Person opens door while your going past

Lawless2k12

This may have been asked before but I couldn't find it no matter what I typed as random door things started to come up from my car door wont open to I hit someone in a car park.

So what I wanted to know was who's at fault in this situation: You're pulled up on the side of a road, parked towards oncoming traffic on the right hand side. Your passenger opens the door to get out but a motorbike coming from behind slams into the door and injures your passenger. The biker was overtaking a car which had stopped outside a bar to drop people off and as he overtook, the car door opened?

Also, who's at fault in general situations when someone swings the door open in front of you and you can't really help but take it off for them?

guttenberg

GENERALLY speaking the driver is responsible, you should anticipate that people may walk out between parked cars to cross the road/doors of parked cars may open etc. It's just one of the many hazards you can encounter everyday!

areyawell

The person who opens the car door without looking.

colm_mcm

Are you parked in a paking space, or on the wrong side of the road and stopped?

Wexfordian

You are probably going to get both sides of this argued. In theory you should always leave a doors width when passing a parked car. Not always doable, but in this case as the guy was overtaking, he had the option to stay put. Also for a motorbike to be that far over the stopped vehicle (either yours or the other) must have been well out in the road. Conversely you shouldn't really be parked against the traffic, and the passenger was probably negligent for not looking, so I'd guess a certain amount of blame will be apportioned each way, probably more leaning against the moving vehicle.

sf80

The biker for their own safety should leave room for a fool opening a door without looking. That does not attribute any blame whatsoever to the biker if you open the door when it is not safe to do so and cause an accident.

Pedro K

Somebody opened a door into somebody else's path of travel without looking. The person who opened the door is at fault and should accept it and stop looking for a way out.

kirving

The passenger should be responsible. I know that the law says that you must be able to stop in the distance you can see to be clear, but that's kind of unreasonable since a door can open at 3+ft into a lane in under a second, with no warning.

As a cyclist, I'm always afraid of it people opening doors into my path so I give stopped cars a wide berth, but as a passenger, I always glance in the mirror before getting out.

Lawless2k12

Just to clarify, I was not the actual driver just said it for simplicity. And it was parked outside a house along the road (residential parking). Its a very narrow road and the car letting people off was taking up a good 2 thirds of driving space so the bike just cut up the middle just as the passenger was getting out. It was quite dark also and she had opened the door and was just getting out so several seconds had passed when she first went to open the door. She was hit over the door onto the bonnet as she had been half out of the car when the bike hit her. Biker was fairly okay with just a few bumps and bruises nothing serious.

goz83

It really depends on how long the door was open, so it's a hard one to prove. If the door was open more than 5 seconds (for example) the biker should have seen it and avoided it. In my opinion, if the passenger had enough time to exit the vehicle and end up going over the door onto the bonnet, then the biker is at fault here, as that's more than enough time to see the door in the way. My guess is that the bikers attention was on the other car, that had stopped.

Supergurrier

Was the biker badly hurt ?

Lawless2k12

Well that's what I would have thought but it's an iffy one tbh... Although it is a 50km zone as its practically in town so I would have thought he'd be able to stop but it was nightish time so it was pitch dark out. He could have seen the gap to the right, accelerated for it and only seen the door at the last second but I suppose that brings up the whole drive at a speed to stop in the space you see clear... it is a bit dodgy I admit

Lawless2k12

Supergurrier wrote: »

Was the biker badly hurt ?

No he had no more than bumps and bruises. The door pretty much just bent backwards so he wasn't met with much force. The passenger on the other hand has broken bones in her back and is awaiting to be told whether she needs to be operated on or not in hospital

daenerysstormborn3

Liability probably end up 50/50.

Biker may not have been badly hurt but I'd say there was some expensive damage to his bike. Regardless of the speed, what may look like light damage on a bike can end up costing a lot to fix.

MetzgerMeister

It is totally the fault of whoever opens the door in my opinion.

This happened to a teacher in my primary school years ago. He cycled to work every day and one morning when he was passing the Garda station, a Garda opened the door of her car without looking. The teacher hit the door, came out over the door and hit his head on the ground. Unfortunately he died from his injuries.

The Garda took full responsibility for her actions and owned up to not looking before opening the door.

colm_mcm

non drivers are often terrible for doing this.

