Dairyfarming

Dairynewbie

Looking for advice re dairy farm.
87acres of land 50acres tillage ground and remainder grass reasonably dry cattle out wintered on it the past few years. No facilities at all a few gates maybe. Additional 34 acres tillage ground 4k away. And 24acres next to house with small slatted shed 12k away from 87 acre block.
I'm thinking of building a cubicle house and parlor on the 87 acre plot and was just wondering how many cows could I aim for on this. Bearing in mind the poor year we are in at the moment. I also have 50 acre plot 45k from the home house. I'm looking to sell this to finance the project.

I'm under 35 and I have a 3 rd level degree.

Any suggestions would be appreciated.

kevthegaff

Dairynewbie wrote: »

Looking for advice re dairy farm.
87acres of land 50acres tillage ground and remainder grass reasonably dry cattle out wintered on it the past few years. No facilities at all a few gates maybe. Additional 34 acres tillage ground 4k away. And 24acres next to house with small slatted shed 12k away from 87 acre block.
I'm thinking of building a cubicle house and parlor on the 87 acre plot and was just wondering how many cows could I aim for on this. Bearing in mind the poor year we are in at the moment. I also have 50 acre plot 45k from the home house. I'm looking to sell this to finance the project.

I'm under 35 and I have a 3 rd level degree.

Any suggestions would be appreciated.

iits gona cost quite a lot for water, paddocks and roadways alone. In the long run id imagine 70-100 cows depending on quality and use of external block. id apply as a new entrant first of all for quota

Dairynewbie

Water already there for the grazing ground and existing road ways just need to be scraped and thin layer of quarry dust added I omitted that from the first post. I just have to move a few trees and I measured 2.9k of fencing needed. The big investment will be the buildings milking machine and stock. Quota I'm looking to avoid buying any and just going on a whim that I can get supplying rights in 2015. It seams that there is no road map to what is happening. Post 2015... Just before anyone starts giving out about all the quota they bought just give a thought for the landless 20 year old I was starting out... Only one of the properties was inherited and this was recently...

Timmaay

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=77779147 Decent thread here about starting out in Dairy, its something you need to plan out very carefully, ask yourself is it the right move and are you committed to 2milkings 7days a wk for most the year! Also, Teagasc have a decent book on starting out or expansion of your existing herd, costs about 25quid!

Dairynewbie

Ya saw the dairy manual.. I'm not overly keen on teagasc.. Or any of their publications I prefer dairyni.com, dairdni.gov.uk and dairyco.co.uk as sources. Im trying to talk to people on the front line first. Not the people who work in neverland. While i admit they have a place just not in my plans.

Tipp Man

Dairynewbie wrote: »

Ya saw the dairy manual.. I'm not overly keen on teagasc.. Or any of their publications I prefer dairyni.com, dairdni.gov.uk and dairyco.co.uk as sources. Im trying to talk to people on the front line first. Not the people who work in neverland. While i admit they have a place just not in my plans.

Personally i think the Irish dairy industry has very little to learn from the UK dairy industry - although it is only a stones throw away the outlook, the market and the industry are entirely different

stanflt

Dairynewbie wrote: »

Ya saw the dairy manual.. I'm not overly keen on teagasc.. Or any of their publications I prefer dairyni.com, dairdni.gov.uk and dairyco.co.uk as sources. Im trying to talk to people on the front line first. Not the people who work in neverland. While i admit they have a place just not in my plans.

avoid teagasc at your financial peril- you dont have to follow them 100 or even 50%-

totally different markets in the south.

milkprofit

100 cows 140,000
parlor etc and housing 250,000

unless u go topless cubicles -pad or kale assuming existing housing for calving and rearing calves
If think of milking cows for u life time go milk for a good dairy farmer for 1 year
What possibility of partnership with some one who has facilities
Land far away lease out sell a quire more near or adjoing

keep going

one question, have you ever worked on a grass based dairy farm

OldnBold

Dairynewbie wrote: »

Ya saw the dairy manual.. I'm not overly keen on teagasc.. Or any of their publications I prefer dairyni.com, dairdni.gov.uk and dairyco.co.uk as sources. Im trying to talk to people on the front line first. Not the people who work in neverland. While i admit they have a place just not in my plans.

