Thoughts on losing fat and getting lean?

yesbuddie

I'm 26 year old male, 5" 7" tall and weigh 158lbs

I'm currently around 22% BF and would like to lose fat and get down to 10%.
I am aware that I don't have loads of muscle but would like to cut first and then bulk.


Please let me know if my Macro's look correct:

Total:
Calories 1,448
Fat 39.6g
Carbs 93.5g
Protein: 164.1g

I'm doing Stongman 5x5 that requires be to lift heavy 3 times a week.

- How is my nutrition?
- Is it OK to cut or should I be thinking of bulking?

Col_Loki

Can you give a sample of your Diet? (there might be some tips on things to eat to stay fuller etc which makes life easier).

Your calorie intake is quite low, if you are happy with that then stick with it...will just lead to quicker results. If you find you are low on energy etc you might want to increase calories a bit.

If you are up around 22% I would personally cut first.

thegreatiam

strong lifts main idea is that to build strength you need to build muscle. there fore you will get bigger. have you considered bulking up first to around 10lb heavier than you want to be then cutting back to target weight? this may be easier. at some point on strong lifts you will reach a point where in order to get stronger you are going to have to bulk a little anyway. bulking first means you wil only need to cut once.

beggars_bush

losing fat is not easy

adding muscle is not easy

however, doing the two together is easier. Train like a mutherfckuer, eat a clean diet and sleep

job done

colman1212

If you really want to cut body fat here is a simple plan to follow which has worked extremely well for me

1) Only eat carbs after training (basmati rice/sweet potato)
2) eat lots of protein and good fats
3) do 30 mins on a treadmill at the end of your weight session slow walking. incline of 3.0 at about 5.8km/h. Your blood sugar is depleted after training so your body will burn fat as an energy source.

ooglybuns

I wouldn't do 5x5 when you are cutting.
Find something higher reps, less rest, more sweat.
Less likely to hurt yourself with less weight on the bar.

RidleyRider

I think your weight is perfect, just get some lighter weights and do many reps. Tighten up your muscles and get them defined. Don't forget the cardio though

double GG

beggars_bush wrote: »

losing fat is not easy

adding muscle is not easy

however, doing the two together is easier. Train like a mutherfckuer, eat a clean diet and sleep

job done

Really? Doing both together is easier? Where did you pull this out of? It's much harder to gain muscle and lose fat at the one time (Beginner gains aside). One requires a calorie surplus and the other a calorie deficit.

Eat your calories when you want, no need to only eat carbs post exercise or before 6pm or any of that nonsense. If it fits your macros and you're hungry eat it.

Your calories do seem a little low? How many cals below maintenance is that? I find if I eat too few cals over a period of time my lifts drop considerably si be careful when cutting. I'd probably up your fat intake if anything, you are only getting 0.25g per lb of body weight, I'd up it to 0.3-0.35g per lb of body weight minimum.

Best of luck! Don't forget to post back with updates!

yesbuddie

Hi guys,

Here are my Macro's for a typical day

Calories: 1797
FAT: 69.7g
Carbs: 115.4g
Protein: 161.5g

How does that look?

I feel as though I'm not getting far to be honest. I am doing the Strongman 5x5 and noticed my squats for example have stalled at 75KG.

Is a matter of persisting and being patient or am I doing something wrong?

Burkatron

yesbuddie wrote: »

Hi guys,

Here are my Macro's for a typical day

Calories: 1797
FAT: 69.7g
Carbs: 115.4g
Protein: 161.5g

How does that look?

I feel as though I'm not getting far to be honest. I am doing the Strongman 5x5 and noticed my squats for example have stalled at 75KG.

Is a matter of persisting and being patient or am I doing something wrong?

You're on a calorie defecit doing a strength programme, that's your 1st mistake.

How long have you being doing the programme? Did you work out your 1 rep max at the start of the programme & are you working off apporpriate percentages?

yesbuddie

Burkatron wrote: »

You're on a calorie defecit doing a strength programme, that's your 1st mistake.

How long have you being doing the programme? Did you work out your 1 rep max at the start of the programme & are you working off apporpriate percentages?

I've read that I strong lifts can be done on a deficit, on the official website!

4 weeks into the programme, though I did do the programme previously! No didn't do any percentages or 1rp before I started.

So what's the best weights programme for losing weight. I would have thought doing all the, compounds would have been good?