Lawless2k12

Well ya the bike was pretty much ruined (Have a feeling is was some kind of newish honda) but tbh personal injury is a bigger importance than some stupid machine. The vehicles were irrelevant imo. At least they can be replaced tomorrow.

I just think its dodgy as she had the door open a few seconds but it's hard to say exactly how long as no one was really concentrating on timing the amount of time the door was open Plus the gap he tore up through was quite narrow and not many would expect anything to go up through it

langdang

She'll look the next time!

Mech1

Sounds to me that the door was not opened into anyones path. Then the passenger got out. Then the biker came into the wrong lane while overtaking a stopped car. Then the biker hit a pedestrian and also damaged a car door.

colm_mcm

Any security cameras in the pub I wonder?

Wishbone Ash

Even though the passenger opened the door, the driver of the vehicle is responsible.

I was hospitalised following being "doored" by a passenger exiting a car in standstill traffic. (I was on a cycle lane). The Gardai concentrated their investigations on the driver and I dealt with him alone as I was advised by them that the driver of a vehicle is responsible for all aspects pertaining to his vehicle.

(PS AFAIK it's illegal to park on the opposite side of a two way road during lighting up hours).

Cedrus

The passenger does not have the benefit of mirrors and is not responsible for the safe stopping of the car, despite them being a principal protagonist I can't see any legal responsibility being attached to them.

If the driver of the car stopped in an unsafe manner (suddenly, on a bad section or position of the road, and it's not clear if this is the case) then they are responsible at least in part and the passenger could certainly claim against them. They are ultimately responsible for their vehicle and it's passengers.

If the biker passed in an unsafe manner or at speed then they are responsible at least in part.

Our man in Havana

Parking on the wrong side of the road is stupid. Except a nice claim from the injured party.

RustyNut

Very easy for the biker to make the argument that he could stop within the distance he could see to be clear then bang door opens right in the middle of his stopping distance. Hope everyone is ok in the end.

Del2005

Did the car have hazard lights on? Not that they count for much but most road users won't squeeze past if they see them.

While the biker may be slightly to blame, IMO the driver is more responsible for parking in a dangerous position and allowing passengers unload while unsafe to do so. Depending on the road there may have been plenty of room for the bike to pass. Most bikers are well aware of the risks of doors opening or cars turning across their path with no warning, but as with all road users there are a few muppets who take risks.


270kg + of bike and rider has a lot of kinetic energy even at low speed, especially against a door,I hope the passenger isn't too badly injured.

the_syco

Lawless2k12 wrote: »

You're pulled up on the side of a road, parked towards oncoming traffic on the right hand side.

I can see the motorcyclist getting a nice lump sum. Hope they're okay; what could look like a few bumps could be very bad internally. Hope they get themselves checked out!

goz83

MetzgerMeister wrote: »

It is totally the fault of whoever opens the door in my opinion.

I would totally agree with you if the door was opened and the bike collided with the door. However, the door was opened and the passenger had time to exit the car before being struck by the bike with enough force to launch her over the door and onto the bonnet. Technically the passenger, who was then arguably a pedestrian was struck. I get out of my car quickly when I park (checking it's safe to open door) but it still takes several seconds from door open to body out of car.

99% of the time, I would say open door is the fault of whoever opened door and the responsibilty of the driver, but this wasn't just an open door situation. The passenger had time to get out of the car. Besides, how long is long enough? If I open the boot of the Zafira in a carpark and i'm taking the kids buggy out, I wouldn't expect to be blamed if some clown cycling, or riding by whacks their head off the corner of the boot.

goz83

Del2005 wrote: »

Did the car have hazard lights on? Not that they count for much but most road users won't squeeze past if they see them.

While the biker may be slightly to blame, IMO the driver is more responsible for parking in a dangerous position and allowing passengers unload while unsafe to do so. Depending on the road there may have been plenty of room for the bike to pass. Most bikers are well aware of the risks of doors opening or cars turning across their path with no warning, but as with all road users there are a few muppets who take risks.
QUOTE]

I haven't seen anything to say that the driver was parked dangerously. It does say that the driver parked on the other side of the road, which I wouldn't say is dangerous at all if properly parked. There was also mention of the road being narrow.

Topper Harley

I normally would say that the person opening the door is at fault but this doesn't sound like the usual sudden opening without looking when a bike/car/cyclist is almost upon them.

