Skipping lectures?

earwax_man

I work very hard; I go to all of my lectures except for one module. I went to it for a month, and now I've realised that I'm wasting hours of my life. There's only a project after week 7, and until then; we're learning about what ethics are and pictures of a guy's holiday. I read the slides from the blackboard site but feel guilty about not going. Does anyone think that I should actually start attending this or should I just go in after week 7 for actual work? I have never missed any other lecture or module beyond this week's for this module. :cool:

gutenberg

earwax_man wrote: »

I work very hard; I go to all of my lectures except for one module. I went to it for a month, and now I've realised that I'm wasting hours of my life. There's only a project after week 7, and until then; we're learning about what ethics are and pictures of a guy's holiday. I read the slides from the blackboard site but feel guilty about not going. Does anyone think that I should actually start attending this or should I just go in after week 7 for actual work? I have never missed any other lecture or module beyond this week's for this module. :cool:

It can sometimes be more beneficial to a student to spend an hour that they would have spent in a lecture reading in the library, if they're going to learn more from the reading than by attending the class. If you're keeping up with the slides and any reading assigned then I don't see any problem with this; maybe occasionally ask a friend who does attend whether anything important came up that wouldn't be on the slides, just in case?

Ravelleman

You're a big boy now. If you don't go to lectures, especially in first year, in most cases no one will notice, come after you or even care. If you've gone and found it to be a waste of time then make a decision and trust your own ability to work these things out.

languagenerd

It very much depends on the course/module in question. In my course, we have to show up to at least 80% of lectures (unless we have medical certs or other valid reason) or we get marked Non-Satisfactory for the term and aren't allowed sit exams. So it's worth checking that there's nothing like that for your course, and whether or not they take attendance.

anothernight

That sounds like 1E8. If I remember it correctly, before you get started on the project the lectures are mostly just waffle. I rarely went to them and it was fine.

Grimebox

Any lecturer worth their salt only use slides as a guideline to what they will actually talk about. So reading the slides alone will never suffice. How many hours a week do you have? While some lectures may appear to be a waste of time, not going at all is an even bigger waste of time.

ajjmk

That's "Introduction to Professional Engineering" if I ever heard it!! I stopped going around this time of year when I was in first year - absolute waste of time imo! Just make sure you're up to date with the project and you should be sound!

Unless a noticeable amount of the class stop turning up and the lecturers start sending around a sign in sheet..

anothernight

Grimebox wrote: »

Any lecturer worth their salt only use slides as a guideline to what they will actually talk about. So reading the slides alone will never suffice. How many hours a week do you have? While some lectures may appear to be a waste of time, not going at all is an even bigger waste of time.

In that module one of the lecturers did just go through his holiday though, complete with pictures as slides. Not going to the lecture and doing some work instead will definitely not be a waste of time, at least not during that part of the module.

When the project begins, the lectures become more worthwhile, iirc.

Grimebox

That's an absolute joke. Get on to your class rep, draft an email and send it on the course co-ordinator.

Unlike you, I am not the model student so if I skip a lecture, there's a very good chance I won't be in the library, probably nursing a hangover instead. I find it best to try not be so arrogant as to believe I am above any lecture regardless of its apparent content.

timmywex

Most engineering lectures are a waste of time and you can do everything in about 2 months before the exams, especially true in first year if you did well in maths/applied maths/physics/dcg in the leaving cert

First year engineers take a few weeks to figure this out, there's some youll still need to go to but theyll be obvious enough

Grimebox

timmywex wrote: »

Most engineering lectures are a waste of time and you can do everything in about 2 months before the exams, especially true in first year if you did well in maths/applied maths/physics/dcg in the leaving cert

First year engineers take a few weeks to figure this out, there's some youll still need to go to but theyll be obvious enough

Yeah this is bad advice

brownacid

Grimebox wrote: »

Yeah this is bad advice

Doesn't stop it being true

andrew

Well I presume it's bad advice because it's not true.

Grimebox

Sorry "Most engineering lectures are a waste of time..." is not true at all.

Calling any of the lecture material a waste of time is folly. Each module is thoroughly examined before it is taught to anybody. I said before students have a horrible tendency to develop an arrogance and believing certain content is above them. I have been there myself, mainly due to laziness to be honest. If anything I was wasting my time by not going to lectures. You may have studied some of the topics previously but can it can't hurt to reinforce it, perhaps you will gain new insights and you will be examined in it shortly anyway. It's a far better strategy to do a little at a time rather than having to cram for everything come exam time. Develop good habits. In later years engineers can have up to 12 exams so cramming can be incredibly difficult in that case.

Ravelleman

It's pretty sad to say that it's not worth going to most of your lectures. It seems to go against the whole spirit of higher education really.

Jhax

I find lectures very unhelpful. It's either one of two scenarios:

1. They read off lecture slides and you lose complete interest after 5 minutes.
2. You have to take down stuff from the board and are focused on taking it down that you completely ignore what the lecturer is talking about.

That being said I have had a few lecturers who had a great balance. They put skeleton notes up on blackboard, and take out important info so you have to go to the lecture to get the info you need to complete the notes for when your revising, and because there isn't much stuff to fill in, you can listen to what they have to say and get a grasp of what is going on.

