Plateau/Upping Calories

doctorwhogirl

Hope I can get some good advice on this as it's the type of topic where there are a million schools of thought!

Basically, I'm a 25 year old female. 5ft 4, weight about 149/150 at the minute.

I lost weight (6stone) getting to my goal weight in June 2010.
I started losing weight in about April/May 2009, so 3.5 years ago.

I lost most of this with weightwatchers (please refrain from WW bashing thank you!) and have been withing a stone of my goal weight of 10st (up and down) since then

I've really struggled to maintain that 10st mark and have tried lots of options. gave Slimming World a go etc...

At the minute I'm counting cals eating around 1300 a day with one cheat day a week where I eat about 1600.

I exercise 4/5 times a week- Boxing class, pump class, spin class and a jog/ gym work.

I can't seem to move below 10.7. Haven't managed it really for the past 1.5 years.

My question is am I eating too little? Because of the low cals for such a long period of time I feel like perhaps I've damaged my metabolism.

I know all about BMR etc... and with exercise I probably am eating below it but it's so hard to tell.

I feel like maybe I should up cals? I've heard a few success stories with this but by weight is a big emotional thing with me and to be perfectly honest, I'm utterly terrified of becoming fat again. That fear is HUGE and I know it has made me somewhat obsessive with my eating.

I just feel like my BMI is above healthy at the minute and I know from my appearance I could stand to lose that half stone at least.

Any advice will be really appreciated.

Thanks for reading all that rambling nonsense!

P.S. I've read all the stickies and my diet at the moment is a good attempt at that. trying to keep carbs fairly low and wholegrain, eating lots of veg and protein.

Chancer3001

chances of you "damaging your matabolism" or any of that are very very low.

Chances are youve miscalculated the amount of calories youre taking.

How do you work them out? Do you weight everything?

Orla K

I was reading on Lyle mcDonalds website about diet breaks, where you eat at maintenance to 'reset' the thyroid. Prolonged dieting can reduce thyroid function. It won't do you any harm to eat at full calories for a time and you can see if it will help or not

doctorwhogirl

Chancer3001 wrote: »

chances of you "damaging your matabolism" or any of that are very very low.

Chances are youve miscalculated the amount of calories youre taking.

How do you work them out? Do you weight everything?

I literally weight EVERYTHING that goes into my mouth. Hence my comment about being obsessive with my eating.

I'm definitely not miscalculating the amount of calories I'm taking in.

I work them out using my fitness pal, my calculator and my digital scales.

There have been periods in my 3.5 years where I was eating maybe 1000 cals and exercising too..not proud of that but I did it. Weight of course went on after I ate normally, and the cycle began again.

Orla, I think I was reading the same. Also was reading an article by Jillian Michaels advising the same.
Since losing weight, my menstrual function has been affected so I'd say the aul thyroid has still not adjusted.

Anyone tried upping cals after a prolonged period of dieting? How did you get on?

It's the clothes not fitting/weight gain that scares me!

Orla K

doctorwhogirl wrote: »

Orla, I think I was reading the same. Also was reading an article by Jillian Michaels advising the same.
Since losing weight, my menstrual function has been affected so I'd say the aul thyroid has still not adjusted.

Anyone tried upping cals after a prolonged period of dieting? How did you get on?

It's the clothes not fitting/weight gain that scares me!

This might gross out some of the guys but how has it been affected?

Also if you need to know anything about getting your thyroid functioning better without meds just ask me. My thyroid got lazy before even dieting although judging by the iceyness of my hands and feet my thyroid has never been up to much.

This is what I was reading. I also can't stand Jillian Michaels, I just don't like people who are bitches.

doctorwhogirl

Orla K wrote: »

This might gross out some of the guys but how has it been affected?

Also if you need to know anything about getting your thyroid functioning better without meds just ask me. My thyroid got lazy before even dieting although judging by the iceyness of my hands and feet my thyroid has never been up to much.

