World War Z

Brown Bomber

Zombie fiction wouldn't normally be my thing tbh but somebody gave me a copy for Christmas and I've been home bored and sick at home so I thought I'd give it read last night. I'd never heard of the book or the author before so I was a little surprised to find the book is rife with Zionist/war propaganda.

The narrative develops through a series of interviews carried out by the narrator, who is working for the UN with witnesses of "World War Z". These interviews take him all over the world.

One of the first interviewees is an Israeli Mossad agent who is driven by the ever-present threats to Israels existence is the first to figure out the zombie threat to the world.

He informs his government who try to inform the world through the UN, but people don't take them seriously - and then all pay the destructive price. His first line is "WHY didn't they believe us!?"

I think we can see obvious parallells with this:

The next interviewee is a former Palestinian refugee, now living in the "middle easts most affluent city", Bethelehem, Palestine. His family wasn't ethnically cleansed from his home by Israeli forces of course - they left by choice! The heroic government of Israel has withdrawn from the occupied territories - even in the knowledge that it would lead to an inevitable civil war with the Haredim.

Despite this withdrawal the Palestinian interviewee had still wanted to see Jews driven into the sea. He was a wannabe terrorist and anti-semite with violent tendencies. Despite this, he admits to not having known anything about Jews.

Meanwhile the heroic Israeli government has offered safety to all Palestinians and Jews around the world within the confines of it's apartheid wall.

The next interviewee is a former member of Iran's Revolutionary Guard who describes the escalation between the two Muslim nations (of course) that destroyed each other with nuclear weapons. Iran (of course) and Pakistan.

After that there was an intervieẃ with an American solider whose account illustrates the dangers of not spending enough on the military. And that is as far as I got.

===============================================================

I'm interested if anyone else has read it and what did they think?

Sir Digby Chicken Caesar

man
i'd love to know what you would have made of the redekker plan

Canis Lupus

So are we discussing if zombies are real or not?

Jonny7

I'll just leave this clue here

humanji

It's hardly surprising that someone who would consider themselves a Zionist would write favorably about Israel. It's not really a conspiracy, is it?

Brown Bomber

humanji wrote: »

It's hardly surprising that someone who would consider themselves a Zionist would write favorably about Israel. It's not really a conspiracy, is it?

I don't know anything about the author but I do know that Josef Goebbels was charged by Hitler to produce propaganda that fused politics, art, media, and literarature etc and it was highly succesful. Goebbels was obviously and openly Nazi but that doesn't make his propaganda any less of an attempt to influence minds by stealth or any less of a conspiracy.

Brown Bomber

Canis Lupus wrote: »

So are we discussing if zombies are real or not?

Nope.

Canis Lupus

Humanji already explained why it would be pro Israeli, I've little to add but it's supposed to be a good zombie book. It's on my to read list. Maybe just give it a chance based on that.

Tzar Chasm

it is a good book tho, I would admit that there does seem to be a bit of a political bias towards the 'zionist narrative' the bits about israel irked me slightly when they portrayed the apartheid wall as the thing that save them, and the rest of the political stereotypes didn't help much, paranoid drunken Russians armed to the teeth and installing a czar (well that last bit does have a little appeal the chinese being a mix of supesrsisious peasants and greedy developers with no regard for the environment, iran and pakistan going fundementalist and nuking each other, its been a while since I read it but they are the ones I remember off and.

his other book
'the zombie survival guide' would probably be more the op's style, as it do sent get into politics, its just a field manual for the zompocalypse. but it is a great read

one of the reviewers summed it up well when he said, funny book, well written, but by the third chapter you will find yourself buying a machette 'just in case'

hooradiation

Brown Bomber wrote: »

Zombie fiction wouldn't normally be my thing tbh but somebody gave me a copy for Christmas and I've been home bored and sick at home so I thought I'd give it read last night. I'd never heard of the book or the author before so I was a little surprised to find the book is rife with Zionist/war propaganda.

The narrative develops through a series of interviews carried out by the narrator, who is working for the UN with witnesses of "World War Z". These interviews take him all over the world.

One of the first interviewees is an Israeli Mossad agent who is driven by the ever-present threats to Israels existence is the first to figure out the zombie threat to the world.

He informs his government who try to inform the world through the UN, but people don't take them seriously - and then all pay the destructive price. His first line is "WHY didn't they believe us!?"

I think we can see obvious parallells with this:

The next interviewee is a former Palestinian refugee, now living in the "middle easts most affluent city", Bethelehem, Palestine. His family wasn't ethnically cleansed from his home by Israeli forces of course - they left by choice! The heroic government of Israel has withdrawn from the occupied territories - even in the knowledge that it would lead to an inevitable civil war with the Haredim.

