Christening - Religious or not?

Janine87

Hi everyone,

I want to get my son christened in the next few weeks. How does it work with all the religious stuff? Do the parents have to be religious??? And what about the godparents, do they have to be religious/catholic?
Is there anything they need to give to the priest of evidence?

Why would you want to get your child christened if you're not religious?

Tim Robbins

Janine87 wrote: »

Hi everyone,

I want to get my son christened in the next few weeks. How does it work with all the religious stuff? Do the parents have to be religious??? And what about the godparents, do they have to be religious/catholic?
Is there anything they need to give to the priest of evidence?

You swear oaths that you will bring your child up as a Catholic. No you don't have to be religious. Most parents aren't. You just lie if you are not religious and pretend you are.

Janine87

Because that is just the way it is in Ireland right?
If you don't christen your child he can't have certain things. I want to give him the opportunity to choose himself.
I am not religious because I am not from Ireland. It's my fiance that wants to get him christened so if he wants that the church will have to deal that my friend is not religious Don't see an issue with it.

@Tim Robbins... is there a test run you have to do before the actual christening? And there is no cert or anything they require from the godparents?

homer911

As a Christian, I feel that anyone who is not a Christian, and whose God Parents are not Christians, is completely devaluing the meaning of Baptism/Christening. You are looking to do it for completely the wrong reasons. There is no non-religious reason to do this in modern Ireland

Maggie 2

Janine87 wrote: »

Because that is just the way it is in Ireland right?
If you don't christen your child he can't have certain things. I want to give him the opportunity to choose himself.
I am not religious because I am not from Ireland. It's my fiance that wants to get him christened so if he wants that the church will have to deal that my friend is not religious Don't see an issue with it.

@Tim Robbins... is there a test run you have to do before the actual christening? And there is no cert or anything they require from the godparents?

Some godparents are requested to provide proof that they are practicing catholics, which is only right, if they are to be the spiritual teachers of the child. You don't have to have a child christened. It's not necessary for many things, other than if you want it to attend a Catholic school, and then they can't exclude you if there is no other school close by.

Janine87

I don't want to get it done but boyfriend does. college here is catholic so no choice

Maggie 2

Janine87 wrote: »

I don't want to get it done but boyfriend does. college here is catholic so no choice

You DO have a choice. When you say College, do you mean third level? Not many Primary Schools will bar you just because you are not Catholic. If you don't intend to practice the religion, then whats the point? It's more honest to decline.

MrStuffins

homer911 wrote: »

As a Christian, I feel that anyone who is not a Christian, and whose God Parents are not Christians, is completely devaluing the meaning of Baptism/Christening. You are looking to do it for completely the wrong reasons. There is no non-religious reason to do this in modern Ireland

Ballderdash!!!!

Bloodwing

OP, the only real issue with getting your child christened is that it's another number on the catholic churches books. When your child is old enough to decide for them self they won't be able to remove their name from the books.

The issue with not getting your child christened is that it limits choices in terms of schools. It's a difficult decision to make but if people don't start voting with their feet then things won't change.

Personally I'd steer clear of the church and put some effort into finding another school where admission isn't based on beliefs.

PDN

MrStuffins wrote: »

Ballderdash!!!!

Ok, let's rephrase it. There's no non-religious reason for an honest person to do this in modern Ireland.

Dan133269

PDN wrote: »

Ok, let's rephrase it. There's no non-religious reason for an honest person to do this in modern Ireland.

What about a well-meaning person who wants their child to be able to become a judge or the President?

What about a well-meaning person who wants to their child to become a doctor/nurse and have the option to work in any of the countries hospitals, including those with a denominational board of management?

What about a well-meaning person who wants their child to go to the local State-funded primary or secondary school?

Obliq

Maggie 2 wrote: »

You DO have a choice. When you say College, do you mean third level? Not many Primary Schools will bar you just because you are not Catholic. If you don't intend to practice the religion, then whats the point? It's more honest to decline.

Yes, she has a choice to be truthful and disadvantage her child, or lie and get her child into most schools.

By saying "not many schools will bar you", you are conveniently whitewashing the fact that some will.

I say do what's best for your child. If this state insists on continuing the practice of non-secular schooling, that's not your fault. You may have to play the system like so many others do, dishonest or not. That's what happens when the state stands over the disadvantaging of a section of society.

Obliq

Dan133269 wrote: »

What about a well-meaning person who wants their child to be able to become a judge or the President?

