Dairy Profit Monitor

delaval

We completed ours today and would be interested as to how others got on.
I feel that it might be interesting as there are many varied locations and systems represented on this forum.

Maybe you feel it all a load of bull as it certainly has its shortcomings, love to hear comments.

keep going

dont tell me thats 2012 its not long since i did 2011.did it it for the first time in 2011 and found it bought home a few home truths that i mightnt be as good as i would like to think i am.that said alot of stuff can be explained to some degree by our circumstances but it showed me the areas i need to look at .its a bit like grass budgeting-wont feed the cows for you but will if its used in the right way improve performance

delaval

Very hard to be accurate with first or second one so you may be being hard on your self. I found as I did more of them it got easier aand more accurate. Whie it may not feed the cows it might feed the family

Timmaay

I did a 2010 one for the DEP last year, hardly glanced at the figures a 2nd time I'll fully admit! Haven't got around to the 2011 one yet, however I think I'll just try get the accountant to give me all the 2012 figures as early as he can and do that one instead.

I'd say its far from bull, some very sobering figures in it, and good to compare with some of Teagascs guideline figures for what you should be aiming for if your considering expansion etc etc. However as you said its hard to be accurate, especially when often what you earn and what you tell the taxman differs ha (through perfectly legitimate tax avoidance I'll add!)

Lets not go comparing figures here though delaval :P, myown HOs will probably get well shown up by your JEx ladies, at least I'm steering things (I think!) in the right direction now!

dar31

next week .... i promise

herd test this week, get on top of it then!!!

poor farmer

delaval wrote: »

Very hard to be accurate with first or second one so you may be being hard on your self. I found as I did more of them it got easier aand more accurate. Whie it may not feed the cows it might feed the family

I have to have in before the end of the month. I agree that it gets more accurate the oftener you do it, and it also encourages you keep doing it to see are you making any progress.

delaval

If people feel ok to discuss at end of month I would really like to get into figures. You can't beat benchmarking your figures against others. What I would like to see is where I can improve our figures.

I am quiet happy to put up all my figures if others want to play!!!!!!

blue5000

delaval wrote: »

If people feel ok to discuss at end of month I would really like to get into figures. You can't beat benchmarking your figures against others. What I would like to see is where I can improve our figures.

I am quiet happy to put up all my figures if others want to play!!!!!!

Hope nobody from fukk1ng thesco reads F&F on boards:eek:

I wonder mods could we get a private forum going for GENUINE farmers' eyes only?

delaval

blue5000 wrote: »

Hope nobody from fukk1ng thesco reads F&F on boards:eek:

I wonder mods could we get a private forum going for GENUINE farmers' eyes only?

Bloody good point........you are assuming of course that they are all profitable!

stanflt

delaval wrote: »

If people feel ok to discuss at end of month I would really like to get into figures. You can't beat benchmarking your figures against others. What I would like to see is where I can improve our figures.

I am quiet happy to put up all my figures if others want to play!!!!!!

i will post when im completed

keep going

stanflt wrote: »

i will post when im completed

dont do it stan,my poor little heart couldnt take it:P

stanflt

keep going wrote: »

dont do it stan,my poor little heart couldnt take it:P

i wont make a huge profit per litre- expect around 12cent but will make up in output per cow:)

Timmaay

http://www.teagasc.ie/news/2012/201203-14.asp anyone know if this is still on the go?? Since BOI replaced most their staff with machines, their banking service has become a royal pain, alongside this banking365 is rubbish. Also Saturday opening for Ulster is a big help! 250quid is a nice enough carrot to get my profit monitor done :P

whelan1

Timmaay wrote: »

http://www.teagasc.ie/news/2012/201203-14.asp anyone know if this is still on the go?? Since BOI replaced most their staff with machines, their banking service has become a royal pain, alongside this banking365 is rubbish. Also Saturday opening for Ulster is a big help! 250quid is a nice enough carrot to get my profit monitor done :P

i got it last june... not sure if its still going on

delaval

Here goes
Fat 4.36 Pro 3.63 Scc 200 Sr milking2.81 total 2.5
Concentrate 4.4c/l
Fert 1.98
Vet .94
Ai .50
Contractor .92

Total v.c. 9.65

Labour 2.02
Interest 1.87
Esb .52
Ins .36
Prof fees .60
Land lease 2.07
Quota lease 2.17
Total f.c. 12.54

