Car Crash Advice

SarahK169

Hi Guys,

This is my first post here. I'm a bit of a nervous wreck at the moment and in need of some advice. It's a bit of a long one, sorry.

I was involved in a RTA this morning on my first drive in my very first car. I was driving along and my window fogged up and the sun was making it harder to see too. I could still see relatively well in front of me, I turned my head for a split second, then out of nowhere BANG! Airbag blows up in my face, my engine smoking, I had hit a car that had seemingly came out of nowhere.

I'm not sure exactly what happened. The driver of the car in front got out took my details, but left without giving me his, which I thought was odd?

Here's the confusing part - he had also hit a car in front of him that was stopped at the lights. Could that of been my fault too? Or is it more likely he hit that car first and braked suddenly and that's why I had smacked into him. Is it my fault or is he trying to put all the blame on me?

Guy he had hit gave me his details.i but the guy I hit took mine and left without giving me his.

Any advice is really appreciated. I was also wondering if it is my fault and his insurance doesn't cover my repairs, is my car a write-off? The radiator burst, bonnet and front bumper is destroyed. The thing that protects you from the impact behind the bumper is badly dented inwards, both airbags are deployed.

Thanks in advance.

areyawell

Really sounds like your fault. If the car in front was stopped at traffic lights like you said and with the amount of damage done to your car it seems that you crashed into the back of him and couldn't see where you were going. You should give yourself sufficient distance to break to a stop to a car in front and you didn't even see the car until you hit the back of it at traffic lights is quite confusing and odd.

Could you not see the traffic lights around you when you were driving or even the car in the front? I dont understand how you missed all this unless you were wearing a blindfold

The car you hit must have causing the car in front to hit the other one in front. Was there no words of exchange or anything like that? Why would the second guy in front give you his insurance details and not take yours. That's baffling. And the first guy took yours. This thread makes no sense

Sully

It sucks dude but you will learn from this! Always need to be alert especially in a built up area. If in doubt, pull in immediately when safe and keep the windows clear when driving!

It appears that you hit into the back of the chaps car when in turn then hit into the next car. A chain reaction if you will!

Sadly, you are reliable for the damage to both cars. Do you know if you had any no claims bonus protection on your insurance? You could pay the insurance company before your next renewal in full and your premium wont go up next year. You could offer to pay the two individuals to cover the cost of the damage yourself but I think it might be safer to let the insurance folk look after you as they will often secure a better deal!

If you cant do either your premium will rise until your back to a full no claims bonus. Alert your insurance company asap of the incident, the odds are the other driver will and was probably being a bit rude and was irritated at (I assume) a young driver. So be careful!

CiniO

areyawell wrote: »

Why would the second guy in front give you his insurance details and not take yours.

I suppose he took her details. And gave her his.
That's the correct procedure.

SarahK169

areyawell wrote: »

Really sounds like your fault. If the car in front was stopped at traffic lights like you said and with the amount of damage done to your car it seems that you crashed into the back of him and couldn't see where you were going. You should give yourself sufficient distance to break to a stop to a car in front and you didn't even see the car until you hit the back of it at traffic lights is quite confusing and odd.

Could you not see the traffic lights around you when you were driving or even the car in the front? I dont understand how you missed all this unless you were wearing a blindfold

The car you hit must have causing the car in front to hit the other one in front

As I turned the corner, the sun was very bright causing a glare with the fog on my windows. I slowed down significantly, I couldn't see as far as the traffic lights but I was able to make out if there were any cars in front in enough time to brake safely. But I turned to my passenger for a split second and then heard a loud bang. Even my passenger said this car just seemed to have just come out of nowhere.

SarahK169

CiniO wrote: »

I suppose he took her details. And gave her his.
That's the correct procedure.

Yeah, the 2nd guy took mine and gave me his. But the first guy only took mine and drove off without giving me his details. He wasn't rude or anything, very calm and polite about it actually.

Please Kill Me

SarahK169 wrote: »

I was driving along and my window fogged up and the sun was making it harder to see too.

No excuse for that, that's what the fan is for, to keep your windscreen clear!

SarahK169 wrote: »

I could still see relatively well in front of me, I turned my head for a split second, then out of nowhere BANG! Airbag blows up in my face, my engine smoking, I had hit a car that had seemingly came out of nowhere.

