Are you ashamed of any of your friends?

annascott

1. Are you ashamed of any of your friends and/or their partners? I mean, really bad dress sense or not dressing correctly for an occasion, badly groomed/ unclean looking hair etc.

2. How would you approach the subject?

Kylo Ren

annascott wrote: »

1. Are you ashamed of any of your friends and/or their partners? I mean, really bad dress sense or not dressing correctly for an occasion, badly groomed/ unclean looking hair etc.

2. How would you approach the subject?

1. Nope

2. I wouldn't. It's their life, they can dress how they like.

pwurple

I have a pal who has started overusing the fake tan alright. It flippen reeks and she is totally orange from it.

I openly take the piss out of her about it, not in front of a load of people, but when it's just us. You can only do that with close friends though. I prefer to do that than talk about it behind her back.

Any serious things though, and I stop being friends with them. I was buddies with a girl who I found out was stealing from her employers for example. I told her I thought it was wrong, and when she tried to justify it with "they won't notice", I just stopped hanging out with her. God knows when she would have started stealing from me.

LizT

annascott wrote: »

1. Are you ashamed of any of your friends and/or their partners? I mean, really bad dress sense or not dressing correctly for an occasion, badly groomed/ unclean looking hair etc.

2. How would you approach the subject?

I don't judge my friends by their dress sense or personal grooming, their personality and character is more important to me.

ElleEm

annascott wrote: »

1. Are you ashamed of any of your friends and/or their partners? I mean, really bad dress sense or not dressing correctly for an occasion, badly groomed/ unclean looking hair etc.

2. How would you approach the subject?

How my friends look is their business, not mine!

I would question a "friend's" priorities if they felt the need to discuss my appearance with me.

xDramaxQueenx

They wouldn't be my friends if I felt ashamed of them. What an absurd question.

Da Shins Kelly

I don't judge people on how they look. My friends all look completely different - crusty types to quirky, colourful types to the fake tan, fake eyelashes, lots of make-up types. What they do all have in common is that they're cool people who have a lot to offer in friendship. I wouldn't tell any of them to change anything about their appearance, that's their choice. How they look is personal to them. It's their personalities I care about.

YumCha

annascott wrote: »

1. Are you ashamed of any of your friends and/or their partners? I mean, really bad dress sense or not dressing correctly for an occasion, badly groomed/ unclean looking hair etc.

2. How would you approach the subject?

I had a friend (guy), who was my boss at the time - we had do to an overseas work trip together. Had only really been on nights out and stuff before but over 20 hours with him on a plane was an eye opener... He had terrible BO, and a real dandruff problem (think actual visible big flakes, not spots).

That trip was the first of about 7 planned that year, and we had a lot of important meetings and stuff (dandruff was THAT visible), so after a lot of fretting I just had to tell him. We were a small company, and someone else senior was there in the meeting and it was horribly horribly awkward - he really had no idea and was terribly hurt. However it came good in the end and we're still friends.

havetoquit

No, how my friends dress or present themselves would not be an issue for me and I consider it to be their choice and theirs only.

With reference to last post and working colleague, I can sympathize and indeed empathize with that, but cannot understand why it could not have been dealt with more sensitively and considerately in this case.

Why would it be necessary to approach the subject in front of others, especially a senior colleague? He must have been acutely embarrassed as well as hurt.

I once knew someone who was presented with a similar situation and she simply put some travel mini shampoo, shower lotion and deodorant in her colleague's brief case when he wasn't looking. Problem solved and not a word spoken.

I guess it is a sensitive area and not one most of us would be comfortable with.

mood

I am not ashamed of but really don't like one friends boyfriend. He thinks he is sooooo funny and he isn't. It's only him who laughs at his jokes while other squirm. He really over steps the mark and what should be slagging is actually really insulting people. I've even had to tell him to take his hand off my ass once after managing to get away and ignore it on a few occasions. :mad:

I couldn't care less what friends look like. I'm friends with them because of their personality not their looks. However, if BO was an issue I would like to think I would talk to them about it as they might not be aware of it. However, I never been in that situation so can't say for sure. It would be a difficult thing to do.

amdublin

YumCha wrote: »

I had a friend (guy), who was my boss at the time - we had do to an overseas work trip together. Had only really been on nights out and stuff before but over 20 hours with him on a plane was an eye opener... He had terrible BO, and a real dandruff problem (think actual visible big flakes, not spots).