Co-op Price 36.9 427kg/ha sold 1064kg/cow sold

If anyone else wants to play feel free
Constructive critics only

Tipp Man

delaval wrote: »

Here goes
Fat 4.36 Pro 3.63 Scc 200 Sr milking2.81 total 2.5
Concentrate 4.4c/l
Fert 1.98
Vet .94
Ai .50
Contractor .92

Total v.c. 9.65

Labour 2.02
Interest 1.87
Esb .52
Ins .36
Prof fees .60
Land lease 2.07
Quota lease 2.17
Total f.c. 12.54

Co-op Price 36.9 427kg/ha sold 1064kg/cow sold

If anyone else wants to play feel free
Constructive critics only

strong jersey influence in your herd??

delaval

You being a cute Tipp man should know it all the 'good management' We are about 50% cross bred.
Any comments on figures, anything jumping out?

Tipp Man

delaval wrote: »

You being a cute Tipp man should know it all the 'good management' We are about 50% cross bred.
Any comments on figures, anything jumping out?

Well obviously your solids are good but you milk volume is on the low side IMO - but given the strong jersey influence it is understandable

How do you think the bad year effected the numbers?
Do you think you will get costs below the magical 20c?

poor farmer

delaval wrote: »

Here goes
Fat 4.36 Pro 3.63 Scc 200 Sr milking2.81 total 2.5
Concentrate 4.4c/l
Fert 1.98
Vet .94
Ai .50
Contractor .92

Total v.c. 9.65

Labour 2.02
Interest 1.87
Esb .52
Ins .36
Prof fees .60
Land lease 2.07
Quota lease 2.17
Total f.c. 12.54

Co-op Price 36.9 427kg/ha sold 1064kg/cow sold

If anyone else wants to play feel free
Constructive critics only

Thanks for putting up your figures ,should the last line be 472kg/cow 1064/ha

delaval

Fed 300kgs meal more than budget fed
Only used 12 tonne grass We gre same as last year but wet playey havoc with intakes
We have a winter calving herd also included in these figures. I think that for us to go sub 20 may be a tall order considering land lease, interest and quota lease. We feel that we can do more on output post quota as there is room for more cows on milking block, dilute fixed costs

mf240

There no figure for machinery owned.
Thought your concentrates would be lower with crossbreds is the weather this year to blame.
What are you stocked at Per ha

delaval

poor farmer wrote: »

Thanks for putting up your figures ,should the last line be 472kg/cow 1064/ha

S.R at top of post 2.81 on milking block 2.5 total

so 2.5 x 427kg or if you want to cod yourself 2.81x427kg

delaval

machine running .93
mach leasing .20
Repairs & M .16

Weather resonsible for extra concentrate.
All figures are solids SOLD
Liters per ha 12,916
Net profit/cow €927

I would really like to compare with guys with B/W as alot of debate here and elsewhere........would make for good debate

PMU

E927 per cow is excellent for a year like 2012. thats nearly E2500 on the grazing block. going down the xbreed route myself.

stanflt

delaval wrote: »

machine running .93
mach leasing .20
Repairs & M .16

Weather resonsible for extra concentrate.
All figures are solids SOLD
Liters per ha 12,916
Net profit/cow €927

I would really like to compare with guys with B/W as alot of debate here and elsewhere........would make for good debate

Would 765 not be your output per cow? You said you sold 427kg per cow @ 4.36 and 3.63 which results in just shy of 5200 litre per cow delivered

Tipp Man

delaval wrote: »

machine running .93
mach leasing .20
Repairs & M .16

Weather resonsible for extra concentrate.
All figures are solids SOLD
Liters per ha 12,916
Net profit/cow €927

I would really like to compare with guys with B/W as alot of debate here and elsewhere........would make for good debate

Are you sure your net profit is €927 per cow?

That seems too high

Tipp Man

stanflt wrote: »

Would 765 not be your output per cow? You said you sold 427kg per cow @ 4.36 and 3.63 which results in just shy of 5200 litre per cow delivered

ach beaten to it

I was thinking that the 927 number was way to high

delaval

I will recheck tonight There the numbers as per P.M.

stanflt

delaval wrote: »

I will recheck tonight There the numbers as per P.M.

Regardless these are excellent figures. Well done and keep up the good work. I wish I was making 15cemt a litre.

delaval

stanflt wrote: »

Regardless these are excellent figures. Well done and keep up the good work. I wish I was making 15cemt a litre.

