and the library in ITC is an absolute joke compared to it. I've gone in some nights and just had to leave ten minute later cause my head was melted listening to the gaggle of talking all around.

Place can be filthy as well with people leaving cup and rubbish around. I wouldn't be big against a cup of coffee or that in the library, but at least clean up after yourself.

I know DCU is a lot bigger, but they had someone walking around sorting people out who weren't doing college work or just chatting.

They also had a turnstile which you had to scan your student card with, this would stop any second level students coming in.

Thank you because i said the exact same thing the other day. Im frankly amazed at the people in society who cant use a bin this day and age. Its a sheer fúcking disgusting act of pure laziness. Of course Mammy or the maid is probably looking after most of them all their life and some of them, god bless, are probably barely off the tit. :rolleyes:

entropi

Deleted User wrote: »

.

Less of this type of talk in future, your post was grand up until that point. Consider this a warning for future reference.

Master of Nothing

Master of Nothing wrote: »

Less of this type of talk in future, your post was grand up until that point. Consider this a warning for future reference.

Apologies mod i've edited my post there

Artful_Badger

Deleted User wrote: »

Thank you because i said the exact same thing the other day. Im frankly amazed at the people in society who cant use a bin this day and age. Its a sheer fúcking disgusting act of pure laziness. Of course Mammy or the maid is probably looking after most of them all their life and some of them, god bless, are probably barely off the tit. :rolleyes:

Just on this point. I think part of the problem with the rubbish is the fact that bins are not provided (or not enough of them) because eating and drinking is not permitted. But the eating and drinking is not stopped.

I see paper bins for recycling paper in the library but general waste bins arent that prominent (if they are there at all). So when you have lazy dirty people who will use any excuse not to clean up after themselves, coupled with the lack of bins t put the rubbish in, you get lots of crap left around.

Same thing in some of the computer rooms, where there are no bins. You'll always without fail find rubbish left around at the pc's.

entropi

Deleted User wrote: »

Apologies mod i've edited my post there

Thank you.

Artful_Badger wrote: »

Just on this point. I think part of the problem with the rubbish is the fact that bins are not provided (or not enough of them) because eating and drinking is not permitted. But the eating and drinking is not stopped.

I see paper bins for recycling paper in the library but general waste bins arent that prominent (if they are there at all). So when you have lazy dirty people who will use any excuse not to clean up after themselves, coupled with the lack of bins t put the rubbish in, you get lots of crap left around.

Same thing in some of the computer rooms, where there are no bins. You'll always without fail find rubbish left around at the pc's.

I'm in agreement with that myself. It seems that it steadily gets worse through the year, with the library remaining mostly clean of coffee cups etc until around Nov-Dec, then it just gets worse after the xmas break. More bins are definitely needed, and it would be nice if someone could tour the floors every while to check if people are bringing their stuff to bins or not.

The main query is, what can be done by the college to people who consistently leave their dirt all around the place and are too lazy/apathetic to clean up after themselves?

Artful_Badger

Master of Nothing wrote: »

I'm in agreement with that myself. It seems that it steadily gets worse through the year, with the library remaining mostly clean of coffee cups etc until around Nov-Dec, then it just gets worse after the xmas break. More bins are definitely needed, and it would be nice if someone could tour the floors every while to check if people are bringing their stuff to bins or not.

The main query is, what can be done by the college to people who consistently leave their dirt all around the place and are too lazy/apathetic to clean up after themselves?

I'm not sure the college can do much to anyone. I'd say all they could do is just try to encourage people not to do it and hope enough listen that it doesnt become too much of a problem.

I think if they tackled the group/social aspect of people using the library it might have a knock on effect in regards to the more dirty/lazy people. One person on his own having a coffee and a packet of crisps while doing a bit of work isnt that likely to leave the rubbish if there is a bin near by. A large group chilling out however and the chances of crap being left dramatically rises. Both in terms of the amount of rubbish they would have if they are on their lunch or whatever and the whole trying to impress their mates by acting like they dont give a shít. Without a group to show off to most people will fall in line in terms of whats expected of them when using the facilities.

So in my mind a few more bins and a crack down on the facilities being used by groups as a hang out between classes and you would turn it into a cleaner, quieter and much more study friendly place.

entropi

Definitely, it's a social thing more than anything. They do say that the tables on the 1st and 2nd floor are for group work, maybe it should be pointed out more that actual work has to be taking place? The new SU area was created for hanging out, and should be utilised more. There are so many days I've walked by it and it was almost empty!

