tackling obesity

doulikeit

gonna be a bit of a nazi here, obesity is a ticking time bomb for our already stretched health service cant imagine the staff and resources that this is going to tie up in a few years, most overweight people i know are always trying to loose weight but rarely do, im no athlete myself, but is there no sort of national bootcamp that could be put in place targets to meet and goals to achieve, encouragement and positive reinforcement and a sense of all being in it together, but with no bs excuses and no whinging. here comes the down side if people do not meet there targets or are "not playing the game" higher tax margins or less dole cause its all going to have to be paid for this is a national problem (or it will be), and has to be treated as such. So i know there will be certain cases but apart from that what im trying to say is should a person who is not prepared to go along with this be taxed for being obese and as such an unwelcome burden on our system

orestes

doulikeit wrote: »

gonna be a bit of a nazi here

Stopped reading there, anything that follows that can be immediately disregarded.

Czarcasm

Hands up who else is watching embarrassing fat bodies on channel 4 right now?

HTML5!

You're being more of a Stalinist.

Pottler

When we've done with the fatties, we can move onto those skinny feckers, they're a danger to themselves, slipping down cattle-grids and getting stuck in small gaps. Once we're all average, we'll have no-one to attack. It'll be great.... Apart from them coloured average people....and the deaf ones...and those blind cnuts.... O.P, you don't suppose your idea is a bit, err, shitty?

1ZRed

Helping lower earning parents -who are more likely buying more salt, suger and fat laden processed foods, realise that you can cook far healthier and more nutritious meals if you're willing to put in the work and make it yourself.

It's not as time consuming as you'd think and the benefits far outweigh the added time spend preparing for them.

The King of Moo

Heroin addicts, obesity, and now this: if someone starts a thread about immigration I won't get any sleep.

I'll simply say this:

There have already been many well-publicised initiatives to curb obesity.

The reason such a harsh "boot camp" would not work and be unfair is because the obesity problem is not simply a matter of people being lazy or greedy, and solving it is not as simple as telling people to get up and exercise and eat less.
Many seriously overweight people are so because of underlying emotional and psychological issues, and shouting at them won't resolve those issues.
There are also often many psychological and emotional obstacles to reducing obesity, on a personal level.

This is why a more nuanced approach of education and awareness is preferable.

endacl

1ZRed wrote: »

Helping lower earning parents -who are more likely buying more salt, suger and fat laden processed foods, realise that you can cook far healthier and more nutritious meals if you're willing to put in the work and make it yourself.

It's not as time consuming as you'd think and the benefits far outweigh the added time spend preparing for them.

And cheaper too. They could always watch Jeremy Kyle in the kitchen while they cook.

admiralofthefleet

make the door into mc donalds taller and thinner

1ZRed

Lack of exercise and more time spent stationary in children's lives is a growing cause in the obesity problem as well.

Many children aren't interested in sport but mostly likely are not interested in the basic sports which are supplied here, like soccer, football and hurling.

I think there's a sport for everyone because many don't like the limited sports available in Irish schools when in America there are dozens on offer like tennis, track, hurdles, swimming, etc. which appeal to different strengths.

Although it's not feasible or realistic for all of them to be implemented into schools, adding more varied sports could well increase children's interest in staying more active.

I think offering points in the leaving cert for sport -and to treat it kind of like a 'subject', would be a good way to go as many train during their time at school and it would give them a reward for doing so as you sacrifice study time for it.

I'd also think it'd give people more of an incentive to take up a sport and be more active.

storker

Gonna be a bit Nazi here. Maybe we should have a strategy for people can only manage a single full stop and a solitary capital letter in nearly 200 words. This is a ticking mental-health and ophthalmic time-bomb as people scratch their heads wondering what the hell is so wrong with punctuation anyway and squint at the virtually-unformatted text block trying to make sense of it.

1ZRed

endacl wrote: »

And cheaper too. They could always watch Jeremy Kyle in the kitchen while they cook.

It does work out cheaper as well. Obviously I don't mean the fault lies solely with people of a lower income, as it effects people of any income, but when resources are strained you can see why they'd appear cheaper initially.

