Book WWE out a hole with undefeated Ryback vs Champion CM Punk at Hell in the Cell

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My main man Dave Meltzer breaks it down

This is where the WWE concept of a gimmick match on a certain day even if the programs aren't ready for it has backfired. In some cases, like an annual Elimination Chamber because in February there will always be a Mania main event shot not decided by the Rumble, that makes sense. A July Money in the Bank makes sense. But the annual planned out months in advance when booking is changed weekly for a Hell in a Cell has, and figures completely back this up, just destroyed the entire PPV value of a match that used to add tons of buys and now means very little.

If this was any kind of a match but Hell in a Cell, there would be no booking issues. You could do a cheap finish, and it would suck in a sense. But after the cheap finish Ryback can still lay Punk out with the Samoan drop through a table or something for a closing pop. Even in a cage match, you can have him blast Punk and Punk falls out the door or even a stunt spot where he knocks the entire side of the cage down and Punk hits the floor first. But Hell in a Cell is supposed to have no DQ, and can only end via pin or submission. For long-term booking, Punk has to be champion in January since he's at this point scheduled against Rock and that's expected to be a huge show. But this is not the time to beat Ryback.

You can have Ryback win the title and then Punk win it back with a fluky ending at Survivor Series or with a screwy table break finish in a tables match at TLC, but I wonder if losing the title will take an edge off Ryback at this point. You can also do a multiple person match at Survivor Series where Punk pins someone else, Ryback doesn't get pinned or submit, and you get the title where you need it. But you still have him as the guy who failed to defend.

It's just a weird sense of the Cena injury, the Orton movie, no other babyfaces over, a face with an undefeated streak, actual long-term money plans where Punk needs to be champion and it being Hell in a Cell month that puts them in a position where they have to be really creative on the finish, or on the booking of that show and the next finish.

Plus, we have history that tells us about how the guy Ryback is a complete copy of, Bill Goldberg, and how his drawing power was never the same after his loss, as gimmicked up as it was.

Answers on a postcard.

GTR63

Hmm well you need Cena or Punk to be champ by Royal Rumble to take on Rocky. So maybe have Ryback beat Punk at HIAC, then Punk or Cena win it back in a 3 way at Survivor series or in a gimmick match at TLC without pinning Ryback.
I don`t agree at all about Ryback getting this HUGE push but thats my 2 cents

Penn

Have him beat Punk up so bad that Punk is ruled unable to continue with the match. Title doesn't change hands. Ryback still looks strong. Punk takes a week or two off but isn't off long enough to vacate the title

Lord TSC

No matter what happens now, you've got to do a screwy finish, short of having either man win clean, and that seems unlikely. Even Cena's line on Raw (paraphrasing; "Ryback doesn't want the title, he wants to beat you up") implies were going to just get some dodgy ending. That's going to suck but I think we've got to accept it's going to happen.

You could bring Brock in and involve him somehow, having him help Punk at Heyman's request. Have him do a run in, rip the door off the cell and then him and Ryback go at it. This could lead to Cena and HHH coming out, and eventually a mass brawl ensues. Have others run out as well, trying to seperate everyone, and then Punk uses the confusion to grab the title and sneak out of the cage and up the ramp, leaving the match and simply providing no actual ending to it.

This would actually provide a set up to Survivor Series; Team Heyman Guys (Punk & Brock) vs Team Faces (Cena, HHH, Ryback), with both teams fleshed out a bit.

A Primal Nut

Yeah Brock interfering at Heyman's behest, setting up a rivalry with Ryback makes sense.

I doubt they planned Ryback to have a big long undefeated streak like Goldberg, if that was the case he wouldn't be in the main event scene yet. He looks likes Goldberg and like anyone who starts new in WWE and is being pushed, he's won all his matches so far. But I doubt it is intentional on WWE's part. Losing to Punk ends the Goldberg comparisons and might be good for his career. Winning the title and losing it again at the next PPV would still make him a star.

Wins and losses aren't that big a deal in fan's eyes. The fans like the character, his fighting style, etc. They aren't going to turn on a guy because he lost a match.

