Women and homelessness

Another way women are portrayed in the media.

Currently there is a radio ad for a homeless charity, it has woman talking about how she had to leave her violent husband in very cold weather with her children and ends up living in one room with no cooking faculties and so on.

I know it a homeless charity and they are trying to extract money from people so they are trying to make it as poignant as possible with out it becoming a farce. However it portrayer's women as straight out of 1950,... Women are victims first last and in the middle,....they are financially dependant on a husband/man, women never have money or choices of their own, they never have a job/career, they never have any family or friends or if they do by implication they are as poor and down trodden as she is and cant help her.

I think its a terrible stereotype of woman and really gets on my nerves am I the only one who feel like that.

Neyite

If the ad came from Womens Aid would it be any better?

I haven't
heard the ad myself. The sad fact is that during the Christmas season it can be the worst time for domestic violence to escalate, and maybe where you may be able to go to a friend for a few days, if they have a full house you have nowhere to go, but a shelter.

Usually by the time a woman is forced to flee her home to escape danger she has already been manipulated into being a stay at home mother, without any access to finances, or transport.

When I had to leave it was sudden. I worked, and I luckily didnt have children then, but whatever I earned always seemed to be absorbed by the household bills, so I was always broke. I couldn't afford the deposit on another flat, nor the first months rent, and my family lived too far away for me to stay with them and still commute to work. If I had children I would have ended up in a refuge or shelter for a few nights at least.

Maybe the ad is trying to change the stereotype that homeless people are addicts, and that there are many reasons for homelessness?

MagicMarker

I don't think it's a stereotype at all, like it or not a lot of women, such as middle aged 'homemakers', are dependent on their husbands.

I am middle aged and know lots of other middle aged women and they all work even if its only for a few hours a week, all my sisters work and my friends, the only woman I know who does not work outside the home has taken a careers brake and is going back to work when her youngest child goes to school.

Going back over the past 30 years something like 80% of women have competed second level education, currently its over 90% completing secondary education.

I worked as volunteered in womans refuge about 15 years ago so I know domestic violence is a complex one.

I still think the portrayal of women as a victim with little or no choices in life is not good.

MagicMarker

You and your friends working doesn't change the fact that there are plenty of women out there who don't, who gave up work to be a stay at home mum and who are dependent on their husband's income.

These people exist, and the ad (from your description at least, I haven't seen it) is representative of the people is these situations.

Fr_Dougal

mariaalice wrote: »

I still think the portrayal of women as a victim with little or no choices in life is not good.

It's the harsh reality for a lot of women out there.

eviltwin

I've heard the ad and don't think there is anything wrong with it. Would it be any better if she had said she was made homeless by losing her job or an addiction? She's still a woman so is she still a "victim" regardless of how she ends up in that position?

The fact is for a lot of women even those with jobs, if they have a violent partner their only way to get out is by leaving. And you would need to be on good money to be able to walk out of your home and start anew somewhere else.

I think its good the ad is showing that people aren't always homeless just because they are drunk or on drugs which seems to be the stereotype.

There are lots of realities for women who are in abusive situations and I suppose my main problem with ads and others like it, ls it only port ryes one reality for woman in that situation and its always the one where she is a powerless passive victim ( of a man ) its so one dimensional.

The point about the homeless charities ads is a good one they have changed tack in the past few years, there ads use to never mention addiction,violence, mental health dysfunctional families ( the usual causes of of homelessness )... the ads use to portrayed the homeless as some poor unfortunate who was down on his luck and fell through the cracks god love him type of thing( I am not saying that dose not happen but it is not the majority reason for homelessness )

Merkin

MagicMarker wrote: »

You and your friends working doesn't change the fact that there are plenty of women out there who don't, who gave up work to be a stay at home mum and who are dependent on their husband's income.

These people exist, and the ad (from your description at least, I haven't seen it) is representative of the people is these situations.

Totally agree. There are lots of women out there who can't work or who have chosen not to because childcare simply is not affordable based on extortionate fees or who simply can't get a job and are dependent on a partner. While you and your friends are fortunate enough to be able to work and be financially independent there are a lot of women out there for one reason or another who are not in this position.

ash23

It's one woman and one womans circumstances.

I don't see how they are portraying all women as being dependent on their husbands. The reality of trying to work and earn a living as a single woman with children is difficult. You have to cover childcare for starters. That means a minimum wage job just won't suffice.
If your children are 10+ you don't get one parent family payment. You can't get rent allowance if you already own a house (even if there is a violent partner in situ).


I can easily see how a woman who made career sacrifices when she had her children could end up homeless if she had to leave a partner.
It very nearly happened to me and I've always worked.

eviltwin

Its not an ad about domestice violence, its an ad about homelessness. The story portrayed has to be taken in that context.