Finding a computer these days to do actual work is becoming much harder too. On two days last week I walked around the place three times during the day and nothing was free, not even one in the classrooms. It's gonna be a nightmare coming up to exam time, it was the same last year too.

artanevilla

Tempted to go in with a dB meter to compare it with other places during the day. SU and restraunt are probably quieter.

patdshaker

artanevilla wrote: »

Tempted to go in with a dB meter to compare it with other places during the day. SU and restraunt are probably quieter.

Do because it was a disaster up on the 3rd floor yesterday

oscillating wildely

Have any of you brought it up as an issue considering that the Students Union elections are on?

While I understand that how many piss-ups you can organise is probably the prime electioneering point, surely if enough of you mobilise and voice your concerns then it has to be raised as electioneering issue.

Artful_Badger

oscillating wildely wrote: »

Have any of you brought it up as an issue considering that the Students Union elections are on?

While I understand that how many piss-ups you can organise is probably the prime electioneering point, surely if enough of you mobilise and voice your concerns then it has to be raised as electioneering issue.

The platforms people were trying to get elected on as far as I see were a far cry from anything academic based. I wouldnt see any point in bringing it up as all you'd get is lies and false promises anyway, no candidate is gonna tell a prospective voter anything they dont want to hear. And I'd be very surprised if any of them would go against the grain of having the craic by publicly telling the student body they intended to try sterilise the library.

Once elected they will be busy organising piss ups too so I'd be confident in saying the student union would be the last place to go with this issue. I'll give my feedback at the end of the year to the student services in the hope they try adopt a stricter approach from the start of next year. With people having gotten use to the way things are and the end of year approaching I doubt there is anything that can be done to have an immediate effect.

artanevilla

Shame for those in their final year who could do with a decent library this year. Hopefully the college can implement something over the summer to sort it out.

oscillating wildely

Guys this is an annual issue that never gets resolved because not enough fuss is made by students and if it is left until the end of the year then it is swept under the carpet in the hope that those who raised the issue will either has graduated or forgotten the following year.

As I have said earlier it has to be driven by the students as you are the guys who it directly affects.

Artful_Badger

oscillating wildely wrote: »

Guys this is an annual issue that never gets resolved because not enough fuss is made by students and if it is left until the end of the year then it is swept under the carpet in the hope that those who raised the issue will either has graduated or forgotten the following year.

As I have said earlier it has to be driven by the students as you are the guys who it directly affects.

I suppose you're right. Moaning about these issues while not actively trying to get them resolved wont achieve much.

threein99

I don't even bother going up to the third floor of the library if I want to study, its a glorified second SU.

NedNoodles

It's been nice and quiet so far over Easter thank God!

artanevilla

NedNoodles wrote: »

It's been nice and quiet so far over Easter thank God!

This is something you can actually thank God for!

Scone190

Its the biggest joke of a "Library" ! The top floor should be left with the tables for group work only not every floor!! It s also a state everytime I go in ...Is it that hard for people just to take their rubbish with them !!Its more a social spot then a library the mount of couples etc on the third floor is annoying its the bloody like the foundry

Scone190

Scone190 wrote: »

Its the biggest joke of a "Library" ! The top floor should be left with the tables for group work only not every floor!! It s also a state everytime I go in ...Is it that hard for people just to take their rubbish with them !!Its more a social spot then a library the mount of couples etc on the third floor is annoying its the bloody like the foundry

Its society today im afraid and it seems the general attitude is to suck it up. An attitude which absolutely boils my blood and i feel helpless. :mad:

The attitude to rubbish is particularly sickening and its not limited to the college to be fair. I live just outside a small village in South Tipperary and we could have a lovely village and surrounding areas bar only the toxic attitude of certain civilians. I see bags of rubbish dumped in wooded areas and non biodegradable things like aluminium cans just thrown sporadically on the road amongst many other things. Shameful carry on. Its a real Monkey see-monkey do thing and if we are shown a careless attitude to rubbish disposal when we are young then what can we expect of the next generation only the same as we pass it on

There is little ITCarlow (or any other college or organisation) can do about peoples attitude to rubbish or recycling. Perhaps increase various waste disposal points all over the campus (general, paper, plastic, etc). The amount of paper cups and plastic bottles i have bring home in order to avoid throwing them in the general rubbish bin in the college annoys me. Plastic bottles in particular are used in the production of polyester garments. Simple things could make some small difference. But while they could impose punishments for x, y and z, it wont make a squat of difference if people dont realise the exact implications of their 'disposal methods' and the knock on effect it could have down the line. They also dont realise the downright ignorance and disrespect it shows to fellow citizens and this irresponsible attitude we have that someone else is paid to tidy up after us. They shouldn't have to-full stop.
We are creating bigger more pointless landfills by taking the course of action when we could dispose perfectly recyclable material in a proper manner and make a valid contribution.