That trip was the first of about 7 planned that year, and we had a lot of important meetings and stuff (dandruff was THAT visible), so after a lot of fretting I just had to tell him. We were a small company, and someone else senior was there in the meeting and it was horribly horribly awkward - he really had no idea and was terribly hurt. However it came good in the end and we're still friends.

You told him that personal thing in front of somebody else

:eek:

YumCha

havetoquit wrote: »

No, how my friends dress or present themselves would not be an issue for me and I consider it to be their choice and theirs only.

With reference to last post and working colleague, I can sympathize and indeed empathize with that, but cannot understand why it could not have been dealt with more sensitively and considerately in this case.

Why would it be necessary to approach the subject in front of others, especially a senior colleague? He must have been acutely embarrassed as well as hurt.

I once knew someone who was presented with a similar situation and she simply put some travel mini shampoo, shower lotion and deodorant in her colleague's brief case when he wasn't looking. Problem solved and not a word spoken.

I guess it is a sensitive area and not one most of us would be comfortable with.

It wasn't an ambush with someone else in the room - i had gone to that person to ask how to best deal with it (as they were responsible for HR too) and they suggested we have a meeting with the 3 of us. We were all good friends at the time... and stayed friends afterwards.

I can definitely understand the appeal of wanting to drop hints and hope they cop on - but I certainly think it would have dragged things out, and been even more embarrassing for him.

Sorcha16

I think a key component of friendship is pretty much loving, accepting and liking people just as they are

havetoquit

Yes, it was definitely an awkward situation for you to be in, but I guess the fact that a third person was brought into the equation and knowing that he had been discussed in this way, probably made it very hard for him.

But hey, at the end of the day, all is good and you are all friends, so I guess he realized that you meant well and in the long run saved the day. It obviously could not have been easy for any of you to deal with, because of the personal nature of the issue.

xDramaxQueenx

YumCha wrote: »

I had a friend (guy), who was my boss at the time - we had do to an overseas work trip together. Had only really been on nights out and stuff before but over 20 hours with him on a plane was an eye opener... He had terrible BO, and a real dandruff problem (think actual visible big flakes, not spots

This post here really stood out for me. Do you feel like some kind of hero saving your friends reputation?
I find it hard to believe somebody suffering from flakes of "dandruff" was oblivious to it.

I suffer with psoriasis on my scalp, and I am so very aware that "visible flakes" sometimes might appear on my clothes, despite using lotion on my scalp every day and washing my hair every day. I am paranoid checking to ensure no visible flakes are on my clothes and it makes me sad to think I might be friends with somebody who would actually be embarrassed to be my friend because of a skin condition I have.

YumCha

xDramaxQueenx wrote: »

This post here really stood out for me. Do you feel like some kind of hero saving your friends reputation?
I find it hard to believe somebody suffering from flakes of "dandruff" was oblivious to it.

I suffer with psoriasis on my scalp, and I am so very aware that "visible flakes" sometimes might appear on my clothes, despite using lotion on my scalp every day and washing my hair every day. I am paranoid checking to ensure no visible flakes are on my clothes and it makes me sad to think I might be friends with somebody who would actually be embarrassed to be my friend because of a skin condition I have.

Sigh - I didn't feel like a hero at all. And I wasn't embarrassed or ashamed of my friend - I posted here because I thought the story might be relevant, not because I agreed with the thread title. And I have immense empathy for people with skin conditions - I'm absolutely mortified if you feel that was a personal attack.

Maybe I should have put more detail in the first post, but there were a lot of other circumstances - and as friends the both of us were genuinely worried that he wasn't taking care of himself... and that this might have been representative of something bigger.

