Bus Eireann - Revised route 2 no longer serving Rosslare

dublinman1990

Bus Eireann have announced details of the revised Route 2 from Dublin Airport to Wexford. The revised route will start on the 30th September 2012.

http://www.buseireann.ie/news.php?id=1166&month=Sep

I see that due to low passenger numbers and no longer being commercially viable; Route 2 will no longer serve Rosslare Europort.

Passengers that are planning to travel to Rosslare Europort from Wexford can still get Route 40 which runs five times a day in each direction. Journey time is very good at 25 minutes.

Route 2 will be operating 16 services per day in each direction.

Journey times on Route 2

Dublin Airport to Wexford >> 2 hours 40 minutes.
Dublin City to Wexford >> 2 hours 20 minutes.

The X2 is still 20 minutes quicker than Route 2.

X2 journey times

Dublin Airport to Wexford >> 2 hours 20 minutes
Dublin City to Wexford >> 2 hours

Passengers connecting to Waterford can still get the 370 to WRH via Wellingtonbridge.

foggy_lad

They mention one X2 service each way per day and describe it as limited stop but it has only one less stop than the rest of the services:D they make it sound like some kind of express service instead of a limited legroom(using the new super coaches) expressway service.

V_Moth

Just noticed that myself. The idiocy of the resulting timetabling is beyond belief. The first #2 arrives into Wexford at 08:45 missing the first Wexford - Rosslare service leaving at 08:00. The next Wex - Ross service is at 11:45.

Also, it now makes impossible to reach the early Rosslare ferries by public transport. Getting the late ferry now means taking 14:00 service ex Dublin to be guaranteed of getting the 18:00 service from Wexford to Rosslare.

A summary timetable of the Wexford - Rosslare "services" can be seen here.

:mad:

L1011

Seems to have been hacked about a fair bit

The overnight depatures from Dublin are gone, even on weekends, but the ones from Wexford are still present - there used to be acceptable loads on the 2 and 4 departures on Friday/Saturday nights if not the other days, may have dropped off though.

I also notice that the smaller stops now have set times rather than being marked as Request in general - may be an attempt to try and counter Wexford Bus.

foggy_lad

I just noticed that a lot of the Request stops have been dropped altogether including Beehive, Ballincor, Jack Whites Cross, Kish bridge, Inch, Clough, Ballycanew, Ballyedmond, Castleellis Cross, Castlebridge and St. Senan’s Hospital. Also the late night/early morning stops at Wicklow and Ashford have been cut.

kmurph

I've been getting the 8.20am service to the Harbour and 5.30pm back to town for the past 2 1/2 years so my only option now is going to be starting work 1/2 hour earlier and finish 1/2 hour earlier in order to get the 8am down and 5pm up services.

Hopefully once this kicks in the Rosslare Harbour residents are going to get fairly ticked off at the choice of only going into town in the mornings either at 9am and then not until 1pm.

What about people in Rosslare who work in town? I usually see a fair few people getting the 8.30am bus in. What do they do now? Go in at 7am and get a coffee in O'Briens for an hour and a half?

The bus driver yesterday did say that the drivers themselves aren't too happy about the situation either.

I must try and find out whether the buses will still be going down to the garage in the port to be serviced or if all that will be done in Wexford now. Would seem crazy for the buses to be still going up and down to Rosslare but deliberately not taking any passengers.

lottpaul

foggy_lad wrote: »

I just noticed that a lot of the Request stops have been dropped altogether including Beehive, Ballincor, Jack Whites Cross, Kish bridge, Inch, Clough, Ballycanew, Ballyedmond, Castleellis Cross, Castlebridge and St. Senan’s Hospital. Also the late night/early morning stops at Wicklow and Ashford have been cut.

Does that mean this bus won't stop in any of the places named above?

Geog1234

In case it's of help to anyone there is still a route 2 bus at 08.00 from Rosslare Harbour to Wexford (this bus goes onto Dublin via Tullow) and is listed in a separate timetable:http://www.buseireann.ie/pdf/1256223990-5.pdf

For travelling to the late evening ferries from Rosslare there's a train at 16.37 from Dublin Connolly reaching Rosslare at 19.25 but this doesn't run on Saturday and Sunday.

