2012 Autumn Internationals superthread

thomond2006

The France squad was announced today. Uncapped players in bold.

Forwards:

Props: Eddy Ben Arous (Racing-Métro), Thomas Domingo (Clermont), Yannick Forestier (Castres), David Attoub (Stade Français), Vincent Debaty (Clermont), Nicolas Mas (Perpignan),

Hookers: Benjamin Kayser (Clermont), Christopher Tolofua (Stade Toulousain), Dimitri Szarzewski (Racing Metro 92),

Locks: Yoann Maestri (Stade Toulousain), Pascal Papé (Stade Français), Jocelino Suta (Toulon), Sébastien Vahaamahina (Perpignan),

Backrows: Damien Chouly (Clermont), Thierry Dusautoir (Stade Toulousain, cap.), Pierrick Gunther (Toulon), Wenceslas Lauret (Biarritz), Fulgence Ouedraogo (Montpellier), Louis Picamoles (Stade Toulousain)

Backs:

SHs: Maxime Machenaud (Racing-Métro), Morgan Parra (Clermont),

FHs: Frédéric Michalak (Toulon), Jules Plisson (Stade Français), François Trinh-Duc (Montpellier),

Centres: Maxime Mermoz (Toulon), Wesley Fofana (Clermont), Florian Fritz (Stade Toulousain), Gaël Fickou (Stade Toulousain),

Back Three: Vincent Clerc (Stade Toulousain), Brice Dulin (Castres), Benjamin Fall (Racing-Métro), Yoann Huget (Stade Toulousain), Vincent Martin (Toulon),

LINK: http://www.lequipe.fr/Rugby/Actualites/Avec-huit-nouveaux/320016

A lot of new faces, 18 year old Gael Fickou gets in after some great performances for Toulouse since moving from the Toulon espoirs system. In fact a lot of Toulon players have got in.

France will serious depth at scrum-half, Machenaud was excellent against Munster, likewise Michalak against Montpellier. They may well move Michalak to flyhalf.

Gunther has been an emerging star and has kept out Van Niekerk out of the Toulon side at times. A big physical blindside with plenty of pace.

totallegend

thomond2006 wrote: »

A lot of new faces

It's almost like they're planning for the future or something. Very odd for a national rugby team to be doing that.

Suta, Vahaamahina and Tolofua are all natives of French colonies/possessions in the Pacific. See, that's where Ireland went wrong; if we'd conquered Fiji back in the 1800s we'd have loads of players to call on now.

Seriously though, that is shaping up to be a good team. A couple of problem positions maybe; not sure about the quality at hooker and second-row but no shortage of power and pace throughout the squad.

Winters

I didnt know that Gael Fickou is a product of the Toulon club. You could be forgiven for thinking he was another player to come out of the Toulouse academy.

For a club supposedly full of foreigners that's a big amount of players in the French squad. Laporte and Mourad Boudjellal must be going mad!

It will be interesting how many Top14 based players will be called up to the Welsh and English sides. While the IRFU have no policy on picking players playing outside the four provinces, I cant see any exiles actually being called up.

irishbucsfan

In fairness there aren't many exiles who are good enough for us to call up anyway.

The only guy who I can think of who is worth looking at is John Andress. Andress has started every game for Worcester at TH this season AFAIK. He also seems to have settled down. He's 28 as well so he's got plenty of miles left on the clock and should be around for England 2015. I really think Kidney would be much more likely to call up Tony Buckley though!

Guys like Tommy Seymour, Tomas O'Leary, Ian Humphreys and Robin Copeland aren't on the same level as what we've got. The other guy who could be useful is Niall Morris if Kearney isn't 100% fit. I'd imagine Kidney would prefer to use Earls or Keatley at 15 though than a natural 15 who is playing well outside of Ireland.

molloyjh

irishbucsfan wrote: »

In fairness there aren't many exiles who are good enough for us to call up anyway.

The only guy who I can think of who is worth looking at is John Andress. Andress has started every game for Worcester at TH this season AFAIK. He also seems to have settled down. He's 28 as well so he's got plenty of miles left on the clock and should be around for England 2015. I really think Kidney would be much more likely to call up Tony Buckley though!

Guys like Tommy Seymour, Tomas O'Leary, Ian Humphreys and Robin Copeland aren't on the same level as what we've got. The other guy who could be useful is Niall Morris if Kearney isn't 100% fit. I'd imagine Kidney would prefer to use Earls or Keatley at 15 though than a natural 15 who is playing well outside of Ireland.

Heaven forbid a full back at full back...