Stereomaniac

I don't think it matters all that much if Ryback loses next weekend. I think it will take a lot of the pressure off of his character. The undefeated streak should be ended and at least if it's being ended by CM Punk it keeps some sort of weight and also it's another little bit of notoriety for Punk. The big challenge for the company, in my opinion, is keeping him relevant after the pay per view, instead of just throwing him away once used.

chopperbyrne

It's Umaga/Kozlov all over again.

Build him up only to have him lose to a top star and instantly lose all credibility and momentum.

What they need to do is have Punk win by destroying him with a chair or with help from others, but then end the show with Ryback standing up and either dropping Punk or one of his allies to continue the feud or set up a new one.

A Primal Nut

Ryback's streak needs to end sometime and this is as good an opportunity as any.

Thinking about it again, I doubt we will see Lesnar in an unadvertised appearance, such is the cash they are paying for such a small number of appearances.

Ok, there was his return, but apart from that.

Lord TSC

I disagree wins and loses mean nothing in fans eyes; 90% of Ryback's appeal right now is he's unbeaten and has never looked like losing. Would this match have half the appeal if Ryback had a loss on his record? Without his win streak, Ryback has very little; he his poor wrestling skills, mic skills and charisma. About the only thing he has going for him is that he absolutely destroyed everyone he's fought so far.

chopperbyrne wrote: »

What they need to do is have Punk win by destroying him with a chair or with help from others, but then end the show with Ryback standing up and either dropping Punk or one of his allies to continue the feud or set up a new one.

This is just about the only way a loss works I think; he needs to just take everything Punk has and shrug most of it off. To get ahead of the criticisms, yes, I know this is what Cena does and we give out about it but there's a difference; Cena does it because he's booked badly and forgets how to sell things, while Ryback needs to be booked that way to protect him.

If Ryback absorbs a few G2Ss, a Rock Bottom, breaks out of every submission move Punk has, and then only loses through some freak occurance or a screwjob ending, it protects him somewhat. His aura will still be diminished, but to cement him as a credible threat to Punk, Ryback needs to eat a tonne of moves and shrug them off like a tank....

EDIT: As far as "The streak needs to end some time", tell that to Undertaker :P
Joking aside, I think it's a shame he's in the title picture now. A run with the IC title, a dominating Royal Rumble performance and a win there would have seen him heading into Mania with a crazy, CRAZY amount of fan support and momentum. Streaks need to end sometime, but if this one ends at the PPV, or even if he wins the title, I will feel like this has been a rushed waste of potential....

chopperbyrne

Teamshadowclan wrote: »

Joking aside, I think it's a shame he's in the title picture now. A run with the IC title, a dominating Royal Rumble performance and a win there would have seen him heading into Mania with a crazy, CRAZY amount of fan support and momentum. Streaks need to end sometime, but if this one ends at the PPV, or even if he wins the title, I will feel like this has been a rushed waste of potential....

Yep, he should have had an Ultimate Warrior type streak instead.

mayordenis

My guess is some sort of escape type angle, where Punk just gets the **** out after a while.

Diabhal Beag

A Primal Nut wrote: »

Ryback's streak needs to end sometime and this is as good an opportunity as any.

It's a terrible time to do it. He is only just getting over properly and this would be taking the legs from underneath him. There's every chance WWE will make an even bigger mess of the corner they've backed themselves into though.

Stereomaniac

The big selling poingt with Ryback isn't his winning streak, hell, he didn't even win some of them decisively, they were D.Q wins. It's that he physically dominates his opponents.

Ridley

...have Punk come off the cell and Ryback arrested.

Obviously Punk can't do a Foley but pull him off the side ala HBK and through the table, see Ryback destroy him and an army of jobber cops show up. When Punk goes out on a stretcher have him do some weak smirk to the camera that it was all part of the plan.

starviewadams

Have it turn out that Punk and Heyman paid off Ultimate Warrior to hide under the ring and have him emerge and take out Ryback just as he's about to beat Punk.

Completely unexpected and sets up Ryback vs Warrior at Survivor Series,which quite frankly,equals money.