Education with regards to healthy foods and more of an emphasis on that is the way to go, imo, when trying to tacke obesity.

dttq

doulikeit wrote: »

gonna be a bit of a nazi here, obesity is a ticking time bomb for our already stretched health service cant imagine the staff and resources that this is going to tie up in a few years, most overweight people i know are always trying to loose weight but rarely do, im no athlete myself, but is there no sort of national bootcamp that could be put in place targets to meet and goals to achieve, encouragement and positive reinforcement and a sense of all being in it together, but with no bs excuses and no whinging. here comes the down side if people do not meet there targets or are "not playing the game" higher tax margins or less dole cause its all going to have to be paid for this is a national problem (or it will be), and has to be treated as such. So i know there will be certain cases but apart from that what im trying to say is should a person who is not prepared to go along with this be taxed for being obese and as such an unwelcome burden on our system

Why not the concentration camps of old, not one fatty in sight.

The King of Moo

dttq wrote: »

Why not the concentration camps of old, not one fatty in sight.

Only if you take a very one-sided look at things.

D1stant

doulikeit wrote: »

gonna be a bit of a nazi here, obesity is a ticking time bomb for our already stretched health service cant imagine the staff and resources that this is going to tie up in a few years, most overweight people i know are always trying to loose weight but rarely do, im no athlete myself, but is there no sort of national bootcamp that could be put in place targets to meet and goals to achieve, encouragement and positive reinforcement and a sense of all being in it together, but with no bs excuses and no whinging. here comes the down side if people do not meet there targets or are "not playing the game" higher tax margins or less dole cause its all going to have to be paid for this is a national problem (or it will be), and has to be treated as such. So i know there will be certain cases but apart from that what im trying to say is should a person who is not prepared to go along with this be taxed for being obese and as such an unwelcome burden on our system

Yeah you're right James Reilly and Mary Harney should be taxed to the hilt

fussyonion

As a kid, I was brought up on a diet of mostly processed food.

We'd have sugary cereals and white toast for breakfast, cheese sandwiches on white bread for lunch, with crisps and chocolate. Dinner would be crispy pancake/chips/waffles/pizza and we had crisps and biscuits as snacks.
But we were out playing every single day, since we got home from school til it got dark.
We burned off the calories.

I found myself in a situation where, as an adult, I was piling on the pounds, but I've re-educated myself and I now know eating healthy is not only better for your health, but better all round.

Forget how you'll look when you reach your ideal weight, think about what's going into your body.

Do you really want to fill with additives and crap?
My reason for mentioning my childhood diet is that nobody can turn around and blame their upbringing for their current weight-we most likely all ate stuff like that, but we exercised.

Exercising and eating well is the only way obesity will be tackled and no fad diets or slimming pills will retrain your mind or make you think any differently.

I do, however, feel for the people who genuinely have medical conditions that are causing weight-gain.

KKkitty

Peoples lives are more sedentary now than they ever were. They sit in a car or bus going to work or school. Sit at a desk for the majority of their day and then get home and eat late in the evening with little time for physical activity before bed. Kids often sit twiddling their thumbs playing xbox or playstation. You need to get to the root of the problem first though.

Airitech

fussyonion wrote: »

As a kid, I was brought up on a diet of mostly processed food.

We'd have sugary cereals and white toast for breakfast, cheese sandwiches on white bread for lunch, with crisps and chocolate. Dinner would be crispy pancake/chips/waffles/pizza and we had crisps and biscuits as snacks.
But we were out playing every single day, since we got home from school til it got dark.
We burned off the calories.

I found myself in a situation where, as an adult, I was piling on the pounds, but I've re-educated myself and I now know eating healthy is not only better for your health, but better all round.

Forget how you'll look when you reach your ideal weight, think about what's going into your body.

Do you really want to fill with additives and crap?
My reason for mentioning my childhood diet is that nobody can turn around and blame their upbringing for their current weight-we most likely all ate stuff like that, but we exercised.

Exercising and eating well is the only way obesity will be tackled and no fad diets or slimming pills will retrain your mind or make you think any differently.

I do, however, feel for the people who genuinely have medical conditions that are causing weight-gain.

It seems everyone wants to be a victim these days. No one wants to take responsibility for themselves anymore.

By whining and blaming everyone else for their problems they are effectively saying its not my fault I'm obese, I can't do anything about it, you have to fix it for me, poor me, pity me.