BoarHunter

thomond2006 wrote: »

Gunther has been an emerging star and has kept out Van Niekerk out of the Toulon side at times. A big physical blindside with plenty of pace.

Great propsect player this Gunther.

look at his work rate here. Not only at the end of it but all through the game phase

EDIT : he is the number 6 with Chabal hair style

Fickou is really exciting as well. Hope Michalak starts, I have had enough of one dimensional Trinh Duc. Hope to see Machenaud-Michalak. that's a pity for Parra seeing him so clinical in his kicks at goal but hey ...

Swiwi

BoarHunter wrote: »

Great propsect player this Gunther.

look at his work rate here. Not only at the end of it but all through the game phase

EDIT : he is the number 6 with Chabal hair style

Fickou is really exciting as well. Hope Michalak starts, I have had enough of one dimensional Trinh Duc. Hope to see Machenaud-Michalak. that's a pity for Parra seeing him so clinical in his kicks at goal but hey ...

Agree, I think Trinh Duc fits the definition of journeyman. Michalak has his faults, but French flair he lacks not.

Swiwi

BoarHunter wrote: »

Great propsect player this Gunther.

look at his work rate here. Not only at the end of it but all through the game phase

EDIT : he is the number 6 with Chabal hair style

Fickou is really exciting as well. Hope Michalak starts, I have had enough of one dimensional Trinh Duc. Hope to see Machenaud-Michalak. that's a pity for Parra seeing him so clinical in his kicks at goal but hey ...

Gunther looks like a young Gerard Depardieu before he got fat on good food & wine....

dropkickrugby

Gunther scored Toulon's first try on Sunday ( or the second one) too. Big boy

bilston

irishbucsfan wrote: »

In fairness there aren't many exiles who are good enough for us to call up anyway.

The only guy who I can think of who is worth looking at is John Andress. Andress has started every game for Worcester at TH this season AFAIK. He also seems to have settled down. He's 28 as well so he's got plenty of miles left on the clock and should be around for England 2015. I really think Kidney would be much more likely to call up Tony Buckley though!

Guys like Tommy Seymour, Tomas O'Leary, Ian Humphreys and Robin Copeland aren't on the same level as what we've got. The other guy who could be useful is Niall Morris if Kearney isn't 100% fit. I'd imagine Kidney would prefer to use Earls or Keatley at 15 though than a natural 15 who is playing well outside of Ireland.

Ian Whitten possibly? Probably not but put it this way I'd take him over Downey.

Fireball07

I honestly think an in-form TOL could actually be better than what we have but I wouldn't call him up now. But if he has good form for an entire year, we shouldn't forget him completely.

And I don't know about Whitten...I'd take Downey ahead of him but we should jump Marshall into the squad before either of them imo.

Podge_irl

Isn't Whitten mostly playing on the wing for Exeter?

I'd be amazed if one of McFadden or Downey isn't 12 for the AIs. Unless D'Arcy is back, in which case it will be him. I would be a big fan of bringing Marshall into the squad now - he's the best long term option. He'll face difficulties until he overtakes Wallace at Ulster though.

Quint2010

Podge_irl wrote: »

Isn't Whitten mostly playing on the wing for Exeter?

I'd be amazed if one of McFadden or Downey isn't 12 for the AIs. Unless D'Arcy is back, in which case it will be him. I would be a big fan of bringing Marshall into the squad now - he's the best long term option. He'll face difficulties until he overtakes Wallace at Ulster though.

Downey? Really? Hasn't impressed me at all for Munster. McFadden is playing well for Leinster. Or Deccie will shock us all by picking....Paddy Wallace

Podge_irl

He hasn't impressed me massively either - I just think that will end up being reasonably irrelevant.

McFadden has been very good in the last two games in parts, but he is very much a route 1 centre. He has the ability to pass (he threw a beauty out to Kearney on the wing to release Fitz for his length of the field try against Bath), he just doesn't know when to do it. Presented with an overlap he's as likely to put his head down and plough forward as to draw the man and pass. He might get better with an extended run in the position though. There is no indication that Kidney view McFadden as a 12 though.

Wallace is definitely a runner, and I like him as a player and think he is unfairly maligned a lot, but he is 32 (?). He is not a long term option, and nor is Downey for that matter. At least McFadden is reasonably young, but Marshall is the only one looking like a long term option at 12.

jacothelad

Podge_irl wrote: »

He hasn't impressed me massively either - I just think that will end up being reasonably irrelevant.