This doesn't make sense. If you could see "relatively well" you would have noticed the car in front stopped. Also, why did you turn your head? You seem to be completely new to driving - you shouldn't take your eyes off the road, even for a second. You can't afford that luxury!!

SarahK169 wrote: »

Here's the confusing part - he had also hit a car in front of him that was stopped at the lights. Could that of been my fault too?

Not confusing at all, sounds like you hit the car in front of you at quite a force as it sounds like you didn't even get a chance to hit the brakes. When you hit him, you pushed him into the car in front of him. If that's the case, you are liable for both cars!

SarahK169 wrote: »

Or is it more likely he hit that car first and braked suddenly and that's why I had smacked into him. Is it my fault or is he trying to put all the blame on me?

Either way - you hit him from behind, you're liable.

SarahK169 wrote: »

.... if it is my fault and his insurance doesn't cover my repairs, is my car a write-off? The radiator burst, bonnet and front bumper is destroyed. The thing that protects you from the impact behind the bumper is badly dented inwards, both airbags are deployed.

Hard to say really without seeing it, but yeah - sounds really bad!! That really was a bad first day experience for you!

Reloc8

First drive in very first car ? Are you seriously saying you were driving for the first time ever in your life, unaccompanied by an experienced driver? Just glad/hope nobody's injured. EDIT : didn't realise you had a passenger...who seems to have distracted you but that's by the by.

Just by way of general advice at an accident anyway where there's damage to property or injury you have an obligation to report it to the Gardai, and anyone involved has the right to get the details including insurance of the others.

I suspect the 2nd guy (car in front of the Q) wasn't fussed about the OP because he got the details of the guy who hit him so he's fine. The guy behind him got the OP's so he's not fussed either. OP should have asked for his though, there's certainly no reason not to.

Anyway, OP sounds like you ploughed into someone and caused him to impact the car in front. Its more or less always your fault if you run into the back of someone.

You need a mechanic to tell you if your car is a write-off or not.

TouchingVirus

SarahK169 wrote: »

As I turned the corner, the sun was very bright causing a glare with the fog on my windows. I slowed down significantly, I couldn't see as far as the traffic lights but I was able to make out if there were any cars in front in enough time to brake safely. But I turned to my passenger for a split second and then heard a loud bang. Even my passenger said this car just seemed to have just come out of nowhere.

Doesn't make a difference I'm afraid, the fact is you took your eyes off the road and hit a vehicle in front of you. You will be liable for at least the damage to the person in front's car. If your collision caused his car to hit the one in front of his then you will be liable for damage to that car too.

Be thankful that nobody was seriously injured and it's just car damage, it could have been much worse. Eyes on the road, especially in hazardous conditions (i.e. with a half-fogged window and a low sun).

Don't worry about the increase to your premium, it's what you pay your insurance for. Similarly your insurance company will decide if your car is a write-off if you've got fully comp. If not and you have to look after your own damage then you'll have to get repair quotes from a crash repairer and decide if it's economical to repair it or cut your losses

SarahK169

Reloc8 wrote: »

First drive in very first car ? Are you seriously saying you were driving for the first time ever in your life, unaccompanied by an experienced driver? Just glad/hope nobody's injured. EDIT : didn't realise you had a passenger...who seems to have distracted you but that's by the by.

Just by way of general advice at an accident anyway where there's damage to property or injury you have an obligation to report it to the Gardai, and anyone involved has the right to get the details including insurance of the others.

I suspect the 2nd guy (car in front of the Q) wasn't fussed about the OP because he got the details of the guy who hit him so he's fine. The guy behind him got the OP's so he's not fussed either. OP should have asked for his though, there's certainly no reason not to.

Anyway, OP sounds like you ploughed into someone and caused him to impact the car in front. Its more or less always your fault if you run into the back of someone.

You need a mechanic to tell you if your car is a write-off or not.

My passenger at the time of the accident (also friend) is an experienced full licence driver.

CiniO

Reloc8 wrote: »

Just by way of general advice at an accident anyway where there's damage to property or injury you have an obligation to report it to the Gardai,.

Obligation to report it to the Gardai applys only when there is someone injured or killed.
If damage is only to property, there is no need to report to Gardai.

Reloc8

SarahK169 wrote: »

My passenger at the time of the accident (also friend) is an experienced full licence driver.

I edited - I saw your subsequent post that mentioned the passenger who you were looking towards when you hit the vehicle in front and who didn't see the vehicle either.