Despite this withdrawal the Palestinian interviewee had still wanted to see Jews driven into the sea. He was a wannabe terrorist and anti-semite with violent tendencies. Despite this, he admits to not having known anything about Jews.

Meanwhile the heroic Israeli government has offered safety to all Palestinians and Jews around the world within the confines of it's apartheid wall.

The next interviewee is a former member of Iran's Revolutionary Guard who describes the escalation between the two Muslim nations (of course) that destroyed each other with nuclear weapons. Iran (of course) and Pakistan.

After that there was an intervieẃ with an American solider whose account illustrates the dangers of not spending enough on the military. And that is as far as I got.

===============================================================

I'm interested if anyone else has read it and what did they think?

Oh christ. Only here could a harmless book about zombies be twisted into "dem zionists!", but I guess when you've only got a hammer everything looks like a nail.

First -The whole "Unheeded warning" is a very common trope in, well, just about everything. If people paid attention to the lone voice in the bloody wilderness absolutely no story would ever go anywhere.
Alien wouldn't gotten very far if they'd heeded the warning beacon on LV426 and just gone on their merry way, would it?

As for the Iran/Pakistan thing, the point isn't what "oh those wacky muslims killing each other" it is explicitly about how in the world of zombie fiction that people are far more dangerous than the undead. If you recall the whole situation escalates from refugees flooding from Pakistan to Iran and a quick escalation from a border skirmish to full scale war.
They didn't wipe eachother out because they're muslims, they wiped each other out because of zombie tropes 101 - man is the real monster.

And the interview with the US marine isn't about "spend more on the military" it was how the foremost military power in the world was poorly equipped to fight the kind of battle they had on their hands. The character you're referring to points out that
A] the American people had no desire to fight after several intractable conflicts abroad, which is fairly accurate
B] The tactics employed were poorly suited to the task at hand (the battle of yonkers)
C] They had spent loads of money on the military, the battle of yonkers was explicitly meant to be a showcase of how the US military could beat this threat with all it's high-tech weapons. If you contained your misplaced disgust to read that far then you'll know that didn't work.
Say hello to another common trope in zombie fiction. In order for a zombie apocalypse to work there must be a breakdown of the normal order.



I think you need to learnt hat not everything can be viewed in terms of how terrible you think Israel is and that fiction is just that.
Christ, this has been depressing.

JustinDee

Brown Bomber wrote: »

I don't know anything about the author but I do know that Josef Goebbels was charged by Hitler to produce propaganda that fused politics, art, media, and literarature etc and it was highly succesful. Goebbels was obviously and openly Nazi but that doesn't make his propaganda any less of an attempt to influence minds by stealth or any less of a conspiracy.

Its a work of fiction. Entertainment. It also includes within the story, all sorts of issues and traits involving society and its factions within, not just race or Israel but class, nationality, wealth and even natural instinct when all else has failed.

Propaganda? Oh ffs.

Torakx

Remember this was probably wrriten with the film in mind.

Owryan

Torakx wrote: »

Remember this was probably wrriten with the film in mind.

From reading about the film and having seen the trailer , about the only thing the book and the film have in common is the title.

hooradiation

Owryan wrote: »

From reading about the film and having seen the trailer , about the only thing the book and the film have in common is the title.

True.

Still gonna go see it though.

Owryan

hooradiation wrote: »

True.

Still gonna go see it download though.

:P


FYP




only joking oh uber mods

shedweller

JustinDee wrote: »

Its a work of fiction. Entertainment. It also includes within the story, all sorts of issues and traits involving society and its factions within, not just race or Israel but class, nationality, wealth and even natural instinct when all else has failed.

Propaganda? Oh ffs.

A lot of propaganda could be regarded as fiction. Why should this be any different?

Tzar Chasm

that's a reasonable point, if someone posted a video of jude suss or some other film of that ilk they would probably be banned, I can see where brown bomber is coming from on this subject, but I would have to say that having read the book a lot of it is just due to the authors american perspective and his inclination to write for his target audience of americans, the book is full of little moments of over simplified americsnised views of the rest of the world, I fully expect in the movie that there will be a scene where some form of crowd chants USA,USA,USA

btw I too am not expecting the film to be any good, i'll still watch it, but i'm not expecting much

hooradiation

Tzar Chasm wrote: »

that's a reasonable point, if someone posted a video of jude suss or some other film of that ilk they would probably be banned, I can see where brown bomber is coming from on this subject, but I would have to say that having read the book a lot of it is just due to the authors american perspective and his inclination to write for his target audience of americans, the book is full of little moments of over simplified americsnised views of the rest of the world, I fully expect in the movie that there will be a scene where some form of crowd chants USA,USA,USA

Well I can't take his criticisms seriously, seeing as he didn't bother his hole to finish it.

Also, he seems to think it's about Israel being "the hero" when after the outbreak they really don't figure much into it and, as you said, it's more about the Americans.