The attitude I'm seeing is that people would sooner make being obese acceptable than put the work in to lose some weight.

Ruudi_Mentari

Should be tackled around the ankles. Too much girth up top

tin79

admiralofthefleet wrote: »

make the door into mc donalds taller and thinner

The thinner bit I get but how would making the door taller have any impact?

KKkitty

As a woman when I was naive I would get magazines and one edition they'd praise a celeb for not being afraid to be curvy and the next would be how to drop a dress size in a week. The media has played its part in obesity being so prevalent today. Fad diets, people having little motivation and food being packed with additives and god knows what else are factors too.

Airitech

tin79 wrote: »

The thinner bit I get but how would making the door taller have any impact?

You put a hurdle in front of it and make them jump through.

Airitech

KKkitty wrote: »

As a woman when I was naive I would get magazines and one edition they'd praise a celeb for not being afraid to be curvy and the next would be how to drop a dress size in a week. The media has played its part in obesity being so prevalent today. Fad diets, people having little motivation and food being packed with additives and god knows what else are factors too.

This "curvy, real women" crap that the media is coming out is doing women a disservice. They are just patronising overweight women so they will buy their crappy magazine.

dttq

Airitech wrote: »

This "curvy, real women" crap that the media is coming out is doing women a disservice. They are just patronising overweight women so they will buy their crappy magazine.

Indeed.

1950s curvy = Marilyn Monroe

2013 curvy = Oprah Winfrey.

mikemac1

Kids back in school? Traffic crawls

Struggle to walk down the footpath? It's because Mammy is parking right on the footpath to take the little darlings as close as possible!

What's with all the driving to school?

Put those kids on their rother and send them to school. :cool:
The walking bus also works well
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Walking_bus

KKkitty

Airitech wrote: »

This "curvy, real women" crap that the media is coming out is doing women a disservice. They are just patronising overweight women so they will buy their crappy magazine.

Real women embrace their curves though I don't buy into that tripe anymore. I'm sure I'm slightly overweight myself but even though I know the root of the problem I lack the motivation to do anything and I see failure before I could even start.

guppy

fussyonion wrote: »

As a kid, I was brought up on a diet of mostly processed food.

We'd have sugary cereals and white toast for breakfast, cheese sandwiches on white bread for lunch, with crisps and chocolate. Dinner would be crispy pancake/chips/waffles/pizza and we had crisps and biscuits as snacks.
But we were out playing every single day, since we got home from school til it got dark.
We burned off the calories.

I found myself in a situation where, as an adult, I was piling on the pounds, but I've re-educated myself and I now know eating healthy is not only better for your health, but better all round.

Forget how you'll look when you reach your ideal weight, think about what's going into your body.

Do you really want to fill with additives and crap?
My reason for mentioning my childhood diet is that nobody can turn around and blame their upbringing for their current weight-we most likely all ate stuff like that, but we exercised.

Exercising and eating well is the only way obesity will be tackled and no fad diets or slimming pills will retrain your mind or make you think any differently.

I do, however, feel for the people who genuinely have medical conditions that are causing weight-gain.

I have a work colleague who has an overweight child. Obesity runs in her family, so much so that her other, normal weight, child, she sees as "scrawny" and "nothing to hug".

Her overweight child is miserable because of his weight, and she's trying to help him lose it, but she thinks giving a 6 year old an adult sized dinner is normal. She won't let him have soft drinks, but thinks cheese sandwiches between meals are fine as snacks (because they're not sweets). Plus she seems to think that when people gasp at the photo of her child and exclaim "my, isn't he a big lad" it's a mark of triumph.


This woman isn't stupid at all, but she seems blinded by reality. Her son is so conscious of his weight, but she's so hung up on him being "normal" and her other son being "scrawny" that she seems to have convinced herself that the problem child is the one that needs "fattening"!

How do you fight that? How can you convince someone that "sturdy fit" trousers are just a euphemism for "fat"? How can you tell someone that their "skinny" child is actually a bit tubbier than most kids when she's expressed to you that she finds said child way too skinny and she hates hugging him as "theres nothing to him"?

And how the hell do you stop kids growing up with that influence from being obese in later life?