McFadden has been very good in the last two games in parts, but he is very much a route 1 centre. He has the ability to pass (he threw a beauty out to Kearney on the wing to release Fitz for his length of the field try against Bath), he just doesn't know when to do it. Presented with an overlap he's as likely to put his head down and plough forward as to draw the man and pass. He might get better with an extended run in the position though. There is no indication that Kidney view McFadden as a 12 though.

Wallace is definitely a runner, and I like him as a player and think he is unfairly maligned a lot, but he is 32 (?). He is not a long term option, and nor is Downey for that matter. At least McFadden is reasonably young, but Marshall is the only one looking like a long term option at 12.

McSharry

Podge_irl

I forgot about him (he was injured for quite a while wasn't he?). He'l unfortunately suffer from Connacht syndrome though. Still, be it him or Marshall, I would like to see a long-term option trialled at least in the Fiji game.

bamboozle

best thing for McFadden is that he gets a run of games at 12 for leinster, unfortunately with injuries he'll be moved across the backline plugging holes until we have a full compliment of fit players.

i'd love to see form & younger players brought into the squad for the Fiji match, Henshaw, McSharry, O'Halloran, McCarthy, D. Buckley, Loughney, Henderson, Marshall, Touhy, Gilroy, Jackson, Strauss, Madigan, Keatley, Sherry, Zebo, O'Dea. The form Irish 9's at the moment are Marshall & TOL

thomond2006

Forwards:
Robert Barbieri, Mauro Bergamasco, Martin Castrogiovanni, Lorenzo Cittadini, Alberto De Marchi, Paul Derbyshire, Simone Favaro, Joshua Furno, Quintin Geldenhuys, Leonardo Ghiraldini, Davide Giazzon, Andrea Lo Cicero, Francesco Minto, Sergio Parisse, Antonio Pavanello, Michele Rizzo, Manoa Vosawai, Alessandro Zanni

Backs:
Tommaso Benvenuti, Mirco Bergamasco, Tobias Botes, Kristopher Burton, Gonzalo Canale, Edoardo Gori, Tommaso Iannone, Andrea Masi, Luke McLean, Luca Morisi, Luciano Orquera, Alberto Sgarbi, Giovanbattista Venditti

leonard7

The all blacks are clearly the best team in the world currently...however, the scarier thought is that the 2nd best team could be made up of ineligible all blacks due to their policy of not picking anyone playing outside of NZ...how about this for a backline.
9. Jimmy Cowan 10. Nick Evans 12. Luke Mc Callister 13. Sonny Bill Williams 11. Sivivatu 14. Doug Howlett 15. Muliaina (bit old now tho)

and add in Kaino my favourite player and my 2011 best player in the world and thats real

6dsp9

bamboozle wrote: »

best thing for McFadden is that he gets a run of games at 12 for leinster, unfortunately with injuries he'll be moved across the backline plugging holes until we have a full compliment of fit players.

i'd love to see form & younger players brought into the squad for the Fiji match, Henshaw, McSharry, O'Halloran, McCarthy, D. Buckley, Loughney, Henderson, Marshall, Touhy, Gilroy, Jackson, Strauss, Madigan, Keatley, Sherry, Zebo, O'Dea. The form Irish 9's at the moment are Marshall & TOL

Really don't think Zebo is a good rugby player at all. As for Paddy Jackson the u20s seemed to play a hell of a lot better in the world championship than the 6 nations when they had Hanrahan and not him at 10,I think Hanrahan should be in there.

bilston

Why do people continue to use the U20s as a stick time beat Paddy Jackson with? Not that I actually agree that he played badly for them anyway but he is playing as well as any Irish 10 at Pro 12 level and HEC level. I think that counts a bit more than U20 rugby...

irishbucsfan

Absolutely, anyone who doesn't see the quality that Jackson possesses mustn't have seen him play recently.

Fireball07

Jackson didn't have the best 6N for the U-20s but he wasn't bad, and he's been superb for Ulster so far this season. Like really really good, much better than I expected from him.

And Zebo's come on an awful lot too, decision-making and stuff has improved immensely.

Glass Prison 1214

bilston wrote: »

Why do people continue to use the U20s as a stick time beat Paddy Jackson with? Not that I actually agree that he played badly for them anyway but he is playing as well as any Irish 10 at Pro 12 level and HEC level. I think that counts a bit more than U20 rugby...

ye its a completely different level, Sean O'Brien didn't start for the irish u20s when he was that age and he hasnt turned out to be to bad to put it mildly

bilston

Fireball07 wrote: »

Jackson didn't have the best 6N for the U-20s but he wasn't bad, and he's been superb for Ulster so far this season. Like really really good, much better than I expected from him.

And Zebo's come on an awful lot too, decision-making and stuff has improved immensely.