Have put together the following which I believe is a full list of public transport options between Rosslare Harbour and Wexford and vice versa:

Wexford to Rosslare Harbour weekdays:
08.00 route 40 express bus Mon-Sat inclusive
11.45 route 370 local bus Mon-Sat inclusive
12.02 train Mon-Sat inclusive
12.30 route 40 express bus Mon-Sat inclusive
14.10 route 40 express bus Mon-Sat inclusive
16.04 train Mon-Sat inclusive
18.00 route 385 local bus Mon-Sat inclusive
19.04 train Mon-Fri inclusive
20.30 route 40 express bus Mon-Sat inclusive
20.40 route 2 express bus Mon-Sat inclusive
21.04 train Mon-Sat inclusive
21.10 route 132 local bus Thursdays only

Wexford to Rosslare Harbour Sundays:
08.00 route 40 express bus
12.48 train
14.10 route 40 express bus
15.55 route 40 express bus
16.08 train
20.30 route 40 express bus
20.51 train

Rosslare Harbour to Wexford weekdays:
05.35 train Mon to Fri inclusive
07.00 route 40 express bus Mon-Sat inclusive
07.20 train Mon-Sat inclusive
07.45 route 379 local bus Saturdays only
08.00 route 2 express bus Mon-Sat inclusive
08.15 route 132 local bus Thursdays only
09.00 route 40 express bus Mon-Sat inclusive
12.55 train Mon-Sat inclusive
13.00 route 40 express bus Mon-Sat inclusive
13.45 route 370 local bus Mon-Sat inclusive
14.40 route 40 express bus Mon-Sat inclusive
17.00 route 40 express bus Mon-Fri inclusive
17.55 train Mon-Sat inclusive
19.00 route 40 express bus Mon-Sat inclusive

Rosslare Harbour to Wexford Sundays
07.15 route 40 express bus
09.40 train
13.00 route 40 express bus
14.20 train
14.40 route 40 express bus
17.00 route 40 express bus
17.40 train
19.00 route 40 express bus

Niles

lottpaul wrote: »

Does that mean this bus won't stop in any of the places named above?

I'm surprised there isn't a limited amount of services via these stops. Inch already as had a lower level of service since the last revision, with most services using the bypass. I'd imagine once 'missing link' section of motorway is built/opened between the Beehive and Arklow BÉ will want to bypass Jack White's and Ballincor in a similar fashion. Surely some level of service should be retained to locations like these, it can't be costing them anymore to serve them. And until the motorway is built it won't affect speed to any great extent.

foggy_lad

lottpaul wrote: »

Does that mean this bus won't stop in any of the places named above?

As it is advertised and operated as an expressway service rather than a stage carriage service I would think it only stops as per the listed stops on the timetable, just like the 007 services to colonel and cork stop in Naas town centre only and don't stop at any of the stops entering Naas that the 126 stops at.

lottpaul

foggy_lad wrote: »

As it is advertised and operated as an expressway service rather than a stage carriage service I would think it only stops as per the listed stops on the timetable, just like the 007 services to colonel and cork stop in Naas town centre only and don't stop at any of the stops entering Naas that the 126 stops at.

Thanks for that. Seems an appalling decision as the Numbers 2 and 5 are the only buses on that section of the N11 and the stops at Jack Whites and Ballinacor are heavily used by students and OAPs in particular. Talking on the phone to family in the area this news hasn't seeped out yet but I'd imagine there'll be an outcry when it does.

foggy_lad

lottpaul wrote: »

foggy_lad wrote: »

As it is advertised and operated as an expressway service rather than a stage carriage service I would think it only stops as per the listed stops on the timetable, just like the 007 services to colonel and cork stop in Naas town centre only and don't stop at any of the stops entering Naas that the 126 stops at.