Airitech

KKkitty wrote: »

Real women embrace their curves though I don't buy into that tripe anymore. I'm sure I'm slightly overweight myself but even though I know the root of the problem I lack the motivation to do anything and I see failure before I could even start.

We all know what curvy is, and its not the fcuking Michelin man.

You're overthinking things. If you try to plan out days and weeks ahead of yourself you'll feel overwhelmed and give up.

Dont think about it. Just get up and go for a walk. Do it again tomorrow. Small successes build confidence and then you can start planning longer term. Worked for me.

KKkitty

Airitech wrote: »

We all know what curvy is, and its not the fcuking Michelin man.

You're overthinking things. If you try to plan out days and weeks ahead of yourself you'll feel overwhelmed and give up.

Dont think about it. Just get up and go for a walk. Do it again tomorrow. Small successes build confidence and then you can start planning longer term. Worked for me.

Who would you consider as curvy? I do overthink things like that. I've had a rough time of it in the last 8 months or so and have eaten badly and not been as physical as I should have been.

Airitech

KKkitty wrote: »

Who would you consider as curvy? I do overthink things like that. I've had a rough time of it in the last 8 months or so and have eaten badly and not been as physical as I should have been.

Charlotte Church or Chloe Agnew. Neither would be considered slim but they it does really suit them.

humbert

orestes wrote: »

Stopped reading there, anything that follows that can be immediately disregarded.

Now, tell the truth, you had to stop reading so you could get the first post in.

The King of Moo wrote: »

Heroin addicts, obesity, and now this: if someone starts a thread about immigration I won't get any sleep.

I'll simply say this:

There have already been many well-publicised initiatives to curb obesity.

The reason such a harsh "boot camp" would not work and be unfair is because the obesity problem is not simply a matter of people being lazy or greedy, and solving it is not as simple as telling people to get up and exercise and eat less.
Many seriously overweight people are so because of underlying emotional and psychological issues, and shouting at them won't resolve those issues.
There are also often many psychological and emotional obstacles to reducing obesity, on a personal level.

This is why a more nuanced approach of education and awareness is preferable.

Like any vice, easy to overcome if life is on the up and very very difficult if life is getting you down. Also, the idea of a boot camp is inherently short-sighted.

guppy

KKkitty wrote: »

Who would you consider as curvy? I do overthink things like that. I've had a rough time of it in the last 8 months or so and have eaten badly and not been as physical as I should have been.

Beyonce, Cheryl Cole, Anne Hathaway. I'm sure there are bigger sized curvy ladies too, but its late! Curvy is about ratio of waist to hips, not about fat content. I will never be "curvy" (and I'm currently down 6lbs with another 14lb to go) as I just don't have the big hips to give me curves, even when I was 9 stone

Galwayguy35

My next door neighbour was over 20 stone in weight but although he didn't look it because he was tall he decided to do something about it and changed his eating habits and walked 5 miles a day.

Surprise surprise he lost the weight, it's not rocket science to loose weight.

It's up to people to take responsibility for their own bodies and not expect others to do it for them.

Obesity is literally a killer unless it is tackled.

cantdecide

Galwayguy35 wrote: »

My next door neighbour was over 20 stone in weight but although he didn't look it because he was tall he decided to do something about it and changed his eating habits and walked 5 miles a day.

Surprise surprise he lost the weight, it's not rocket science to loose weight.

It's up to people to take responsibility for their own bodies and not expect others to do it for them.

Obesity is literally a killer unless it is tackled.

That's my story too. I was badly overweight. Life sucks balls in all kinds of ways when you're that heavy. I still shudder at the thought of being that weight and I know I'll never be there again.

myflipflops

I can tell you from the personal experience of going from obese to being a very healthy weight last year how to tackle obesity:

Eat Less
Exercise more.

It is that simple.

Plazaman

Yet another fatty bashing thread. I blame Mr Chow.

Sir Digby Chicken Caesar

not really
you dont have to exercise at all, you just have to eat well and keep an eye on your calories

you can even eat absolute **** but so long as you keep an eye on calories you'll lose weight, you just wont be healthy, will feel like **** and most likely will have an absolute whore of a time sticking to the calorie limit as **** foods tend not to be very filling in sensible calorie amounts.