Agree on Zebo. He gets a bad rep because he was picked ahead of Gilroy and D.Kearney in June but that doesn't make him a bad player. Not at all. I like him, he's exciting and if there is one thing the Irish team needs at the minute it's a bit of excitement. Not that I think he should start in a first choice team but he has a great future.

mogwai81

I think Zebo's game has improved massively this season. Paddy Jackson's kicking was the only area of real
concern for me. But in fairness his kicking hasn't been bad this season. I think to many people expect player's
to be the finished article by 22, it's just unrealistic.

bilston

mogwai81 wrote: »

I think Zebo's game has improved massively this season. Paddy Jackson's kicking was the only area of real
concern for me. But in fairness his kicking hasn't been bad this season. I think to many people expect player's
to be the finished article by 22, it's just unrealistic.

Jackson's kicking stats must be at least 80% this season. He's obviously been working very hard on it because yes last season it was average.

GerM

Glass Prison 1214 wrote: »

ye its a completely different level, Sean O'Brien didn't start for the irish u20s when he was that age and he hasnt turned out to be to bad to put it mildly

He was injured. He started initially. SOB had an absolutely shocking time of it for the first couple of years of his career but was earmarked for a huge career from early on. I recall the story of when a Leinster development side played the Irish U20 side in 2008 with SOB playing for Leinster. The referee actually had a word with SOB (then 21) and told him to dial it down as he reckoned he was going to hurt one of the U20 lads.

thomond2006

http://www.planetrugby.com/story/0,25883,16024_8183397,00.html

Pocock expected back for the november tests.

leonard7

i have to say Jacksons kicking was never a concern for me form is temporary but the kid oozes class...i remember watching this and thinking there is irelands future 10 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x3bkmNv7Lns

here is the 2nd half just because i love watching this

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DTVyWRv8yfk&feature=relmfu

thomond2006

thomond2006 wrote: »

Backrows: Damien Chouly (Clermont), Thierry Dusautoir (Stade Toulousain, cap.), Pierrick Gunther (Toulon), Wenceslas Lauret (Biarritz), Fulgence Ouedraogo (Montpellier), Louis Picamoles (Stade Toulousain

Dusautoir is out for 6 weeks so he is likely to miss all of France's AIs.
http://www.planetrugby.com/story/0,25883,3551_8185437,00.html

You're probably looking at a backrow of 6. Gunther 7. Ouedraogo 8. Picamoles

CIARAN_BOYLE

Welsh squad named

Backs: Leigh Halfpenny, Liam Williams, Alex Cuthbert, George North, Harry Robinson, Ashley Beck, Jonathan Davies, Jamie Roberts, Scott Williams, Dan Biggar, James Hook, Rhys Priestland, Tavis Knoyle, Mike Phillips, Lloyd Williams.

Forwards: Scott Andrews, Ryan Bevington, Paul James, Aaron Jarvis, Gethin Jenkins, Adam Jones, Richard Hibbard, Ken Owens, Matthew Rees, Bradley Davies, Luke Charteris, Ian Evans, Alun Wyn Jones, Toby Faletau, Ryan Jones, Rob McCusker, Aaron Shingler, Justin Tipuric, Josh Turnbull, Sam Warburton.

irishbucsfan

Only uncapped player is Jarvis. And that's possibly only due to the injury of Rhys Gill.

Klunk_NZ

Average All Black winning margin of 25 points once the tours done.

Swiwi

Klunk_NZ wrote: »

Average All Black winning margin of 25 points once the tours done.

We shall see. I imagine Italy & Scotland will be overcome easily enough, but Wales & England should provide more robust opposition.

Hype710

Ex-Ulsterman Tommy Seymour named in Scotland's squad for the AIs. Best of luck to him.

thomond2006

Scotland squad:

Backs: Blair, De Luca, Dunbar, Evans, Hogg, Horne, Jackson, Jones, Laidlaw, S Lamont, R Lawson, Murchie, Pyrgos, Scott, Seymour, Visser.

Forwards: Barclay, Brown, Cross, Denton, Ford, Gilchrist, Grant, Gray, Hall, Hamilton, Jacobsen, Kellock, S Lawson, McInally, Rennie, Ryder, Strokosch, Traynor.