This is what I was reading. I also can't stand Jillian Michaels, I just don't like people who are bitches.

Just irregularity! I suffer from Raynauds in my hands which developed after losing weight. So I assumed my thyroid but apparently it was fine. :rolleyes:

So knowing about improving thyroid function would be really helpful!!!!

Orla K

doctorwhogirl wrote: »

Just irregularity! I suffer from Raynauds in my hands which developed after losing weight. So I assumed my thyroid but apparently it was fine. :rolleyes:

So knowing about improving thyroid function would be really helpful!!!!

Thyroid testing is a bit of a sham, it can be poor functioning and the doctor will say your fine. Heavy periods are more associated with being hypo, I'm not sure about irregularity but if it's changed then I'd get that checked.

If you've been dieting for 3.5years straight you need a diet break, I'd follow Lyle mcDonalds idea of it. Honestly if slight thyroid problems are caused by prolonged dieting it's pretty simple to get it right again. Just eat more, if your low carb get in 100g-150g if your low fat get in more of those but just make sure you keep to eating the right things. I regularly up my calories to around maintenance mostly because when I eat under for longer than a week or two I get cold, tired and can't focus on a thing, my functioning just go's right down. Upping the calories makes me feel a little more normal, I'm still cold, tired and find it difficult to focus/function but now I now what I'm doing when I'm doing it.

The other stuff can get complicated and you have to watch everything your eating and can be very difficult and probably pointless for you.

BlueIsland

IMO (from the language you use) you really dont have a healthy relaitonships with food at all....

"I literally weight EVERYTHING that goes into my mouth. Hence my comment about being obsessive with my eating"

"I feel like maybe I should up cals? I've heard a few success stories with this but by weight is a big emotional thing with me and to be perfectly honest, I'm utterly terrified of becoming fat again. That fear is HUGE and I know it has made me somewhat obsessive with my eatiNG"

Maybe others will disagree but i think you need to reassess your relationship with food which is ONLY the fuel you use to keep your body going to LIVE YOUR LIFE.

doctorwhogirl

BlueIsland wrote: »

IMO (from the language you use) you really dont have a healthy relaitonships with food at all....

"I literally weight EVERYTHING that goes into my mouth. Hence my comment about being obsessive with my eating"

"I feel like maybe I should up cals? I've heard a few success stories with this but by weight is a big emotional thing with me and to be perfectly honest, I'm utterly terrified of becoming fat again. That fear is HUGE and I know it has made me somewhat obsessive with my eatiNG"

Maybe others will disagree but i think you need to reassess your relationship with food which is ONLY the fuel you use to keep your body going to LIVE YOUR LIFE.

No I agree with you. My relationship with food isn't healthy, and I am trying to deal with that in a variety of ways.

That's why I'm hoping that increasing calories/decreasing my hold on food will help me in a variety of ways.

I don't know if you have lost a lot of weight personally, but it was the biggest journey and most emotional thing I've ever done. But, it's a double-edged sword.
Again, if you haven't been through it, and maybe you have, but losing a huge amount of weight is like beating an addiction. I was addicted to food so I never viewed food as fuel. I have started to do so more as I have developed an interest in exercise. Food is one of the hardest addictions to beat because you don't need cigarettes, don't need drugs...but you have to eat food. Going cold turkey is not an option.


Don't get me wrong, I do live my life. If I;m going out, I'm going out and that's that. But at the same time I've worked hard to be relatively healthy and I don't want to throw that away either.

It's a really fine line though, I appreciate that! And my relationship with food needs work for sure. Thanks for the advice

Anyway I'm deviating from my question about upping calories!!!

doctorwhogirl

I'm back again! Same problem and really would love to know if anyone has any other advice or suggestions because I'm absolutely ready to just give in and eat anything and everything at this stage!