SarahK169

CiniO wrote: »

Obligation to report it to the Gardai applys only when there is someone injured or killed.
If damage is only to property, there is no need to report to Gardai.

We called the Gardai and they refused to come because nobody was injured

Reloc8

CiniO wrote: »

Obligation to report it to the Gardai applys only when there is someone injured or killed.
If damage is only to property, there is no need to report to Gardai.

Actually both unless parties exchange details at scene (as happened here) :-

106.—(1) Where injury is caused to person or property in a public place and a vehicle is involved in the occurrence of the injury (whether the use of the vehicle was or was not the cause of the injury), the following provisions shall have effect:

(a) if the vehicle is not stationary after the occurrence, the driver of the vehicle shall stop the vehicle;

(b) the driver or other person in charge of the vehicle shall keep the vehicle at or near the place of the occurrence for a period which is reasonable in all the circumstances of the case and having regard to the provisions of this section;

(c) the driver of the vehicle or, if he is killed or incapacitated, the person then in charge of the vehicle shall give on demand the appropriate information to a member of the Garda Síochána or, if no such member is present, to one person entitled under this section to demand such information;

(d) if a member of the Garda Síochána is not present at the occurrence and either—

(i) there is no person entitled under this section to demand the information, or

(ii) the case is one in which, as respects the sole person entitled under this section to demand the appropriate information or each of the persons so entitled, it is reasonably clear that he could not be expected to make a demand because of injury, illness, age or other disability,

the driver of the vehicle or, if he is killed or incapacitated, the person then in charge of the vehicle shall report the occurrence as soon as possible to a member of the Garda Síochána and, if necessary, shall go for that purpose to the nearest convenient Garda Síochána station and also shall give on demand the appropriate information to the member.

areyawell

Why drive if you couldn't see properly is the main question?

allthedoyles

Don't believe much of what you have read so far.

First of all ,don't admit liability to anyone ......This will be your insurance company policy.

How can you be responsible for the car in front of the car, in front of you .....The car in front of you should have been at least 6 car lengths behind that car.

Get yourself checked out immediately for injuries and if necessary claim from insurance of other drivers .

BUBBLE WRAP

Please Kill Me wrote: »

No excuse for that, that's what the fan is for, to keep your windscreen clear!

The OP made a mistake, happens to everyone.

Please Kill Me wrote: »

Hard to say really without seeing it, but yeah - sounds really bad!! That really was a bad first day experience for you!

No sh1t...

SarahK169

areyawell wrote: »

Why drive if you couldn't see properly is the main question?

I could hardly just stop in the middle of the road, could I? There was nowhere to stop safely, Im not an experienced driver, I didn't know the ideal way to react in that situation. My passenger (experienced driver) was happy and felt safe enough. I slowed down significantly, I turned my head only for a split second, only as a natural reaction, to ask my passenger to wipe the window, and then smack! That's why I am convinced he pulled out suddenly from somewhere I couldn't see or else braked suddenly and hit the other car and then I hit him. But I could be very wrong too.

SarahK169

allthedoyles wrote: »

Don't believe much of what you have read so far.

First of all ,don't admit liability to anyone ......This will be your insurance company policy.

How can you be responsible for the car in front of the car, in front of you .....The car in front of you should have been at least 6 car lengths behind that car.

Get yourself checked out immediately for injuries and if necessary claim from insurance of other drivers .

Im no car expert, but that's what I was thinking myself regarding the 3rd car. Surely if the guy in front of me was stopped at the lights he would have had his brakes on therefore preventing my car from pushing his car into the 3rd car, especially if was keeping the correct distance behind the vehicle?

TheChizler

SarahK169 wrote: »

I could hardly just stop in the middle of the road, could I? There was nowhere to stop safely, Im not an experienced driver, I didn't know the ideal way to react in that situation. My passenger (experienced driver) was happy and felt safe enough. I slowed down significantly, I turned my head only for a split second, only as a natural reaction, to ask my passenger to wipe the window, and then smack! That's why I am convinced he pulled out suddenly from somewhere I couldn't see or else braked suddenly and hit the other car and then I hit him. But I could be very wrong too.

I have a friend who when driving would turn her entire body towards you and take her hands off the wheel to gesture while talking. Real heart in mouth situation, refused to get in her car after a couple of occurrences. Best to practice on being able to interact with anything in the car without affecting your observation, even if it means totally ignoring your passenger for a few seconds. There's no such thing as 'only' a split second when controlling a car.