Given that this seems to be contentious and that the consensus seems to be that I was in the wrong, what would you do if you saw someone you cared about change in a short period of time? For example, signs that they may not be showering or washing their clothes?

doriansmith

A flaky scalp isn't exactly a sign someone isn't showering though, is it? I've got psoriasis on my scalp too & there's not much I can do about it, sometimes it gets very flaky. I'd be mortified if I was called into a meeting to discuss it! I don't see the need to point something like that out in that manner.

Eve_Dublin

I've also got psoriaisis on part of my scalp too (we should start a club!) and if someone mentioned something to me, I couldn't do anything about it anyway. There doesn't seem to be a cure.


I've got a student in one of my classes who suffers from BO (I teach adults). This girl is beautifully turned out otherwise and I was warned about her BO problem by the last teacher before I started the job. I presume because the class is so tight-knit and they've been in the same class for years and also work together, that if someone felt it was something they could approach her about, they would've. The Spanish would be fairly direct. As no one has said anything to her and the problem is still there, I'd presume it's something she can't fix and so we have to live with it.

Some people have problems with their bodies that can't be dealt with and the person in question is already aware of it. People should also take that into account.

LegacyUser

I couldn't give a fug about a person's fashion sense.
I absolutely hate to admit this though (even anonymously) but I have a few issues with my boyfriend and my family. We are together almost 10 years, he has no education not even a junior cert because he left school very young and then worked on the sites until the recession hit. He is unemployed for years and is making very little effort to get a new different type of job, or to back and further his education. He thinks with no junior cert that he will not get on any plc course or college course and that at his age (30) he is not going back to do his junior cert. My family are all educated to masters and even phd level and now have good jobs but are also of course paying A LOT of taxes. They are always friendly and polite but I know that they see my boyfriend as an uneducated sponger and a waster, and I know they think I am too good for him. I know that he is a hugely intelligent man, and I love him very much but I just can't seem to motivate him to do something with his life. All he does is sit at home smoking all day. I am still in education myself, but if I am lucky enough to get a good job by the time I finish my education, I can't see myself staying with someone who is just happy to sit at home all day getting dole, whilst I go out slaving away working 5 or 6 days a week. It would drive me demented! I still have a lot of years left to study yet so hopefully things will improve with him before then. I know that he is a very kind and loving and gentle person, he is very funny and he has also been with me through all the best and definitely the worst moments of my life. He really is very intelligent, he does his own research in topics like science, astronomy, and history related things and knows a huge amount about these subjects. He has no confidence whatsoever though when it comes to actual formal education though, and would prefer to just not try at all rather than fail. I used to be more understanding, but now I am starting to see him as weak and lazy too.
(And yes we have talked about this, he keeps saying he will get around to doing something but he never does. I kinda blame the amount he smokes for lacking motivation to do anything with his life. I know that does not happen to everyone but it seems to be the case with him. He stopped smoking for a week once and in that week was like a different person bursting with energy and enthusiasm. I was shocked cos I thought he would be snappy and moody from withdrawal but not so. He of course went back smoking again though once he got money.)

So hate to admit it, but I am ashamed of my boyfriends work ethic...... :-(

(and what I see as an addiction that he won't do anything about)

havetoquit

Yes Psoriasis is a troublesome condition indeed and one has to sympathize with those who suffer from it.

The BO issue is also one where we cannot always assume that it is caused by a lack of hygiene, as there is a condition which even requires some type of sweat gland removal to correct the issue.

There are also those who are totally meticulous about personal hygiene and can smell like flowers leaving the house only to find themselves perspiring profusely as soon as they are presented with any type of anxiety making situation. Over-active sweat glands.

I think that most people with such issues do take every possible precaution to prevent it affecting those to whom they sit in close proximity to; never being without wet wipes and a good non chemical anti-perspirent.