Can't but agree. Teagasc totally focused on their system which certainly doesn't suit me. If you're into liquid milk or based North of Dublin then what happens in Greenmount may be of assistance. Above all make your own mind up based on what you want farming to give you.

Dairynewbie

keep going wrote: »

one question, have you ever worked on a grass based dairy farm

Yes for 1 year while in nz... A few years ago now. Alot bigger that what I'm looking to do.

Dairynewbie

OldnBold wrote: »

Dairynewbie wrote: »

Ya saw the dairy manual.. I'm not overly keen on teagasc.. Or any of their publications I prefer dairyni.com, dairdni.gov.uk and dairyco.co.uk as sources. Im trying to talk to people on the front line first. Not the people who work in neverland. While i admit they have a place just not in my plans.

Can't but agree. Teagasc totally focused on their system which certainly doesn't suit me. If you're into liquid milk or based North of Dublin then what happens in Greenmount may be of assistance. Above all make your own mind up based on what you want farming to give you.

I'm based in the south east.

Dairynewbie

Does anyone have any experience with breeds like dairy shorthorn and brown Swiss. I'm looking to do something different. (Never was one to follow the Crowd)

Viewtodiefor

Dairynewbie wrote: »

Looking for advice re dairy farm.
87acres of land 50acres tillage ground and remainder grass reasonably dry cattle out wintered on it the past few years. No facilities at all a few gates maybe. Additional 34 acres tillage ground 4k away. And 24acres next to house with small slatted shed 12k away from 87 acre block.
I'm thinking of building a cubicle house and parlor on the 87 acre plot and was just wondering how many cows could I aim for on this. Bearing in mind the poor year we are in at the moment. I also have 50 acre plot 45k from the home house. I'm looking to sell this to finance the project.

I'm under 35 and I have a 3 rd level degree.

Any suggestions would be appreciated.

Is there any sfp on what you own at present?
Are you working at present?

I'm just thinking out loud here. You have 145 acres in total correct?

Just you leased it @ 175 acre = 25375
SPF to be confirmed

Costs of getting into 100 cows will be large
And if you sell land to finance it then you will be renting closer to 87 acre block
Cows 100k
Parlour diy job 25k
Housing diy job 25k
Slurry tanks 25k
Milk tank 5k
Esb and other works 15k

Conservative figures and very rough but you can see 250k will just bout get u started in milk with less land than you began with .

Viewtodiefor

Viewtodiefor wrote: »

Dairynewbie wrote: »

Looking for advice re dairy farm.
87acres of land 50acres tillage ground and remainder grass reasonably dry cattle out wintered on it the past few years. No facilities at all a few gates maybe. Additional 34 acres tillage ground 4k away. And 24acres next to house with small slatted shed 12k away from 87 acre block.
I'm thinking of building a cubicle house and parlor on the 87 acre plot and was just wondering how many cows could I aim for on this. Bearing in mind the poor year we are in at the moment. I also have 50 acre plot 45k from the home house. I'm looking to sell this to finance the project.

I'm under 35 and I have a 3 rd level degree.

Any suggestions would be appreciated.

Is there any sfp on what you own at present?
Are you working at present?

I'm just thinking out loud here. You have 145 acres in total correct?

Just you leased it @ 175 acre = 25375
SPF to be confirmed

Costs of getting into 100 cows will be large
And if you sell land to finance it then you will be renting closer to 87 acre block
Cows 100k
Parlour diy job 25k
Housing diy job 25k
Slurry tanks 25k
Milk tank 5k
Esb and other works 15k

Conservative figures and very rough but you can see 250k will just bout get u started in milk with less land than you began with .

Just saw your going to sell additional 50acres that's another 8750 in rent.

My opinion unless you fancy it big time rent it n work away at sumthing else. It will be a long time before you make enough money out of the cows to buy back your 50 acres

Second option sell the lot and buy a farm with 150 or more block n facilities at least then you'd hit the ground running.