Stereomaniac

Maybe we'll see Jake Roberts come out to help CM Punk against the Warrior. Equals more.

Lord TSC

Ridley wrote: »

...have Punk come off the cell and Ryback arrested.

Thinking about it, the idea of having Ryback arrested is brilliant. It would be right up Heyman's alley to cry assault....

Mr.Nice Guy

I think it would be a terrible time to end the streak. I think it is his main selling point at this moment. I remember how Joe declined rapidly after his first loss in TNA.

In my view they have three options here:

1) A draw finish

Problem with this is that it was done with Cena/Punk at NOC. It could be argued this would build nicely into a triple threat between the three of them at the next PPV but two draw finishes in quick succession is really pushing things. You'd keep Ryback undefeated but Punk would come across as a flukey champion and more worryingly you'd devalue your PPVs.

2) Ryback wins and Punk wins it back in a triple threat

I think this idea has more merit. Ryback wins clean and either at the next show or the one afterwards you have Ryback defend the title in a triple threat involving Cena. Punk pins Cena and then Ryback is protected in the same way that TNA used to do for Joe. Only thing I dislike about this is that I feel Punk vs Rock is more special if Punk has held the title a long time.

3) Some whacky concept

Here's one you could do which is an idea akin to that which happened between Taker and Angle at Survivor Series 2000. Remember Eric Angle...?

Ryback and Punk beat the hell out of each other for a good 15 minutes. Heyman is going crazy outside the door. Near the conclusion Punk crawls under the ring. Ryback drags him back into the ring and hits the Shell Shock or whatever they call it. The ref counts the pin and Ryback celebrates. Heyman demands the door open and we see Punk crawl out from under the ring and run up the aisle and out of the building. Then Ryback looks down at the figure lying in the ring in the Punk gear and realises it's Punk's twin a.k.a. Seth Rollins (with a new haircut). Ryback gives chase and the show ends.

I have a horrible feeling that they will in fact job Ryback out through some sort of interference. Personally I think that's a bad idea. I am fascinated to see how they work it out.

glenjamin

Having Brock come out is the best option. It would mess up plans of HHH v Lesnar: part 2 but I don't think too many people would care too much about that. Lesnar putting over Ryback would be bigger than Punk doing so. Plus it keeps Punk v Rock on track. Win/win. **** HHH.

Ando's Saggy Bottom

They can easily do some kind of crappy finish where Punk somehow escapes the cage with Heyman's help and legs it with the belt. Call it a no contest or something and preserve the streak.

Stereomaniac

Has everyone suddenly become fans of Ryback overnight or something? This is so confusing.

Lord TSC

Stereomaniac wrote: »

Has everyone suddenly become fans of Ryback overnight or something? This is so confusing.

I've been a fan for weeks.

I don't know why to be honest. Usually I don't get so fond of big monsters like this. But there's something about him that I quite like and that makes me smile when he comes out. The crowd have started getting behind him. I think it's a case of the right character at the right time.

Regardless, fan or not, the crowd are obviously into him and that means he should be protected for as long as possible....

starviewadams

Stereomaniac wrote: »

Has everyone suddenly become fans of Ryback overnight or something? This is so confusing.

Ryback is quality!!

Hope they go all the way with him and let him decimate Punk.

gnfnrhead

Punk kicks Ryback in the face, pins him, 5 seconds and we get all pluses. Clean win for the heel champion, Punk holds onto the belt, Ryback fcuks off back to the midcard. No negatives at all.

Hender

AJ loses the plot over next couple of weeks, books someone else in the Match as a Triple Threat....Ryback kills all round him....Shell shocked on 3rd man...punk throws him out of the ring...cheap pin.

End of story!

the groutch

hard to see a way round this one with the one on one.

Punk wins and Ryback's streak ends, kills any momentum he has, one step away from being another Brodus.

Ryback wins and Punk wins it back later in the year, Punk has no credibility as an opponent. And stops Punk short of beating Cena's 380 day reign.

very hard to see how they'd manufacture a draw/no contest out of a HIAC match.