Re liability to the car two in front of you, was the car you hit stopped or nearly stopped at the time, or driving up close behind the car in front? There might be some joint liability if it transpired that they jumped into too small a gap.

Esel

allthedoyles wrote: »

.....The car in front of you should have been at least 6 car lengths behind that car.

What? Even if the car in front was not stopped behind another car (which seems to be the case here) where do you get 6 car lengths from?

DirkVoodoo

SarahK169 wrote: »

Im no car expert, but that's what I was thinking myself regarding the 3rd car. Surely if the guy in front of me was stopped at the lights he would have had his brakes on therefore preventing my car from pushing his car into the 3rd car, especially if was keeping the correct distance behind the vehicle?

Rubbish, and insurance companies will sort it out. I was stopped in traffic, handbrake up and sufficient distance from the car in front (6 car lengths? Please, show me anyone who does that or any insurance company that would chase up such nonsense). Was hit by the car stopped behind me, which was hit by some dope travelling at speed down the N11 who failed to brake. I hit the car in front of me, minor damage to his bumper. My car was badly damaged and the car behind me was in bits.

This was 9 years ago and I still remember it vividly. We all swapped details, Gardai and ambulances arrived (no one seriously injured) and after a few weeks, each of our insurance companies went after the person who caused the accident. Because unfortunately, that's how it works.

My brother was driving me somewhere the other night, his windows were fogged up. I made him stop before reversing out of the driveway and we sat there until the windows were clear. You make it sound like these were unavoidable circumstances, but they weren't. Carry a pair of sunglasses in your car, use the visor and if your windows start to fog up, turn on the fan.

Nothing you can do now except take the inevitable hit on your premium, learn from your mistake and be thankful it wasn't more serious.

DirkVoodoo

Esel wrote: »

What? Even if the car in front was not stopped behind another car (which seems to be the case here) where do you get 6 car lengths from?

Bizzarre one! All I can think is that he is confusing stopping distances at 50 km/hr? (6 VW passats is about 24 metres).

Try doing that in Dublin traffic and people will be driving around you to fill in the spaces!

Merch

SarahK169 wrote: »

I could hardly just stop in the middle of the road, could I? There was nowhere to stop safely, Im not an experienced driver, I didn't know the ideal way to react in that situation. My passenger (experienced driver) was happy and felt safe enough. I slowed down significantly, I turned my head only for a split second, only as a natural reaction, to ask my passenger to wipe the window, and then smack! That's why I am convinced he pulled out suddenly from somewhere I couldn't see or else braked suddenly and hit the other car and then I hit him. But I could be very wrong too.

TBH, you admit you dont have a clue what happened, what speed were you travelling at? a second at enough speed can be a long distance. You dont know what happened therefore, it seems very likely you caused the collison because as you say yourself, you were not prepared to be on the road (either experience or vehicle condition). If you dont know, who is supposed to know? you are in charge of a mechanically propelled mass of 1-2 tonnes, if a pedestrian steps out in front of you, you should be able to stop.
Personally, I dont look at passengers when talking to them, some people find that odd, but If im driving, thats what I do, not saying Im perfect, but if you cant hold a conversation and drive, then do only one or the other.
If you are only convinced but are uncertain he pulled out, you wouldnt have seen him anyway as you weren't looking, so you ploughed into the back of a car, its very possible you shunted him and the next car.

So, speed of this collision? any ideas?
Do you have a learner permit or a recent full licence?
If you couldnt see out the windows and had to ask the passenger to clear them, then how could you see the car in front? so even if he pulled out, you are still liable.
I'm not slating you, but honestly, you dont seem like you should be driving.

allthedoyles wrote: »

How can you be responsible for the car in front of the car, in front of you .....The car in front of you should have been at least 6 car lengths behind that car.

why do you think this? do you ever see cars that far from each other in traffic?? it all depends on the speeds of the vehicles as to the seperation

goz83

6 CAR LENGHTS? Where is that rubbish coming from? 6 feet maybe, but 6 car lenghts? Are we talking coopers, or lincoln limos?