I am not saying it could not does not happen to some woman of course it does but my point it is some women... and in the absents of other portraits of woman who got out of an abusive situation( in the media and cultural ) the default position for woman in abusive situations is the one in the ad and it become embedded in our culture that women are dependant on men are passive and powrless....in fact it might cause women not to leave an abusive situations because if you listen to the ad its says if you leave an abusive situation you will end up living in one room with no cooking facilities.

eviltwin

mariaalice wrote: »

I am not saying it could not does not happen to some woman of course it does but my point it is some women... and in the absents of other portraits of woman who got out of an abusive situation( in the media and cultural ) the default position for woman in abusive situations is the one in the ad and it become embedded in our culture that women are dependant on men are passive and powrless....in fact it might cause women not to leave an abusive situations because if you listen to the ad its says if you leave an abusive situation you will end up living in one room with no cooking facilities.

But it is an ad for a homeless charity so they have to portray someone who is homeless.

There are lots of positive stories out there, Womens Aid featured a few real life women who got out of abusive relationships and rebuilt their lives in their 16 Days campaign.

mariaalice

mariaalice wrote: »

I think its a terrible stereotype of woman and really gets on my nerves am I the only one who feel like that.

Its not a stereotype as such, but its a fairly accurate portrayal of one of the main reasons women become homeless, and there are a myriad of circumstances leading to that outcome.

Working women with an independent income are much less likely to end up on the street because they can provide for themselves.

People don't become homeless because they have lots of choices, they become homeless because they have none.

Handsome Bob

mariaalice wrote: »

I am not saying it could not does not happen to some woman of course it does but my point it is some women... and in the absents of other portraits of woman who got out of an abusive situation( in the media and cultural ) the default position for woman in abusive situations is the one in the ad and it become embedded in our culture that women are dependant on men are passive and powrless....in fact it might cause women not to leave an abusive situations because if you listen to the ad its says if you leave an abusive situation you will end up living in one room with no cooking facilities.

That is a reality for some women unfortunately. Many women from the travelling community, for example, would have been brought up conditioned to serve their husband and subsequent children. They have little or no education and will struggle finding paid employment. They have little to no resources to improve their situation.

That is why the ad is asking people to help, so money can be raised so women as mentioned above can avail of homeless services (two of Ireland's leading homeless NGOs offer a service which provides support for people looking to live independently), or so such women can be sent on training and courses to improve their future prospects.

Frogeye

I always thought that homelessness affected men to a far greater extent than women? but I guess the image of some scruffy male wino doesn't pull the heart strings as much a beaten up housewife.

The Big Red Button

Frogeye wrote: »

I always thought that homelessness affected men to a far greater extent than women? but I guess the image of some scruffy male wino doesn't pull the heart strings as much a beaten up housewife.

But sure that's like saying you shouldn't support charities for abused animals, when there are starving children out there.

It's like describing some cancer charities as being 'sexier' than others. (Link.)

Some causes are always going to be viewed as being worthier or less worthy than others.

This is The Ladies Lounge; it's supposed to be a place where womens' issues are discussed, primarily from a female point of view. Which is why it should be OK to discuss homelessness, specifically focussing on the ways in which women may be affected.

If, for example, I saw a thread about sexual assaults on males in The Gentlemens Club, I wouldn't go in there shouting my views about sexual assaults on women. Because it would be inappropriate to do so, in the context of that forum.

rainbow kirby

Frogeye wrote: »

I always thought that homelessness affected men to a far greater extent than women? but I guess the image of some scruffy male wino doesn't pull the heart strings as much a beaten up housewife.

The topic is "Women and Homelessness" which means that the issue is being specifically looked at from the female perspective - if you want to start a thread about men and homelessness then tGC or Humanities would be an appropriate place for that. Not tLL. Stay on topic or don't post.

Hurricane Carter

chatterpillar wrote: »

But sure that's like saying you shouldn't support charities for abused animals, when there are starving children out there.

It's like describing some cancer charities as being 'sexier' than others. (Link.)

Some causes are always going to be viewed as being worthier or less worthy than others.

This is The Ladies Lounge; it's supposed to be a place where womens' issues are discussed, primarily from a female point of view. Which is why it should be OK to discuss homelessness, specifically focussing on the ways in which women may be affected.

If, for example, I saw a thread about sexual assaults on males in The Gentlemens Club, I wouldn't go in there shouting my views about sexual assaults on women. Because it would be inappropriate to do so, in the context of that forum.

Many of the views expressed are completely one-sided and it's like men aren't allowed come in here and give their 2c, so we've no comeback, but that's OK, because you've the shelter of it being under the 'Ladies Lounge'.

If you want an actual discussion, because many of the issues affect both genders, then why not post in a neutral forum? I'm not speaking specifically about this thread.

It's like so some people can just post in here give the line 'well it's about women so..tough'. It's quite ironic too.

