Rescue coming out of the bag. Driving iron type going in.

m r c

Hi guys I'm hardly the only one who can't really get on with the hybrids, I have never really felt the love to be honest. The best I can explain it is to say that my hybrid play has always put too much spin on the ball. Wether it's into the wind the thing spins up and I find it easy to accidently put hook and slice spin on it. The only shot I like to play with it is a cut shot from about165/175 meters. I don't have the same problem with my other clubs. Where my 3 iron I find it much more reliable, the biggest miss is a little short sometimes if I don't exactly pure it and now I'm thinking along the lines of the new 712u or the new mph4 in an 18 degree 2 iron replacement.

Apart from just being personal preference does anyone use similar sticks or have opinions on the long iron/rescue debate?

WHIP IT!

m r c wrote: »

Hi guys I'm hardly the only one who can't really get on with the hybrids, I have never really felt the love to be honest. The best I can explain it is to say that my hybrid play has always put too much spin on the ball. Wether it's into the wind the thing spins up and I find it easy to accidently put hook and slice spin on it. The only shot I like to play with it is a cut shot from about165/175 meters. I don't have the same problem with my other clubs. Where my 3 iron I find it much more reliable, the biggest miss is a little short sometimes if I don't exactly pure it and now I'm thinking along the lines of the new 712u or the new mph4 in an 18 degree 2 iron replacement.

Apart from just being personal preference does anyone use similar sticks or have opinions on the long iron/rescue debate?

Career mid-handicapper and I've owned two hybrids in my time. Like yourself, I have a love/hate relationship with the club. There are stretches where I honestly feel like I can do no wrong with them and other stretches where I'll refuse to even take it out of the bag.

mag

i dumped my hybrid this yr for a mizuno fi-hi 18deg. its not as easy to hit out of the rough but from tee/fairway i find it a lot easier to control, particularly in the wind. liked the 18deg fli-hi so much i got the 21 & 24 as well, dropping my 3/4i. working well so far.

m r c

WHIP IT! wrote: »

Career mid-handicapper and I've owned two hybrids in my time. Like yourself, I have a love/hate relationship with the club. There are stretches where I honestly feel like I can do no wrong with them and other stretches where I'll refuse to even take it out of the bag.

Just for the record whipit I'm an "aspiring" career mid handicapper :-)

PARlance

m r c wrote: »

Just for the record whipit I'm an "aspiring" career mid handicapper :-)

That's ok....as long as you're not currently a low handicapper :eek:

Mr. Larson

I have room for both. I've a 24 degree hybrid & also carry a 4iron which is essentially the same loft. Hybrid never off the tee, 4i off the tee on tight driving holes. 4i never from the rough, hybrid from there all day long. I find I hit it straighter with the 4i but need a good lie to hit it.

Alrite Chief

Have the same myself. Used to be my go to club. Couldn't put a foot wrong with it. Now im crapping myself standing over a shot with it.

bustercherry

Is this thread actually serious?

The 712u etc... From what I gather are designed for players that produce a lot of club head speed and strike it pure. Certainly not a club for a high handicapper could hit consistently.

IMO you should leave well alone for the time being.

Senna

If the OP is confident with a 3 iron and hits it well, i can only see a 712u being easier to hit, horses for courses but i agree most mid/high handicappers wouldn't hit a 712u better than a hybrid.
I'm a 15 handicapper and i haven't had a 3 iron in the bag for 10 years, couldn't hit them to say my life. I do have 3 hybrids at the moment and they work brilliant for me.

GreeBo

Senna wrote: »

If the OP is confident with a 3 iron and hits it well, i can only see a 712u being easier to hit, horses for courses but i agree most mid/high handicappers wouldn't hit a 712u better than a hybrid.
I'm a 15 handicapper and i haven't had a 3 iron in the bag for 10 years, couldn't hit them to say my life. I do have 3 hybrids at the moment and they work brilliant for me.

Id have to ask the question why someone who can comfortably hit a 3 iron off the fairway and hit it well is still a mid/high handicap?