Of course the sad thing is idealisms like this are seen as pie in the sky, airy fairy stuff.

We could have such a great world if only we'd wake up and realise it.

artanevilla

It's also too fecking hot. Melting at the moment, drains your energy and hard to study...

entropi

artanevilla wrote: »

It's also too fecking hot. Melting at the moment, drains your energy and hard to study...

Agreed! Went in there this morning for a while, almost combusted with the heat and left very shortly after I went in. At least it's not freezing cold, I suppose that's something

artanevilla

entropi wrote: »

Agreed! Went in there this morning for a while, almost combusted with the heat and left very shortly after I went in. At least it's not freezing cold, I suppose that's something

I shouldn't complain, used to stay in as long as possible in the winter cause the heating in my apartment is ****e.

leesaunders

Bit late coming to this thread but, an idea I toyed with was sitting on the center circle of the soccer pitches and doing some study there. Since all the FAI heads seem to gather in the LRC to have a good old chin wag.

artanevilla

leesaunders wrote: »

Bit late coming to this thread but, an idea I toyed with was sitting on the center circle of the soccer pitches and doing some study there. Since all the FAI heads seem to gather in the LRC to have a good old chin wag.

In fairness there's people from all courses doing it.

leesaunders

Ah I know that but it more obvious with them.

artanevilla

Poor ****ers have a uniform.

wheres me jumpa

Glad to see this is still an issue! I was both part of the issue in my early years and fiercely sshing by the end of my years in the college. The problem to me was always a building containing class rooms, offices, two floors of pc's, group study area's, air horn alarm on the elevator and Spanish students congregating on the steps is completely unsuitable for the limited quiet study area on the ground floor.

The whole building is such an open space. Even if the people around you are quiet you get the noise of the foot fall between classes and people hanging around on other floors. A dedicated library and study area is required.

It is also the downside of attending a college that is 'great craic'. Certainly in my day there was a large percentage of chancers, coasters and people who perhaps were not in the course they necessarily wanted to be in. This does not not excuse peoples behavior in library but it is a factor. Let me wrap up this paragraph by saying I am not belittling the college here, I received a valuable education, but the 'great craic' attitude does exist among some students.

I have returned to the college recently to use the sports facilities and the investment on that side appears to have been huge. Which is great for the college and the local area. However, I would be interested to visit the library to see if it has changed since my time. Judging by the comments here it remains the same which would suggest the sports element of the college is over taking the academic element.

RealistSpy

wheres me jumpa wrote: »

Glad to see this is still an issue! I was both part of the issue in my early years and fiercely sshing by the end of my years in the college. The problem to me was always a building containing class rooms, offices, two floors of pc's, group study area's, air horn alarm on the elevator and Spanish students congregating on the steps is completely unsuitable for the limited quiet study area on the ground floor.

The whole building is such an open space. Even if the people around you are quiet you get the noise of the foot fall between classes and people hanging around on other floors. A dedicated library and study area is required.

It is also the downside of attending a college that is 'great craic'. Certainly in my day there was a large percentage of chancers, coasters and people who perhaps were not in the course they necessarily wanted to be in. This does not not excuse peoples behavior in library but it is a factor. Let me wrap up this paragraph by saying I am not belittling the college here, I received a valuable education, but the 'great craic' attitude does exist among some students.

I have returned to the college recently to use the sports facilities and the investment on that side appears to have been huge. Which is great for the college and the local area. However, I would be interested to visit the library to see if it has changed since my time. Judging by the comments here it remains the same which would suggest the sports element of the college is over taking the academic element.

I don't think 'great craic' has anything to do with the problem here. Universities or Colleges shouldn't be a depressing place, students must have fun and that shouldn't stop you from getting good grades.

Regarding classrooms being part of the LRC, I believe that is a valid point. What we need are more areas like the quiet room. Maybe those classrooms could be converted.

wheres me jumpa

RealistSpy wrote: »

I don't think 'great craic' has anything to do with the problem here. Universities or Colleges shouldn't be a depressing place, students must have fun and that shouldn't stop you from getting good grades.

Im not debating that. And Im not arguing my point but just to elaborate, I do feel that the there is a percentage of the student population that dont particulalry care how they get on. As a reuslt the LRC is seen as a hangout / bird spotting location. This is a factor in all colleges however in a small library it only takes a few of these types to dominate the atmosphere. Not the entire problem but certainly a factor imo.