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Super League 2013

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    #32
    couerdelion
    Registered Users Posts: 2,910 ✭✭✭couerdelion


    toomevara wrote: »
    Something obviously gone on in the background there...whether we'll actually find out or not.....

    I just don't think it was financially viable.

    Really worried about the game in general at the moment especially after the decision on playing numbers / dual registered players etc which makes me think that the whole game is in danger of collapse (unless they really are being super prudent and addressing issues before they become a problem...).

    Does anyone know what the playing squad sizes are like in Aus? 25 elite and 25 u19 players doesn't seem like a lot in such a tough sport. I know the commision suggested the second tier should be u23 instead but that was ignored presumably because u19's can be paid less than u23's - or that's the impression I got from Hetheringtons interview.


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    #33
    toomevara
    Registered Users Posts: 5,772 ✭✭✭toomevara


    couerdelion wrote: »
    Really worried about the game in general at the moment especially after the decision on playing numbers / dual registered players etc which makes me think that the whole game is in danger of collapse (unless they really are being super prudent and addressing issues before they become a problem...).

    Does anyone know what the playing squad sizes are like in Aus? 25 elite and 25 u19 players doesn't seem like a lot in such a tough sport. I know the commision suggested the second tier should be u23 instead but that was ignored presumably because u19's can be paid less than u23's - or that's the impression I got from Hetheringtons interview.

    +1. The game over here is in serious trouble financially in certain areas. Now, rugby league has been written off more times than a Liz Taylor marriage and it has always bounced back, but definitely tough times ahead. The latest basket case is Castleford who are in major, major difficulties, with falling gates, an appalling stadium and small squad. The dual reg system is verging on the ridiculous for some players at the moment and many argue it's diluting club identities and placing players in difficult/untenable positions. The franchise system has been utterly discredited and I fail to see how clubs like Featherstone can be kept out of SL while the likes of Cas remain in...

    With the game in Oz going stratospheric, and salary caps going through the roof at the moment and with top players being cherry picked by NRL teams...Widdup, the Burgess boys, graham et al the traffic between comps has reversed totally. I mean, does anyone seriously think that the likes of Sam Tomkins will remain in British RL beyond next year? Already there are reports of NRL clubs sniffing around this seasons hot property the amazing, freakishly good Liam Farrell (must be in the genes), who is going to be huge. (he hasn't missed a single tackle yet this season, outlandish).

    As regards NRL squad size, I guess its all down to the salary cap, but I follow the bunnies pretty closely and they have first squad size of 31. Incidentally I've also been following the nRL pretty closely this season and the difference in standard between the NRL and SL is absolutely huge. Another worrying indicator.


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    #34
    couerdelion
    Registered Users Posts: 2,910 ✭✭✭couerdelion


    31 is about what I would expect, but the franchise system works well in Aus too, with clubs able to take a few years to build squads and start challenging.

    In the old days the english clubs would have a first team, alliance/second team and an academy team which gave a lot of players good rugby week in week out with alliance games on a friday night (free entry with season ticket) and then the academy teams playing before the first team on a Sunday. those were great days and you could never get too much league.
    It's a shame the way things are going.

    Tomkins will no doubt go to union when his contract is up (if not earlier). He's seen how well his brother has done and I reckon he fancies a piece of that.


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    #35
    toomevara
    Registered Users Posts: 5,772 ✭✭✭toomevara


    couerdelion wrote: »

    Tomkins will no doubt go to union when his contract is up (if not earlier). He's seen how well his brother has done and I reckon he fancies a piece of that.

    I fear you may be right, but he'll be wasted and I'd imagine monumentally bored in Union. Hope he goes to Oz and at least stays in the game. Watching SBW and his return to league with the Roosters shows just how much a league player looses in terms of skills, fitness and mental acuity in the old kick'n'clap. In his first game you could see that the physicality and speed of the game was a bit of a rude (re)awakening for him. lets just say he didnt have the physical dominance he was used to in the 15 man game.


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    #36
    Creeby
    Registered Users Posts: 115 ✭✭Creeby


    anyone remember Tomkins in the barbarians game? I think it was against Australia? He got tossed around like a rag doll


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    #37
    toomevara
    Registered Users Posts: 5,772 ✭✭✭toomevara


    Creeby wrote: »
    anyone remember Tomkins in the barbarians game? I think it was against Australia? He got tossed around like a rag doll

    Yeah, tomkins said it was an awful experience afterwards, but tbh, why anyone expected anything else is beyond me. I can only imagine what would happen to a union full back, with no league experience, dropped into a scratch team against an international outfit. Very different games, very different requirements. Jaysis look at Chris Ashton, still struggling with the basics of kick'n'clap defensive play...


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    #38
    toomevara
    Registered Users Posts: 5,772 ✭✭✭toomevara


    Say what you like about the the Easter programme (personally; too many games, desperately unfair on players and teams with smaller squads and we'll have a slew of freak results/blow-outs in the next couple of weeks) but some mouth-watering clashes. Last nights Bradford/Leeds clash was a superb game and Wigan/Saints (5 mins in) seems like a high quality affair.. KR and FC to follow. Doesn't get much better than that...