What about a well-meaning person who wants to their child to become a doctor/nurse and have the option to work in any of the countries hospitals, including those with a denominational board of management?

What about a well-meaning person who wants their child to go to the local State-funded primary or secondary school?

Correct.

Or to become a primary school teacher? Honesty doesn't pay off in this country. I know it should, I know we should all take a stand, but it disadvantages your children.

philologos

Janine87 wrote: »

Hi everyone,

I want to get my son christened in the next few weeks. How does it work with all the religious stuff? Do the parents have to be religious??? And what about the godparents, do they have to be religious/catholic?
Is there anything they need to give to the priest of evidence?

Why do you want your child baptised?

It is regarded as an initiation into the Christian faith. Do you believe that Jesus Christ is Lord and that He came into the world to rescue you from the penalty of sin on the cross and that He rose 3 days later?

If so you'd want your child to grow up in the knowledge of Jesus.

If not I'd encourage you to look in to Jesus, and investigate what He said and did for yourself before you consider baptising your kids.

mark renton

homer911 wrote: »

There is no non-religious reason to do this in modern Ireland

There are non religious reasons:
1) ye get a new name, two names will come in handy when the kid grows and gets into trouble.

2) ye get godparents, and that means cash money on birthdays.

Obliq

PDN wrote: »

Ok, let's rephrase it. There's no non-religious reason for an honest person to do this in modern Ireland.

Que? Do you have children? Have you ever had to commit any class of cognitive dissonance on their behalf? Could you live with being dishonest about something like this if it meant giving your child a better start? I could.

Janine87

Janine87 wrote: »

Because that is just the way it is in Ireland right?
If you don't christen your child he can't have certain things. I want to give him the opportunity to choose himself.

You want to "give him the opportunity to choose" by signing him up to one particular religion which he can't officially leave, ever? How exactly is that a choice?

philologos

For the record I'd be inclined to say that priests / pastors should be inclined to keep weddings, funerals and baptisms for those who believe and trust in Jesus and challenge those who want these things to investigate the Gospel first. It would send a clear sign that Christians take their faith seriously.

Obliq

bluewolf wrote: »

You want to "give him the opportunity to choose" by signing him up to one particular religion which he can't officially leave, ever? How exactly is that a choice?

That is the only reason not to really. However, it is possible to leave a church.....but it might not be possible to attend the school within walking distance if you're not a member of said church :pac:

mark renton

PDN wrote: »

Ok, let's rephrase it. There's no non-religious reason for an honest person to do this in modern Ireland.

When you say "honest", do you mean "not stealing" or "telling the "truth"?

Obliq

philologos wrote: »

For the record I'd be inclined to say that priests / pastors should he inclined to keep weddings, funerals and baptisms for those who believe and trust in Jesus and challenge those who want these things to investigate the Gospel first. It would send a clear sign that Christians take their faith seriously.

Yes, well...how about doing that when Christians make it fair for children of any or no faith to attend public schools?

Obliq

Will I repeat my reply to that?

Obliq

Obliq wrote: »

That is the only reason not to really. However, it is possible to leave a church.....but it might not be possible to attend the school within walking distance if you're not a member of said church :pac:

If people want to use that reason they should say so instead of all this BS about how signing them up to ONE organisation is "giving them a choice". If you want to "give them a choice", sign them up to none or all of them.

philologos

Obliq wrote: »

Yes, well...how about doing that when Christians make it fair for children of any or no faith to attend public schools?

Perhaps you should find out what my position on that is first rather than assuming?

Obliq

philologos wrote: »

Perhaps you should find out what my position on that is first rather than assuming?

I see no action from the religious in Ireland to make schools secular. Correct me if I'm wrong, please.

Obliq

bluewolf wrote: »

If people want to use that reason they should say so instead of all this BS about how signing them up to ONE organisation is "giving them a choice". If you want to "give them a choice", sign them up to none or all of them.

Yes, quite. If it had of been a case of the local NATIONALschool to me only taking a particular religion (and the one that by not joining could also disadvantage my child in their future career choice), I'd consider being dishonest, naturally.

homer911

Obliq wrote: »

Yes, well...how about doing that when Christians make it fair for children of any or no faith to attend public schools?

It doesn't seem to be a problem for the increasing number of Muslim children entering the school system...

philologos

Obliq wrote: »

I see no action from the religious in Ireland to make schools secular. Correct me if I'm wrong, please.

Who do you mean by "the religious"?

Please ask me first about my position rather than assuming.

I support getting rid of entrance requirements, and reallocating secular schools in addition to faith schools.