So I've upped calories to 1450 and I actually lost a few weeks ago and got down to 10st 7 which was great. My healthy BMI is anything below 10st 5 so I was really happy with that. I also made changes to my carb intake.

I maintained that for 2/3 weeks.

Now I'm 10st 10.4 this morning (weigh in day)

Nothing has changed!!!

My food diary is here to look at if that may shed some light!
There was a viscount biscuit consumed today out of annoyance...ignore that...that doesn't normally get consumed!

ANY help at all please!

Ant11

Weight at the end of the day is just a number, it's how you look and feel that matters. Have you taken photos or body measurements? Maybe you've gotten stronger, gained some muscle and possibly lost some inches without noticing?

cmyk

doctorwhogirl wrote: »

My food diary is here to look at if that may shed some light!
There was a viscount biscuit consumed today out of annoyance...ignore that...that doesn't normally get consumed!

The link to your food diary doesn't work for me?

So taking your calories up did work? 1450 still seems low to me and that's not considering your activity levels. If we can see the food diary above we might get a better idea though.

Stench Blossoms

Is this your diary?

http://www.myfitnesspal.com/food/diary/doctorwhogirl

Emeraldy Pebbles

Ant11 wrote: »

Weight at the end of the day is just a number, it's how you look and feel that matters. Have you taken photos or body measurements? Maybe you've gotten stronger, gained some muscle and possibly lost some inches without noticing?

+1

I found taking photos a much more useful tool when I was losing weight than weighing. You can see the changes to your body.

doctorwhogirl

Stench Blossoms wrote: »

Is this your diary?

http://www.myfitnesspal.com/food/diary/doctorwhogirl

Yep! Nicely found!!!

Ant11

This is my opinion, others may differ. It think 1450 cals is too low for your activity level. Your TDEE is about 2100/2200 so I'd aim for 1650/1700. Looking at your food diary I'd increase your protein and fat intake and lower the carbs. Or you could cycle your carb intake to be higher on training days and lower on non training days. The figure for protein content in the Tuna is wrong. It says 4g protein for a tin of tuna. I'd also ditch the scone and choc spread (I'm assuming its full of sugar but could be wrong).

Edit: Sorry I just seen the weight of the tin of tuna is only 15g.

doctorwhogirl

Ant11 wrote: »

This is my opinion, others may differ. It think 1450 cals is too low for your activity level. Your TDEE is about 2100/2200 so I'd aim for 1650/1700. Looking at your food diary I'd increase your protein and fat intake and lower the carbs. Or you could cycle your carb intake to be higher on training days and lower on non training days. The figure for protein content in the Tuna is wrong. It says 4g protein for a tin of tuna. I'd also ditch the scone and choc spread (I'm assuming its full of sugar but could be wrong).

Edit: Sorry I just seen the weight of the tin of tuna is only 15g.

See the only thing is, the scone is like my little thing that keeps me going! Which is very hypocritical of me given I'm here saying I want to lose weight but I llive for that scone in the evenings! It's a ww recipe scone made with low fat natural yoghurt and homemade so didn't think it was all that bad. I figured if that was the one bad thing in my diet I'm not doing too badly? Maybe I'm wrong. And surely that wouldn't be responsible for these random gains?

Again, I'm sure that sounds hypocritical- me asking for advice and then saying "NO! NOT THE SCOOONE!!!!" :P

cmyk

Here's my 2c...

doctorwhogirl wrote: »

I lost weight (6stone) getting to my goal weight in June 2010. I started losing weight in about April/May 2009, so 3.5 years ago. I lost most of this with weightwatchers (please refrain from WW bashing thank you!) and have been withing a stone of my goal weight of 10st (up and down) since then

No bashing of weight watchers here, they've been helping people lose weight for about a billion years now ; )

doctorwhogirl wrote: »

At the minute I'm counting cals eating around 1300 a day with one cheat day a week where I eat about 1600. I exercise 4/5 times a week- Boxing class, pump class, spin class and a jog/ gym work. My question is am I eating too little? Because of the low cals for such a long period of time I feel like perhaps I've damaged my metabolism.