Wibbs

OK this stops now. The clue is in the title of the forum. If you don't understand this or do and still want to make a point, do it elsewhere*. NOT in this forum or this thread. Frankly I'm tired of this pattern when once a year we get a tiny minority of blokes who come in here upset that "ohmigoditsawomensforum". You think this one sided or unfair? OK go into the cycling forum and post what about cars and vice versa. Go into the Rugby forum and start talking about soccer, etc etc. There are many many examples of this on the site. It's not, or shouldn't be rocket science. It isn't to the many men who are bloody good members of this community.

TL;DR? Next guy who comes along with a "what about men" style post will be banned and his post deleted. Plus just in case reading the sitewide charter came as hardship no replying to this post either. Final warning.








*try feedback if you like but it's been done to death by the usual minority of peeps and it's getting real tiresome at this stage.

eviltwin

Frogeye wrote: »

I always thought that homelessness affected men to a far greater extent than women? but I guess the image of some scruffy male wino doesn't pull the heart strings as much a beaten up housewife.

I think that's part of the problem, we assume homelessness is a problem that only affects certain people in society, drug addicts, alcoholics etc. Many of the male faces of homelessness we have seen in the past have been men with problems and I think society has a view that "oh well he brought it on himself". There is a perception that maybe giving these people a home won't exactly help them either because their problems are much more complex

As has been mentioned before I think its great we are seeing other sides. We are seeing that homelessness can be something that happens to women too. I'd like to see more campaigns that feature people who might have previously had jobs, mortgages etc and other groups we don't normally think might be at risk.

And that's not because I think they are more worthy of support, its just that it might help increase contributions to the charities involved which help all homeless people regardless of their circumstances.

ash23

The fact is that homelessness remains something that many people think will never happen to them. But none of us know that the decisions we make now are the right ones.

So choosing to buy a house with the person we love, choosing to reduce your working hours for the sake of your family, deciding to put the main earners career ahead of yours in a relocation..........all these decisions made with the best of intentions may lead you on a path you would never have foreseen.

Homelessness isn't necessarily caused by a drug problem or alcoholism. Sometimes someone just makes choices which they feel are right at the time but the future isn't kind to them and those choices result in them being homeless.

I don't think that showing people that is making out like women are dependent, meek little creatures. More a "There, but for the grace of God,go I"

Handsome Bob

It's a cliche but one that can ring through: some people are just one missed pay cheque away from facing homelessness. It really depends on what family and friends someone has around them as I've seen people cause absolute chaos and heart break due to their addictions and behaviour, yet they will always be bailed out by someone at the last minute.

That ad is nothing to do with portraying women in a bad light.

It's an ad to show that homelessness doesn't only happen to alcholics and drug users.

It's an ad to show that homelessness can happen to anyone.

It's an ad to show that homelessness can happen to someone you know.

It's an ad to put an end to the stereotype people hold for those who have been forced out of their homes.

I've heard plenty of other ads over the years that focus on other reasons for homlessness, this is just one of those reasons and it's happening around us right now.

I think it's an excellent ad.

While I still do not like the any ad that portrayed woman as a victims it might be better if it was part of a suit of ad that portrayed different aspects of homelessness and the type of people who become homelessness along with interesting positivity stories about people sorting their lives out.

Another interesting point I think is the one about how women can almost fall in to a situation of becoming financial venerable by give up work when they have a family.

It doesn't portray women as victims though. It tells the story of one woman. One woman does not equal all women.

MagicMarker

mariaalice wrote: »

While I still do not like the any ad that portrayed woman as a victims....

Why?

ash23

mariaalice wrote: »

While I still do not like the any ad that portrayed woman as a victims

Some women are victims though. I don't see what is wrong about highlighting it.

And I can't understand why they would just have positive stories either. It's not a fairy tale, for a lot of people who are homeless there is no happily ever after. That's reality.

OldNotWIse

Dont think its a stereotype, just a sad and true statistic. Women are more likely to suffer domestic violence. It's not a bad reflection on them, its just fact. I hardly think we should be getting on the feministic high-horse over something as sad as homelessness - its a tragedy regardless of the gender.

Because its not a one dementia story, some people do get out of abusive situations and its more rounded and realistic to tell that story as well.
I am allowed to say that I think it would be better if that womans story was part of a suit of stories about homelessness.

As I have said before I have worked as a volunteer in a woman refuge so I know it is a very difficult area.

mariaalice, of course you are allowed to say what you think. Noone has said otherwise. It's a discussion forum so others are allowed to disagree with or question your opinions.

ash23

mariaalice wrote: »

Because its not a one dementia story, some people do get out of abusive situations and its more rounded and realistic to tell that story as well.
I am allowed to say that I think it would be better if that womans story was part of a suit of stories about homelessness.

As I have said before I have worked as a volunteer in a woman refuge so I know it is a very difficult area.