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    #39
    Creeby
    Registered Users Posts: 115 ✭✭Creeby


    toomevara wrote: »
    Yeah, tomkins said it was an awful experience afterwards, but tbh, why anyone expected anything else is beyond me. I can only imagine what would happen to a union full back, with no league experience, dropped into a scratch team against an international outfit. Very different games, very different requirements. Jaysis look at Chris Ashton, still struggling with the basics of kick'n'clap defensive play...

    Yea I completely agree but this is why I think he should stay where he belongs, in league. He is one of the stars of the game at the moment and a change of codes would only lead to him declining in skills.


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    #40
    Creeby
    Registered Users Posts: 115 ✭✭Creeby


    toomevara wrote: »
    Say what you like about the the Easter programme (personally; too many games, desperately unfair on players and teams with smaller squads and we'll have a slew of freak results/blow-outs in the next couple of weeks) but some mouth-watering clashes. Last nights Bradford/Leeds clash was a superb game and Wigan/Saints (5 mins in) seems like a high quality affair.. KR and FC to follow. Doesn't get much better than that...

    Great to see 19 year old John Bateman, the 19 year old forward getting stuck into the veterans Carl Ablett nd Jamie Peacocke. Delighted for Bradford considering what they've been through in recent times but would have loved seeing them win it last night. One of the better games I've seen all year, todays games didn't have much on it.


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    #41
    toomevara
    Registered Users Posts: 5,772 ✭✭✭toomevara


    Creeby wrote: »
    Great to see 19 year old John Bateman, the 19 year old forward getting stuck into the veterans Carl Ablett nd Jamie Peacocke. Delighted for Bradford considering what they've been through in recent times but would have loved seeing them win it last night. One of the better games I've seen all year, todays games didn't have much on it.

    +1. Really good result for the Bulls and TBH they'd have been good value for the win. What about salford/giants though? A last minute drop goal by the Reds to win and then Widnes beating Warrington! Must be something in the water...Seem like the TV cameras were at the wrong games...


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    #42
    Creeby
    Registered Users Posts: 115 ✭✭Creeby


    toomevara wrote: »
    +1. Really good result for the Bulls and TBH they'd have been good value for the win. What about salford/giants though? A last minute drop goal by the Reds to win and then Widnes beating Warrington! Must be something in the water...Seem like the TV cameras were at the wrong games...

    Damn! Didn't see/hear about either of those matches. Hopefully this weeks matches don't disappoint. Also good to see there hasn't really been any hammerings, yet...


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    #43
    WakeyTyke
    Registered Users Posts: 526 ✭✭✭WakeyTyke


    Friday was certainly Good for SL with the form book being turned upside down in places and some highly competitive matches and good attendances.


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    #44
    toomevara
    Registered Users Posts: 5,772 ✭✭✭toomevara


    WakeyTyke wrote: »
    Friday was certainly Good for SL with the form book being turned upside down in places and some highly competitive matches and good attendances.

    Yep, but unfortunately we see the fruits of the ridiculous Easter programme with some frankly silly results which do nothing for the competition or the teams involved. Warrington 54 London 20/ Saints 48 Cas 18/ Giants 62 Widnes 6/ and worst of all KR 6 Wigan 84.

    Daft results and it'll take weeks for some of those teams to recover. SL does not have the depth to sustain such a gruelling programme and the sooner it's dispensed with the better.


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    #45
    Creeby
    Registered Users Posts: 115 ✭✭Creeby


    toomevara wrote: »
    Yep, but unfortunately we see the fruits of the ridiculous Easter programme with some frankly silly results which do nothing for the competition or the teams involved. Warrington 54 London 20/ Saints 48 Cas 18/ Giants 62 Widnes 6/ and worst of all KR 6 Wigan 84.

    Daft results and it'll take weeks for some of those teams to recover. SL does not have the depth to sustain such a gruelling programme and the sooner it's dispensed with the better.

    I agree with you once again. I think the matches on Thursday and the derbies on good Friday are enough to be with content with for the Easter weekend. The other matches 2-3 days later are just plain stupid.


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    #46
    toomevara
    Registered Users Posts: 5,772 ✭✭✭toomevara


    Creeby wrote: »
    The other matches 2-3 days later are just plain stupid.

    Couldn't agree more. leave it at the good Friday derbies. Was a brilliant days rugby and showcased rugby league at its best, packed stadia, brilliant rugby and even some sunshine. How good was Leeds/Bradford? A brilliant game all-round. They reckon over the weekend over 110,000 fans turned up to watch a game of RL. The Monday stuff is a farce. Tiny crowds and quite obviously some of the less strong teams' coaches are now clearly looking at it and saying "sod it, I'm writing that game off, stick me B or C team out and rest the big names". Can't say as I blame them....


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    #47
    jkmanc1974
    Registered Users Posts: 780 ✭✭✭jkmanc1974


    toomevara wrote: »
    Yep, but unfortunately we see the fruits of the ridiculous Easter programme with some frankly silly results which do nothing for the competition or the teams involved. Warrington 54 London 20/ Saints 48 Cas 18/ Giants 62 Widnes 6/ and worst of all KR 6 Wigan 84.

