Improving digital freeview tv signal quality

Reg'stoy

I have a friend living in Rush, north Co Dublin. They had always been able to get a mixed quality non Irish tv signal and after the switch over have been getting some of the UK freeview channels along with the Saorview Irish channels.

They are getting signal strength 70% but the signal quality is only as low as 5% up to 15%. Some of the freeview channels come in ok while others BBC1 for example come in prettly poorly. The Saorview strength and quality are 100%/95%.

Questions, with a caveat neither of us are particularly tech savey regarding digital Tv. Would a realignment of their chimney mounted aerial improve things, would fitting a 'booster/amp' along the cable run, be it in the hotpress or behind the Tv, work also.

They don't get Dave or any of the other lesser freeview channels but are not too worried about that, so what increase in signal quality (important one) from what I have been able to google would be enough.

whitebriar

To help people reply effeciently,can you post a pic of the aerial

Are houses next door not having the problem,post a pic of their aerials too and a description of your area (height above sea level,view in direction of kilkeel etc)

lucernarian

Reg'stoy wrote: »

I have a friend living in Rush, north Co Dublin. They had always been able to get a mixed quality non Irish tv signal and after the switch over have been getting some of the UK freeview channels along with the Saorview Irish channels.

They are getting signal strength 70% but the signal quality is only as low as 5% up to 15%. Some of the freeview channels come in ok while others BBC1 for example come in prettly poorly. The Saorview strength and quality are 100%/95%.

Questions, with a caveat neither of us are particularly tech savey regarding digital Tv. Would a realignment of their chimney mounted aerial improve things, would fitting a 'booster/amp' along the cable run, be it in the hotpress or behind the Tv, work also.

They don't get Dave or any of the other lesser freeview channels but are not too worried about that, so what increase in signal quality (important one) from what I have been able to google would be enough.

Usually the amps are fine unless water is getting in, the cable is a regular culprit and it's easy to replace it with better quality cable. Then the aerial itself may not be up to scratch. Or putting the aerial on a slightly higher pole might work wonders.

Reg'stoy

Thanks folks, I will next time I'm over get pictures or ask them to send me some.

Does anyone one know of any good installers in the Rush area, at a guesstimate the aerial is in place the 15 years they've lived there; so maybe a complete overhaul of the aerial, cable and maybe re-route same to a couple of extra points might be in order.

P_1

A booster could do the trick, my folks in Balrothery were having the same trouble hassle but a booster solved that pretty swiftly

lucernarian

pithater1 wrote: »

A booster could do the trick, my folks in Balrothery were having the same trouble hassle but a booster solved that pretty swiftly

There's a lot of threads that talk about "boosters" on boards, you'll see they usually don't work. One swallow doesn't make a summer. Especially the stuff found in argos, it's often a waste of money unless it's being used to supply a second TV that's got a long length of cable to supply it. If the booster can be tried out and put back in the package if it doesn't work, and brought back to the shop, then it's worth trying out!

JonathonS

Reg'stoy wrote: »

Does anyone one know of any good installers in the Rush area,

Try Dowlings in Skerries.

R.O.R

Reg'stoy wrote: »

Thanks folks, I will next time I'm over get pictures or ask them to send me some.

If you can find their house on streetview on google maps, you should be able to zoom to get a fairly decent picture of the aeriel.

adox

I`m in Rush(near the Harbour) and have a chimney mounted aerial since we bought the house 13 years ago.

Bought a freeview HD telly late last year and the signal strength on Freeview is 100 % with an average of 90% quality.

Reg'stoy

adox wrote: »

I`m in Rush(near the Harbour) and have a chimney mounted aerial since we bought the house 13 years ago.

Bought a freeview HD telly late last year and the signal strength on Freeview is 100 % with an average of 90% quality.

Cheers Adox what direction is your aerial pointed and are you getting all the freeview channels including Dave and Sky news.

Reg'stoy

The house is west facing, their aerial is on the left.

doney84

adox wrote: »

I`m in Rush(near the Harbour) and have a chimney mounted aerial since we bought the house 13 years ago.

Bought a freeview HD telly late last year and the signal strength on Freeview is 100 % with an average of 90% quality.

Are you getting the commerical muxes (Dave, Pick TV, Sky News etc) or just the PSB muxes (BBC's, UTV, CH4, E4 etc)?

FREETV

Reg'stoy wrote: »

The house is west facing, their aerial is on the left.

That is a wideband grid type aerial, notoriously they have a very poor performance on Group A frequencies which would be one reason for the poor signal readings and they probably have RG6 Cabling which only lasts over five years before water ingress problems. Those aerial haven't got the same gain as a Group A Triax Unix 100 for instance or probably a Unix 52. The signal luckily is very strong from Divis in North County Dublin. They could connect some fresh cable to the aerial bypassing the masthead amp and try the signal or turn down the masthead amp before connecting it. With better equipment they should be able to get the same signal readings as Adox. The longer the pole the better. Webro WF100 will help too. It probably isn't even aligned and pointed towards Divis either.