Thanks for that. Seems an appalling decision as the Numbers 2 and 5 are the only buses on that section of the N11 and the stops at Jack Whites and Ballinacor are heavily used by students and OAPs in particular. Talking on the phone to family in the area this news hasn't seeped out yet but I'd imagine there'll be an outcry when it does.

Maybe they will still be stopping or serving all those request stops but I can't see them achieving the times claimed if they do, not that it stops them on other routes like the x8 x20 30 004 etc

bmaxi

lottpaul wrote: »

Thanks for that. Seems an appalling decision as the Numbers 2 and 5 are the only buses on that section of the N11 and the stops at Jack Whites and Ballinacor are heavily used by students and OAPs in particular. Talking on the phone to family in the area this news hasn't seeped out yet but I'd imagine there'll be an outcry when it does.

I don't know why it hasn't seeped out, it has been on SE Radio several times, there were meetings, successful I might add, in Camolin, to campaign against the dropping of the stop there and I myself raised the issue on the Wexford forum on Boards to be met with general apathy.
The most appalling part of these changes is the dropping of the stop at St. Vincent's Hospital , apart from one service in each direction daily. BE say the reason for this is the lack of bus priority on Nutley Lane yet the two services which are to use it are the ones likely to meet heavy traffic but ironically are allotted exactly the same running time as other services . The discontinuation of the overnight services from Dublin Airport, while retaining those from Wexford, seems to be in line with general Government policy, that people will be leaving the country, never to return.
The upshot of all this is that these are changes driven by accountants and not transport planners.

AlekSmart

bmaxi wrote: »

I myself raised the issue on the Wexford forum on Boards to be met with general apathy.

The upshot of all this is that these are changes driven by accountants and not transport planners.

The two components outlined by bmaxi are directly linked.

However,the traditional Irish apathy,due in the main to having a lifestyle waay beyond what we can actually afford,is going to be seriously tested in the next 12 months,as the IMF/ECB accountancy driven directives begin to seep through.

Tin Hat time methinks ! :eek:

LXFlyer

As usual, another post of nonsense. There is only one bus from Rosslare to Waterford. As the 55 timetable clearly indicates, passengers change from the 40 to the 55 at Waterford.

LXFlyer

Just for clarification, my post #15 above was in response to yet another erroneous and predictably wrong post by Foggy Lad (which he has now deleted) in which he alleged BE were wasting money by duplicating the two routes between Waterford and Rosslare.

I certainly was not alleging anything about Alek's post which now resides above mine!

Fratton Fred

Hang on a sec,

Does this mean that to get from Dublin to Rosslare I will either have to change at Wexford, or use the laughably pathetic train?

I only did it a few times a year, but that is a disaster.

XxMCRxBabyxX

I was on the 2 last week and the driver had warned me about this. I didn't think it was happening so soon though! I don't think the drivers are all that impressed by it.

This also means that I have no way of getting home to Wicklow past 11

LXFlyer

Fratton Fred wrote: »

Hang on a sec,

Does this mean that to get from Dublin to Rosslare I will either have to change at Wexford, or use the laughably pathetic train?

I only did it a few times a year, but that is a disaster.

Yes, you will have to change unless you take the once a day service via Tullow.

Remember this is a commercial service that is not subsidised, so the company are entitled to change it as they see fit.

munchkin_utd

Fratton Fred wrote: »

Hang on a sec,

Does this mean that to get from Dublin to Rosslare I will either have to change at Wexford, or use the laughably pathetic train?

I only did it a few times a year, but that is a disaster.

slight tangent, but why would anyone need to go to Rosslare by public transport?

I suppose, its self explainitory that there arent that many reasons seeing as Bus Eireann have cut their service from 30+ Wexford-Rosslare connections to 5 or so to match demand!

L1011

munchkin_utd wrote: »

slight tangent, but why would anyone need to go to Rosslare by public transport?

I suppose, its self explainitory that there arent that many reasons seeing as Bus Eireann have cut their service from 30+ Wexford-Rosslare connections to 5 or so to match demand!