I can well understand the poster's concern if this was irregular for her colleague and he began to appear unusually disheveled and unkempt. Dealing with such sensitive areas is not easy I imagine and the approach would need to be well thought out.

On the other hand, let us remember that there is a school of thought which subscribes to the fact that perspiration is a perfectly normal bodily function and our modern methods of preventing it are damaging. I guess in the old days, it would just have been accepted as normal, as deodorant had not even been invented, nor had anti Psoriasis treatments, apart from home made remedies.

GreeBo

havetoquit wrote: »

as soon as they are presented with any type of anxiety making situation. Over-active sweat glands.

I think that most people with such issues do take every possible precaution to prevent it affecting those to whom they sit in close proximity to; never being without wet wipes and a good non chemical anti-perspirent.

+1.
As someone who turns purple and sweats sometimes in the most benign of social situations I completely understand this.

havetoquit wrote: »

there is a school of thought which subscribes to the fact that perspiration is a perfectly normal bodily function and our modern methods of preventing it are damaging.

If you have spent the day doing hard physical work or perhaps a day where you spend 8 hours in the same meeting room you are supposed to sweat. Old sweat smells, thats life.

However, if I was doing something (or not doing something) that was impacting perceptions others had about me, and I could do something about it, I would like someone to tell me, rather than have people talk about it behind my back. If they are friends I would assume they are doing it for my benefit. If a friend cant tell you, who can?

Giselle

YumCha wrote: »

Sigh - I didn't feel like a hero at all. And I wasn't embarrassed or ashamed of my friend - I posted here because I thought the story might be relevant, not because I agreed with the thread title. And I have immense empathy for people with skin conditions - I'm absolutely mortified if you feel that was a personal attack.

Maybe I should have put more detail in the first post, but there were a lot of other circumstances - and as friends the both of us were genuinely worried that he wasn't taking care of himself... and that this might have been representative of something bigger.

Given that this seems to be contentious and that the consensus seems to be that I was in the wrong, what would you do if you saw someone you cared about change in a short period of time? For example, signs that they may not be showering or washing their clothes?

I think under those circumstances you did absolutely the right thing. Its impossible to describe a total situation in a few paragraphs, but its obvious it was all done with the best intentions and with concern for the person involved.

Madam_X

LizT wrote: »

I don't judge my friends by their dress sense or personal grooming, their personality and character is more important to me.

Yeh I presumed that was what this thread was about. Appearance? Lol.

And even if a friend of mine was extremely scruffy and it wasn't appropriate for whatever reason, I wouldn't feel ashamed of them. I'm not them.

Poor personal hygiene though, I'd have to say something in private - but again, not because of shame, more because of worrying whether they're depressed.

I don't agree with all the "No, they wouldn't be my friends in the first place" stuff in relation to personality. I bet plenty of us have at least one friend whom we know well enough to love and recognise all the good in them, but who still do annoying stuff that strangers/acquaintances would not accept. But again, shame is a bit of a strong word in those instances.

havetoquit

!!topsecret!! wrote: »

I couldn't give a fug about a person's fashion sense.
I absolutely hate to admit this though (even anonymously) but I have a few issues with my boyfriend and my family. We are together almost 10 years, he has no education not even a junior cert because he left school very young and then worked on the sites until the recession hit. He is unemployed for years and is making very little effort to get a new different type of job, or to back and further his education. He thinks with no junior cert that he will not get on any plc course or college course and that at his age (30) he is not going back to do his junior cert. My family are all educated to masters and even phd level and now have good jobs but are also of course paying A LOT of taxes. They are always friendly and polite but I know that they see my boyfriend as an uneducated sponger and a waster, and I know they think I am too good for him. I know that he is a hugely intelligent man, and I love him very much but I just can't seem to motivate him to do something with his life. All he does is sit at home smoking all day. I am still in education myself, but if I am lucky enough to get a good job by the time I finish my education, I can't see myself staying with someone who is just happy to sit at home all day getting dole, whilst I go out slaving away working 5 or 6 days a week. It would drive me demented! I still have a lot of years left to study yet so hopefully things will improve with him before then. I know that he is a very kind and loving and gentle person, he is very funny and he has also been with me through all the best and definitely the worst moments of my life. He really is very intelligent, he does his own research in topics like science, astronomy, and history related things and knows a huge amount about these subjects. He has no confidence whatsoever though when it comes to actual formal education though, and would prefer to just not try at all rather than fail. I used to be more understanding, but now I am starting to see him as weak and lazy too.
(And yes we have talked about this, he keeps saying he will get around to doing something but he never does. I kinda blame the amount he smokes for lacking motivation to do anything with his life. I know that does not happen to everyone but it seems to be the case with him. He stopped smoking for a week once and in that week was like a different person bursting with energy and enthusiasm. I was shocked cos I thought he would be snappy and moody from withdrawal but not so. He of course went back smoking again though once he got money.)