OP I would advise you to stick with the rescue and maybe get a lesson or check out some videos on how to use it properly. Its far easier to hit than a long iron and you can pretty much hit the same shots with it.

spacecoyote

Would it be worth considering that u might have the wrong shaft for your swing on the hybrid resulting in the inconsistent results?

saintastic

spacecoyote wrote: »

Would it be worth considering that u might have the wrong shaft for your swing on the hybrid resulting in the inconsistent results?

Could also be from having a swing that is too steep. One of my friends was never able to hit a hybrid and he was told in a lesson that he was too steep on all his shots. Might not be the case with all but may help someone.

spacecoyote

saintastic wrote: »

Could also be from having a swing that is too steep. One of my friends was never able to hit a hybrid and he was told in a lesson that he was too steep on all his shots. Might not be the case with all but may help someone.

Yep, that would make sense alright. One session with a coach would point out if thats the case.

Would cost considerably less to get a couple of lessons to sort out a swing fault over buying a new club too!

TRS30

mag wrote: »

i dumped my hybrid this yr for a mizuno fi-hi 18deg. its not as easy to hit out of the rough but from tee/fairway i find it a lot easier to control, particularly in the wind. liked the 18deg fli-hi so much i got the 21 & 24 as well, dropping my 3/4i. working well so far.

I am doing the same for next season. Dropping my hybrid and playing a 18 dg Fi-hi.

I cannot find a hybrid that doesnt hook. All other clubs are fine just hybrids.

m r c

TRS30 wrote: »

I am doing the same for next season. Dropping my hybrid and playing a 18 dg Fi-hi.

I cannot find a hybrid that doesnt hook. All other clubs are fine just hybrids.

Glad to see lads with the same theory. I think hybrids are overrated. Come to think about its probably a way for the oem's to make more money in the first place.

I used to think they were fantastic but as the ball striking improved I have much less shots for them and on long par 3's I'd much rather have a long iron.

heavyballs

GreeBo wrote: »

Id have to ask the question why someone who can comfortably hit a 3 iron off the fairway and hit it well is still a mid/high handicap?

OP I would advise you to stick with the rescue and maybe get a lesson or check out some videos on how to use it properly. Its far easier to hit than a long iron and you can pretty much hit the same shots with it.

i agree,the op sounds like he should be playing on tour,can't beleive he used 'pure it' in a sentence,


"the biggest miss is a little short sometimes if I don't exactly pure it"

mag

i think hybrids have their place, and played one myself for yrs. i used to carry a 2 iron before that and the switch to the hybrid meant more options (out of the rough, bad lies, launch downwind off tees, etc...) and forgivness but now the utility iron (fli-hi in my case) is the best of both worlds. so much so that i have now three of them, as i mentioned. i play off 4, have been 2 if that makes any difference..

bustercherry

m r c wrote: »

Glad to see lads with the same theory. I think hybrids are overrated. Come to think about its probably a way for the oem's to make more money in the first place.

I used to think they were fantastic but as the ball striking improved I have much less shots for them and on long par 3's I'd much rather have a long iron.

Maybe I'm being a bit harsh but you need a bit of a reality check.

With your club head speed (based on the quoted distance of an equivalent hybrid), most likely you will not be able to hit this club consistently and certainly will struggle to get the launch high enough; let alone any distance on it. The lads with the same theory are much better players than you and hence maybe it is an option for them.

m r c

bustercherry wrote: »

Maybe I'm being a bit harsh but you need a bit of a reality check.

With your club head speed (based on the quoted distance of an equivalent hybrid), most likely you will not be able to hit this club consistently and certainly will struggle to get the launch high enough; let alone any distance on it. The lads with the same theory are much better players than you and hence maybe it is an option for them.

175 meters cut with a 22 degree hybrid is very short ya

I had hoped this would be a reasonable discussion

heavyballs

m r c wrote: »

175 meters cut with a 22 degree hybrid is very short ya

I had hoped this would be a reasonable discussion

only when you............'pure it'

m r c

heavyballs wrote: »

only when you............'pure it'

Pure this...............go **** yourself

m r c

That's very interesting it won't let you say **** even when you type it out.

Idk why you are bothered why I would use the word pure? Could you please inform me of a more appropriate word then I won't look as stupid.

kiers47

m r c wrote: »

Pure this...............go **** yourself

To be fair i found it quite witty. You have sunk lower than the people slating you.
Enjoy the holiday.

m r c

kiers47 wrote: »

To be fair i found it quite witty. You have sunk lower than the people slating you.
Enjoy the holiday.