Peter Rhea

That's a fairly typical setup for that area: a vertically polarised 'grid' aerial. It will have been intended to receive from the Clermont Carn (ROI) & Kilkeel (NI) transmitters, as they're not too far apart.

Kilkeel is only a fill-in site, intended to serve the actual town of Kilkeel & nearby areas, so it isn't high powered & is dwarfed by the output from Clermont Carn, which is one of our main sites. So it's no surprise that there is a discrepancy in the signal received from each at your location.

The aerial in the photo looks to be already fitted with a 'masthead' amplifier. There should be a power supply for this, maybe at the main tv point (or any other convenient location): DC power is delivered via the aerial cable itself.

FREETV

adox wrote: »

I`m in Rush(near the Harbour) and have a chimney mounted aerial since we bought the house 13 years ago.

Bought a freeview HD telly late last year and the signal strength on Freeview is 100 % with an average of 90% quality.

Hi adox, any idea of what type of aerial was installed to your chimney to help the original poster out?

Reg'stoy

@FREETV and @Peter Rhea Thanks guys, there appeared to be a power supply in their hotpress (unplugged it no TV) last time I was there. The aerial you describe FREETV is the exact one I have in my attic (Swords) unfortunatly I don't get the freeview signal but I have a humax hdr freesat box so no bad.

I reckon from all the great advice (as usual) here, the best thing would be for them to get a new aerial along with new cabling. They'll have to changed at some stage because as I said earlier the aerial is at least 15 years there so in fairness doesn't owe them a lot at this stage.

I mentioned Dowlings to the other half who is also from Rush and they seem to have a good name and as a local business I will recommend them. I'll hang on and see if adox replies before telling them.

Thanks again folks as always boards.ie proves its worth.

lucernarian

FREETV wrote: »

That is a wideband grid type aerial, notoriously they have a very poor performance on Group A frequencies which would be one reason for the poor signal readings and they probably have RG6 Cabling which only lasts over five years before water ingress problems. Those aerial haven't got the same gain as a Group A Triax Unix 100 for instance or probably a Unix 52. The signal luckily is very strong from Divis in North County Dublin. They could connect some fresh cable to the aerial bypassing the masthead amp and try the signal or turn down the masthead amp before connecting it. With better equipment they should be able to get the same signal readings as Adox. The longer the pole the better. Webro WF100 will help too. It probably isn't even aligned and pointed towards Divis either.

That post unfortunately is of limited relevance here, as they are receiving Freeview from Kilkeel, a vertically-polarised Group B relay of Divis. The grid aerial is okay in these circumstances, assuming water hasn't gotten into the balun (the black box in the centre of the aerial)

FREETV

To_be_confirmed wrote: »

That post unfortunately is of limited relevance here, as they are receiving Freeview from Kilkeel, a vertically-polarised Group B relay of Divis. The grid aerial is okay in these circumstances, assuming water hasn't gotten into the balun (the black box in the centre of the aerial)

The aerial just needs to be realigned for Divis first as adox is receiving Divis in Rush. The equipment can be checked then also. They want Divis after all and are based in Rush.

lucernarian

FREETV wrote: »

The aerial just needs to be realigned for Divis first as adox is receiving Divis in Rush.

Kilkeel is better in Rush. Changing to Divis will mean two new aerials (unless the grid is re-used for clermont carn, probably a new pole also that can hold two aerials and the cost of a combiner and likely a different masthead amp. A very expensive job in comparison.

Also depending on the aerial brand, it may have to be taken down and the fixing dismantled, then reassembled, to convert it to horizontal polarisation.

FREETV

To_be_confirmed wrote: »

Kilkeel is better in Rush. Changing to Divis will mean two new aerials (unless the grid is re-used for clermont carn, probably a new pole also that can hold two aerials and the cost of a combiner and likely a different masthead amp. A very expensive job in comparison.

Also depending on the aerial brand, it may have to be taken down and the fixing dismantled, then reassembled, to convert it to horizontal polarisation.

Aye true but maybe someone local here from boards will help them out for free and align it, check the signal, amp, cabling etc? That equipment is poor, the same stuff was already installed on the chimney here at our house before I moved.

SPAWKER

FREETV wrote: »

The aerial just needs to be realigned for Divis first as adox is receiving Divis in Rush. The equipment can be checked then also. They want Divis after all and are based in Rush.

Depends on what part of Rush they are in as to wheather they will get Divis or not.Some parts of Rush are too low to receive it.