It sounds to me as if the car was parked in a parking space on the side of the road and the passenger had already exited the car.

It would seem the biker was concentrating on the car he was overtaking/looking for oncoming traffic. With this and, because of the darkness, the low visibility of the parked car, I'd be inclined to think the biker just didn't notice the open door until it was too late.

Lawless2k12

To the people mentioning dangerously parking the car and it being illegal to park against traffic in lighting up hours: It was around 9pm, pretty much pitch black apart from a few street lights. It's one of those narrow little roads with a few dozen houses on either side but there's a little pub at the corner about 50 metres from where the other car had stopped to drop people off. All the residents park on either side of the road outside their houses as there are no driveways. Makes the road about the width of 1 and a half cars.



I suppose it would be somewhat like that but it's a flat road, less cars would be parked on it and the houses have small little gardens in the front with railings guarding them. Then there's a footpath on either side. Depending on what direction they come from the residents tend to just pull up right outside their house be it with or against traffic...

EDIT: It's not a one way just so people know before they say I didn't clarify it

Our man in Havana

I would clean up there if I was a traffic warden. Rubs hands with glee.

ShadowHearth

i have to say this door flipping on busy streets goes on my tits in a HUGE way!!!

I have to drive oneway main street back home and almost every single day i get a muppet who flips the door in front of me. even worse when person walks to the car and wide opens his cars door just about when you go pass.

OP, in your case ( and all of them ) passanger is at fault.

Lawless2k12

ShadowHearth wrote: »

i have to say this door flipping on busy streets goes on my tits in a HUGE way!!!

I have to drive oneway main street back home and almost every single day i get a muppet who flips the door in front of me. even worse when person walks to the car and wide opens his cars door just about when you go pass.

OP, in your case ( and all of them ) passanger is at fault.

Ya I understand what you mean. P*sses me off as well when a door swings wide open just as you come near, but it's not a straight cut case here really as the passenger had time to get fully out as she was flipped up over the door... I guess it may depend on the witnesses at the end of the day though?

mitosis

The passenger had time to exit the car. Thus the door becomes an obstacle the biker has to react properly to. Different than if the door was opened directly as the bike approached. In fact, if the bike was doing 50kph and the door was open for 5 seconds, the bike was about 70m away when the door was opened. Mayble not even in view.

Our man in Havana

It is what the insurance companies/barristers and the judge decide at the end of the day.

ShadowHearth

Lawless2k12 wrote: »

Ya I understand what you mean. P*sses me off as well when a door swings wide open just as you come near, but it's not a straight cut case here really as the passenger had time to get fully out as she was flipped up over the door... I guess it may depend on the witnesses at the end of the day though?

Its very hard to judge from only one side of the story. We can all speculate on what happened.

Lawless2k12

Our man in Havana wrote: »

It is what the insurance companies/barristers and the judge decide at the end of the day.

Can't argue with that! Long wait until then though...

tenreds

I think the biker is in the wrong here...but why didn't you park on the left side of road so your not leaving people exit out on to the middle of the road.

djimi

If she was in the process of getting out of the car when hit then it sounds to me like the biker most likely should have had enough time to see the danger and react had they been paying proper attention. Its hard to know though without knowing exactly how it went down.

Generally I would say that if the door was opened into the path of the bike so that they had no time to react then it would be the fault of the passenger. If the biker hits a door that has already been open for a number of seconds then they are most likely the ones at fault. Its not exactly a black and white situation though.

Under normal circumstances, where the bike was simply overtaking the car in question, then the bike would have been at fault as you must allow enough room when overtaking to compensate for this kind of thing.

Bohrio

A few years ago I had an accident with my motorbike under a similar situation, I was overtaking a bunch of cars stopped in traffic. A man in car decided to open the door because he wanted to remove his coat and I bumped into it, I dont remember anything but this is what I was told. I was doing 40 kmh (probably less).

The garda said that the other guy was at fault (after watching CCTV) and the other guys insurance company decided they didnt want to go to the high court so they decided to settle and pay compensation in the end (everything was caught on CCTV).

I didnt leave 1.5 meters (normally I would if the road width allows it but sometimes streets are not 3 meters wide), The reason why is ie to avoid being hit by someone parked on the other side of the road (right side) if they decided to pull out, among others.