Handsome Bob

doulikeit wrote: »

gonna be a bit of a nazi here, obesity is a ticking time bomb for our already stretched health service cant imagine the staff and resources that this is going to tie up in a few years, most overweight people i know are always trying to loose weight but rarely do, im no athlete myself, but is there no sort of national bootcamp that could be put in place targets to meet and goals to achieve, encouragement and positive reinforcement and a sense of all being in it together, but with no bs excuses and no whinging. here comes the down side if people do not meet there targets or are "not playing the game" higher tax margins or less dole cause its all going to have to be paid for this is a national problem (or it will be), and has to be treated as such. So i know there will be certain cases but apart from that what im trying to say is should a person who is not prepared to go along with this be taxed for being obese and as such an unwelcome burden on our system

Good idea, but I think it'd be better if your instructor gave this kind of reinforcement:

"Were you born a fat, slimy, scumbag puke piece o' ****, Private Pyle, or did you have to work on it?"

"Oh that's right, Private Pyle, don't make any ****ing effort to get to the top of the ****ing obstacle. If God would have wanted you up there he would have miracled your ass up there by now, wouldn't he?"

"You're so ugly you could be a modern art masterpiece! What's your name fat body?"

I mean that's the kind of straight forward solution we all think fat or obese people need to get up off their hole ain't it.

Hourglass Shrugged

doulikeit wrote: »

gonna be a bit of a nazi here, obesity is a ticking time bomb for our already stretched health service cant imagine the staff and resources that this is going to tie up in a few years, most overweight people i know are always trying to loose weight but rarely do, im no athlete myself, but is there no sort of national bootcamp that could be put in place targets to meet and goals to achieve, encouragement and positive reinforcement and a sense of all being in it together, but with no bs excuses and no whinging. here comes the down side if people do not meet there targets or are "not playing the game" higher tax margins or less dole cause its all going to have to be paid for this is a national problem (or it will be), and has to be treated as such. So i know there will be certain cases but apart from that what im trying to say is should a person who is not prepared to go along with this be taxed for being obese and as such an unwelcome burden on our system

"You're a fat bollocks, so we're going to tax you more!"

Hmm, for some reason I don't see that coming across too well. If people wish to be fat, let them, but remind them that they'll have to pay for their own healthcare if their obesity has adverse effects on their health.

doulikeit

no that was not the intention at all, i understand a delicate and emotional subject for some but what im saying is with education, help and the support and understanding of all of us to help these people, and if there is some sort of national program where u can turn too it might not be so daunting. With just a little pressure applied in the right place (physical training and diet education) it would be a positive thing and save millions of euro and man hours, its just a thought, "bashing" anyone was not the intention

MistyCheese

Galwayguy35 wrote: »

Surprise surprise he lost the weight, it's not rocket science to loose weight.

Neither is it rocket science to spell "lose".

cantdecide

MistyCheese wrote: »

Neither is it rocket science to spell "lose".

Booo...

Hourglass Shrugged

doulikeit wrote: »

no that was not the intention at all, i understand a delicate and emotional subject for some but what im saying is with education, help and the support and understanding of all of us to help these people, and if there is some sort of national program where u can turn too it might not be so daunting. With just a little pressure applied in the right place (physical training and diet education) it would be a positive thing and save millions of euro and man hours, its just a thought, "bashing" anyone was not the intention

I wouldn't waste a single cent of tax payers money on "diet education". It's perfectly obvious to anyone with half a brain that if you eat too much food you will expand. Common sense. The reason so many people get so fat isn't because of lack of dietary education but because of addiction; they're addicted to food. Simples. No amount of education is going to alleviate them of that addiction.

Galwayguy35

MistyCheese wrote: »

Neither is it rocket science to spell "lose".

It may be the internet but it's not really a nice thing to comment on an honest spelling mistake and try and make me look stupid.

Manners and politeness cost nothing I was taught from an early age.

The King of Moo

Hourglass Shrugged wrote: »

I wouldn't waste a single cent of tax payers money on "diet education". It's perfectly obvious to anyone with half a brain that if you eat too much food you will expand. Common sense. The reason so many people get so fat isn't because of lack of dietary education but because of addiction; they're addicted to food. Simples. No amount of education is going to alleviate them of that addiction.

Addiction is a big factor, but you can't dismiss dietary education either. Most people know that pizza and crisps are bad for you, but not as many people are aware of the damage things like white bread and pasta can do.