That number is correct rechecked the old fasioned way
€927 includes milk,cow and calf sales this figure doesn't include inventory changes!
€748 milk sales only
Sfp not included

amen

So I'm not a farmer but always interested in the posts here and have learnt a few things.

So for those who are making 12c/15c per litre I assume that is profit after everything has been paid for (feed, fuel, your own labour etc).

So from reading the average cow produces around 6000 litres of milk a year giving a profit of €720 per cow.
So if you have a 100 diary cows you turn a profit of €72,000 ?

Taking the 100 diary cows how much would spend per litre to get the 12c/15 c profit?

I'm curious as to how the production cost/profit ratio matches other business such as banking,retails, manufacturing etc

delaval

amen wrote: »

So I'm not a farmer but always interested in the posts here and have learnt a few things.

So for those who are making 12c/15c per litre I assume that is profit after everything has been paid for (feed, fuel, your own labour etc).

So from reading the average cow produces around 6000 litres of milk a year giving a profit of €720 per cow.
So if you have a 100 diary cows you turn a profit of €72,000 ?

Taking the 100 diary cows how much would spend per litre to get the 12c/15 c profit?

I'm curious as to how the production cost/profit ratio matches other business such as banking,retails, manufacturing etc

These figures do not include Principal,Drawings or Tax
They are only for comparison purposes:)

mf240

100 cows cost 150,000
palour 50,000
cubicle house 150,000
roadways fencing water troughs 40,000
bare minimum of machinery 30,000
silage slab 20,000
land 120 acres 1,500,000

total = 1,940,000 roughly.

would be hard to do without inheriting at least some of above but having said that if you could make it work its not a bad life.

Id imagine the same level of investment in retail would return a lot more. but then there doesent seem to be much confidence in retail at the moment.

Timmaay

Will there be confidence in dairying in late 2015/2016 if Europe is swimming in milk and no one to buy it ha!

You could rent the land on a long term lease either, I certainly wouldn't recommend any less than 15yrs if your pouring down all that concrete, and at a guess of how hard it is to rent at the minute, that would cost 250euro/acre, so 120acres, say knock 30k/yr off the bottom line of 72k, leaves 42k profit.

rancher

amen wrote: »

So I'm not a farmer but always interested in the posts here and have learnt a few things.

So for those who are making 12c/15c per litre I assume that is profit after everything has been paid for (feed, fuel, your own labour etc).

So from reading the average cow produces around 6000 litres of milk a year giving a profit of €720 per cow.
So if you have a 100 diary cows you turn a profit of €72,000 ?

Taking the 100 diary cows how much would spend per litre to get the 12c/15 c profit?

I'm curious as to how the production cost/profit ratio matches other business such as banking,retails, manufacturing etc

And I wouldn't be crazy about the lifestyle that comes with it either

Timmaay

Delaval, probably a stupid question considering you have JEx cows, but I assume you're fully spring milk?

delaval

Timmaay wrote: »

Delaval, probably a stupid question considering you have JEx cows, but I assume you're fully spring milk?

No would have a large winter milk contract. Very few Jex used for this mostly B/W fill this, though any cow calving after 17/3/13 still milking. We just love hardship here:D:D:D

delaval

Is it a case that people that nobody else has a profit monitor done, or is it a case that ye're hi-cost B/W's are not at the races?
I took a bit of stick here regarding Jex and had enough confidence in them to post their figures. Maybe it's time to put your collective money where ye're mouths are in the interest of debate. Many people on Boards speak of it being as good as a discussion group, well let's see!!!!!!!!!!

bob charles

delaval wrote: »

Is it a case that people that nobody else has a profit monitor done, or is it a case that ye're hi-cost B/W's are not at the races?
I took a bit of stick here regarding Jex and had enough confidence in them to post their figures. Maybe it's time to put your collective money where ye're mouths are in the interest of debate. Many people on Boards speak of it being as good as a discussion group, well let's see!!!!!!!!!!

