Civil Service Mileage-the future of...

Stitch09

HI All,

Just wondering if anyone here has any ideas on how civil service mileage may or may not change with the new budget. Seems insane with the rise in price of fuel that the rates havent changed at all to reflect it since 2009.
I'm on civil service rates for the company i work with and am just trying see what other people may think is going to happen here...
Thanks

Stheno

How much do you get per mile?

Honey-ec

Civil service rates are still extremely generous, consider yourself lucky that your company matches them.

Mileage in my job is 12c per km, regardless of engine size.

munchkin_utd

but those rates are so shocking high that only a fraction goes on fuel.

Not to mention, with the new fuel efficient cars nowadays, your cost of fuel per km with high fuel prices now is much of a muchness compared to say a thirstier old car in 2009 drinking cheap petrol.

Then, low petrol costs + thirsty cars
Now, high petrol costs + effient cars
same difference, sorta.

AltAccount

I'd be amazed to see the rates revised upwards in the current economic climate, it'd be political suicide.

Stitch09

the rates at the moment are:
Official Motor Travel in a calendar year
<1.2L 1.2-1.5L 1.5L+
Up to 6437km 39.12 cent 46.25 cent 59.07 cent
6438km and over 21.22 cent 23.62 cent 28.46 cent

12c/km seems unfeasabily low but i'm thinking we have different uses for our cars so might not be comparing like with like? I'm on the road as a rep with my own car...could never afford to run anything on that rate let alone service and maintain, tax and insure...tight enough as it is.
Stheno, my engine is greater than 1.5 so i'm on the highest bracket

Stheno

OSI wrote: »

59cent a km! :eek: That is mental money, no wonder everyone hates the civil service.

That is mental money!

Can't see that getting increased

Honey-ec

Stitch09 wrote: »

12c/km seems unfeasabily low but i'm thinking we have different uses for our cars so might not be comparing like with like? I'm on the road as a rep with my own car...could never afford to run anything on that rate let alone service and maintain, tax and insure...tight enough as it is.

It's 12c per km across the board, doesn't matter if you're field staff or office staff, and no-one gets a car allowance or fuel card. 12c per km, end of.

Stitch09

For the first 6437km you get that rate, cut back after that...
again i'm not civil service, and if you do the maths on how much your fuel costs are as well as the other charges mentioned, it is by no means a honey pot. if your a civil servant claiming occasional milage on a car thats mostly for personal use i'm sure its a tidy little perk, but considering the mileage i put in and the gear i have to carry with me, its a world removed from a nice side earner

n97 mini

The civil service rates were seen as too high and were reduced. They're still too high.

I used to get €1.27 per mile, tax free, on a 1.6 litre car.

OSI

OSI wrote: »

59cent a km! :eek: That is mental money, no wonder everyone hates the civil service.

Any company can pay those rates to their employees, many do too.

unkel

AltAccount wrote: »

I'd be amazed to see the rates revised upwards in the current economic climate, it'd be political suicide.

The government seems to think keeping the public servants happy is political survival, not political suicide

tayto lover

OSI wrote: »

59cent a km! :eek: That is mental money, no wonder everyone hates the civil service.

I wonder do they have to have a car for their jobs. If so then it's also to cover wear and tear, tyres, servicing, depreciating etc. It would not be so good overall i'd think.

I don't see 4k euro as excessive compensation for someone putting 4k miles up on their private car in a year for work purposes. If they incurr further miles the compensation drops significantly.

tayto lover

unkel wrote: »

The government seems to think keeping the public servants happy is political survival, not political suicide

I'm not in the Public Service but people continuously groaning every time they see the words Public Service can be very annoying. But then again some people just like a good old moan.

bladespin

CS mileage rates must rise at some stage, just like the private sector's expenses, as costs go up so the rates must rise too, every job I've worked in has matched the CS rate for mileage so I'm a bit suprised to find it being described as excessive, it's not.

JJJJNR

I did a few contracts for various state bodies and couldn't believe (or complain about) the 1.27 rate seemed very fair at the time. 12c a km is a joke, im sure they are claiming the civil service rate when it comes to doing their books at the end of the year.

Edwardius

that 12c/km loses you money unless you're using less than about 7L/100km at 1.70 a litre, even before maintenance costs. That's like paying to work!

Eoin

OSI wrote: »

59cent a km! :eek: That is mental money, no wonder everyone hates the civil service.

Unless the civil service are different to most companies who also pay the same rates, that money also covers the wear and tear, class 2 insurance if needed, depreciation for higher mileage and so on.

Pottler

RoverJames wrote: »

Any company can pay those rates to their employees, many do too.

Exactly. I get those rates, usually 59c, I tend to love jobs that are the other side of the country! Bring it on! Everyone else says "ah, god love you, havin to drive to Cork", I go "Yeah, it's cat":D And 472 km, door to door!