All that being said, it's taken me 2 years in college to realize that even if a lecture isn't helpful, you should go to it. I've gone to more lecture in the start of this semester than I did probably all of the second semester in 2nd year and I have to say that it's helped me a lot. Not from a learning aspect, but from actually getting into the 'academic' mindset. I find if I go in for my lectures I'll stay behind in the library and study unlike if I stay home I'll just vegetate on the couch for the day. Also I've noticed just by reading the notes I took down in the lecture on the way home from college that day I have a better understanding of the course.

It's really personal preference though. It's no secret that most people can learn more in an hour on their own than in a lecture, but 99% of people who skip don't do anything at all, so it's better to go and do a little than not go and do nothing.

timmywex

Grimebox wrote: »

Yeah this is bad advice

brownacid wrote: »

Doesn't stop it being true

andrew wrote: »

Well I presume it's bad advice because it's not true.

Different for every subject lads, my experience of engineering is its true, and for alot of other people in the class for the first two years anyway

Every lecture has most of the class sitting on facebook anyway, figure as you like :cool:

@Grimebox, what do you study?

brownacid

Grimebox wrote: »

Sorry "Most engineering lectures are a waste of time..." is not true at all.

Calling any of the lecture material a waste of time is folly. Each module is thoroughly examined before it is taught to anybody. I said before students have a horrible tendency to develop an arrogance and believing certain content is above them. I have been there myself, mainly due to laziness to be honest. If anything I was wasting my time by not going to lectures. You may have studied some of the topics previously but can it can't hurt to reinforce it, perhaps you will gain new insights and you will be examined in it shortly anyway. It's a far better strategy to do a little at a time rather than having to cram for everything come exam time. Develop good habits. In later years engineers can have up to 12 exams so cramming can be incredibly difficult in that case.

There are plenty of modules throughout the whole engineering course which are a complete waste and should be completely revised. Things that spring to mind are MAnagement in thrid and fourth year, especially 3rd year and those INtro to engineering modules that just get you to write an essay on a dump or a bridge.
I agree that teh majority of lectures should be attended, the trick is figuring out which isn't worth it.

DeDoc

timmywex wrote: »

Most engineering lectures are a waste of time and you can do everything in about 2 months before the exams, especially true in first year if you did well in maths/applied maths/physics/dcg in the leaving cert

First year engineers take a few weeks to figure this out, there's some youll still need to go to but theyll be obvious enough

Presumably you managed to ace all your exams with this more efficient methodology of yours?

bonerjams03

earwax_man wrote: »

I work very hard; I go to all of my lectures except for one module. I went to it for a month, and now I've realised that I'm wasting hours of my life. There's only a project after week 7, and until then; we're learning about what ethics are and pictures of a guy's holiday. I read the slides from the blackboard site but feel guilty about not going. Does anyone think that I should actually start attending this or should I just go in after week 7 for actual work? I have never missed any other lecture or module beyond this week's for this module. :cool:

lucernarian

DeDoc wrote: »

Presumably you managed to ace all your exams with this more efficient methodology of yours?

Not exactly the best way of measuring "efficiency"? Suppose someone just wanted to avoid having to sit supplementals and pass first year with the minimum effort...

I don't think it's useful to talk about the worth of going to lectures as an absolute thing. Some lectures are clearly going to teach more about a given subject or will have higher penalties for lack of attendance than others, and so on.

And who are we kidding, is a class rep who's pretty much around a wet week in comparison to some lecturers going to be listened to and have course changes adopted?

Ravelleman

To_be_confirmed wrote: »

And who are we kidding, is a class rep who's pretty much around a wet week in comparison to some lecturers going to be listened to and have course changes adopted?

Indeed, every undergrad, JF especially, is an expert.

DeDoc

I don't think anyone should be above criticism, but there are mechanisms to express your concern (e.g. through a class rep). Or you could have a look at past exam papers and try and relate what the lecturer is doing - and if you can't see any relevance then ask.

I'm sure most would be delighted to talk to someone interested enough to have made that effort.

I'd just be pretty wary of blanket statements encouraging people to skip lectures - in my own experience, those who skipped lots of lectures tended to correlate pretty closely with those who did badly on the courses and vice versa

Grimebox

timmywex wrote: »

Different for every subject lads, my experience of engineering is its true, and for alot of other people in the class for the first two years anyway

Every lecture has most of the class sitting on facebook anyway, figure as you like :cool:

@Grimebox, what do you study?

I don't see how what I study is relevant to be honest. I study computer science. Not that far off engineering

lazy girl

everyone skips lectures!!!

Equium

If you're going to spend the time focussing on your weaker subjects, then I don't see a problem with skipping certain lectures. Most years in engineering seem to have a 'filler' module which can be passed with the minimum of effort. I (and a good number of the class) often worked on projects or lab reports during the time scheduled for these subjects. As long as you make up the hours before the exam, you should be fine.