Benny_Cake

Obliq wrote: »

I see no action from the religious in Ireland to make schools secular. Correct me if I'm wrong, please.

There are plenty of religious parents sending their kids to Educate Together schools and to schools run by VECs. In the next few years ago a good number of schools will be transferred from Catholic patronage to other forms of patronage. Plenty of "the religious" support this, doubtless others oppose it but you'd do well to lay off the crude generalisations.

Obliq

homer911 wrote: »

It doesn't seem to be a problem for the increasing number of Muslim children entering the school system...

Well, I don't know? Perhaps it may be because the minority of Muslims has yet to spread far beyond specific areas? I think there are muslim schools, again...I don't know. But I do know this. Maybe when muslim children find as adults that they are unable to enter areas of work such as primary school teaching (unless the law changes), this will be seen as a problem.

A sizeable number of people throughout Ireland sign up to (mostly Catholicism) only because to do otherwise would mean effort and trouble (in sourcing schools, upsetting grandparents, possibly hindering their children in job opportunities) that they don't wish to stand up to.

You tell me why not?!

Obliq

Benny_Cake wrote: »

There are plenty of religious parents sending their kids to Educate Together schools and to schools run by VECs. In the next few years ago a good number of schools will be transferred from Catholic patronage to other forms of patronage. Plenty of "the religious" support this, doubtless others oppose it but you'd do well to lay off the crude generalisations.

Ok, it's fair to tell me to lay off the generalisations, but if the current "effort" to transfer schools from Catholic patronage is anything to go by, it's also fair for me to say it's not a very good effort.

VEC's are not secular, btw. They all have patronage from a church. There are no secular schools bar the Educate Together schools, and the nearest one to me is an hour and a half's drive away.

Hate to call out a mod, but isn't it a bit disingenuous to say that "a good few schools will be transfered" when you know that's not true? A good few in terms of Dublin, or countrywide?

Obliq

philologos wrote: »

Who do you mean by "the religious"?

Please ask me first about my position rather than assuming.

I support getting rid of entrance requirements, and reallocating secular schools in addition to faith schools.

Thank you. Yes, I should have asked for clarification of your views. I guess when you had made a statement like that without also providing them, I felt within my rights to say where that would leave a large number of people in Ireland who would be stuck with no school to go to. Fair enough?

Oh sorry, forgot to answer your question. By "the religious", I mean religious people of all denominations.

philologos

Obliq wrote: »

Thank you. Yes, I should have asked for clarification of your views. I guess when you had made a statement like that without also providing them, I felt within my rights to say where that would leave a large number of people in Ireland who would be stuck with no school to go to. Fair enough?

Oh sorry, forgot to answer your question. By "the religious", I mean religious people of all denominations.

It's not in your right to presume my position. It's rather rude.

I wouldn't primarily classify myself as "religious". I believe in Jesus, yes.

It's up to the State to take action on schooling. It's not up to me to decide that for you, especially considering I live outside of Ireland.

The baptism requirement discriminates also against Christians who believe in adult baptism.

Obliq

philologos wrote: »

It's not in your right to presume my position. It's rather rude.

I wouldn't primarily classify myself as "religious". I believe in Jesus, yes.

It's up to the State to take action on schooling. It's not up to me to decide that for you, especially considering I live outside of Ireland.

The baptism requirement discriminates also against Christians who believe in adult baptism.

I didn't actually mean to presume your position (that would be rude), so saying in my initial reply to you that "you should" was wrong and I'm actually sorry
However, if you can understand my position, what I should have said is that the faiths that currently patronise our national schools should first let them be secularised before making sure that everyone who signs their children up to those faiths are doing it for the right reasons. Now, is that fair? In your opinion, if it's not too late to ask?

philologos

Obliq wrote: »

I didn't actually mean to presume your position (that would be rude), so saying in my initial reply to you that "you should" was wrong and I'm actually sorry
However, if you can understand my position, what I should have said is that the faiths that currently patronise our national schools should first let them be secularised before making sure that everyone who signs their children up to those faiths are doing it for the right reasons. Now, is that fair? In your opinion, if it's not too late to ask?

What "faiths"?

Personally, I think the restrictions should be removed as I've told you. I also think churches should take Christianity seriously and show that baptism, marriage, and funerals within churches are ultimately to honour / commemorate / encourage those who seek to live and speak for Him in this world and those who have believed and trusted in Jesus Christ.

I've already told you this.