The Gardai said that it was perfect for me to overtake as the roadmarkings said so and that the guy should have looked before he did what he did.

I am not saying that, if the same situation repeats, this will turn out the same but just wanted to share my experience!

Pedro K

Lawless2k12 wrote: »

Also, who's at fault in general situations when someone swings the door open in front of you and you can't really help but take it off for them?

This question was asked in the OP. If this is how it happened, then your own question was answered in the bold part.

 was just getting out so several seconds had passed when she first went to open the door. She was hit over the door onto the bonnet as she had been half out of the car when the bike hit her. Biker was fairly okay with just a few bumps and bruises nothing serious.

Half out of the car after several seconds? Took her time. Unless there are independent witnesses the length of time can't be proven. What did, undoubtedly, happen though, is a car door was opened into the path of travel of a bike and this caused a collision.

Out of interest, if it had been a bin truck that took the door off the car after it was opened without adequate observation people still be questioning or denying liability? I mean, how could you possibly not notice a bin truck?

dr.fuzzenstein

Lawless2k12 wrote: »

This may have been asked before but I couldn't find it no matter what I typed as random door things started to come up from my car door wont open to I hit someone in a car park.

Half past three

Lawless2k12

Pedro K wrote: »

This question was asked in the OP. If this is how it happened, then your own question was answered in the bold part.



Half out of the car after several seconds? Took her time.

That's not how it happened I was just curious in general situations...

And would it not usually take a number of seconds to get out of the car? Usually it would take me at least 2 to 3 seconds to be near fully outside of the car. Maybe I'm just lazy

Lawless2k12

dr.fuzzenstein wrote: »

Half past three

..... That has no meaning to me at all? :L

dr.fuzzenstein

Lawless2k12 wrote: »

..... That has no meaning to me at all? :L

Sorry, couldn't resist, I just couldn't make head nor tail of the opening paragraph.

Pj!

I was stopped in Abbeyleix a few years ago and across the road from me a woman pulled in to park. Legitimate space. In off the road, parallel with the road.
She swung her drivers door open with not a thought nor care for passing traffic or cyclists.
Just as I began thinking 'what an idiot woman', a large artic, driving at a pacey town speed, made very short work of her door with a very large bang. Door in absolute bits. I don't know if the truck driver realised (he caught it with the trailer) but he didn't stop.
Glass everywhere. Door mangled. Woman ok. But lesson learned.

Our man in Havana

That sort of thing is still common in Abbeyleix. The parking in it is terrible.

BrensBenz

OP, You've described the only accident I ever had: A parked car opened his door and sent a cyclist onto my windscreen. The cyclist (my workmate!) spent a night in hospital but was released next day. Both drivers were interviewed at the local cop shop; neither of us was prosecuted but the other (parked) driver lost his job soon after (company car and he didn't report the accident to his employer. Parked outside a pub so there may have been previous history or Garda findings that I'm not aware of).
I paid for my replacement windscreen but, really, the lasting memory of this accident is not about the cost or fault or liability but with the fact that I almost killed someone. In retrospect, I think my share of the blame would have been less than 50% but, even if 100% blameless, I would struggle to get past the feeling of guilt at being the "instrument" of someone's death.

galwaytt

Here's something to look at....... http://www.rotr.ie/rules-for-driving/parking/general-rules.html

In that, I could see that, irrespective of care/intentions, that at least 4 of those rules were not fully complied with by the car driver, so car driver is at fault.

Yakuza

Lawless2k12 wrote: »

This may have been asked before, but I couldn't find it no matter what I typed as random door things started to come up from "my car door wont open" to "I hit someone in a car park".

dr.fuzzenstein wrote: »

Half past three

Does that help?

I drill it into my kids to always look before opening a door, whether it be to make sure they won't scratch it off a wall / pillar in a car park or to make sure they don't clock someone. I would pretty much always be parked with the flow of traffic and they'd be getting out on the left side of the car but (especially on the school run) that doesn't preclude cyclists or kids on scooters (scooterists / scooterers? ) from being in the path of an opening door.

2 stroke

From my reading of this, everybody was at fault with 2 faults against the biker, involved in a collision while driving on wrong side of road and driving too close to parked cars, too fast to stop.