OP. If you hit the car in front, unless the handbrake was on, it's alost certain that you would have knocked the car forward several feet by your description of the damage to your own car. It's easy to make excuses, but i'm sure it was more than a split second your eyes were off the road; otherwise you wouldn't be saying you could see fine while in the same sentence, describe the fog and the glaring sun. It doesn't take eye contact to talk to your passenger, or ask them a question. The fully licensed passenger should have been giving you advice if there was any hazard, but as you said, your passenger was "happy". It sounds like you made a silly mistake. I've been there myself when I was in my first week of driving. I even went as far as to try blame a slightly worn rubber cover on the brake pedal, but in the end, I knew I messed up and I had to pay for some bumper damage to the car in front.

Without knowing all the details, it's hard to paint a proper picture here, but your car is busted up and the force was strong enough to shunt the other car into another car at traffic lights, which you failed to see. Hope it doesn't cost you too much. Your insurance would have been higher next year anyway, because women can no longer be given lower premiums just for being women. As you've proven....everyone is a risk on the road....even if it is just a split second.

GE90

Another prime example of how terrible the driving licence system is in Ireland. Its madness that you can go in answer 40 multiple choice questions and then your fully qualified to get behind the wheel of a car! A full licensed driver next to you makes little difference, how are they going to help when you have do a emergency stop or avoidance maneuver, encounter black ice ect. ? Plus most learners rarely have a fully licensed driver with them anyway and the guards seem to be turning a blind eye.

BTW this is not a stab at you SarahK169 the systems wrong not you. The crash those seem to be your fault do but the best thing to do is learn from it, you will never again leave home with a impaired windscreen you have learned the hard way.

Merch

As other people have said, this is a hard lesson to learn
but unless you accept responsibility, even to yourself that you were in the wrong, then you will never learn from it and may have the same thing happen again.

SarahK169

GE90 wrote: »

Another prime example of how terrible the driving licence system is in Ireland. Its madness that you can go in answer 40 multiple choice questions and then your fully qualified to get behind the wheel of a car! A full licensed driver next to you makes little difference, how are they going to help when you have do a emergency stop or avoidance maneuver, encounter black ice ect. ? Plus most learners rarely have a fully licensed driver with them anyway and the guards seem to be turning a blind eye.

BTW this is not a stab at you SarahK169 the systems wrong not you. The crash those seem to be your fault do but the best thing to do is learn from it, you will never again leave home with a impaired windscreen you have learned the hard way.

I totally agree with you. In retrospect, I'm wishing the Essential Driving Training course was necessity before even being allowed to go onto the road. I definitely have learned the hard way.

goz83

GE90 wrote: »

Its madness that you can go in answer 40 multiple choice questions and then your fully qualified to get behind the wheel of a car!

Remember when you didn't have to answer any questions? Just hand a photo into the tax office with a tenner and you get your pink slip and your license in the post. Ah, those were the days. That's how I got my license only 12 years ago. But...I did my driving test ans since did a theory test for the bike...and I still make mistakes. Wouldn't be driving with a misty window though.

My neck and back are in bits right now! I was rear ended 14 months ago. Hand brake was on and I was shunted forward almost hitting the car in front, which was a good 4-5 feet away (i could see the bottom of the rear tires). Whiplash is a pain! Never know when it will bite you. I do be fine for ages and then out of the blue, i'm like a cripple for the day. Car damage is one thing, but personal injury can really add to your premium.

areyawell

Did you or the other experienced driver not know to turn on the heating for the windows? What did the experienced driver with you say about the matter?

SarahK169

areyawell wrote: »

Did you or the other experienced driver not know to turn on the heating for the windows? What did the experienced driver with you say about the matter?

I turned on the heating for the windows straight away, it obviously didn't work quick enough. It all happened so quick, It still feels surreal.

goz83

SarahK169 wrote: »

I turned on the heating for the windows straight away, it obviously didn't work quick enough. It all happened so quick, It still feels surreal.

You didn't wait long enough, or you didn't turn it on soon enough. Wouldn't be blaming the tools unless you had a sudden heater matrix leak, which fogged the windows up in a matter of seconds. It smells like fish.

stacexD

DirkVoodoo wrote: »

Bizzarre one! All I can think is that he is confusing stopping distances at 50 km/hr? (6 VW passats is about 24 metres).

Try doing that in Dublin traffic and people will be driving around you to fill in the spaces!