Pacoa

Buy one of these

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wzRN4AiS9j4

then buy old cows in april and send them to the factory in october. Simples :-)

49801

Pacoa wrote: »

Buy one of these

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wzRN4AiS9j4

then buy old cows in april and send them to the factory in october. Simples :-)

A bit tough on the knee's!!! but concept has merit.

Markcheese

Pacoa wrote: »

Buy one of these

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wzRN4AiS9j4

then buy old cows in april and send them to the factory in october. Simples :-)

Brilliant ... Better than paying for concrete and the tanks, spreading ect. Less road ways less lameness , great for a farm that's not in one block ...
You'd need flat ground though, a fair bit of moving daily ( move parlour twice a day) bulk tank , generator .. Feed ...

Sure I saw something on nationwide years ago where a couple of lads up the country built a tow able herring bone parlour . Cows went up ramps,milker stood in pit... It folded back hydraulically for road transport....

Dont be daft

Markcheese wrote: »

Brilliant ... Better than paying for concrete and the tanks, spreading ect. Less road ways less lameness , great for a farm that's not in one block ...
You'd need flat ground though, a fair bit of moving daily ( move parlour twice a day) bulk tank , generator .. Feed ...

Sure I saw something on nationwide years ago where a couple of lads up the country built a tow able herring bone parlour . Cows went up ramps,milker stood in pit... It folded back hydraulically for road transport....

Lad in Kerry built it for a farm he had rented up the country. Mad lookin yoke altogether.
Some hardship towing it around the place come October and it gettin stuck everywere. Then tearing up the place to get it out.
Dont know if he still uses it but he pulled out of the farm up the country after 2 years of it.

I wouldnt like to be taking it on as a permanent solution. Milking is bad enough on the soul, without having to throw hardship into the mix.

Heard he sold the design to delaval or dairymaster after.

Dairynewbie

Was looking at a few options and met with the bank. Selling the 50acre parcel is off the table now. Impossible to sell at the moment.
I have got finance approved to start work next year. Done plans for a 90 cow cubicle house and 10 unit swing over best milking parlor. Got it costed before I submit it for planning. 180k
Roadways in place and water.
One person I met recently said I should go for jersey cows. Easier hardier and milk of their backs cross with pb Angus/Hereford.
Ai sexed semen for replacements.
Is he mad? Worked with jersey cross in nz but never was involved in the financials so don't know how the pb jerseys would work out. Any ideas.

case 5150

Dairynewbie wrote: »

Was looking at a few options and met with the bank. Selling the 50acre parcel is off the table now. Impossible to sell at the moment.
I have got finance approved to start work next year. Done plans for a 90 cow cubicle house and 10 unit swing over best milking parlor. Got it costed before I submit it for planning. 180k
Roadways in place and water.
One person I met recently said I should go for jersey cows. Easier hardier and milk of their backs cross with pb Angus/Hereford.
Ai sexed semen for replacements.
Is he mad? Worked with jersey cross in nz but never was involved in the financials so don't know how the pb jerseys would work out. Any ideas.

180k you mad and you only starting out?? low cost, no fancy frills, basic i say start with, upgrade then
it going to cost you way more you have ta buy cows as well

and you are forgetting the most important thing before you milk is QUOTA, any QUOTA secured yet have you!!!

funny man

Dairynewbie wrote: »

Was looking at a few options and met with the bank. Selling the 50acre parcel is off the table now. Impossible to sell at the moment.
I have got finance approved to start work next year. Done plans for a 90 cow cubicle house and 10 unit swing over best milking parlor. Got it costed before I submit it for planning. 180k
Roadways in place and water.
One person I met recently said I should go for jersey cows. Easier hardier and milk of their backs cross with pb Angus/Hereford.
Ai sexed semen for replacements.
Is he mad? Worked with jersey cross in nz but never was involved in the financials so don't know how the pb jerseys would work out. Any ideas.

don't know if that's true 50acres @10k/acre easily achievable around me.
90 cows accom and swing over parlour at 180k is good value if all concrete collecting and handling yards, also all equipment including dairy and bulk milk tank are included. What about stock and i pressume your going to build it over the next 2 years or you already have quota sorted.
JerseyX cows have a reputation for better fertility, "milk of their back", they sure will as will any breed if they are in negative energy balance, in lay mans terms if they aren't fully fed.
AI sexed semen was a big thing when i started farming over 40 years ago, as it still is today but no one has cracked it yet, sexed semen is ok for replacement heifers, with higher conception rates it may be a runner, for cows NO! compact calving is more important.