Grimebox

This thread is an argument for fully reintroducing fee's

anothernight

Grimebox wrote: »

This thread is an argument for fully reintroducing fee's

Or for removing filler modules in courses.

When I was in first year, one of the lecturers I had for one of those filler modules was incredibly boring and barely taught us anything in most lectures. I have him again this year, and he's actually a brilliant lecturer who tries his best to really teach us the material. I think he just knew how pointless that module was and probably hated it as much as we did.

There's an awful lot of stuff that we have to attend that is completely unnecessary.

timmywex

anothernight wrote: »

Or for removing filler modules in courses.

When I was in first year, one of the lecturers I had for one of those filler modules was incredibly boring and barely taught us anything in most lectures. I have him again this year, and he's actually a brilliant lecturer who tries his best to really teach us the material. I think he just knew how pointless that module was and probably hated it as much as we did.

There's an awful lot of stuff that we have to attend that is completely unnecessary.

Mainly because of engineers Ireland & accreditation really, some subjects on ethics, management etc are kinda pointless but have to be covered!

Chuchoter

Question guys, what constitutes 'non satisfactory' attendance as regards seminars? I'm in first year law and I've accidentally missed two (one because of a timetable change I didn't know about and the other because the bus was late). I know two in 4 weeks isn't great, but what is the cut off and will they warn me?

languagenerd

Chuchoter wrote: »

Question guys, what constitutes 'non satisfactory' attendance as regards seminars? I'm in first year law and I've accidentally missed two (one because of a timetable change I didn't know about and the other because the bus was late). I know two in 4 weeks isn't great, but what is the cut off and will they warn me?

It varies across courses, but university standard is one third (i.e. you must attend at least 2 thirds of classes). I'm not sure if that's in every module or overall - probably per module, because I'm sure you can't just go to all classes of four modules and none of another two! 11-week term, so don't miss more than 3 of them (if they're weekly) and you'll be fine!

From the Calendar:

23 All students must fulfil the requirements of the school or department, as appropriate, with regard to attendance and course work. Where specific requirements are not stated, students may be deemed non-satisfactory if they miss more than a third of their course of study or fail to submit a third of the required course work in any term.

I've actually never heard of anyone being returned NS (I'm sure they exist, just no-one I know of), so don't worry too much about it

Grimebox

Well if there isn't attendance taken in a given class you can miss every single lecture and nothing will happen. Even with attendance taken, its not unheard of for nothing to happen too. Lecturers and staff have enough on their plate as it is then to be worrying about attendance of every student. The whole NS thing for attendance has always occurred to me as an empty threat to be honest, I'm basing my opinion on absolutely no real evidence however

Lawliet

I have heard of people getting them, but they were all in taking the piss territory, as in they never showed up to anything, but even with the NS they were allowed sit their exams.
I can't see any department going to the trouble of giving you a slap on the wrist for a handful of absences.

gutenberg

Likewise, I haven't heard of anyone actually getting an NS for attendance reasons but I do know that one coursemate was hauled in front of our head of department and threatened with one, if he didn't attend all the remaining classes for all courses for that year; however, as in Lawliet's case, he was in 'taking the piss' territory. In practice I don't know how it was monitored either, as our course spanned two departments so the HoD was dependent on the other department taking attendance as well. He told our friend that he had informed the other department, but it's hard to know if he actually did... The guy did get to sit his exams anyway, ended up with a low 2.2.

Maybe_Memories

I've heard of people being threatened with NS after missing one lecture in medicine/dentistry.

Gordon Gecko

Maybe_Memories wrote: »

I've heard of people being threatened with NS after missing one lecture in medicine/dentistry.

Depends whether they take a roll at the lecture or not but if you miss a couple of tutorials in Dent they haul your ass up to the Dean (of Dent, scarier than Junior Dean by a country mile) and you have to explain yourself.

nervous_twitch

Grimebox wrote: »

The whole NS thing for attendance has always occurred to me as an empty threat to be honest, I'm basing my opinion on absolutely no real evidence however

I wasn't going to post, but then I saw this and had to.

I got 3 NS's in my SF year and was disqualified from exams; thus automatically having to repeat the year and pay €6000 for the privilege. As others have mentioned though, it's only when you're in absolute taking-the-piss territory. I was going to about 3 tutorials/lectures per week - doing all the required work, mind you - just never going to class. So while I'm sure it's OK to miss a good few lectures, it's definitely not an empty threat.

Before anyone asks, I don't know what the hell I was doing at the time. Just working and drinking and acting the dope :rolleyes:

gavmcg92

I remember 1E8. Pointless lectures where the lecturer felt as if it was self appraisal hour. "I did this ... I did that... I get paid this much ...." etc.
Like others here have mentioned, I would recommend that you attend them the odd time or ask someone who attends them regularly if there has been any changes, just so you don't miss out on any assignments handed out, suggestions for the report etc.
From what I can remember, you have to write a fairly long report come December. Remember that module is 10 credits and cannot be repeated if you fail. (just remember that)

Grimebox

Or you could just be that someone who goes to all the lectures so you don't have to ask someone who attends them regularly if there has been any changes, just so you don't miss out on any assignments handed out, suggestions for the report etc.