People do live there.

bmaxi

MYOB wrote: »

People do live there.

True but as with every branch of the public service, from Taoiseach to teaboy, people don't matter.

LXFlyer

But this is a commercial service - that's the point. It is not subsidised.

Niles

I actually the loss of the Ballincor/Beehive/Inch/Jack Whites stops is more concerning than the loss/scaling back of the Nutely Lane one - at least in the case of the latter there are alternatives available (walk or get the 47 from UCD), but this is not the case at the former locations. It doesn't give them an edge over Wexford Bus either - Wexford Bus serve all these locations bar Inch (and if you're going into both Arklow and Gorey serving Inch doesn't make a noticeable difference in that you have to go on and off the bypass anyway).

And then of course there's the issue of Ballycanew losing it's service - ironically the services via Ballycanew are quicker, although they do mean avoiding the Ferns/Enniscorthy stops.

Surely there could at least be a limited (perhaps once a day in each direction) serving the stops being removed.

A lot of this seems to be about competing with Wexford Bus' times - which themselves are misleading - ten minutes from Gorey to Arklow? Never seen it happen, not even on the early morning services. Likewise their 16:30 Dublin Airport-Wexford departure is never on time on a weekday, usually a good 10-15 minutes out, not that this is the fault of the drivers. Bus Éireann's times may seem longer, but they're generally a truer reflection of what is actually the journey time. It's a pity the NTA can't pay closer attention to this.

LXFlyer

Well perhaps people should start lobbying the NTA to provide a subsidised service for those locations?

AlekSmart

lxflyer wrote: »

Well perhaps people should start lobbying the NTA to provide a subsidised service for those locations?

Spot-on.

Posters now need to re-focus in ALL such service provision issues on the NTA role.

Remember the NTA's remit is countrywide,with the hint being in the word NATIONAL.

Lets see now if the whole "Independent of the Dept of Transport" stuff actually rings true ?

Fratton Fred

munchkin_utd wrote: »

slight tangent, but why would anyone need to go to Rosslare by public transport?

I suppose, its self explainitory that there arent that many reasons seeing as Bus Eireann have cut their service from 30+ Wexford-Rosslare connections to 5 or so to match demand!

Last minute dash to England using Sail Rail.

There is a train that links up with the 9pm Stena Ferry to Fishguard which means you get to London at around 7:30am. You can't do that from Holyhead.

Booking and flying the same day will cost over €300, this way costs €60.

kmurph

Hmm, still no sign of any notices or posters in either the Wexford or Rosslare Harbour bus stops advertising the changes.

munchkin_utd

Fratton Fred wrote: »

Last minute dash to England using Sail Rail.

There is a train that links up with the 9pm Stena Ferry to Fishguard which means you get to London at around 7:30am. You can't do that from Holyhead.

Booking and flying the same day will cost over €300, this way costs €60.

indeed, you get a bus or train to meet that particular connection. And there'll still be that connection there.

Is there a demand though to get to this port 24 hours a day when theres no ferry anywhere to be seen?
Obviously not, so I dont see the problem.

This is a NON subsidised service that wasnt paying for itsself so theres 2 options
a ) find money to subsidise a bus service that isnt being used
b ) cut the service to sustainable levels

as others said, the changes further up the country with ommited stops probably are more of concern than cutting the services to a port that very few have any need to goto outside of the couple of sailing times.

V_Moth

I would agree that a near 24 hour service to Rosslare is a bit excessive, but entirely cutting the entire service is also a bit stupid. They could have retained at least two or three direct services from Dublin to Rosslare Harbour to allow for connections to the ferry services.

The weird thing is that the regional summary timetable lists a 002 service from Wexford to Rosslare (dep 18.20), yet this is not mentioned on the 002 timetable. I am guessing this is the 15.30 Eurolines feeder service, but this could catch out a few people looking to use that service.