Look I know I shouldn't have said that, but I was just trying to see what other opinions were out there, I'm not in a big circle of golfers to chat about the game and I'm not here slagging off others.

kiers47

m r c wrote: »

Look I know I shouldn't have said that, but I was just trying to see what other opinions were out there, I'm not in a big circle of golfers to chat about the game and I'm not here slagging off others.

In fairness most people here are giving you advice perhaps some are not giving you the advice you want to hear by telling you your crazy to go down that route. It is criticizing you but it is still advice.
You are always going to have the Grammar Nazi's, the people who choose to pick on silly statements etc... It is the internet at the end of the day. Just ignore and move on.

As for your enquiry i think considering the level you are at that you should stick out the hybrid(perhaps as suggested you have the wrong shaft fitting). Presuming Mid-Handicapper you are going to have shots on the long holes anyway so it is probably a safer option to not be taking on the greens in 2 anyway. Surely a 4 iron is low enough for any mid handicapper.

Anyway good luck in your quest. Report back on how it went if you go with it.

bustercherry

m r c wrote: »

175 meters cut with a 22 degree hybrid is very short ya

I had hoped this would be a reasonable discussion

So your replacing a 22 degree hybrid with a 18 degree utility iron?

m r c

kiers47 wrote: »

In fairness most people here are giving you advice perhaps some are not giving you the advice you want to hear by telling you your crazy to go down that route. It is criticizing you but it is still advice.
You are always going to have the Grammar Nazi's, the people who choose to pick on silly statements etc... It is the internet at the end of the day. Just ignore and move on.

As for your enquiry i think considering the level you are at that you should stick out the hybrid(perhaps as suggested you have the wrong shaft fitting). Presuming Mid-Handicapper you are going to have shots on the long holes anyway so it is probably a safer option to not be taking on the greens in 2 anyway. Surely a 4 iron is low enough for any mid handicapper.

Anyway good luck in your quest. Report back on how it went if you go with it.

Thank you, I newish to the game and improving at the moment. I've started swinging with more fluidity rather than trying to bust the ball.
I don't understand much of the science of golf but I had noticed that my hybrid puts a fair bit of spin on the ball. I hit my other woods reasonably well. All my woods have the same shaft the aldila nv stiff 75 g in the driver 3 and 7 woods and 85g in my hybrid so I don't think it's the shaft. I have been fitted for this shaft for low spin low flight.
Wind is a fairly big factor for me in golf, I play links and keeping it on the fairway is sometimes more of a priority than playing the driver. To this end I was thinking about a two iron instead of my hybrid.

m r c

bustercherry wrote: »

So your replacing a 22 degree hybrid with a 18 degree utility iron?

Yes. The loft of the hybrid was not intended to fit into a space distance wise. More of an in trouble stick. I have a space behind my three wood to 3 iron that adding a 2 iron might improve.
I bought the hybrid after having a 16 degree one, thinking the extra loft would help improve exiting rough stuff.

m r c

I accept the infraction, to be fair I deserve it.

PARlance

m r c wrote: »

Look I know I shouldn't have said that, but I was just trying to see what other opinions were out there, I'm not in a big circle of golfers to chat about the game and I'm not here slagging off others.

**** *** ** * ******* *** *********** ***** *** ***** ********

Head up MRC, I know a 6 handicapper that says "pure it" all the time, but I guess he can get away with it because he can pure a 712u.

I didn't realise it was impossible to hit a 3 iron if you were a high/mid handicapper. I didn't know a 3 iron was the thing keeping people in that handicap level.

(Just to clarify... the * above result from shift+8 in an attempt at humour)

m r c

For anyone wondering, for me understanding this video lead me to big improvements.

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=53DaCUuj1Bo

I hadn't understood there was a second way to release the club head, I always rolled my hands but I guess my timing was always a little off. The stable release as explained here honestly has taken 30 shots off my score per round very quickly. I find it excellent because you get to feel much more like you are swinging to target IMHO ( it's just a feeling don't hammer me)

30 shots yes but then I still have plenty to spare :-)

GreeBo

^
Argh!
Why would you want all that stuff in your head?!
The release happens...you are just there for the ride!

m r c

GreeBo wrote: »

^
Argh!
Why would you want all that stuff in your head?!
The release happens...you are just there for the ride!