Stereomaniac

starviewadams wrote: »

Ryback is quality!!

Hope they go all the way with him and let him decimate Punk.

I don't think he'll win the belt. I am going to put money on it probably. I hope that the match is good, as it is a different main event to what we see normally. I like the character but I am by no means a mark for him or anything.

etloveslsd

Would they have Punk throw him in the Anaconda Vice and Ryback refuses to submit? a-la Stone Cold and Bret Hart, didn't do Stone Cold any harm.

I hope they don't throw away Punks lengthy reign to protect Ryback. They have made such a big deal about it, and its leading to The Rumble.

Jamie OD

At this point I'm expecting Dolph to somehow be persuaded into cashing in MITB before or during the match, turning it into a Triple Threat. Then he's the one who gets pinned by Punk. Not the best idea but if WWE really are hesitant in having either Punk or Ryback lose then there's a solution for them. On the plus side, Dolph in Hell In A Cell would be entertaining.

Furious-Red

Jamie OD wrote: »

At this point I'm expecting Dolph to somehow be persuaded into cashing in MITB before or during the match, turning it into a Triple Threat. Then he's the one who gets pinned by Punk. Not the best idea but if WWE really are hesitant in having either Punk or Ryback lose then there's a solution for them. On the plus side, Dolph in Hell In A Cell would be entertaining.

Dolph can only cash it on the World Champion

Omackeral

Dolph has the Blue Briefcase which means he can only challenge for the WHC

Lord TSC

They wouldn't have to use the briefcase.

At this stage, inserting Dolph into the match might be the best option (hell, throw in someone else as well...). Gives them an out for the match and hides Ryback's weaknesses....

Stereomaniac

If they wouldn't have to use the briefcase, how would they put Dolph into the Cell then? Despite what little continuity WWE have, I'm sure they'd need a reason to add him.

the groutch

maybe have Vickie doing a deal behind his back trading his briefcase for a spot in HIAC.
Ziggs loses, turns on Vickie and turns face in the process

Lord TSC

They even set up Ziggler a bit last week on Raw when he said he wanted in so he could try and win both titles in a night.

Hender

From A.J.'s Twitter: "Been called to an emergency meeting with the WWE Board of Directors at #WWE Global HQ. #Confused #RAW"

Anyone else think this could be to do with Punk/Ryback?

My prediction may come true!

gnfnrhead

AJ gets added to the match? :pac:

Ridley

Teamshadowclan wrote: »

They wouldn't have to use the briefcase.

At this stage, inserting Dolph into the match might be the best option (hell, throw in someone else as well...). Gives them an out for the match and hides Ryback's weaknesses....

Sounds pretty ugly to me. I'm going on the assumption that Ryback will be doing his one count kickout schtick so Punk and Ziggler flying all over the ring and needing to believably get Ryback out of the way long enough so Punk can pin Ziggler doesn't appeal as a main event. Chain Ryback to the cell? Lock him outside of it?

At least one on one, Ryback doesn't need to be regularly going for the win. In theory, Punk just needs to keep ducking the finisher.

It is just the WWE title in the HiaC this year, right? For a last minute replacement for Cena, the gimmick actually works well this time around (rather than just doing it because it's October) but the sooner Ryback goes back to wrestling like Skip Sheffield the better.

Stereomaniac

The CM Punk & A.J storyline never really reached a logical ending. But I guess this is wrestling.

Lord TSC

Ridley wrote: »

It is just the WWE title in the HiaC this year, right?

I think Sheamus vs Big Show is one as well....

Sirsok

Whatever happens I genuinely think Punk and Ryback will have a stellar match. When I record Raw Ryback is one of the few things I dont fast forward. His offense looks like it kills and Punk can have a good match with anyone....I think people with be surprised by the match.

Alot of negativity in regards to Ryback gettin the nod for the match on some sites but its fresh and exciting. Having the same guys every month competing doesnt interest me....cena, orton, show, del rio, cena, orton, show, del rio and it goes on and on, or it seems that way to me anyway.