Popoutman

Hmm - people can't do maths, or else they tend to forget the real costs in owning and running a car. Some of the civil servant rates are not too far off the mark.

I did up some costings recently on the running of a car.

Turns out the most expensive component of car ownership was the depreciation. My A4 cost me €4000 a year in depreciation alone. Tax and insurance on top, brought it to ~€5500. One set of tyres per year, another €500. Two services, at maybe €500 each average over the lifetime of the car so far. So before driving a single km, I'm already down €7000. If I'm driving an Irish average of 15,000kms per year, that's roughly 47 cents per kilometre. Fuel alone adds about another 15-20 cents on top. So that's 70cents per kilometre minimum.

And that's for a relatively cheap to run 1.9tdi, that was bought 2nd hand at 3 years old. The numbers don't drop much for driving a small engined petrol car, owned from new.

The company I was working for at the time would only pay 50c per km, until I refused to drive my car for the jobs as I was paying the company for the privilege of the wear and tear on my car at the time. It wasn't long before a more sane rate for me of 85 cents per km was agreed - as it was a lot cheaper than renting a van or owning a company van for the number of times a customer site was needed to be visited.

kippy

Popoutman wrote: »

Hmm - people can't do maths, or else they tend to forget the real costs in owning and running a car. Some of the civil servant rates are not too far off the mark.

I did up some costings recently on the running of a car.

Turns out the most expensive component of car ownership was the depreciation. My A4 cost me €4000 a year in depreciation alone. Tax and insurance on top, brought it to ~€5500. One set of tyres per year, another €500. Two services, at maybe €500 each average over the lifetime of the car so far. So before driving a single km, I'm already down €7000. If I'm driving an Irish average of 15,000kms per year, that's roughly 47 cents per kilometre. Fuel alone adds about another 15-20 cents on top. So that's 70cents per kilometre minimum.

And that's for a relatively cheap to run 1.9tdi, that was bought 2nd hand at 3 years old. The numbers don't drop much for driving a small engined petrol car, owned from new.

The company I was working for at the time would only pay 50c per km, until I refused to drive my car for the jobs as I was paying the company for the privilege of the wear and tear on my car at the time. It wasn't long before a more sane rate for me of 85 cents per km was agreed - as it was a lot cheaper than renting a van or owning a company van for the number of times a customer site was needed to be visited.

I'm not sure why you would factor depreciation into that costing to be honest.

kippy

kippy wrote: »

I'm not sure why you would factor depreciation into that costing to be honest.

Throw 25k+ business kms on your private car over 4 years and come trade in time you might have more of an idea why he factored it in

jonsnow

tayto lover wrote: »

I'm not in the Public Service but people continuously groaning every time they see the words Public Service can be very annoying. But then again some people just like a good old moan.

Stop moaning about moaners ye moaner:D*

*aware of my own hypocrisy

kippy

RoverJames wrote: »

kippy wrote: »

I'm not sure why you would factor depreciation into that costing to be honest.

Throw 25k+ business kms on your private car over 4 years and come trade in time you might have more of an idea why he factored it in

Is it the fault of your employer that you drive a car that depreciates at 4k a year?

Eoin

RoverJames wrote: »

Throw 25k+ business kms on your private car over 4 years and come trade in time you might have more of an idea why he factored it in

It's a valid point. The car will be worth 4K less regardless; simply because of the year on reg. The difference between what it fetches and what a car with 25000 kms less mileage fetches is the figure you need to take into account.

Unless you meant 25K per year over 4 years? That'd make a much more substantial difference to its value on the market, I'd imagine.

bladespin

kippy wrote: »

I'm not sure why you would factor depreciation into that costing to be honest.

The mileage affects the price therefore your car is worth a good bit less thanks to work miles, you would have to be compensated for the loss.

Gumbo

Dont forget 59c is the higher rate.
From that 59c per km you must upgrade your insurance to cover you for driving for work and also get an indemnity from your employer that if anything happens, you claim from your own insurance.

bladespin

And yet you can't tax it as a commercial :rolleyes:

Senna

I dont understand, the examples above, are they for a car bought solely for work and not used as a personal car as well?
Because if its a personal car as well, then you would be paying for a lot of those costs anyway. Seems strange that you want your employer to pay all costs even when you would be paying them employed or not.

Gumbo

Senna wrote: »

I dont understand, the examples above, are they for a car bought solely for work and not used as a personal car as well?
Because if its a personal car as well, then you would be paying for a lot of those costs anyway. Seems strange that you want your employer to pay all costs even when you would be paying them employed or not.

Personal car. But if your boss askes you to use it for work, he has to reimburse you. Yes you would be paying for tax, S,D&P Insurance and doing your normal mileage.

But when using for work, you do increased miles which means increased wear and tear, you have yo insure it for use with your employment and holding tools whether that be camera equipment or similar which can cost anything from free to an extra 400e per year or more.

Why should an employee pay these costs himself?