Burkatron

yesbuddie wrote: »

I've read that I strong lifts can be done on a deficit, on the official website!

4 weeks into the programme, though I did do the programme previously! No didn't do any percentages or 1rp before I started.

So what's the best weights programme for losing weight. I would have thought doing all the, compounds would have been good?

If you're doing a strength programme ideally you're doing it to get stronger! Yep you can still do the movements on a defecit but don't expect to get stronger. BTW just because it's on a website doesn't mean it's through! The guy from strong lift isn't a credible source tbh.

You've stalled after 4 weeks because a) you're not eating enough & b) you probably started at too high a percentage of your 1rm to begin with.

Try taking a reset/deload week now by dropping the weight back 10-15% & that should hopefully see you through your plateau in a few weeks time. Or you could figure out your 1rm's & start the cycle again at a lower weight, 60-75% & focus on technique.

There's no best weights programme for losing weight! It's all down to your diet! If you're focusing on losing weight don't expect to get the gains promised on a programme like strong lifts! Pick your goal, don't expect to do everything!

If I was in your boat I'd try to hit maintenance (or if disciplined enough clean bulk) while getting stronger. You'll end up cutting your weight & then be giving out about how weak/small you are & bulk anyway! I'm 1 inch shorter & roughly the same weight as you so I know where you're coming from!!

Burkatron

<snip>

You phrased it grand.If your main goal is to lose body fat then as I said, it won't really matter what weights programme you do! Excercise has minimal effect on weight loss in comparison to diet so focus on what you eat!

Out of curiosity how do you know you're 22%?

Me, i've been at my heaviest 77kg/12.2 stoneish at 13/14% This is when I was doing mma/Mainly Bjj & quickly realised I was out of my depth so cut down to 70kg at who knows, i never measured??....I was still out of my depth but I'm always more comfortable in myself at 11st then 10st, I feel better, I think I perform better, mood is better so I'm happy out! At the moment I'm focusing on strength training so I've let my bodyfat go up a little(right before xmas...smrt) I'd like to think I'm under the 14% mark..., I'm still between 70-73kg just not strict on calories at the moment as imo it's easier to get stronger & then cut

You can bulk with putting on minimal amounts of fat (read here), you can also maintain your exact levels & get stronger by eating maintenance calories & lifting big, you can also attempt to get stronger & lose weight BUT this is extremely hard to do as both goals will be extremely slow & you'll plateau alot quicker.

So again, if you're main goal is to lose weight now then pick an excercise you enjoy, keep it relatively light in comparison to your max performance &
focus on diet. You'll get down to 12% but then are you actually going to bulk? (Not that bulking is the be all and all)You've done all the hard work of getting yourself down to a level you want to be only to go & put on size again?

In all of this the 1 thing people always forget is to reassess your calorie intake maybe every 4-8 weeks or depending on when you stall. At every stage you need to workout your new maintenance calories & then +/- x amount of calories depending on what your goal is till you're at your target!

yesbuddie

Burkatron wrote: »

You phrased it grand.If your main goal is to lose body fat then as I said, it won't really matter what weights programme you do! Excercise has minimal effect on weight loss in comparison to diet so focus on what you eat!

Out of curiosity how do you know you're 22%?

Me, i've been at my heaviest 77kg/12.2 stoneish at 13/14% This is when I was doing mma/Mainly Bjj & quickly realised I was out of my depth so cut down to 70kg at who knows, i never measured??....I was still out of my depth but I'm always more comfortable in myself at 11st then 10st, I feel better, I think I perform better, mood is better so I'm happy out! At the moment I'm focusing on strength training so I've let my bodyfat go up a little(right before xmas...smrt) I'd like to think I'm under the 14% mark..., I'm still between 70-73kg just not strict on calories at the moment as imo it's easier to get stronger & then cut

You can bulk with putting on minimal amounts of fat (read here), you can also maintain your exact levels & get stronger by eating maintenance calories & lifting big, you can also attempt to get stronger & lose weight BUT this is extremely hard to do as both goals will be extremely slow & you'll plateau alot quicker.

So again, if you're main goal is to lose weight now then pick an excercise you enjoy, keep it relatively light in comparison to your max performance &
focus on diet. You'll get down to 12% but then are you actually going to bulk? (Not that bulking is the be all and all)You've done all the hard work of getting yourself down to a level you want to be only to go & put on size again?