Maybe the will do something like the match getting to out of control and breaking the confides of the cell and a big spot on the stage where punk has to get carried out. Maintaining both wrestlers credibilty as a monster and heel

the groutch

I think it's safe to say we're already resigned to a dusty finish

Jayob10

Have Cena replace Ryback at the 11th hour seemingly at Punk's request.

Punk looks like beating Cena in HIAC only for Ryback to appear just as Cena comes back to life, crowd are expecting Ryback to cost Punk the title (for costing Ryback his title shot), but shock horror Ryback turns on Cena and lays him out for Punk to retain.

Heyman then grins like a Chesire cat, as Punk's new henchman has both of their backs, a bit like Batista was the muscle for HHH.

Until the inevitable turn somewhere down the line.

Its a good way to slow build Ryback as a heel. Keep him in the main event scene but in the background.

When he gets tired of taking orders from Heyman and Punk the crowd will go crazy to see him turn face again.

RobbingBandit

Brock comes out towards end of the match, he interferes taking out both Ryback and Punk leading to a no contest,next night on Raw Heyman comes out with Punk on left and Brock on right with Heyman boasting Punk is still champ and Lesnar took out the unbeatable Ryback, Vince then comes out making Punk vs Ryback with Brock banned from the arena. Ryback comes out followed by his new advisor The Nature Boy Ric Flair.

duuuaaaane

Ryback will use his 'strength' to throw Punk throw the cell to the outside. Once Punk can leave, he gets up and f*cks off like a p*ssyfoot heel. Keeps belt. Simple.

*SPOILER FOR RAW*





---
Luckily booking 101 suggests Ryback won't go over. I'm terrified he will, I've not once felt invested in his character. Would hate to see him end this potentially record-breaking title streak.

gnfnrhead

Jayob10 wrote: »

Have Cena replace Ryback at the 11th hour seemingly at Punk's request.

Punk looks like beating Cena in HIAC only for Ryback to appear just as Cena comes back to life, crowd are expecting Ryback to cost Punk the title (for costing Ryback his title shot), but shock horror Ryback turns on Cena and lays him out for Punk to retain.

Heyman then grins like a Chesire cat, as Punk's new henchman has both of their backs, a bit like Batista was the muscle for HHH.

Until the inevitable turn somewhere down the line.

Its a good way to slow build Ryback as a heel. Keep him in the main event scene but in the background.

When he gets tired of taking orders from Heyman and Punk the crowd will go crazy to see him turn face again.

Punk costs Ryback a title match, so Ryback joins up with Punk?

Horsebox9000

Logic dictates the following will happen;

We find out on the night that Punk is unable to wrestle thanks to a malicious attack backstage.Vickie examines the medical certification and agrees Punk should have the night off. Shock, horror and dismay. With not knowing who is going to face Ryback, she approaches Cena but turns out he just signed a deal to TNA.
Dazed and confused the lights go black, crowd silences and a figure appears in the ring. It's no other than Goldberg! He says he is sick of the comparisons to Ryback and it was him who attacked Punk so he could have a match with Ryback to shut people up.
Goldberg then checks the date on his Nokia 3210 only to find out it's his dogs birthday so he must leave post haste, but says he has a replacement for the Ryback match.
Come the match Ryback is standing in the ring, anxiously waiting his opponent. We are told by the commentary team it's a huge surprise.
Lights dim, everyone waits with anticipation. Music hits, it's none other than..... BAH GAWD......GILLBERG.
The match starts, Gillberg gives Ryback a wristlock and he taps out. End of PPV. Next night Ryback retires, Gillberg loses to Punk and Goldberg gets a pedicure.