6 Feet possibly? That's how far away from a car you should stop at lights (according to my instructor) 6 car lengths there wouldn't be enough road in the country to keep us all driving that far apart :P

allthedoyles

Once you apply the brake pedal it will take time for your vehicle to react. This depends on the condition your vehicle is in and, in particular, the condition of the braking system.

The last factor that determines your total stopping distance is the vehicle's braking capability. This depends on many things, for example:

• brakes,
• tyre pressure, tread and grip,
• the weight of the vehicle,
• the vehicle's suspension, and
• road surface.

Don't admit liability and allow your insurance company to determine this .

SarahK169

goz83 wrote: »

You didn't wait long enough, or you didn't turn it on soon enough. Wouldn't be blaming the tools unless you had a sudden heater matrix leak, which fogged the windows up in a matter of seconds. It smells like fish.[/Quote

The reason I was even driving in the first place was to charge the battery as I left the car sitting for sitting in the cold for two weeks and it died. I got a jump start and was advised to drive it for an hour to charge the battery. I'm being told my weak battery could have been the culprit for the window heater now working as quick as they I should if it were a fully charged battery.

goz83

You're being told wrong. Low battery would not have any impact on the heater. Slap whoever told you that. You could start the car, disconnect the battery and the car should keep running. Fans and heating would still work as normal.

hattoncracker

I'm really sorry this happened to you OP. I don't know how I would cope with that at all, I was the most nervous driver ever when I started last year!

Your insurance is gonna take a hit, probably more hefty than you expected with the new vaginal premiums being introduced! But let them battle it out between them, its what their paid to do. No one was hurt so put it behind you and move on.

My advice to you and to any learner is to invest in your lessons. This bullcrap about three hours practice with your sponsor in between lessons should be ignored at the start IMO, its too early when your first lesson only covers starting and going into different gears, get extra lessons at the start, its harder to get bad habits if your first hours of learning are with an instructor because learning with experienced drivers can cause way more bad habits.

You should do a lesson with your instructor ASAP in their car to get yourself back behind the wheel in their car so you don't lose your nerve.

I know hindsight is a wonderful thing, and you probably felt safer because you had your licenced driver with you because that's how we are taught to see it, but ideally you should have waited til the window cleared down, and your experienced driver should have told you this.


I hope everything works out for you, OP.

Mr Benevolent

SarahK169 wrote: »

I'm being told my weak battery could have been the culprit for the window heater now working as quick as they I should if it were a fully charged battery.

Not possible unless you're driving a Ford with a Quickclear windscreen. OP, always clear the windscreen and side windows before driving. Also, never turn your head to talk to someone while driving, it's just too dangerous.

CiniO

SarahK169 wrote: »

I slowed down significantly, I turned my head only for a split second, only as a natural reaction, to ask my passenger to wipe the window, and then smack! That's why I am convinced he pulled out suddenly from somewhere I couldn't see or else braked suddenly and hit the other car and then I hit him. But I could be very wrong too.

That's an expensive lesson, but now you should know that most important thing when driving is observation.
You have to be aware of the whole situation around your car.
You have to know what cars are in front of you, on side of you and behind you.
You have to know what speed they are doing. You have to watch if someone is not braking or slowing down, and if they are, you must think what's the reason.

Generally speaking a good driver knows what's around him at all times.

Imagines that while driving at some random moment someone just stops the situation as it is (like in cartoons that whole situation freezes), blindfolds your eyes, and asks you to tell him what cars are around you and where did they come from. Unless you will be able to answer that question in any random moment of driving, you can't say you are a good driver.

CiniO

This thread proves how bad is the driver training system.
There should be no way anyone could go on the road, without doing all the lessons with instructor in double control car beforehand.

Reloc8

SarahK169 wrote: »

My passenger (experienced driver) was happy and felt safe enough. I slowed down significantly, I turned my head only for a split second, only as a natural reaction, to ask my passenger to wipe the window, and then smack! That's why I am convinced he pulled out suddenly from somewhere I couldn't see or else braked suddenly and hit the other car and then I hit him. But I could be very wrong too.

1. But sure, your passenger didn't even see him/where he came from so they're more or less useless.

2. How was your passenger going to wipe the window without obscuring your view while you drove along ?

3. You say you slowed down significantly, but your airbags deployed and you're concerned your car is a write off due to impact damage. Whatever speed you were doing was still significant.