I dunno Greebo. I found it excellent to be honest. I'd describe myself as the type that needs to understand the how and the why to "do"

scubapro

m r c wrote: »

For anyone wondering, for me understanding this video lead me to big improvements.

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=53DaCUuj1Bo

I hadn't understood there was a second way to release the club head, I always rolled my hands but I guess my timing was always a little off. The stable release as explained here honestly has taken 30 shots off my score per round very quickly. I find it excellent because you get to feel much more like you are swinging to target IMHO ( it's just a feeling don't hammer me)

30 shots yes but then I still have plenty to spare :-)

http://cdn.thesandtrap.com/0/05/05d5b27b_Picture1.png
Dustin Johnson with this move from a thread on the sandtrap.

bustercherry

m r c wrote: »

Yes. The loft of the hybrid was not intended to fit into a space distance wise. More of an in trouble stick. I have a space behind my three wood to 3 iron that adding a 2 iron might improve.
I bought the hybrid after having a 16 degree one, thinking the extra loft would help improve exiting rough stuff.

That's you problem. FFS your a 23 handicapper (if what you posted on another thread is true)..... unless its a first cut, wedge it out back on the fairway.

Just out of curiosity, what distance gap are you trying to fill between your 3 wood and 3 iron? Why do you think you need the accuracy of an iron over the forgiveness of a hybrid?

m r c

bustercherry wrote: »

That's you problem. FFS your a 23 handicapper (if what you posted on another thread is true)..... unless its a first cut, wedge it out back on the fairway.

Just out of curiosity, what distance gap are you trying to fill between your 3 wood and 3 iron? Why do you think you need the accuracy of an iron over the forgiveness of a hybrid?

Yes I am a 23 h/cap(it is true) I have been warned for using an f/bomb.

In regard to your questions, I've learned not to bother with distances here(people like you might doubt the truth of my posts)

And your second question is just plain dumb IMHO.

GreeBo

m r c wrote: »

And your second question is just plain dumb IMHO.

I reckon its a valid question tbh.
You are not off 23 because you are a little bit inaccurate with your 3 irons.

m r c

GreeBo wrote: »

I reckon its a valid question tbh.
You are not off 23 because you are a little bit inaccurate with your 3 irons.

You are right greebo I'm not off 23 because I'm inaccurate with my 3 irons. It's mostly 3 things putting, chipping and from time to time messing up on 30/50 meter pitches.
All of these I haven't spent the time on because I've been spending too much time working on my full swing.
Also I've said elsewhere that I want to get lower.
Ok

Why would somebody need accuracy of an iron over the forgiveness of a rescue?

Well which is it, is not the definition in golf terms of a forgiving club a club that is accurate. Other people have commented here agreeing with me on hybrids but I was told that they were better golfers and that didn't apply to me.

Is it acceptable I to use two f's and an s together in this forum?

m r c

m r c wrote: »

You are right greebo I'm not off 23 because I'm inaccurate with my 3 irons. It's mostly 3 things putting, chipping and from time to time messing up on 30/50 meter pitches.
All of these I haven't spent the time on because I've been spending too much time working on my full swing.
Also I've said elsewhere that I want to get lower.
Ok

Why would somebody need accuracy of an iron over the forgiveness of a rescue?

Well which is it, is not the definition in golf terms of a forgiving club a club that is accurate. Other people have commented here agreeing with me on hybrids but I was told that they were better golfers and that didn't apply to me.

Is it acceptable I to use two f's and an s together in this forum?

Actually upon a reread of the rules I'm not supposed to back seat moderate so I should not have asked that question.

PARlance

bustercherry wrote: »

Why do you think you need the accuracy of an iron over the forgiveness of a hybrid?

GreeBo wrote: »

I reckon its a valid question tbh.
You are not off 23 because you are a little bit inaccurate with your 3 irons.

A few things:
1: The common understanding is that a 3 Iron would be used for accuracy where a hybrid would give more forgiveness. We get that, it's the common consensus.