Timmaay

You hardly need the best 10unit swing over parlour on the market straight up, there are numerous lads pulling old 6/8unit parlours out at the minute and are flogging them off for nothing on donedeal. You'd save a bundle with something small for the minute, and once you are clever about it, you can size up everything so as you can drop in a fancy 10unit without having to change any walls etc in the future no problem. An old parlour doesn't mean your cutting corners either, I know plenty of lads with old 6/8unit milking parlours and they milk always themselves without spending hours in the parlour, and have no issues with scc or milk quality etc, most things like that are down to management rather than old stainless steel anyway! Similarly with the sheds, its possible to do it in phases, have everything fairly well laid out at the start, just say putup 50 cubicles for now and putup the rest later!

Finally, go get that new Irish Dairy Magazine (there's a thread in the farming section here about it on the 1st or 2nd page), some excellent examples in it of how dairyfarmers are starting out/expanding at the minute, and the costs involved etc.

maxxuumman

Dairynewbie wrote: »

Was looking at a few options and met with the bank. Selling the 50acre parcel is off the table now. Impossible to sell at the moment.
I have got finance approved to start work next year. Done plans for a 90 cow cubicle house and 10 unit swing over best milking parlor. Got it costed before I submit it for planning. 180k
Roadways in place and water.
One person I met recently said I should go for jersey cows. Easier hardier and milk of their backs cross with pb Angus/Hereford.
Ai sexed semen for replacements.
Is he mad? Worked with jersey cross in nz but never was involved in the financials so don't know how the pb jerseys would work out. Any ideas.

From having been in you shoes, 3rd level degree, off farm job, starting cows from scratch, I would advise you against what you are doing.
That aside for the moment, on what you have posted above.
1. I agree with the bank. Don't sell an appreciating asset, to invest in a depreciating one. Your figures on 100 cows should be well able to service a 180k loan over 15 yrs. the land will be available to you to sell if a parcel comes up near you in the future. In the mean time you could short term lease out that block to help you finance the loan.
2. I wouldn't be afraid of the loan. You are "young", in so far as, you are 35 so you have 15-20 yrs to go hard, at cows. Service your mortgage, make some money and have some options at the age of 55. Do your building and facilities right now. And set yourself up for a low labour, low cost system.. You will have very little capital investment to do over a15to 20 yr period, and that will maximise the value of depreciation , on what you build now.
3. Be realistic, at that acerage, and that cow numbers you are going to be a one man show, looking after 100 or so cows, 7 days a week. You may be able to afford occasional help, or relief, but that's it. You don't want to be doing this at 70yrs of age.

On the jersey thing, personally wouldn't be my cup of tea. Ireland has a very large beef industry, there is a good value on cull cows, and good calves. For that last few yrs, I've gone sexedmsemen on the heifers, and a dairy bull to tidy up the heifers. Usually get 70-75% heifers/bull from the heifers. It means a beef stock bull can be used to do alot of the serving of the cows. Good factory cull cows, and good beefy calves , can be a good earner.