Yip its very shrewd business to show openly to your output buyers what your costs are. If I was a buyer and I see it quoted on here that there are farmers making 15c a litre I would be thinking I could put on the squeeze on price. all well and good to share figures privately but not on an open forum for all to see. Just my taughts. A private discussion section on a site would suit this sort of debate but then that would be making things elitist among previous members

stanflt

delaval wrote: »

Is it a case that people that nobody else has a profit monitor done, or is it a case that ye're hi-cost B/W's are not at the races?
I took a bit of stick here regarding Jex and had enough confidence in them to post their figures. Maybe it's time to put your collective money where ye're mouths are in the interest of debate. Many people on Boards speak of it being as good as a discussion group, well let's see!!!!!!!!!!

mine will be up by next weelend- expecting 12c from milk production- id be high input/output system

whelan1

doing mine at the minute, unfortunately our teagasc advisor is out on leave so we have no dairy advisor for our whole county:mad: ... so i might have to ask people on here for their assistance

delaval

bob charles wrote: »

Yip its very shrewd business to show openly to your output buyers what your costs are. If I was a buyer and I see it quoted on here that there are farmers making 15c a litre I would be thinking I could put on the squeeze on price. all well and good to share figures privately but not on an open forum for all to see. Just my taughts. A private discussion section on a site would suit this sort of debate but then that would be making things elitist among previous members

Bob
Your point is well made but I would counter that it is no longer relavent. I wouldn't have dreamed of posting such info. prior to 2009. As Glanbia set up the Greenfield farm in Kilkenny the ground has shifted many degrees in this regard. We also now have a farm in Bandon and a lot of work taking place in Ballyhaise Co Cavan re. wetter more difficult land.

I however totally agree with your point re. private forum, from my limited exerience of Boards it could be in fact quiet destructive.

delaval

whelan1 wrote: »

doing mine at the minute, unfortunately our teagasc advisor is out on leave so we have no dairy advisor for our whole county:mad: ... so i might have to ask people on here for their assistance

Get up last years input sheet on line you will find it a great help and it will refresh your way of approaching it.
We get a big sheet of paper an write all headings accross the top a then fill in numbers per month as you go through bank statements and invoices/statements. If you contact your Glanbia business advisor you can get a very detailed print out breaking down all your inputs to the various enterprises.
I would caution against using figures from Agrilink as they do not include any discounts negociated when paying bill. Ours is quiet straight forward as we are 100% dairy here.If you need any assistance I would be glad to help

Timmaay

Delaval, you use the IFAC profit monitor report? And do you enter it all into the Teagasc Client website, like for the DEP, or do you do it in yourown excel spreadsheet?

bob charles

delaval wrote: »

Bob
Your point is well made but I would counter that it is no longer relavent. I wouldn't have dreamed of posting such info. prior to 2009. As Glanbia set up the Greenfield farm in Kilkenny the ground has shifted many degrees in this regard. We also now have a farm in Bandon and a lot of work taking place in Ballyhaise Co Cavan re. wetter more difficult land.

I however totally agree with your point re. private forum, from my limited exerience of Boards it could be in fact quiet destructive.

and my opinion of that research farm was Glanbia (whoever is behind it) saying to their suppliers look we can produce milk for argument sake 20c/l so everyone else should be able to aswell even though on a monitor farm there are many "hidden" costs

mf240

bob charles wrote: »

and my opinion of that research farm was Glanbia (whoever is behind it) saying to their suppliers look we can produce milk for argument sake 20c/l so everyone else should be able to aswell even though on a monitor farm there are many "hidden" costs

would usually agree with you bob but the info being reported in the journal seems to suggest that they are finding it hard to make it work and its certainly no gravy train.

bob charles

mf240 wrote: »

would usually agree with you bob but the info being reported in the journal seems to suggest that they are finding it hard to make it work and its certainly no gravy train.

it must be doing terrible, if they are saying everything isnt going 100% in the paper

Timmaay

Any of the Greenfield, or monitored farms produced their 2012 profit monitor figures yet?

Blue Holland

Anyone on here use the Teagasc Cost Control Planner to fill up profit monitor, also is profit per litre before or after own labour?
Almost have it finished, bit of work dividing stuff between different enterprises.

delaval

Blue Holland wrote: »

Anyone on here use the Teagasc Cost Control Planner to fill up profit monitor, also is profit per litre before or after own labour?
Almost have it finished, bit of work dividing stuff between different enterprises.

After your own labour. Your on labour is looked on as drawings because these can vary greatly from farm to farm ie. single person as compare to married with 3 in college and one in secondary:(:(:(

delaval

Timmaay wrote: »

Delaval, you use the IFAC profit monitor report? And do you enter it all into the Teagasc Client website, like for the DEP, or do you do it in yourown excel spreadsheet?

Tim
I'm not with ifac.
I enter on client site

I only use sheet for roughwork