Ok so your maintenance is probably between 1950 - 2250, that's a pretty big deficit, add to that the duration of time you've been dieting that's going to be tough on the body. Dieting (certainly at that level) is not a very natural thing to do, you are, at the end of the day providing your body with a shortfall of the energy/nutrients it needs. It's quite possible that you've in some way 'damaged your metabolism'. I'm pretty sure as mentioned earlier lyle mcdonald has an article regarding just that, in particular with people who tend to be highly stressed or tightly wound, so maybe a quick google of that might help you.

doctorwhogirl wrote: »

I feel like maybe I should up cals? I've heard a few success stories with this but by weight is a big emotional thing with me and to be perfectly honest, I'm utterly terrified of becoming fat again. That fear is HUGE and I know it has made me somewhat obsessive with my eating.

Yep, and since you've posted this originally I think you've taken that advise and seen some movement? I'd say maybe take a full diet break...that is eating at maintenance for a little while and then start edging your calories back down to create a moderate deficit. I know you fear gaining weight, but clearly being stuck at this weight is doing nothing for your confidence either, so in a sense you've nothing to lose by trying it.

doctorwhogirl wrote: »

P.S. I've read all the stickies and my diet at the moment is a good attempt at that. trying to keep carbs fairly low and wholegrain, eating lots of veg and protein.

Macros look fine to me, maybe bump up the protein slightly, and replace some of your sugary carb sources with more vegetables...you say eating a lot of vegetables, but really it only seems to be a few with your evening meal, from the few days I've looked at. I find that bumping up the vegetable intake makes a difference to everything!

doctorwhogirl

Thanks so much for your thoughtful reply. Really do appreciate it

cmyk wrote: »

Here's my 2c...

Ok so your maintenance is probably between 1950 - 2250, that's a pretty big deficit, add to that the duration of time you've been dieting that's going to be tough on the body. Dieting (certainly at that level) is not a very natural thing to do, you are, at the end of the day providing your body with a shortfall of the energy/nutrients it needs. It's quite possible that you've in some way 'damaged your metabolism'. I'm pretty sure as mentioned earlier lyle mcdonald has an article regarding just that, in particular with people who tend to be highly stressed or tightly wound, so maybe a quick google of that might help you.

I believe I've read that in my travels alright. It does make sense and clearly the weight is stressing me out combined with the fact (though I hate to admit it!!!) I'm pretty tightly wound as a person anyway.

cmyk wrote: »

Yep, and since you've posted this originally I think you've taken that advise and seen some movement? I'd say maybe take a full diet break...that is eating at maintenance for a little while and then start edging your calories back down to create a moderate deficit. I know you fear gaining weight, but clearly being stuck at this weight is doing nothing for your confidence either, so in a sense you've nothing to lose by trying it.

Saw some movement quickly followed by a sharp gain of 3.5? Which makes no sense. When I saw the movement though I really felt it. I felt more lean, and tighter. Now I'm back to being less tight and more flab and the inches have returned. Very sickening! I upped from probably eating abour 1000-1200 (after exercise) to eating 1450 (before exercise). It is the weight gain I fear, absolutely, and the clothes not fitting. But that's a good point about confidence. Clearly this is stressing me out so maybe trying to fix my metabolism and gaining a few pounds at the same time is the lesser of two evils.

cmyk wrote: »

Macros look fine to me, maybe bump up the protein slightly, and replace some of your sugary carb sources with more vegetables...you say eating a lot of vegetables, but really it only seems to be a few with your evening meal, from the few days I've looked at. I find that bumping up the vegetable intake makes a difference to everything!

Great to know. I looked back on old diaries and my macros were like 65-75% carbs!!!!!! Oooops

I was looking at it myself today and I think lunch is an issue. I tend to eat v little at work, and then have something when I come home. Maybe I need to put those extra calories in my lunch section.