So hate to admit it, but I am ashamed of my boyfriends work ethic...... :-(

(and what I see as an addiction that he won't do anything about)

Dear guest. I really do sympathize with your situation and your message tells me that you have pretty much made your decision about your future and whether you want this man as part of it.

You and only you can look at this relationship realistically, where you see it going and the impact that dealing with it long term may have upon you, particularly if you decided to have a family.

I can appreciate how hard it can be, especially when feelings along with a few intermittent positives can blind our judgement.

You already know the answer and I wish you a successful future with the happiness and peace of mind you have every right to expect.

Stay focused, strong and resilient.

Knockout_91

Yes.

This one friend - whenever she drinks, she automatically feels the need to be the loudest, most annoying person ever. She shouts foul language thinking its "cool" and although she speaks very posh (d4) when sober, this awful Dublin accent comes out when she's drunk. Humiliating

woodchuck

!!topsecret!! wrote: »

I am still in education myself, but if I am lucky enough to get a good job by the time I finish my education, I can't see myself staying with someone who is just happy to sit at home all day getting dole, whilst I go out slaving away working 5 or 6 days a week.

I don't mean to go off topic, but just wanted to give you a bit of warning... if in the future you're both living together and you're earning a decent wage he'll be entitled to little/no dole (he'll be means tested against you regardless of whether or not you're married). Is this something he's aware of? If not maybe it's worth talking about... if he knows his own supply of money is going to dry up down the line then it might actually motivate him to get out there and make something of himself! It would certainly seem like lunacy for you to support him (and his smoking addiction) if he's not even willing to try and upskill in order to get a job

WaltKowalski

I'm not ashamed by any of my friends, but I have been told by someone (family, not a friend) that they're ashamed of me and that I wasn't welcome at an event because of their opinion of me.
That was a cause of great upset to me, especially since the person with the exceptionally low opinion of me doesn't know at all.

username123

I have a friend who becomes a different person when she drinks, aggressive, has been known to start fights. I never made it a secret that I disagreed with this behaviour and she herself is aware of it and tries to keep a lid on things. Its improved over the years but occasionally when she is upset about something, the few drinks will bring the monster out. Not nice. But Im not ashamed of her at all, however I dont agree with her drunken behaviour.

Im not really getting feeling ashamed about someone elses appearance? Is it that you are embarrassed to be seen in their company because you think they are uncool?

Vojera

Not a friend, but my OH's uncle (he's more like a dad to her) can come across really racist sometimes and it's mortifying. I know he's a different generation (he's in his sixties) but he's always calling people "smokies" and "pakis" and it's really embarrassing. I don't think he really means any harm and his whole family just accept that that's the way he is, but I wasn't raised that way and it's really hard to listen to.