the groutch

if it was WCW in '99 that's probably what would have happened

Rjd2

Former WWE Superstar Chris Jericho appeared on Busted Open with Dave LaGreca and Mike Riker, where he addressed CM Punk's WWE Championship defense against Ryback at Hell in a Cell. The program airs Mondays, Wednesdays, and Fridays on Sirius 92 and XM 208 from 2:00 to 4:00 p.m. Highlights from the interview are as follows:
Why he thinks Ryback should win on Sunday: "I don't know anything and I don't work for the WWE. I haven't talked to Vince in about a month. But I personally think and this is something that obviously Busted Open Radio has very hardcore wrestling fans who are listening as we all are. The number one thing people b---h about is that there is nothing new and it's the same old same old with John Cena. This is the chance to create a new guy. This is the chance to make a new star instantly, and I know tradition says you must build a star. There is no tradition in a case like this. The comparisons are to Goldberg. Most of the fans in this day and age have no idea who Goldberg is and don't care. We do, but in the year 2012 Goldberg was over ten years ago. How did Goldberg get over? …. By beating everybody. There was no loss for Goldberg. As soon as he did lose, that's when things started going downhill for him. Ryback is not a normal guy. This is not a guy that we see that builds his way to the top and fans get behind him slowly but surely. You want to pick a new guy? Have him beat CM Punk this week. Who gives a sh** about Punk's title reign? It means nothing. Here is a chance to take a guy who people are getting behind. If he beats Punk at Hell in A Cell and after three hundred and thirty seven days or whatever and Punk is finally beaten, people are going to start to take notice of this guy. Those who don't watch Raw are going to tune in to see what's going on. Ryback beats everybody. Ryback faces Rock at Royal Rumble. What happens if a couple of weeks before that something goes on with Ryback and Undertaker got involved in the Rock match? What if Rock wins the title and goes on to face Cena we expected and what if its Ryback vs Undertaker at Wrestlemania? What if Ryback beats Undertaker at Wrestlemania? You have a new star for the next ten years to headline pay-per views and main events."

Has CM Punk gone as far as he can go as a character?: "He has gone as far as he can go. The Rock is the Rock. He comes from a different era. Undertaker, Steve Austin, that comes from a different era. Nobody will ever be a bigger star than those guys, because people in their heads...It's like the old Batman TV show when we were kids. We thought it was the greatest show ever. You watch it back now and it sucks. But it has a certain place in your head that it will never be replaced. The band KISS in 1978 if you're old enough to remember was thought of as the greatest band ever, even if they weren't. Rock is a guy unto his own. Punk is as big of a star as he can be as a heel in WWE. Beating Ryback doesn't make him a bigger star. It doesn't."

Can the injury to John Cena be a blessing in disguise?: "It is a blessing in disguise. The biggest breaks I ever got in this business was when someone got hurt, or when someone went to make a movie. I won the undisputed championship because Triple H was hurt and Rock was leaving. Cena got hurt. What do we do? One thing about Vince McMahon is his motto is to take a negative and turn it into a positive. Vince knows how rare it is for someone to get over so quickly. Vince knows Ryback is not a money making star right now. But if he goes into Hell In A Cell and he destroys Punk and beats him, a hundred percent those fans are going to go bananas for Ryback. You have created a new star. Punk can come back the next night and b---h and complain and do what a heel does. Heels aren't built to win. Heels are built to lose. That's what heels do. The fact that Punk has held the title for three hundred and thirty seven days, it might mean something to you guys. I can tell you Punk doesn't care. Punk wants to make money and if that means Punk and Ryback becomes the hottest feud and suddenly something happens where it goes to Ryback and Rock, that's a match where suddenly you made a new guy. I would love to see Punk and Rock and I'm sure Punk would be disappointed if it didn't work out. But this is business. If you have a chance to build someone that can put a company on his back, then you do it. The stop and start pushes that the WWE has been doing and infamous for the last ten years has got to stop and this is the perfect time for it."


http://www.wrestlinginc.com/wi/news/2012/1023/557374/chris-jericho/#ixzz2A9ZLC0B8

FutureGuy

Ryback to win cleanly. Not because I like it, not because I think it's the correct booking, but because I think it's what WWE will do. They have a chance to make a star right now - all eyes are on Ryback.

Loughc

FutureGuy wrote: »

Ryback to win cleanly. Not because I like it, not because I think it's the correct booking, but because I think it's what WWE will do. They have a chance to make a star right now - all eyes are on Ryback.

Again I'm just not seeing Ryback as Main Event Star Quality. It's really not clicking for me....