2: If mrc can't hit a hybrid (doesn't feel confident/comfortable etc) then it is no longer a forgiving club. If he tops everything with a hybrid then I don't think he cares what it says it should do on the tin.

3: I play with a 24 HC'er and his most used club is his 3 iron, he is very accurate and consistent with it. He can't/never uses anything lower....no hybrids, woods or driver and his short game and especially his putting are very poor. He earns his handicap in other areas outside of his long irons.

Making condescending assumptions about a guy that is on here due to the love of the game/eagerness to learn & improve is a bit rich considering you have never seen him play and therefore cannot possibly tell what is contributing to his level of HC.

Mr. Larson

I don't think associating a persons handicap with their ability to strike a ball is very helpful personally. Granted it's usually a reasonable indicator but when dealing with specific cases it's a lazy criteria.

GreeBo

ajcurry123 wrote: »

A few things:
1: The common understanding is that a 3 Iron would be used for accuracy where a hybrid would give more forgiveness. We get that, it's the common consensus.

I dont think anyone is disputing that?

ajcurry123 wrote: »

2: If mrc can't hit a hybrid (doesn't feel confident/comfortable etc) then it is no longer a forgiving club. If he tops everything with a hybrid then I don't think he cares what it says it should do on the tin.

Indeed.

ajcurry123 wrote: »

3: I play with a 24 HC'er and his most used club is his 3 iron, he is very accurate and consistent with it. He can't/never uses anything lower....no hybrids, woods or driver and his short game and especially his putting are very poor. He earns his handicap in other areas outside of his long irons.

Thats exactly the point. Off 23 you dont need to get better a hitting hybrids/driving irons.

ajcurry123 wrote: »

Making condescending assumptions about a guy that is on here due to the love of the game/eagerness to learn & improve is a bit rich

I dont think questioning the reasoning behind someone making a decision is condescending? OP said he bought a more lofted rescue to help getting out of heavy rough and it was pointed out that off 23 you dont really need to be trying to play this shot. Bustercherry pointed out that the driving iron might not suit the OP due to swing speeds, again I think this is a fair point.
Finally the OP mentions adding a 2 iron between 3W and 3i. I think its fair game to ask why a 23 handicap golfer would need to do this.

ajcurry123 wrote: »

considering you have never seen him play and therefore cannot possibly tell what is contributing to his level of HC.

The short game is what contributes to everyones handicap, I dont need to watch someone play for years to know that, especially a higher handicapped player. Thats why focusing their attention on a tiny aspect of their game that is likely adding bugger all to their score is not helpful; hence the advice.

spacecoyote

I'd still argue the case that before the OP goes out and invests his cash in a new club that he consider going for one lesson. It'll only cost about €30 (considerably cheaper than a new club) and it should point out if there is a swing flaw that might be preventing that consistent contact that you are looking for.

By the sound of things, if you tend to hit a slice with it, you're probably swinging on an Out-to-In plane.

A bit of Pro guidance and you may well find, as I have myself, that the hybrid becomes one of the most useful clubs in your bag

bustercherry

m r c wrote: »

Yes I am a 23 h/cap(it is true) I have been warned for using an f/bomb.

You told someone to go %^&* themselves and not for swearing. This is not back seat moderating either, just pointing out the difference.

m r c wrote: »

In regard to your questions, I've learned not to bother with distances here(people like you might doubt the truth of my posts)

Actually it's very relative. As pointed out the 712u is a club designed for players with a high swing speed. If you trying to plug a gap below 200 yards, with a 2 iron, then I (and I suspect lots of people) would doubt you have the swing speed to utilise it.

m r c wrote: »

And your second question is just plain dumb IMHO.

I think Greebo and yourself have covered that.

bustercherry

Mr. Larson wrote: »

I don't think associating a persons handicap with their ability to strike a ball is very helpful personally. Granted it's usually a reasonable indicator but when dealing with specific cases it's a lazy criteria.

First of all OP this is not meant to be an attack on you or your ability.