In all of this the 1 thing people always forget is to reassess your calorie intake maybe every 4-8 weeks or depending on when you stall. At every stage you need to workout your new maintenance calories & then +/- x amount of calories depending on what your goal is till you're at your target!

I used one of those fat % scales at my gym, not sure how accurate it in.

Yes, main goal is to lose Fat rather than weight. If I lose weight, I'm afraid ill lose the little muscle I have. What do you mean by light activity? Weights 3 times a week?

Also, I do wonder if I'm wasting my time eating 160g if protein a day. What effect would it have If I didn't bother eating it? I usually have to have 2 shakes a day to meet that amount.

Mellor

yesbuddie wrote: »

I used one of those fat % scales at my gym, not sure how accurate it in.

Not very accurate.

Yes, main goal is to lose Fat rather than weight. If I lose weight, I'm afraid ill lose the little muscle I have. What do you mean by light activity? Weights 3 times a week?

If you are ballpark 20+%, then losing weight won't mean losing muscle.

Also, I do wonder if I'm wasting my time eating 160g if protein a day. What effect would it have If I didn't bother eating it? I usually have to have 2 shakes a day to meet that amount.

You aren't wasting your time with protein.
You also don't need two shakes to hit 160g. Two servings of meat has you most of the way there

Burkatron

yesbuddie wrote: »

I used one of those fat % scales at my gym, not sure how accurate it in.

Yes, main goal is to lose Fat rather than weight. If I lose weight, I'm afraid ill lose the little muscle I have. What do you mean by light activity? Weights 3 times a week?

Also, I do wonder if I'm wasting my time eating 160g if protein a day. What effect would it have If I didn't bother eating it? I usually have to have 2 shakes a day to meet that amount.

Don't go balls to the wall every workout so you can recover! For example the 5x5 programme you're doing start off at 60-70% of your 1 rep max & add your 2-5lbs each lift per week when you can. Take your deload week. Finish the cycle, break, retest start working off the same template against your new higher maxes. If you go too high from the start you'll stall pretty quickly! Same goes for any form of training, recovery is the most important part or you wont be able to improve

yesbuddie

Mellor wrote: »

Not very accurate.



If you are ballpark 20+%, then losing weight won't mean losing muscle.

You aren't wasting your time with protein.
You also don't need two shakes to hit 160g. Two servings of meat has you most of the way there

Cool. So I should start incorporating cardio as well? Maybe some HIIT

I find that I eat up to 3 fillets of chicken OR 2 fillets of steak and still don't hit my protein needs. That's why I rely on protein shakes.

RidleyRider

3 chicken breasts is up on 120grams of protein according to my package here. Plus two shakes? You're surely passing your protein needs at that. 3 breasts of chicken is practically one meal, maybe two. You still have 4/5 meals to hit your targets.

King of Kings

Burkatron wrote: »

You're on a calorie defecit doing a strength programme, that's your 1st mistake.

why so? What is wrong with it?

Burkatron

King of Kings wrote: »

why so? What is wrong with it?

Nothing wrong with it, at that stage I had assumed the OP's main goal was to get stronger,usually the reason someone does a 5x5 variation! You know yourself that he wont get the full benefits of a strength programme on a calorie defecit!

Mellor

Burkatron wrote: »

Nothing wrong with it, at that stage I had assumed the OP's main goal was to get stronger,usually the reason someone does a 5x5 variation! You know yourself that he wont get the full benefits of a strength programme on a calorie defecit!

He said his goal was to lose body fat.
So calling it a mistake to be eating a deficit is pretty strange. He might not increase strength as fast as possible, but he can still make strength gain on a deficit, especially starting out.

Burkatron

Mellor wrote: »

He said his goal was to lose body fat.
So calling it a mistake to be eating a deficit is pretty strange. He might not increase strength as fast as possible, but he can still make strength gain on a deficit, especially starting out.

Yep, my mistake, I was posting this time lastnight right before bed & was skimming the post & made an assumption.

Anyway, am I wrong in saying the OP could do a less intense programme & still lose the weight with less chance of burning out & getting injured? Do you really think Stronglifts is ideal on 1k calorie defecit??

yesbuddie wrote: »

I am doing the Strongman 5x5 and noticed my squats for example have stalled at 75KG.