Theta

rish Rugby Squad (Guinness Series 2012)

Rory Best (Banbridge/Ulster)
Tommy Bowe (Belfast Harlequins/Ulster)
Darren Cave (Belfast Harlequins/Ulster)
Tom Court (Malone/Ulster)
Gordon D'Arcy (Lansdowne/Leinster)
Keith Earls (Thomond/Munster)
Stephen Ferris (Dungannon/Ulster)
Cian Healy (Clontarf/Leinster)
Jamie Heaslip (Naas/Leinster)
Iain Henderson (Queens University/Ulster)
Chris Henry (Malone/Ulster)
David Kilcoyne (UL Bohemians/Munster)
Luke Marshall (Ballymena/Ulster)
John Muldoon (Galwegians/Connacht)
Conor Murray (Garryowen/Munster)
Mike McCarthy (Buccaneers/Connacht)
Fergus McFadden (Old Belvedere/Leinster)
Kevin McLaughlin (St. Mary's College/Leinster)
Donncha O'Callaghan (Cork Constitution/Munster)
Paul O'Connell (Young Munster/Munster)
Brian O'Driscoll (UCD/Leinster) Captain
Ronan O'Gara (Cork Constitution/Munster)
Peter O'Mahony (Cork Constitution/Munster)
Eoin Reddan (Lansdowne/Leinster)
Mike Ross (Clontarf/Leinster)
Donnacha Ryan (Shannon/Munster)
Jonathan Sexton (St.Mary's College/Leinster)
Richardt Strauss (Old Wesley/Leinster)
Andrew Trimble (Ballymena/Ulster)
Dan Tuohy (Ballymena/Ulster)
Simon Zebo (Cork Constitution/Munster)


Id be pissed if i was Madigan!

irishbucsfan

No Maitland, he musnt be fit.

thomond2006

Nyanga called up in place of Dusautoir who's injured.

Cormic

Why so many back row? Why no full back? Why no younger OH? Baffling!

CIARAN_BOYLE

Cormic wrote: »

Why so many back row?

We have a lot of good back rowers, seven in the squad and two locks and a hooker that cover there as well

Theta

Cormic wrote: »

Why so many back row? Why no full back? Why no younger OH? Baffling!

Why hasn't Jones been included for full back cover? He will play Earls at 15 instead of playing Madigan of Jones who has played there in several games this season already and can cover OH.

ray jay

Supposedly Kidney will be adding others to the squad closer to the SA match (most obviously at full back), I think he's just waiting to see how the next couple of league matches play out. Nice to see Henderson and Luke Marshall made the cut.

Players by position:

Rory Best
Richardt Strauss

Cian Healy
Tom Court
David Kilcoyne
Mike Ross

Donncha O'Callaghan
Paul O'Connell
Iain Henderson
Mike McCarthy
Donnacha Ryan
Dan Tuohy

Stephen Ferris
Jamie Heaslip
Chris Henry
Peter O'Mahony
John Muldoon
Kevin McLaughlin

Eoin Reddan
Conor Murray

Ronan O'Gara
Jonathan Sexton

Luke Marshall
Gordon D'Arcy
Brian O'Driscoll
Darren Cave
Fergus McFadden
Keith Earls

Andrew Trimble
Simon Zebo
Tommy Bowe

theKramer

ray jay wrote: »

Players by position:
Cian Healy
Tom Court
David Kilcoyne
Mike Ross

So that means Tom Court is the backup tighthead, even though he has been playing only at loosehead, which is mental...

leonard7

nice to finally see vissers name were it belongs...in a "competitive" team

leonard7

also i wouldn't take the scots too lightly i can feel something brewing in scotland in a respectable team... first year i can see where tries are going to come from! Now just nick de luca to get rid of

thomond2006

leonard7 wrote: »

also i wouldn't take the scots too lightly i can feel something brewing in scotland in a respectable team... first year i can see where tries are going to come from! Now just nick de luca to get rid of

We've said this before the international season for years now and Scotland have never produced.

BoarHunter

thomond2006 wrote: »

Dusautoir is out for 6 weeks so he is likely to miss all of France's AIs.
http://www.planetrugby.com/story/0,25883,3551_8185437,00.html

You're probably looking at a backrow of 6. Gunther 7. Ouedraogo 8. Picamoles

I would rather play Nyanga 6.Gunther 7.Nyanga 8.Chouly

3 jumpers/runners/scrappers in a different style. Picamole towards the end to finish the job

CIARAN_BOYLE

theKramer wrote: »

So that means Tom Court is the backup tighthead, even though he has been playing only at loosehead, which is mental...

Deccie has said that he will probably add a prop

That means that he has told Fitzpatrick Loughney and Hagan that they are within inches of being picked and whoever impresses most gets in

damianmcr

Court said last night that him going from LH to TH was like a 2nd row moving to centre. When someone mentioned the last time he played TH he pulled his jacket over his face.