4. Bearing mind that there was a car ahead of him stopped at lights apparently, which we'll presume was no more than a couple of car lengths ahead of him, did you see that car ? Why were you to coming to a full halt because of the lights anyway ? You hit the second car at the lights, which was pulled up to the first car, you didn't see the second car 'pull out' but you don't seem to have seen the first car anyway, or been dealing appropriately with the lights against you.

Look anyway, nobody's hurt which is the main thing. People are more than willing to give you sympathy for being in an accident which is very stressful and frightening especially when starting to drive, but you seem to be trying to maintain that this didn't happen because of your driving - which would be a very dangerous reaction to this incident.

goz83

Thank god it wasn't a pedestrian that was hit.

I seen a guy getting slammed into on O' Connell street in Dublin when he was crossing at pedestrian lights. The car must have been doing at least 20mph and failed to see the red lights or the poor guy that was catapulted off the windscreen and thrown a good 15 feet from where the car stopped. Amazingly, he jumped right up and picked up his shoe and started walking away thinking he had done something wrong. He must have been in agony a short time later. The lady driver continued to drive with a busted windscreen until a couple of people got her to pull over while others tended to the fairly dazed and confused young man.

Merch

hattoncracker wrote: »

Your insurance is gonna take a hit, probably more hefty than you expected with the new vaginal premiums being introduced! But let them battle it out between them, its what their paid to do. No one was hurt so put it behind you and move on.
I hope everything works out for you, OP.

How do we know? I was a passenger in a car that was hit years ago, and it wasnt till the next day or two that I was in pain, and Im telling you it wasnt nice. NO I didnt follow it up, mostly because I was younger and stupid.

And no I dont mean the kind of I think they will sue pain, I mean real pain.

If you hit a car hard enough to cause the airbags to deploy, Im quite suprised there were not injuries. Its quite possible they were also in shock.

CiniO wrote: »

This thread proves how bad is the driver training system.
There should be no way anyone could go on the road, without doing all the lessons with instructor in double control car beforehand.

Yes possibly the system is bad, other people also manage with a bad system and dont plough into the back of innocent drivers, I thought it was already introduced that you had to have a number of lessons before even being allowed on the road, or is that the test?. People have a responsibility themselves and that is something they take on when they drive a few tonnes around.

OP have you done any lessons? no offense, but you should, for your own sake.
Really whether a person feels they are safe or not, a second proffesional opinion in a dual controlled car is a better idea.

goz83

+1 to what merch said. No matter how inadequate the training required, it is the drivers responsibility to ensure that he/she is capable and comfortable driving a tonne or two of lethal force. Also agreeing with the pain section. I'm right now unable to get out of my bed because my neck and shoulder is very painful from my accident last year

SarahK169

Reloc8 wrote: »

1. But sure, your passenger didn't even see him/where he came from so they're more or less useless.

2. How was your passenger going to wipe the window without obscuring your view while you drove along ?

3. You say you slowed down significantly, but your airbags deployed and you're concerned your car is a write off due to impact damage. Whatever speed you were doing was still significant.

4. Bearing mind that there was a car ahead of him stopped at lights apparently, which we'll presume was no more than a couple of car lengths ahead of him, did you see that car ? Why were you to coming to a full halt because of the lights anyway ? You hit the second car at the lights, which was pulled up to the first car, you didn't see the second car 'pull out' but you don't seem to have seen the first car anyway, or been dealing appropriately with the lights against you.

Look anyway, nobody's hurt which is the main thing. People are more than willing to give you sympathy for being in an accident which is very stressful and frightening especially when starting to drive, but you seem to be trying to maintain that this didn't happen because of your driving - which would be a very dangerous reaction to this incident.

I am absolutely not trying to place the blame on the other driver or anyone else. If you read my post properly you will see that I am looking for advice from an outside perspective, not to place blame. I just do not want to be taking 100% of the blame IF (notice the "if") it was also partially the other drivers fault also. So that's why I came here, to get advice! I am not looking for sympathy either, I am perfectly fine. Like I said, just looking for advice which people have kindly given me.

Merch

SarahK169 wrote: »

I am absolutely not trying to place the blame on the other driver or anyone else. If you read my post properly you will see that I am looking for advice from an outside perspective, not to place blame. I just do not want to be taking 100% of the blame IF (notice the "if") it was also partially the other drivers fault also. So that's why I came here, to get advice! I am not looking for sympathy either, I am perfectly fine. Like I said, just looking for advice which people have kindly given me.

well fair enough but you did try to suggest the other driver may have pulled out in front of you, but I think that is irellevant as even if you could see him, that would mean you should be prepared to stop, you have (and honestly enough) admitted to a host of errors. The fact you couldn't see where you were going or where caught off guard by the reduced visibility caused by the windows being fogged and then the added effect of driving into a glaring winter sun tells me, You need professional lessons.
Thats not critical, its honest.