FREETV

SPAWKER wrote: »

Depends on what part of Rush they are in as to wheather they will get Divis or not.Some parts of Rush are too low to receive it.

Fifteen to twenty feet long mast guyed with steel wire ropes then?

Ronnie Raygun

FREETV wrote: »

The aerial just needs to be realigned for Divis first as adox is receiving Divis in Rush. The equipment can be checked then also. They want Divis after all and are based in Rush.

Where does adox mention receiving Divis? IIRC from other threads, it's Kilkeel. Also, where does the OP here mention that they "want" Divis?

FREETV wrote: »

That equipment is poor, the same stuff was already installed on the chimney here at our house before I moved.

For "poor" equipment, it certainly makes for a v. popular installation in that part of the country. Have you done many CC/Kilkeel installs in that area?

FREETV

Ronnie Raygun wrote: »

Where does adox mention receiving Divis? IIRC from other threads, it's Kilkeel. Also, where does the OP here mention that they "want" Divis?



For "poor" equipment, it certainly makes for a v. popular installation in that part of the country. Have you done many CC/Kilkeel installs in that area?

I am not an installer, cool down please, trying to help the OP, maybe adox is receiving Kilkeel. I did work in electronics and studied it in college though. Those aerials are cheap installs, good for analogue when it existed and ghosting problems but lower gain compared to a high gain Unix for instance.

Ronnie Raygun

Everything is "cheap" when you compare it to something more expensive. No need to rubbish other peoples' setups like that.

FREETV

Ronnie Raygun wrote: »

Everything is "cheap" when you compare it to something more expensive. No need to rubbish other peoples' setups like that.

True Ronnie, I didn't mean to offend you or others, they aren't rubbish but compared to even an old Triax Unix 100 Group A or B, even wideband one they are poor performance wise but may still do the job if the signal is adequate enough.

Mr. Rabbit

I know this is a terrestrial thread, but if reception from Divis is impossible, would Freesat not be a far better option than Kilkeel ?

There's really not that much difference between it and Freeview these days.

whitebriar

Mr. Rabbit wrote: »

I know this is a terrestrial thread, but if reception from Divis is impossible, would Freesat not be a far better option than Kilkeel ?

There's really not that much difference between it and Freeview these days.

If Dowlings have a meter and a spare group A,they could test Divis there.They could test it on the grid but,results will be poor compared to the group A.
If there was a good signal on Divis,that's the route I'd go down but only if ch 23 is available. A good installer would probably want €300+ depending on the price of a new aerial,pole etc, to re do the set up as a Divis one.
Servicing the grid,alligning it properly,cabling etc for Kilkeel a lot less.

Beauty of fixing up your aerial system,is the ease of multi room with a decent bouquet of channels in rooms.The best set up free of monthly bills,is to have that and free sat on a combi box as a back up in a main room.

We have the full free view HD service down here from preseli,installed professionally combined with saorview and Its 99.99% reliable on both,and like a lot of people in my area haven't looked back in the 3 and a half years that the full power welsh service has been available down here.Its such a lovely seamless system and highly recommendit where it's possible.

Ronnie Raygun

FREETV wrote: »

I am not an installer ...

Nor am I, & I would be inclined to believe that the grid aerial would never have offered anything better than mediocre reception from Kilkeel (OP mentions "mixed quality").

Also, only since switchover completed has there been a real incentive to try for Divis, so historical use of Kilkeel could be simply due to reasons of convenience (2 tx sites on 1 aerial) & maybe a less ghosted analogue picture, rather than a lack of signal strength from Divis.

Kilkeel takes the Mourne mtns. out of the signal path & about 35 miles distance, but Divis is considerably higher & far more powerful.

Reg'stoy

SPAWKER wrote: »

Depends on what part of Rush they are in as to wheather they will get Divis or not.Some parts of Rush are too low to receive it.

Ok according to google maps find altitude they are at 10.5 meters or 36 feet in old money. They are the beach side of the Skerries road in Thornleigh.

whitebriar

Reg'stoy wrote: »

Ok according to google maps find altitude they are at 10.5 meters or 36 feet in old money. They are the beach side of the Skerries road in Thornleigh.

I don't know the area,so can't comment further on Divis.But that's low,do they have a sea view from their chimney towards Kilkeel?

In kilkeels favour,it's a direct sea path probably.Arfon down in Wicklow is coming in fine on grids albeit,Arfon is 5 times the power but against that,its nearly 3 times the distance but has much better height.

You'd be as well getting the local installer out and getting them to meter Divis and Kilkeel.A small group b to replace the grid wouldn't cost a whole lot extra if Kilkeel is the strongest.
Also chances are the grid isn't centred exactly on kilkeels beam anyway, so when your installer is done,that also will have improved things.