Realistically I'm only consuming about 260 odd cals until 4pm. Probably not enough fuel to keep me going. I've started bringing my almonds to work which is giving me about 400 cals.

Thanks again for the advice!
Keep it coming because (despite the above about the beloved scone!) I'm really open to advice and constructive criticism.

Orla K

cmyk wrote: »

Yep, and since you've posted this originally I think you've taken that advise and seen some movement? I'd say maybe take a full diet break...that is eating at maintenance for a little while and then start edging your calories back down to create a moderate deficit. I know you fear gaining weight, but clearly being stuck at this weight is doing nothing for your confidence either, so in a sense you've nothing to lose by trying it.

This is near enough to what I was going to say. Do this.

cmyk

doctorwhogirl wrote: »

Thanks so much for your thoughtful reply. Really do appreciate it

No problem, bear in mind though, this is a forum and noone is going to give you a silver bullet to this, and you know your body best. What works for one person doesn't necessarily work for others.

doctorwhogirl wrote: »

I'm pretty tightly wound as a person anyway.

That was my polite way of asking that question ; ) It's far easier said than done but maybe just relaxing into things and not being quite so rigid might just help other things fall into place. How's your sleep, daily stress levels etc.?

doctorwhogirl wrote: »

Saw some movement quickly followed by a sharp gain of 3.5? Which makes no sense.

Fluctuations like that are almost always water retention, especially as you said you felt 'tighter'. Most people will move up and down a few pounds during the day, some more dramatically than others, measure progress over a longer timescale, stop standing on the scales 3 times a day ; ) You also need to give any new diet (or dietary levels) at least a couple of weeks to determine whether or not it's working for you.

doctorwhogirl wrote: »

It is the weight gain I fear, absolutely, and the clothes not fitting. But that's a good point about confidence. Clearly this is stressing me out so maybe trying to fix my metabolism and gaining a few pounds at the same time is the lesser of two evils.

Yep, try eating more towards the maintenance and cut back on some of the training...or look into starting some resistance training, it's benefits are many (again google that). Ask someone in the gym to help you out here, or hire a good trainer, they should do 2 things for you if they're any good...1. Get you training more efficiently and 2. Give you some confidence and motivation in what you're doing.

doctorwhogirl wrote: »

I was looking at it myself today and I think lunch is an issue. I tend to eat v little at work, and then have something when I come home. Maybe I need to put those extra calories in my lunch section.

If you spread your calories out a little better (and add some protein into your earlier meals) that might help curb some of your sweet cravings too. Protein sources are primarily...lean meats, fish, eggs, some dairy and some nuts.

doctorwhogirl

cmyk wrote: »

Yep, try eating more towards the maintenance and cut back on some of the training...or look into starting some resistance training, it's benefits are many (again google that). Ask someone in the gym to help you out here, or hire a good trainer, they should do 2 things for you if they're any good...1. Get you training more efficiently and 2. Give you some confidence and motivation in what you're doing.

If you spread your calories out a little better (and add some protein into your earlier meals) that might help curb some of your sweet cravings too. Protein sources are primarily...lean meats, fish, eggs, some dairy and some nuts.

Thanks again for the thorough reply.

Yep am upping my cals again. I'm going to slowly do it, just to allow my body time to adjust so going up to about 1500 this week-1550.

I love my training as a hobby so will keep at it I think. I've already introduced more resistance training recently so hopefully that will help!

Definitely going to up the breakfast and lunch part of my day.
Going to mix my oats with oat bran for breakfast to have more.

Then up my food intake at break-times with salad and a lean protein and keep bringing my almonds to school!

I know there's no silver bullet but it's great even to talk through a possible plan of action with others rather than trying to tackle it by myself.

Also I'm reluctant to go down the medical route regarding thyroid etc... because I do really believe that eating right can definitely help.