I think Christian schools should still exist, amongst other faith schools and secular schools. For example in Britain the percentage is 33% faith schools and 66% secular.

Obliq

philologos wrote: »

What "faiths"?

Personally, I think the restrictions should be removed as I've told you. I also think churches should take Christianity seriously and show that baptism, marriage, and funerals within churches are ultimately to honour / commemorate / encourage those who seek to live and speak for Him in this world and those who have believed and trusted in Jesus Christ.

I've already told you this.

I think Christian schools should still exist, amongst other faith schools and secular schools. For example in Britain the percentage is 33% faith schools and 66% secular.

Well, you've told me just now:-) And I just replied to you. I completely agree with you about taking Christianity seriously -and although you haven't agreed that national schools here should be secular, what you have said is a start:-)

This faith - 92% of primary schools in Ireland are under the patronage of the Catholic Church. 1.2% are either multi or inter denominational schooling under the patronage of Educate Together. The rest are under other minority religions and I can't find statistics on them.

Yes, I agree Christian schools should still exist, but particularly not in rural Ireland where schools are fewer and further between, in my opinion.

philologos

Obliq wrote: »

Well, you've told me just now:-) And I just replied to you. I completely agree with you about taking Christianity seriously -and although you haven't agreed that national schools here should be secular, what you have said is a start:-)

Are you reading my posts? - I support more secular schools. I just think there should be faith schools also, and that parents should have a choice.

Obliq wrote: »

This faith - 92% of primary schools in Ireland are under the patronage of the Catholic Church. 1.2% are either multi or inter denominational schooling under the patronage of Educate Together. The rest are under other minority religions and I can't find statistics on them.

This is up to the Irish Government and the Irish state to decide, and for people to lobby on.

Obliq wrote: »

Yes, I agree Christian schools should still exist, but particularly not in rural Ireland where schools are fewer and further between, in my opinion.

I think they should be dispersed on the basis of demand irrespective of location.

Benny_Cake

Obliq wrote: »

Ok, it's fair to tell me to lay off the generalisations, but if the current "effort" to transfer schools from Catholic patronage is anything to go by, it's also fair for me to say it's not a very good effort.

VEC's are not secular, btw. They all have patronage from a church. There are no secular schools bar the Educate Together schools, and the nearest one to me is an hour and a half's drive away.

Hate to call out a mod, but isn't it a bit disingenuous to say that "a good few schools will be transfered" when you know that's not true? A good few in terms of Dublin, or countrywide?

I didn't make that post in a moderating capacity, so feel free to call me out!

When I was referring to VEC schools, I meant the new community national schools which have begun popping up and are VEC run. I'm pretty sure there is no religious involvement there, there is one which is just down the road from me and out of a class of 22, only one made their first communion this year.

I fully accept that there aren't enough Educate Together schools, particularly in rural areas. With regard to the transfer of patronage, parents are currently being surveyed in a number of areas around the country (list here). There is a considerable amount of work involved in unpicking parts of an education system that has been largely unchanged for decades while also trying to satisfy the widest range of parents possible, but it is beginning to happen.

Obliq

philologos wrote: »

Are you reading my posts? - I support more secular schools. I just think there should be faith schools also, and that parents should have a choice.

Of course I'm reading them, but to be exact, you just said that you thought the restrictions should be removed, not that you support the secularisation. There's a big difference, and thanks for clearing that up.

This is up to the Irish Government and the Irish state to decide, and for people to lobby on.

I am lobbying, here too.

I think they should be dispersed on the basis of demand irrespective of location.

Ah ha. Now here's where we differ in a major way. You see, in rural Ireland, obviously the predominant faith is Catholic. However, the local school here (for eg) in the community that I live in is a community school, as is the one in the neighbouring community. Now, I'd say between the every family in these schools (and I know nearly all of them), about a third don't practice any religion at all and would be delighted with a secular school.

Unfortunately, that would divide the community aspect of the school and send all kids of one faith one way, and no faith another (to simplify it). This would pretty much destroy the togetherness these kids have in growing up in and identifying with their village - thereby depleting the rural culture still more.

I don't understand what the problem with making all national schools secular? The children would still be taught about all religions, there would be no bias towards one faith or another and it would support the notion you have put forward of keeping Christian weddings, funerals and baptisms for those who believe and trust in Jesus. It would just be at home, not during school.

philologos

Obliq wrote: »

Of course I'm reading them, but to be exact, you just said that you thought the restrictions should be removed, not that you support the secularisation. There's a big difference, and thanks for clearing that up.