Is a matter of persisting and being patient or am I doing something wrong?

yesbuddie wrote: »

4 weeks into the programme, though I did do the programme previously!

Do you not think the OP has either started A) on too high a weight or isn't eating enough to make gains anymore? Or could it be a combination of both? You're both experienced enough to see where I'm coming from but yeah, I'll try not to make a mistake ever again :rolleyes:

Scuba Ste

Burkatron wrote: »

Nothing wrong with it, at that stage I had assumed the OP's main goal was to get stronger,usually the reason someone does a 5x5 variation

I always assume it's because they read it online and don't know any better.

5x5 is the new 42.

Scuba Ste

Burkatron wrote: »

Yep, my mistake, I was posting this time lastnight right before bed & was skimming the post & made an assumption.

Anyway, am I wrong in saying the OP could do a less intense programme & still lose the weight with less chance of burning out & getting injured?

I think so yeah. Less volume is usually best for weight loss not less intensity. I'd go with 2-3x5 myself. Depends though.

Burkatron

Scuba Ste wrote: »

I always assume it's because they read it online and don't know any better.
5x5 is the new 42.

Read what in terms of?? Does it actually claim to be an ideal programme for weightloss on the site?

Scuba Ste wrote: »

I think so yeah. Less volume is usually best for weight loss not less intensity. I'd go with 2-3x5 myself. Depends though.

Eh so basically you agree that excercise has minimal effect on weightloss alone?That's what I'm taking from this!

Burkatron wrote: »

There's no best weights programme for losing weight! It's all down to your diet! If you're focusing on losing weight don't expect to get the gains promised on a programme like strong lifts! Pick your goal, don't expect to do everything!

RidleyRider

Burkatron wrote: »

Read what in terms of?? Does it actually claim to be an ideal programme for weightloss on the site?




Eh so basically you agree that excercise has minimal effect on weightloss alone?That's what I'm taking from this!

Guys will ye take this crap to PM, ye're ruining the OP's thread.

Mellor

Burkatron wrote: »

Anyway, am I wrong in saying the OP could do a less intense programme & still lose the weight with less chance of burning out & getting injured? Do you really think Stronglifts is ideal on 1k calorie defecit??

I think a 1k deficit is less than ideal in itself. If it was me, I'd go with closer to 500 regardless of the program used.
also I'm not sure we should take people estimates as completely accurate. Often people who "count" a 1000 deficit, are in reality eating a bit more.

I don't think SL is so intense so as to be problem on a deficit. At least not in the early stages. When the weight gets heavier, I'd probably start ramping sets.

Do you not think the OP has either started A) on too high a weight or isn't eating enough to make gains anymore? Or could it be a combination of both? You're both experienced enough to see where I'm coming from but yeah, I'll try not to make a mistake ever again :rolleyes:

I think stronglifts suggests increasing every workout. So even started at 20kg, you'll get to 75kg in a few weeks. I'd say its time to switch to weekly increases.
A reasonable deficit certainly won't make it easier, but I don't think it will be the limiting factor.

Get technique checked. I'd guess that technique is always a factor when novices stall for the first time.
Increase weekly
Ramps sets
Aim for 500 calorie deficit
Eat enough protein

Burkatron

RidleyRider wrote: »

Guys will ye take this crap to PM, ye're ruining the OP's thread.

I was asking a legit question when someone directly quoted me, what's the problem?

Mellor wrote: »

I think a 1k deficit is less than ideal in itself. If it was me, I'd go with closer to 500 regardless of the program used.
also I'm not sure we should take people estimates as completely accurate. Often people who "count" a 1000 deficit, are in reality eating a bit more.

Totally agree!

I don't think SL is so intense so as to be problem on a deficit. At least not in the early stages. When the weight gets heavier, I'd probably start ramping sets.


I think stronglifts suggests increasing every workout. So even started at 20kg, you'll get to 75kg in a few weeks. I'd say its time to switch to weekly increases.

I suppose I should read up on the programme, I just assumed it was the same as Starting Strength!

A reasonable deficit certainly won't make it easier, but I don't think it will be the limiting factor.

I wouldn't consider 1k reasonable....I know I wouldn't be trying to increase strength on a sustained deficit like that!

Get technique checked. I'd guess that technique is always a factor when novices stall for the first time.
Increase weekly
Ramps sets
Aim for 500 calorie def
Eat enough protein

I'd throw in starting at too high a percentage of your 1 rm/ too heavy a weight ontop of that! You've probably seen it yourself with guys lifting slightly less weight start to make better gains!