OBTW, still think you are crazy to be getting into cows!!!!

mahoney_j

On the jerseys personally id stay well away from them,They are ideal for a country like new zealand where 4 and 5 hundered cow herds are common.In this country your ideal cow is a 50/50 hol freisan british freisan cross.She will give you loads of milk be as fertile as a jersey if managed correctly,Have a valuable bull calf and a more valieable heifer calf and at the end of her day she will come into good money as a cull.Jerseys just cant milk to the potential of a freisan ainmal and if u have to supplement her the only change will be the colour of her dung!wheresas a freisan cow will produce more milk as well as mantaning condition.If you want to try a different type of cow id go for the pedigree ayrshires or a ayreshire/freisan cross

6480

Dairynewbie wrote: »

Was looking at a few options and met with the bank. Selling the 50acre parcel is off the table now. Impossible to sell at the moment.
I have got finance approved to start work next year. Done plans for a 90 cow cubicle house and 10 unit swing over best milking parlor. Got it costed before I submit it for planning. 180k
Roadways in place and water.
One person I met recently said I should go for jersey cows. Easier hardier and milk of their backs cross with pb Angus/Hereford.
Ai sexed semen for replacements.
Is he mad? Worked with jersey cross in nz but never was involved in the financials so don't know how the pb jerseys would work out. Any ideas.

best of luck if u go ahead but what i heard at the ICMSA AGM in limerick last friday was that milk price will dip in mid 2015
because of a surplus of milk products on the markets from the whole EU when the quota s go

Viewtodiefor

6480 wrote: »

best of luck if u go ahead but what i heard at the ICMSA AGM in limerick last friday was that milk price will dip in mid 2015
because of a surplus of milk products on the markets from the whole EU when the quota s go[/Quote

Your mad!

Conflats

Teagasc's push for jersey would be the only major turn off for me if I wanted advice on dairying.

Greenfields project is good to show you can start a dairy farm from scratch (ok big block of dry land and big quota) Is shows the basics.

Using N.I figures, I couldnt see a benefit they have cows in more, heavier soil more rain etc.

Ask dairy farmers around for a good adviser, ask a few could you maybe tag along at discussion groups meetings and as has being said before go and milk for someone else before you invest time and serious money in it. You dont want to find 5 years down the line you dont like it

milkprofit

Dairynewbie wrote: »

Was looking at a few options and met with the bank. Selling the 50acre parcel is off the table now. Impossible to sell at the moment.
I have got finance approved to start work next year. Done plans for a 90 cow cubicle house and 10 unit swing over best milking parlor. Got it costed before I submit it for planning. 180k
Roadways in place and water.
One person I met recently said I should go for jersey cows. Easier hardier and milk of their backs cross with pb Angus/Hereford.
Ai sexed semen for replacements.
Is he mad? Worked with jersey cross in nz but never was involved in the financials so don't know how the pb jerseys would work out. Any ideas.

Can you post u costings repayment schedule etc to get feed back from her to see if it is possible to do
Go to the best dairy farmer in your area Work for him for one or two days for next two years while u are in the planing building phase and get his imput also get access to his financials - with in reason of course

Markcheese

Most important thing is your choice of cow,my bias is to what can produce the most milk per acre off grass grass and more grass, smaller cows cut ground less and eat less per kg of solids ... If you need beef calves go B Friesan...
Your sheds and parlour should suit yr cows (not the other way round) a budget parlour and the open air cubicles would mean less debt and less exposure too an inevitable milk price drop (or cost increase)
Don't forget price wise you'll be competing with farmers here and abroad who don't owe .25 million plus for their 80/100 cow unit ....
Main thing is GO FOR IT, you want it , if the sums add up only you make it happen for yourself...

cosatron

like the rest of the posters, i think your mad. having worked with my dad for the last 8 years with 40 to 50 cows, its allot of work and you are married to them and its a way of life and i hope you realise that. also 180 k is allot of money to spend when that kind of money is not in the dairy industry for the next couple of years when the post quota era settles down as its already predicted that the price of milk will be down in 2015. i think you should start small and work your way up.

Dairynewbie

Thanks for the comments..
Just to clear up a few things. I don't need to go work for a local farmer. Have plenty of experience in that regard.
180k estimate was doing the project direct labour. I also have a few quid for quota, machinery, stock.
Good friend is a dairyman near by so we will be helping out each other.
He has near 150 acres in one block. Milking 85 cows not expanding thinks that's all he needs. (I agree) He has a mortgage on his house. And the old pair are still draining him.
I'm working full time at the moment and wife has a secure job. No other borrowings. or legacy issues. My parents are retired and are not taking a wage. My intention is to scale back in my day job over 18months. Buy in young stock and go mad.