Actually I disagree that it's lazy but I'm basing my points of the OP separate post about starting, highest and Lowest Handicap. His starting handicap was 24; now based on the ongoing discussions about starting handicap allocations (points which I don't agree with, everyone is usually allocated 18 at most etc....) and the fact in 7 months he has only taken .8 of his handicap; I see no indication of an improvement that would indicate good consistent ball striking. Certainly the lack of progress (I dunno realistically how much the OP practices) and the fact his current handicap is above average would indicate the opposite. Further based on experience, good consistent ball strikers can play bogey golf as they have less destructive shots.

Again this is not a dig at the OP but what I based my comments off.

bustercherry

spacecoyote wrote: »

I'd still argue the case that before the OP goes out and invests his cash in a new club that he consider going for one lesson. It'll only cost about €30 (considerably cheaper than a new club) and it should point out if there is a swing flaw that might be preventing that consistent contact that you are looking for.

By the sound of things, if you tend to hit a slice with it, you're probably swinging on an Out-to-In plane.

A bit of Pro guidance and you may well find, as I have myself, that the hybrid becomes one of the most useful clubs in your bag

I would agree entirely with this. Understand why your bad shots are so destructive first before you start investing in new clubs (arguably much hard to hit consistently).

m r c

Ok not to prove anything to anyone


Driver ss averaged over 3 fittings 108 mph
If I busted driver 265 metres carry no wind
Realistic average 235 m
3 wood average. 215 m
3 iron realistically cant carry 200 metres probably 194 m

All above with Nike 20xi x ball and the 3 iron is mp 53

The driver and wood shaft is aldila nv low flight low to suit the home course. My distance is not optimised based on my ss but the compromise was worth it to achieve required ball flight. The extra 30 m on the driver comes IMHO from hitting up more effectively on certain holes but I don't play for 265 m quite honestly because I try to find fairways. Tbh I'm sorry for posting on this site I may have been mistaken in that i had expected friendly banter about golf almost everyone I have played with have been down to earth people.

Bustercherry saying that you are not condescending and then posting in the tone you have been is bs.

Greebo I thought as a mod you might not have been seen to support someone going ffs in a post kinda surprised with that tbh

MP62

m r c wrote: »

Ok not to prove anything to anyone


Driver ss averaged over 3 fittings 108 mph
If I busted driver 265 metres carry no wind
Realistic average 235 m
3 wood average. 215 m
3 iron realistically cant carry 200 metres probably 194 m

All above with Nike 20xi x ball and the 3 iron is mp 53

The driver and wood shaft is aldila nv low flight low to suit the home course. My distance is not optimised based on my ss but the compromise was worth it to achieve required ball flight. The extra 30 m on the driver comes IMHO from hitting up more effectively on certain holes but I don't play for 265 m quite honestly because I try to find fairways. Tbh I'm sorry for posting on this site I may have been mistaken in that i had expected friendly banter about golf almost everyone I have played with have been down to earth people.

Bustercherry saying that you are not condescending and then posting in the tone you have been is bs.

Greebo I thought as a mod you might not have been seen to support someone going ffs in a post kinda surprised with that tbh

And you play off 20+ handicap with those stats, you must be like a paraplegic around the greens.

m r c

MP62 wrote: »

And you play off 20+ handicap with those stats, you must be like a paraplegic around the greens.

Ok thank you for that insightful post. No really thank you.

MP62

m r c wrote: »

Ok thank you for that insightful post. No really thank you.

When you wake up from your dream, you may find its not really important what randomers on the Internet think and then you may stop spinning yarns and tying to impress total strangers and maybe then you'll stop frothing at the mouth and getting hot under the collar, until then carry on regardless.

m r c

MP62 wrote: »

When you wake up from your dream, you may find its not really important what randomers on the Internet think and then you may stop spinning yarns and tying to impress total strangers and maybe then you'll stop frothing at the mouth and getting hot under the collar, until then carry on regardless.

Mp62, I let myself down here yesterday when I dropped an f bomb, I seen that and did what I could to retract.


I have said here in this thread that I'm relatively new to the game and not from a golfing family, hence don't know too many people well established to bounce ideas off. I was coming under a bit of pressure gap wise etc and I put my gaps up truthfully.
I'm. 30 married and have 2 young children and haven't been accused of lying as long as I can remember.

I don't get why you find the need to attack like that, it's not in defence of anything I said about you or your character.