There should be more secular schools and the restrictions dropped on existing faith schools. That's what I've said. I don't support all schools being secular, but I do support parents having a choice.

If someone was lobbying to be MP in my local area and was suggesting to get rid of faith schools entirely they would lose my vote. The same would be true if someone of one particular faith wanted to dominate the education system.

I don't see why you're trying to argue that I'm against secular schools.

Obliq wrote: »

I am lobbying, here too.

Good for you.

Obliq wrote: »

Ah ha. Now here's where we differ in a major way. You see, in rural Ireland, obviously the predominant faith is Catholic. However, the local school here (for eg) in the community that I live in is a community school, as is the one in the neighbouring community. Now, I'd say between the every family in these schools (and I know nearly all of them), about a third don't practice any religion at all and would be delighted with a secular school.

Unfortunately, that would divide the community aspect of the school and send all kids of one faith one way, and no faith another (to simplify it). This would pretty much destroy the togetherness these kids have in growing up in and identifying with their village - thereby depleting the rural culture still more.

Not necessarily. Some Christians send their kids to secular schools and vice versa. I think there should be a reasonable choice, but I don't believe that faith schools should be banned from the countryside.

Obliq wrote: »

I don't understand what the problem with making all national schools secular? The children would still be taught about all religions, there would be no bias towards one faith or another and it would support the notion you have put forward of keeping Christian weddings, funerals and baptisms for those who believe and trust in Jesus. It would just be at home, not during school.

I support parental choice, and I will continue to do so. You should have the right to a choice, but not the right to dictate the choice of others.

Obliq

philologos wrote: »

I don't see why you're trying to argue that I'm against secular schools.

I'm not?! I clearly said that until you clearly said you supported the secularisation (as opposed to merely lifting the restrictions), I wasn't clear. Hope this clears it up

Not necessarily. Some Christians send their kids to secular schools and vice versa. I think there should be a reasonable choice, but I don't believe that faith schools should be banned from the countryside.

I support parental choice, and I will continue to do so. You should have the right to a choice, but not the right to dictate the choice of others.

Well, that's the trouble isn't it? I can't have the right to a choice in rural Ireland by that way of thinking. It is not me who is dictating choice here, it is the Catholic church and the State. That's a fact. Saying that I should have a choice is not at all the same thing as giving me the choice.

Breaking up the children of a small community is a far greater crime in my book than turning a school secular. Secular is not the same as atheist, as you know. Religion would be taught, but it would be more general, that's all. I think the main objection would be in communion and confirmation having to be taught as extra curricular. It's really a case of everyone being required to put their money where there mouths are, as you have forwarded yourself as a preferred option in terms of being true to faith.

Lantus

Janine87 wrote: »

Hi everyone,

I want to get my son christened in the next few weeks. How does it work with all the religious stuff? Do the parents have to be religious??? And what about the godparents, do they have to be religious/catholic?
Is there anything they need to give to the priest of evidence?

You just book it in and turn up. Its pretty easy. There may be 5 other babies getting christened on the same day as yours. There are no hard questions asked. Its typically quite a quick ceremony and you get a cert either there and then or sent out. You need to give the priest a few quid (between 50 and 100.)

homer911 wrote: »

As a Christian, I feel that anyone who is not a Christian, and whose God Parents are not Christians, is completely devaluing the meaning of Baptism/Christening. You are looking to do it for completely the wrong reasons. There is no non-religious reason to do this in modern Ireland

Most people in Ireland consider themselves as Catholic even though almos none attend church in any way at all or read the bible. Its tradition more than religous. I'd estimate that in well over 90% of all christenings in Ireland the parents would meet the above criteria.

philologos

Obliq wrote: »

Well, that's the trouble isn't it? I can't have the right to a choice in rural Ireland by that way of thinking. It is not me who is dictating choice here, it is the Catholic church and the State. That's a fact. Saying that I should have a choice is not at all the same thing as giving me the choice.

Why can't you? I have relatives who live in the countryside near the Border on both sides of my family, there's a number of schools within the locality. If there was a variety (secular, RCC, CofI or whatever else) between these then you would have a choice.

Obliq wrote: »

Breaking up the children of a small community is a far greater crime in my book than turning a school secular. Secular is not the same as atheist, as you know. Religion would be taught, but it would be more general, that's all. I think the main objection would be in communion and confirmation having to be taught as extra curricular. It's really a case of everyone being required to put their money where there mouths are, as you have forwarded yourself as a preferred option in terms of being true to faith.