At the moment I'm making a little over 20k from the rents and when it's added to my day job it's even less. Don't see the point of having nearly 2mil in assets and getting very little in return. No sfp (don't ask why. Long story)
I don't see the point in doing things half arsed. I see buildings as assets so don't mind the cost.
I see a few local farmers around here always complaining about prices and building falling down and the place in a right state. Yet new jeeps and large 4x4 modern tractors. One guy's dad was up at the fence the other day was saying how he managed with a 2 wheel drive all his life. And the young fella has 2 newish 4x4 tractors sitting in the shed mostly In full view. That's where the margin is going.

hillclimber

You mentioned in an earlier post that you were a landless 20 year old starting out. To accumulate that amount of land in 15 years is a fair achievement. If you want to increase your net worth, why not continue with the same formula? Getting bogged down in a one man dairy operation is no fun at all. Best of luck if you decide to go ahead anyway.:)

Dairynewbie

Bought a sites and developed them and got out before it was too late. Was an Anglo kid. Started dealing with them when I was 20/21 put profits into land sold last property in 2007. Then built a house for myself and my wife. When I think how easy it was compared to what I hear now. The bank was out of order. When I started I got a loan from the credit union used this as my 10% deposit. Was part time in college. Was a massive struggle the first one but worked hard.

The bank rep I dealt with was looking for me to buy shares with the profits and they were willing to extend credit based on the shares. I chose the route of buying land and using it as collateral. Developed 2 houses on the purchased land and sold them on.

Key to any project. Is take risks when you have nothing. And protect yourself when you have.
And never loose the run of yourself.
Now with wife and kids I don't think I would do it again. 180k loan does not frighten me as loan to value is about 10%

I based my projections on 22cent a litre.
The purchasing of quota is something I was trying to avoid. But I think I need to be in the system to get rights.

Timmaay

Dairynewbie wrote: »

The purchasing of quota is something I was trying to avoid. But I think I need to be in the system to get rights.

Hmm yeh the whole uncertainty over so called processing rights is annoying. I don't know what co-op you would supply, but Glanbia have already got the ball rolling with their 2cent/litre levy for any extra milk processed above your march 2012 quota level (ie from when they announced it). Any quota purchased after this doesn't count, ie if you buy 200k Litres off Glanbia now, you'll have to pay the 2cent/litre on the full whack from 2015 on.

And on the loan to value of only 10%, I assume that's the land value you are talking about? I don't know if that's really relevant at all, the banks would all be firing money at us "rich" farmers in that case ha. The most important thing is your capacity to meet the repayments, and in the likes of a bad year will they cripple you? We are likely to be in for a shaky year in 2015/16 as a flood of European quota free milk hits the markets, I'd almost guarantee you there will be times then when you're stuck in the milking parlour in a cold wet morning, with rubbish milk prices, and 180k hanging over your head, and you'll be saying what the hell was I thinking :P!

Timmaay

Dairynewbie wrote: »

Don't see the point of having nearly 2mil in assets and getting very little in return.

Hmmm don't kid yourself on this point to be honest, Land might be worth 10k/acre on paper, but from an agricultural point of view, its worth a fraction of that, maybe 3k/acre, with dairying giving at best €800/acre/yr return (for a shed load of work!). An easy decent return on investment in land will only come from its value increasing, hard to see that happening for many years to come in the current market!

(Sorry we are all trying to pick holds in your plans here ha, its just that the grass is always greener and all that, esp when we have been through a very tough year now!)

Dairynewbie

Thanks for the reply's

Grass is not always greener. Just in my case is I spend 1.25 hours getting to work in the morning and same in the evening. That's just mad. Considering I could travel 10-15 min and be less stressed. On a Friday of a bank holiday or if some idiot has a fender bender near the tunnel you could add .5 to 1 hour. I'm off this week and its great.

As I said investment in good facilities and buildings will add to its value so don't mind at all. Also the interest relief to be got can go against my income which helps.