JustinDee

shedweller wrote: »

A lot of propaganda could be regarded as fiction. Why should this be any different?

Fire away then. Read into what you will.
Its obvious that Max Brooks is a working class Afrikaaner pro-communist Cuban who supports Israel and hates entertainers, Arabs, Indian untouchables, women, Chinese farmers and most of all, Canadians . . . really.

Torakx

Sorry i just presumed the new film with Brad Pitt was based off that book.
Same name i think.

I guess if your looking for motive, you should check what other books that writer published and also the publishers.
If the movie is based off the book, then director, producer film history, symbolism and subliminals.

JustinDee

Torakx wrote: »

Sorry i just presumed the new film with Brad Pitt was based off that book.
Same name i think

It is the same book. I was being sarcastic because the charge that it is Zionist is that ludicrous and those traits are all derived from different tales related in the book.

Jewish author and son of Mel Brooks writes what is basically a broad look at the effects of a dystopian disaster on society across the globe. And that's about it really.

Brown Bomber

Torax,

If you are interested you can see for yourself. I found an audiobook version on youtube. The Israeli comes in just after 30 mins - then the Palestinian - then the Iranian
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hIhpOPJ2sXc

Torakx

0:42:00 - 0:48:00

Paints Israel as the only nation doing anything against the coming storm.A haven.
But also highlights taking in outside Jews and Palastinians, using the palestinians as human shields.

I kinda stopped listening after that.
There was alot of references to zionists.

Corkfeen

Corkfeen wrote: »

We really have to discuss some Mel Brooks films after this. Young Frankenstein as a critique on eugenics.

Blazing Saddles was his diatribe against people of colour holding public office as chaos would ensue.

JustinDee

King Mob wrote: »

Blazing Saddles was his diatribe against people of colour holding public office as chaos would ensue.

It was a satirical stab at racist politics in the US. How can that be misrepresented as being against non-whites holding office?? What backs that up?
It is clearly showing up the white people of the town being initially not ready for a non-white as sheriff, by their racist and myopic behaviour.

JustinDee

JustinDee wrote: »

How can that be misrepresented as being against non-whites holding office?? What backs that up?

The same way a book about zombies could be misrepresented as Zionist propaganda? As in not at all and you need to be looking really hard and ignoring the intent of the author...

JustinDee

King Mob wrote: »

The same way a book about zombies could be misrepresented as Zionist propaganda?

The obviousness of who 'Blazing Saddles' digs at is evident in the behaviour of the white people in the town in the first half of the movie.

With 'World War Z', obssessives here go to town on it without even reading the entire story because Israelis are seen as doing something incidentally good ie. being protected from the onslaught by the wall.
These people jumping the gun happen to ignore the ironies. The fact that Cuba becomes the richest nation, high explosive weapons are now useless, South Africans resort to extreme methods to protect themselves successfully, the top echelons in society end up as the grafters due to the futility of their lines of work (solicitors, bankers, politicians etc) while craftsmen are the most valuable.

Its not deep at all. Hidden messages? Twaddle.
Not exactly Umberto Eco but simple enough story written in a thoroughly engaging, pretty original and entertaining way.

hooradiation

JustinDee wrote: »

The obviousness of who 'Blazing Saddles' digs at is evident in the behaviour of the white people in the town in the first half of the movie.

With 'World War Z', obssessives here go to town on it without even reading the entire story because Israelis are seen as doing something incidentally good ie. being protected from the onslaught by the wall.
These people jumping the gun happen to ignore the ironies. The fact that Cuba becomes the richest nation, high explosive weapons are now useless, South Africans resort to extreme methods to protect themselves successfully, the top echelons in society end up as the grafters due to the futility of their lines of work (solicitors, bankers, politicians etc) while craftsmen are the most valuable.

Its not deep at all. Hidden messages? Twaddle.
Not exactly Umberto Eco but simple enough story written in a thoroughly engaging, pretty original and entertaining way.

Honestly, if they got as far as the redeker plan, they'd have kittens.
Followed by aneurysms.

Cookie_Monster

what about the whales? nobody gave a damn about the whales

Brown Bomber

King Mob wrote: »

The same way a book about zombies could be misrepresented as Zionist propaganda? As in not at all and you need to be looking really hard and ignoring the intent of the author...

And the same way that Animal Farm is clearly a children*s book about a bunch of animals on a farm.

Brown Bomber

Brown Bomber wrote: »

And the same way that Animal Farm is clearly a children*s book about a bunch of animals on a farm.

So then my interpretation of Blazing Saddles as a commentary on race relations is a valid one and I am justified in calling Mel Brooks a racist?
If not, why not?

You realise you are referring to a book about zombies that is a spinoff to another book even more tongue in cheek book right?