RidleyRider

Yeah but bickering back and forward isn't putting any clear daylight for the OP. Its both of ye guys' word against each other thats it.

Mellor

RidleyRider wrote: »

Yeah but bickering back and forward isn't putting any clear daylight for the OP. Its both of ye guys' word against each other thats it.

LOL, what are you talking about? We were hardly bickering.
This is a discussion forum. It's pretty normal to discuss a topic like that.
I'd like to think the that the points we both made in those few posts are pretty useful to the OP.

I think are the post below (and others like it) are pretty useless to the OP. Just my opinion, but thats the point postign in he first place.

RidleyRider wrote: »

I think your weight is perfect, just get some lighter weights and do many reps. Tighten up your muscles and get them defined. Don't forget the cardio though

WrigleysExtra

Never understood why people recommend adding or subtracting 500 calories. Start with a 10% deficit. So if your maintenance is 2000 calories then eat 1800 calories. If you see no fat loss for a week or two then make small adjustments.

thegreatiam

WrigleysExtra wrote: »

Never understood why people recommend adding or subtracting 500 calories. Start with a 10% deficit. So if your maintenance is 2000 calories then eat 1800 calories. If you see no fat loss for a week or two then make small adjustments.

500 calories a day defecit is 3500 in a week.
1 lb of fat is 3500 calories.
to lose 1lb a week eat 500 less a day.

WrigleysExtra

You then need to DECREASE or INCREASE intake based on your goals (eg: lose or gain mass). And instead of using 'generic calorie amounts' (eg: 500 cals/ day), this should be calculated on a % of your maintenance. Why? The effect of a given calorie amount on an individual is going to be markedly different based on their size/ total calorie intake. For example - subtracting 500 cals/ day from a 1500 total intake is 1/3rd of the total cals, where 500 cals/ day from 3000 total intake is only 1/6th of the total. The results will therefore be markedly different on an individuals energy level & weight loss. So generally:
- To ADD weight: ADD 10-20% calories to the total above
- To LOSE weight: SUBTRACT 10-20% calories from the total above
Then monitor your results and adjust as required.

taken from bodybuilding. com

thegreatiam

im not advocating one or the other, merely explaining why people go for a 500 calorie deficit.

1lb a week is usually a safe enough measure for most people

Burkatron

WrigleysExtra wrote: »

You then need to DECREASE or INCREASE intake based on your goals (eg: lose or gain mass). And instead of using 'generic calorie amounts' (eg: 500 cals/ day), this should be calculated on a % of your maintenance. Why? The effect of a given calorie amount on an individual is going to be markedly different based on their size/ total calorie intake. For example - subtracting 500 cals/ day from a 1500 total intake is 1/3rd of the total cals, where 500 cals/ day from 3000 total intake is only 1/6th of the total. The results will therefore be markedly different on an individuals energy level & weight loss. So generally:
- To ADD weight: ADD 10-20% calories to the total above
- To LOSE weight: SUBTRACT 10-20% calories from the total above
Then monitor your results and adjust as required.

taken from bodybuilding. com

Exactly why I wouldnt take heed of this! Far too complicated

WrigleysExtra

Burkatron wrote: »

Exactly why I wouldnt take heed of this! Far too complicated

How is it complicated. When you work out your maintenance either subtract or add 10 - 20% to lose or gain. Its simple really.

Burkatron

WrigleysExtra wrote: »

How is it complicated. When you work out your maintenance either subtract or add 10 - 20% to lose or gain. Its simple really.

I was being facetious!

thegreatiam

people like round numbers. the 500 cals makes for some easy reading. 500 a day, 3500 a week= 1lb of fat lost.
10%-20% under maintenance wouldn't deliver the same amount of loss in a week. On most people that would be around 1/2 a lb. losing 200 grams a week would be unsatisfactory for most people.

besides
To ADD weight: ADD 10-20% calories to the total above eat more than you use
To LOSE weight: SUBTRACT 10-20% calories from the total above eat less than you use.

The percentages or calorie amounts only affect how fast you will lose or gain weight.

500 cals a day is simply a convenient way to tell people not to try to lose too much too quickly and still let them see measurable result.
As with most things health related its not the 'best option' its simply the one the majority of people will go for.