My design has everything under one roof. No auto scrapers. 2 Slatted tanks under passageways.
Additional small kit shed to be erected for straw storage and equipment.
Feed area on outside of shed. Good shelter in area I intend building it on.
While the estimate is only for the bank I know il put in more and spend more while doing it but all I'm going to be out to the bank is the 180k.

whelan1

Dairynewbie wrote: »

Thanks for the reply's

Grass is not always greener. Just in my case is I spend 1.25 hours getting to work in the morning and same in the evening. That's just mad. Considering I could travel 10-15 min and be less stressed. On a Friday of a bank holiday or if some idiot has a fender bender near the tunnel you could add .5 to 1 hour. I'm off this week and its great.

As I said investment in good facilities and buildings will add to its value so don't mind at all. Also the interest relief to be got can go against my income which helps.


My design has everything under one roof. No auto scrapers. 2 Slatted tanks under passageways.
Additional small kit shed to be erected for straw storage and equipment.
Feed area on outside of shed. Good shelter in area I intend building it on.
While the estimate is only for the bank I know il put in more and spend more while doing it but all I'm going to be out to the bank is the 180k.

But on the friday of a bank holiday weekend you are looking forward to 3 full days off, doesnt happen in dairy farming

6480

Dairynewbie wrote: »

Thanks for the reply's

Grass is not always greener. Just in my case is I spend 1.25 hours getting to work in the morning and same in the evening. That's just mad. Considering I could travel 10-15 min and be less stressed. On a Friday of a bank holiday or if some idiot has a fender bender near the tunnel you could add .5 to 1 hour. I'm off this week and its great.

As I said investment in good facilities and buildings will add to its value so don't mind at all. Also the interest relief to be got can go against my income which helps.


My design has everything under one roof. No auto scrapers. 2 Slatted tanks under passageways.
Additional small kit shed to be erected for straw storage and equipment.
Feed area on outside of shed. Good shelter in area I intend building it on.
While the estimate is only for the bank I know il put in more and spend more while doing it but all I'm going to be out to the bank is the 180k.

2.5 hours a day wont do much dairy farming for u , it will take a few more hours

keep going

in my view you either want to do it or not.on the minus side you will have to work how hard depends on you and what you want to achieve and while you will gather wealth it might not be disposible income.on the plus side no commuting and your job dosent seem to grab you and you do get to spend time in a family envoirment but you might have to be working at the same time.a huge question here is how does your partner feel about it.it wont work without her buying in.final point.budget must be less than 2000e a cow to establish which is very tight.nothing wrong with outwintering on the tillage land for a few years to establish cash flow but dont think i would spend the rest of my life at it

Viewtodiefor

Dairynewbie wrote: »

Thanks for the reply's

Grass is not always greener. Just in my case is I spend 1.25 hours getting to work in the morning and same in the evening. That's just mad. Considering I could travel 10-15 min and be less stressed. On a Friday of a bank holiday or if some idiot has a fender bender near the tunnel you could add .5 to 1 hour. I'm off this week and its great.

As I said investment in good facilities and buildings will add to its value so don't mind at all. Also the interest relief to be got can go against my income which helps.


My design has everything under one roof. No auto scrapers. 2 Slatted tanks under passageways.
Additional small kit shed to be erected for straw storage and equipment.
Feed area on outside of shed. Good shelter in area I intend building it on.
While the estimate is only for the bank I know il put in more and spend more while doing it but all I'm going to be out to the bank is the 180k.

Very similar circumstances job wise to yourself here, was traveling 3 hours a day up at 6 back at 7pm, difference I have is cows and most infrastructure in place already for expansion. Left job approx 2 yrs ago .
You really need to be committed to this and dint think it will be any easier if fact it will probably be harder but you won't have the traveling. Cash wise you will spend more than your budget that's pretty much guarenteed it always happens on big jobs.
Depends how much of a wage you need out of it for first five years, it is definitely possible but you will be working he'll of a lot of hours for little return for few years considering you are starting from scratch. You will need huge determination and drive going forward, what's your family situation like partner etc? Holidays will be a problem, are you ready for cows 24 seven???