Not being smart but how much money do you think a charity helping homeless people would generate from a series of stories about people who aren't homeless?

If the ad were for womens aid then you might have a point. They should portray women who get out of abusive situations and come out the other side as successful.

But a homeless charity? Come on!What would be the point of showing a succesful woman in a lovely house with her kids tucked up in a warm bed having gotten away from an abusive husband? Yeah, it would be inspiring but it wouldn't be in any way relevant to the actual charity we are talking about.

It has to be relevant too. Concern don't show pictures of chubby Irish babies who are well fed and nurtured.

FairytaleGirl

mariaalice wrote: »

Because its not a one dementia story, some people do get out of abusive situations and its more rounded and realistic to tell that story as well.
I am allowed to say that I think it would be better if that womans story was part of a suit of stories about homelessness.

As I have said before I have worked as a volunteer in a woman refuge so I know it is a very difficult area.

What astounded me about your posts on this thread, is the fact that you don't understand that women in abusive situations usually are powerless, jobless, low self worth, isolated from friends and family and ARE victims in every way.

Its not an attack on feminism, or an offense to the women who manage to walk away successfully, its a reminder of HOW difficult and damaging an abusive relationship is. How in under God you worked at a women's shelter with such a patronizing attitude is beyond me.

Mod

Attack the post, not the poster.

eviltwin

mariaalice wrote: »

Because its not a one dementia story, some people do get out of abusive situations and its more rounded and realistic to tell that story as well.
I am allowed to say that I think it would be better if that womans story was part of a suit of stories about homelessness.

As I have said before I have worked as a volunteer in a woman refuge so I know it is a very difficult area.

Surely you saw women just like the one in the ad then

I'm confused as to why you feel the ad is portraying the woman as a victim and what is wrong with that? She is a victim, a victim of being homeless. Its not saying all women in violent relationships will end up homeless.

LittleBook

mariaalice wrote: »

some people do get out of abusive situations and its more rounded and realistic to tell that story as well.

But ... the woman portrayed in this ad DID get out of an abusive situation! Albeit it was tough going at the beginning but it's rare enough that it's not.

I think I understand that Marialice is trying to say. I think she means that it would be inspirational if women who'd faced the challenges of being homeless, possibly as a result of abuse in the home, were shown not just as homeless, but also as having overcome homelessness.

I don't think its an unreasonable point to make, and I don't think she's saying no women should be portrayed as victims, just that they should be portrayed as not only victims.

Handsome Bob

Candie wrote: »

I think I understand that Marialice is trying to say. I think she means that it would be inspirational if women who'd faced the challenges of being homeless, possibly as a result of abuse in the home, were shown not just as homeless, but also as having overcome homelessness.

I don't think its an unreasonable point to make, and I don't think she's saying no women should be portrayed as victims, just that they should be portrayed as not just victims.

I'd agree with that. I've seen some amazing success stories, from both genders, in regards to homelessness. But highlighting such instances makes people, subtlety, think that there's not a real need to donate.

AhInFairness

Either the OP misunderstood the advert or she's looking for offence where the is none.

S. De Sousa

S. De Sousa wrote: »

I'd agree with that. I've seen some amazing success stories, from both genders, in regards to homelessness. But highlighting such instances makes people, subtlety, think that there's not a real need to donate.

That is exactly the point I was so inarticulately making. I give to charity and I know I am much more likely to give to a charity that make a effort to be realistic and balanced, but I am maybe being naive about the advertising industry they know what stories will raise the most money.

I give to one charity in India I chose it because I like the way they operate.

Its a charity that educates very very poor girls often the family's of bonded labourers. The charity gives a small amount money to the family if the girls is keep in school and give the rest of the money to the school, The money the family gets is the same as the girl could earn if she was working, if the family takes the girl out of school they do not get the money although the school keeps getting it, the reason I support the charity is because it directly challenges a culture of non education of girls, I occasionally get a letter with a photo of the girls graduating secondary school and its great.

FairytaleGirl

FairytaleGirl wrote: »

What astounded me about your posts on this thread, is the fact that you don't understand that women in abusive situations usually are powerless, jobless, low self worth, isolated from friends and family and ARE victims in every way.

Its not an attack on feminism, or an offense to the women who manage to walk away successfully, its a reminder of HOW difficult and damaging an abusive relationship is. How in under God you worked at a women's shelter with such a patronizing attitude is beyond me.

So woman with careers/ jobs, family etc are never in an abusive relationship?

confusticated

mariaalice wrote: »

So woman with careers/ jobs, family etc are never in an abusive relationship?

I don't think anyone said that, but if a woman has no income of her own and no family support, surely you can see that it's more likely she could become homeless getting out of an abusive relationship than a woman who has a source of income and/or family who could help her out for a while and give her a place to stay?