If there's a variety of schools then there's nothing wrong with parents having a choice.

By the by, there was no preparation for religious rituals in my schools growing up. However, if parents decide to bring their kids to a school and there is a general command for having first communion I'm not entirely opposed to it provided there is a fair choice in education.

Obliq

Janine87 wrote: »

Hi everyone,

I want to get my son christened in the next few weeks. How does it work with all the religious stuff? Do the parents have to be religious??? And what about the godparents, do they have to be religious/catholic?
Is there anything they need to give to the priest of evidence?

Arguing away here without you Janine! Apologies for going off on one and not helping with your original question - but many thanks for the interesting thread It's a very topical question though, and hope you'll be interested in the answers!

Obliq

philologos wrote: »

Why can't you? I have relatives who live in the countryside near the Border on both sides of my family, there's a number of schools within the locality. If there was a variety (secular, RCC, CofI or whatever else) between these then you would have a choice...............

If there's a variety of schools then there's nothing wrong with parents having a choice.

I don't have any choice here outside my community. That's my point.

By the by, there was no preparation for religious rituals in my schools growing up. However, if parents decide to bring their kids to a school and there is a general command for having first communion I'm not entirely opposed to it provided there is a fair choice in education.

And that's a whole other subject right there - I've approached this before on other threads about how the curriculum suffers in school years dealing with communion and confirmation. Stands to reason you wouldn't know if you haven't experienced it either in the school you went to or your kids went to.

It's a pretty overwhelming experience to try and guide your child through a year when every one of their friends is at the church every day during school hours, your child sits on their own through the hours of religion classes, the homework ramps up, and the prospect of explaining why every other child is getting envelopes with money handed them at the school gate is not easy, as you can imagine I'm sure.

philologos

Obliq wrote: »

I don't have any choice here outside my community. That's my point.

Then the government should give you a choice, but also to give all a choice. Not just you.

Obliq wrote: »

And that's a whole other subject right there - I've approached this before on other threads about how the curriculum suffers in school years dealing with communion and confirmation. Stands to reason you wouldn't know if you haven't experienced it either in the school you went to or your kids went to.

I went to a CofI primary school and secondary. There were Roman Catholics in our class, but the school arranged confirmation classes for them on the grounds after school.

I believe there should be a choice for parents and that should be up to them to decide.

Obliq wrote: »

It's a pretty overwhelming experience to try and guide your child through a year when every one of their friends is at the church every day during school hours, your child sits on their own through the hours of religion classes, the homework ramps up, and the prospect of explaining why every other child is getting envelopes with money handed them at the school gate is not easy, as you can imagine I'm sure.

Which is why you should have the choice of going to a secular school, a RCC one, or other faiths depending on demand.

Obliq

philologos wrote: »

Then the government should give you a choice, but also to give all a choice. Not just you.

I went to a CofI primary school and secondary. There were Roman Catholics in our class, but the school arranged confirmation classes for them on the grounds after school.

Not just me, no. I quite agree. As for your CofI school, they got it right (or more right) at least. After school is the place for it. Nothing will change on this issue until parents (and they probably will have to be forced) take the rituals out of the classrooms. As an atheist, I'd have far less problem with my kids being in a STATE school with CATHOLIC patronage if that happened there.

Nice talking to you - off to another screen now:-)

two wheels good

philologos wrote: »

Which is why you should have the choice of going to a secular school, a RCC one, or other faiths depending on demand.

But that's wholly impractical in small communities and not the best use of resources even in many larger communities. Why wouldn't these different sections of the same community share one (or more) schools and schedule the religious tuition to convenient time outside core/shared school hours.

philologos

two wheels good wrote: »

But that's wholly impractical in small communities and not the best use of resources even in many larger communities. Why wouldn't these different sections of the same community share one (or more) schools and schedule the religious tuition to convenient time outside core/shared school hours.

It's not really all that impractical. As I've mentioned already even in the case of my relatives who live rurally, they had albeit an extremely limited choice to send their kids to a non-RCC school. If there are multiple schools in an area they should be split by demand in the area.

TheChizler

How hard would it be to fake a baptism certificate, just for the purposes of getting into a primary school? I would never in no way advocate the faking of, or fake an official legal document, but I don't think it would be considered legal in any sense. Is there some contract signed between the parent and the school? They stated the authenticity of the cert? Do they even check the authenticity of a cert, or even ask to see the cert? Is there even a cert or do you just tick a box on a form when applying?