LeeHoffmann

very kind and loving and gentle person, he is very funny and he has also been with me through all the best and definitely the worst moments of my life. He really is very intelligent

most of the top traits I would look for in a partner. I understand why his apparent lack of motivation/interest in improving your life together or building a life is a turn off for you - it would be for me too. But it also seems to me that the judgements you imagine your family are making about him might be causing you to feel ashamed of him. (I´d think intelligence and interest is more important than attaining a particular level of education. Usually the latter is attractive because it signifies intelligence and knowledge, whereas you already know that he´s intelligent and knowledgable. So why is his lack of education an issue for you?)
I really don´t want to interfere or act like I know best (clearly I don´t) but it´s always good to be clear about your reasons for wanting to break up with somebody. I just wouldn´t want to see anybody break up because of a reason they later regret. I´m sure you´ll know what´s right for you. Best of luck to you

redappple

!!topsecret!! wrote: »

I couldn't give a fug about a person's fashion sense.
I absolutely hate to admit this though (even anonymously) but I have a few issues with my boyfriend and my family. We are together almost 10 years, he has no education not even a junior cert because he left school very young and then worked on the sites until the recession hit. He is unemployed for years and is making very little effort to get a new different type of job, or to back and further his education. He thinks with no junior cert that he will not get on any plc course or college course and that at his age (30) he is not going back to do his junior cert. My family are all educated to masters and even phd level and now have good jobs but are also of course paying A LOT of taxes. They are always friendly and polite but I know that they see my boyfriend as an uneducated sponger and a waster, and I know they think I am too good for him. I know that he is a hugely intelligent man, and I love him very much but I just can't seem to motivate him to do something with his life. All he does is sit at home smoking all day. I am still in education myself, but if I am lucky enough to get a good job by the time I finish my education, I can't see myself staying with someone who is just happy to sit at home all day getting dole, whilst I go out slaving away working 5 or 6 days a week. It would drive me demented! I still have a lot of years left to study yet so hopefully things will improve with him before then. I know that he is a very kind and loving and gentle person, he is very funny and he has also been with me through all the best and definitely the worst moments of my life. He really is very intelligent, he does his own research in topics like science, astronomy, and history related things and knows a huge amount about these subjects. He has no confidence whatsoever though when it comes to actual formal education though, and would prefer to just not try at all rather than fail. I used to be more understanding, but now I am starting to see him as weak and lazy too.
(And yes we have talked about this, he keeps saying he will get around to doing something but he never does. I kinda blame the amount he smokes for lacking motivation to do anything with his life. I know that does not happen to everyone but it seems to be the case with him. He stopped smoking for a week once and in that week was like a different person bursting with energy and enthusiasm. I was shocked cos I thought he would be snappy and moody from withdrawal but not so. He of course went back smoking again though once he got money.)

So hate to admit it, but I am ashamed of my boyfriends work ethic...... :-(

(and what I see as an addiction that he won't do anything about)

You are not alone - I too once felt like you, but it was with my ex boyfriend! As I read your post I totally associated with everything you said. I was ALWAYS nagging my ex to go do PLC courses, etc. I was ashamed I have to say - I know my parents were disappointed. The only difference between your post and my story is that my ex thought he was really smart (as opposed to actually being smart!), he would often say that he could easily have gotten an A in Leaving Cert maths . . if he wanted to. But I think that was an excuse. Eventually he ended up doing a part time night course and I really think he only did it to keep me quiet. I remember sitting at a table with him for hours trying to teach him basic maths and physics for his course. I was only 19 at the time. Then he broke up with me. Obviously I was devastated at the time but I have to say I am sooooo relieved to no longer have that feeling hanging around my neck. As for my ex, not surprisingly not long after our break up he dropped out of the course. He is now in his late twenties, has no trade or any basic education over leaving cert and has been on the dole living at his parents house for years.

I am now finishing a PhD, and my current boyfriend is a teacher. It wouldn't matter to me if my boyfriend had a junior cert, leaving cert, apprenticeship, trade, degree, PhD or nothing at all - what matters is that he wants to do what he does FOR HIMSELF. It isn't me nagging him and I love him for that.

I know this post probably doesn't help you and I will be the first to admit that I was totally smitten with my ex, if he hadn't broken up with me I would never have broken up with him. But I really question where I would be with him now because I couldn't take the pressure of forcing him to try and make something of himself!