If you are go for it but don't expect it to change your life overnight!!

awaywithyou

dairynewbie,

i think fair play to you for going ahead with this project...

i was wondering what age you are and have you children...?

1chippy

It doesnt really matter what any of us think. But if you have the inclination go for it. what will you say to yourself in twenty years.

mahoney_j

Dairynewbie i think you should be complimented for your positivity in going ahead with this project.You seem to have a passion for the land and for cows and you also have some good financial experience behind you from your buying and selling of sites/houses etc and not getting too greedy by getting out early.I worked off farm for 11 years before i took over from my father but i always looked forward to comming home and working the land and milking cows.I wouldnt swap where i am now for anything else.yes i work hard (7am start and finish at 6)and still manage to take time off by getting father to milk and some relief milking from frs whenever needed.Im milking 70 cows and am making a devcent living out of it but have invested in the farm(new parlour ,reseeding etc to make life that bit easier.Not a fan of hardship and low cost high labour input systems

royalmeath

Why would you cripple yourself with debt when you dont have to. If you have 50 acres that far from your base
then sell it, why not?. You would be coming into dairying with no debt and if a bit of land came up beside you
you would have cash readily available. No one knows what way the milk situation really will be post quota so if you
borrow 180k and a year later your getting 15 cent a litre for your milk the ball will move swiftly out of your court and into the banks.
If you are to set up dairying then why not start with 30 or 40 cows see how you go and if your enjoying the job then consider expansion.
Also with regard your milking facilities there is no need to go out and buy a brand new plant. there are plenty of preowned milking machines
in great condition and you would have no problem getting a fitter to install it. I myself am milking in a parlour that was installed more than 30
years ago. With a little bit of tlc a milking machine will last a lifetime

TheSunderz

and wat happens if the price of milk drops to 20 cents!! looking to go into dairy myself

freedominacup

TheSunderz wrote: »

and wat happens if the price of milk drops to 20 cents!! looking to go into dairy myself

you loose money:eek:

mf240

freedominacup wrote: »

you loose money:eek:

will it stop at 20 whos to say it wont go to 15 when all this milk flows.

I dont intend to carry any debt into the post quota era.

All that said having read dairynewbies posts I have every faith in him.

Best of luck dairynewbie.

F.D

waiting to get shot down in a blaze of glory here but anyway...Go All out Borrow an extra 150K put in a robot, and then keep the off farm job partime for a few hours per day, at least the milking is done and you can use the time to do the other essential jobs, and if the milk price crashes at least you are still bring in enough to keep the house and family, the farm should cover the cost of itself, and when/if it all levels out and the milk is back to a good price you can quit the off farm job

Viewtodiefor

F.D wrote: »

waiting to get shot down in a blaze of glory here but anyway...Go All out Borrow an extra 150K put in a robot, and then keep the off farm job partime for a few hours per day, at least the milking is done and you can use the time to do the other essential jobs, and if the milk price crashes at least you are still bring in enough to keep the house and family, the farm should cover the cost of itself, and when/if it all levels out and the milk is back to a good price you can quit the off farm job

This may make sense if you can get ur paddock layout right!

grazeaway

F.D wrote: »

waiting to get shot down in a blaze of glory here but anyway...Go All out Borrow an extra 150K put in a robot, and then keep the off farm job partime for a few hours per day, at least the milking is done and you can use the time to do the other essential jobs, and if the milk price crashes at least you are still bring in enough to keep the house and family, the farm should cover the cost of itself, and when/if it all levels out and the milk is back to a good price you can quit the off farm job

i'd kinda agree with ya there, espically from a green field startup, key would be to get the layout right at the start. if the farm is nice and square then the paddocks could be already in place. with the size of the land going above 80 cows would proably mean needing the land down the road for grazing. Robot could allow you to house the cows when using this grass and zero graze it (saw some lads using old single chops durign the summer to prevent cows poaching so reckon its easily do-able.

intresting article in today farm exam on a fella gone back to milking usign a once a day method. might be something i may look at in a few years if ther eis still a market for milking and i decide to lose the run of myself.