    Daft results and it'll take weeks for some of those teams to recover. SL does not have the depth to sustain such a gruelling programme and the sooner it's dispensed with the better.

    Very good point as watched the Good friday games on TV and also Leeds/Bradford - think that there has been some bizarre results all season though especially involving Hull KR(Witness the Salford game which was possibly one of the strangest games ever seen on Sky)

    Brgds
    Johnny


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    #48
    Dozen Wicked Words
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,325 ✭✭✭✭Dozen Wicked Words


    Hull KR have lost a significant financial backer (well at the end of the season). Not sure how they will manage, and on the subject of finances, Salfords new owner wants a bigger salary cap.

    Not too many teams in the league at the moment would be in a position to spend much more on their wages anyway.


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    #49
    toomevara
    Registered Users Posts: 5,772 ✭✭✭toomevara


    Dozen Wicked Words wrote: »
    Not too many teams in the league at the moment would be in a position to spend much more on their wages anyway.

    There are folk who advocate a two-tier Super League with different salary caps for say the likes of Leeds, Wigan,Saints and Warrington..but I think this would be utterly disastrous for the game. Of course, the reality is we have a two tier super league as it stands. Can anyone envisage any team other than the top 5 winning anything this year?

    Hudgell's abandonment of KR is disastrous. He also states that one of the major reasons behind his decision to jump ship is that the gulf between the likes of KR and say Wigan is affectively unbridgeable and he's just piddling money up against the wall in a fruitless exercise. I can see nothing but tough times ahead for them without his annual half mil contribution.


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    #50
    Dozen Wicked Words
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,325 ✭✭✭✭Dozen Wicked Words


    I know Saints aren't in great shape, but getting beaten by the Broncos can't be good for their confidence. Cracking win for the Broncos though.


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    #51
    jkmanc1974
    Registered Users Posts: 780 ✭✭✭jkmanc1974


    Indeed Saints look to be in a bit of bother - good win for Salford though - Tickets and flights booked for magic weekend so all good

    Brgds
    Johnny


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    #52
    toomevara
    Registered Users Posts: 5,772 ✭✭✭toomevara


    jkmanc1974 wrote: »
    Indeed Saints look to be in a bit of bother - good win for Salford though - Tickets and flights booked for magic weekend so all good

    Brgds
    Johnny

    Yeah, Saints struggling badly largely due to injury. Brown's used 31 players so far this season and given 10 youngsters their debut. He was essentially without 9 first choice players for the Broncos game. Having said that nice to see London finally break their horror run against Saints.


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    #53
    jkmanc1974
    Registered Users Posts: 780 ✭✭✭jkmanc1974


    Saints in big trouble to be fair looking at the result tonight - beaten at Langtree Park by Widnes????

    Brgds
    Johnny


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    #54
    Creeby
    Registered Users Posts: 115 ✭✭Creeby


    As a Saints fan I am devastated with recent results. But only injuries are to blame. We just have to hold out until this storm is over


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    #55
    jkmanc1974
    Registered Users Posts: 780 ✭✭✭jkmanc1974


    Think as soon as the players start coming back for Saints then things will definitely turn.....

    Should be a good game on BBC next Saturday with Leeds v Huddersfield in the cup

    Brgds
    Johnny


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    #56
    Creeby
    Registered Users Posts: 115 ✭✭Creeby


    Yea I think so too. Hopefully it won't be too late though..


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    #57
    toomevara
    Registered Users Posts: 5,772 ✭✭✭toomevara


    If anyone hasn't seen tonight's Cas/Hull FC game...its was an absolute stormer. catch it if you can. On Sky again at midnight....


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    #58
    Dozen Wicked Words
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,325 ✭✭✭✭Dozen Wicked Words


    toomevara wrote: »
    If anyone hasn't seen tonight's Cas/Hull FC game...its was an absolute stormer. catch it if you can. On Sky again at midnight....

    Have free sky for 6 months so going to sky plus it and watch it the moro. Don't know the score either, so going to avoid SSN now.


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    #59
    Dozen Wicked Words
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,325 ✭✭✭✭Dozen Wicked Words


    toomevara wrote: »
    If anyone hasn't seen tonight's Cas/Hull FC game...its was an absolute stormer. catch it if you can. On Sky again at midnight....

    Wow, what a game. Even my missus who hates all rugby was getting into that game. She said how much easier it is to follow what's going on compared to kick and clap. Thought Hull were going to sneak it at very end.


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    #60
    toomevara
    Registered Users Posts: 5,772 ✭✭✭toomevara


    Wigan/Wire last night game of the season. Crazy how when the tracks harden up and weather improves SL goes stratospheric.


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    #61
    Dozen Wicked Words
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,325 ✭✭✭✭Dozen Wicked Words


    toomevara wrote: »
    Wigan/Wire last night game of the season. Crazy how when the tracks harden up and weather improves SL goes stratospheric.

    Great game, great atmosphere. Scheduling for the teams a bit mad though, when they were both coming off virtually 2 week break, and now have to turn around for next game in under a week.


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