Also, you drove into the back of someone you didnt know was there because of the circumstances you mentioned, how? How could that be the other persons fault?
So honestly, where did this all happen, did it happen? is this a troll?

If they pulled out late then, I think its unlikely you'd hit them squarely in the back of their car and then they hit the other car in front of them squarely, it would be more likely you'd hit the drivers door/pillar/rear door or quarter and they probably wouldnt have hit the car in front of them.

This is why (fingers crossed it arrives) I am getting a camera for my car, not that the car is worth much but the stuff I've seen happen that people do, you wouldnt think its possible that people would do it.

goz83

One final point on this for the OP: If you hadn't hit the car you hit, you would have hit the other one at the speed you were doing. As said above, let the insurers sort it out. Some people are saying you learned the hard way, but I disagree. You got off easy, as it sounds like there were no (serious) injuries. Learning the hard way is causing someone to be disabled, or causing their death by negligence.

Sully

SarahK169 wrote: »

I could hardly just stop in the middle of the road, could I? There was nowhere to stop safely, Im not an experienced driver, I didn't know the ideal way to react in that situation. My passenger (experienced driver) was happy and felt safe enough. I slowed down significantly, I turned my head only for a split second, only as a natural reaction, to ask my passenger to wipe the window, and then smack! That's why I am convinced he pulled out suddenly from somewhere I couldn't see or else braked suddenly and hit the other car and then I hit him. But I could be very wrong too.

You were at traffic lights, right? So generally cars are positioned dead straight. If he pulled out suddenly than I assume there was somewhere to pull out from beside the crash? How did he pull out and get straight so quickly and you still didn't spot the car?

If he pulled out, his car was straight enough to be pushed forward to the other car. There was enough time for him to pull out and straighten up safely and you still didn't spot him.

If you were paying attention or were able to see and he pulled out while you were just a second away from the road, than it would have been a side impact. But the way this crash occurred, by your description, suggests there was more than a second without looking at the road or your visibility was much poorer than you originally thought seeing as you didn't spot the car - regardless of whether it was always there or just pulled into the slot.

Your liable for both cars, as I said earlier. If he pulled out suddenly, there may be liability on his part but because he was straightened up and hit the other car in the back, it suggests he was doing nothing wrong. They probably wont allow you go to a garage that would do the repair cheap, so get your own car done with such a garage and it will reduce your cost base going forward. My other posts advises you on the future premiums you face.

Sully

goz83 wrote: »

One final point on this for the OP: If you hadn't hit the car you hit, you would have hit the other one at the speed you were doing. As said above, let the insurers sort it out. Some people are saying you learned the hard way, but I disagree. You got off easy, as it sounds like there were no (serious) injuries. Learning the hard way is causing someone to be disabled, or causing their death by negligence.

I would disagree. When your an inexperienced driver and you hit another car, its a shock and a lesson. If you cause serious damage, its even more of a shock and a harder lesson. Obviously if its much worse, the shock and lesson is much worse.

But what happened was definitely an experience and a lesson that I think will make him/her going forward. Lessons learned improve driving, if you allow it.

goz83

Maybe I was being a bit too rough around the edges. My point was that the OP was unable to see through foggy windows and that it could have just as easily been flesh and bone she hit, which is a much tougher lesson than property damage. I've treated clients who have both caused property damage and personal injury to persons while driving. The ones who cause injury are much more shook up and are often afraid to drive for years after.

Sully

goz83 wrote: »

Maybe I was being a bit too rough around the edges. My point was that the OP was unable to see through foggy windows and that it could have just as easily been flesh and bone she hit, which is a much tougher lesson than property damage. I've treated clients who have both caused property damage and personal injury to persons while driving. The ones who cause injury are much more shook up and are often afraid to drive for years after.

Indeed and I hope that the driver will learn its best not to drive without 100% vision! I have been in similar situations and I just pull in, its freaky driving not being able to see. Anything could happen - an animal could run out, a child, etc. and you wouldn't see.