MagicSean

Obesity costs the health service less in the long run. The evidence has been posted in previous threads so your moral outrage at taxes being wasted is misplaced. That's not to say the issue of obesity shouldn't be tackled but your reason for doing it is wrong. The only issue is the personal well being of the individual. As to your nazi camp, well there are much easier ways to tackle the issue in the short term and long term.

doulikeit

MagicSean wrote: »

Obesity costs the health service less in the long run. The evidence has been posted in previous threads so your moral outrage at taxes being wasted is misplaced. That's not to say the issue of obesity shouldn't be tackled but your reason for doing it is wrong. The only issue is the personal well being of the individual. As to your nazi camp, well there are much easier ways to tackle the issue in the short term and long term.

Boot camp buddy calm down, don't really understand your comment costs less in the long run. Well how do we tackle it then anything I've seen so far does not seem to work

MagicSean

doulikeit wrote: »

Boot camp buddy calm down, don't really understand your comment costs less in the long run. Well how do we tackle it then anything I've seen so far does not seem to work

It's not difficult to understand. The average cost of treating obesity related illness over the course of a patients life is less then the average cost of treating a non-obese patient. It's mostly considered to be because of the lower life span.

You say boot camp but then you decide to tax them if they don't do well in it. Will you be throwing in exemptions for people with medical condtions that contribute to their obesity?

If you want to tackle it you have to accept that it really is none of your business if someone wants to go through life the size of a whale. Some people will not want your help. For those that do you give them opportunity and education.

poeticseraphim

Two hours compulsory exercise for all kids in school throughout their school years.

A compulsory nutrition101 class for kids once a week and parents once a year.

Ban ads for junk food.

Make healthy foods available cheaply. Grants for veg farming??

Help people deal with stress in their workplace.


Encourage the workplace to become more health conscious.


Tell Irish people that ALCHOHOL HAS CALORIES .....


People need to get real..give up alchohol and junk and start some exercise and portion control!

Start enforcing a junk food ban in schools.


People go on about suicide rates...well did people ever stop to think that exercise releases powerful natural endorphins and junk influences your brain????

I bet these lifestyle changes would really increase youth happiness rates :-)


But for get about the adults concetrate on the kids....the should have to run a 5k for the leaving cert....or something...lots of psychological benefits.

IF THEY CUT OUT RE CLASS IT'S EASY!

doulikeit

MagicSean wrote: »

It's not difficult to understand. The average cost of treating obesity related illness over the course of a patients life is less then the average cost of treating a non-obese patient. It's mostly considered to be because of the lower life span.

You say boot camp but then you decide to tax them if they don't do well in it. Will you be throwing in exemptions for people with medical condtions that contribute to their obesity?

If you want to tackle it you have to accept that it really is none of your business if someone wants to go through life the size of a whale. Some people will not want your help. For those that do you give them opportunity and education.[/Q
uote]

So ur not in favour of a state health promotion program, of course itcosting millions and it will get worse u can't denie that and if its costing the state that sort of money as tax payers its all our business. Of course there is exceptions old sick im talking about people of working age who if a program and education is there and they don't avail of it then it becomes a lifestyle choice and if they want to continue with that choice then that's there business they will have to pony up it is a thread on tackling the problem not everyone will like it or agree with it but tackling issues is tough

doulikeit

poeticseraphim wrote: »

Two hours compulsory exercise for all kids in school throughout their school years.

A compulsory nutrition101 class for kids once a week and parents once a year.

Ban ads for junk food.

Make healthy foods available cheaply. Grants for veg farming??

Help people deal with stress in their workplace.


Encourage the workplace to become more health conscious.


Tell Irish people that ALCHOHOL HAS CALORIES .....


People need to get real..give up alchohol and junk and start some exercise and portion control!

Start enforcing a junk food ban in schools.


People go on about suicide rates...well did people ever stop to think that exercise releases powerful natural endorphins and junk influences your brain????

I bet these lifestyle changes would really increase youth happiness rates :-)


But for get about the adults concetrate on the kids....the should have to run a 5k for the leaving cert....or something...lots of psychological benefits.

IF THEY CUT OUT RE CLASS IT'S EASY!

great ideas