EDIT: That last service apparently only runs on Sundays (??). There is a planned 002 service ex Rosslare at 16.30 Mon to Sat.

munchkin_utd

V_Moth wrote: »

<snip>

The weird thing is that the regional summary timetable lists a 002 service from Wexford to Rosslare (dep 18.20), yet this is not mentioned on the 002 timetable. I am guessing this is the 15.30 Eurolines feeder service, but this could catch out a few people looking to use that service.

<snip>

that regional timetable is valid from 2010 so has to be updated yet with the route 2 changes.

a massive ommision from the NTA in giving the OK to the changes is that the evening ferry from Rosslare at 9pm is no longer reachable on a Sunday by train OR by bus !

The route 40 bus does NOT goto Rosslare on a Sunday and any passengers from Cork and beyond are supposed to get onto the 002 at Wexford. But of course no route 2 busses will go to Rosslare any more.

I'd love to be in Wexford station on Sunday the 30th to see the station master tell any passengers who have arrived from Dublin or Cork that they have to find their own way to catch the ferry from there!

V_Moth

munchkin_utd wrote: »

that regional timetable is valid from 2010 so has to be updated yet with the route 2 changes.

You are right, apologies.

I wonder though where that leaves the Eurolines feeder service (formerly?) departing Dublin at 15.30. Checked the Bus Eireann Eurolines section and it is still possible to buy tickets for this route after the timetable change.

Geog1234

The connection from the Dublin direction into the route 890 Eurolines at Rosslare Harbour will likely still be possible. Presumably it'll entail:

Mondays to Saturdays the 15.30 Dublin to Wexford (arr Wexford rail station 17.50). The local route 385 bus to Rosslare Harbour departs Wexford rail station at 18.00 reaching the port at 18.30.

On Sundays there's a route 40 departing Wexford rail station at 17.50 reaching the port at 18.20.

Should be no reason why the Rosslare buses can't wait a few minutes if the service from the Dublin direction is running slightly behind schedule (and if there are onward passengers).

As well as people travelling to/from the Harbour - residents, visitors & ferry foot passengers there's also a reasonable number of people in the villages along the way such as Kilrane and Tagoat who use the services too.

munchkin_utd

Geog1234 wrote: »

<snip>
On Sundays there's a route 40 departing Wexford rail station at 17.50 reaching the port at 18.20.
<snip>

you sure?
On the (old/ exisiting) route 40 timetable they have a bus leaving wexford at 18.20 BUT its a 002 which of course is the route that is going to be chopped and that bus no longer continues to Roslare.

Geog1234

The 17.50 Sundays service Wexford to Rosslare Harbour is mentioned in the Bus Éireann Journey Planner.

On occasion have found that there are services which are mentioned in the Journey Planner which for unknown reason(s) are not mentioned in the timetable tables.

Gekko

CIE pushing people onto trains!

The need for Rosslare passengers to change in Wexford is a joke.

kmurph

I asked the bus driver going to Rosslare this morning if the cuts were still happening next week as there's still no notices at either the Rosslare or Wexford stops advising of the changes. He said that politicians have gotten involved now and there are going to be meetings this week with BE about stopping the cuts to the service.

Nothing will probably come of it but good to know that at least BE are aware of the problems that the cuts will cause.

LXFlyer

Why would they not be happening?

Whatever about notices on stops (which of course should be there), the notice is on the website and unless that is taken down/changed then the changes will still happen.

It really is not the responsibility of BE to provide these services UNLESS they receive state support to fund the losses they result in.

The NTA is responsible for non-commercial services now.

kmurph

Oh I appreciate all that and as I said I won't be holding my breath for any changes but I just thought it was odd that there's no notices at either stop about the changes. The last time a couple of years ago when they cut a couple of the overnight services there were notices at both stops and on the buses themselves about it for weeks. This is cutting an entire route so thought it would warrant a bit more notice.

Geog1234

There really should be notices displayed at stops though there is limited space to display them - some stops have timetable cases which can only hold two A4 sheets. Even laminated notices affixed to stop poles. Internet usage is high but not all users obtain their info this way.

It's all very well politicians becoming involved but as many politicians don't use bus services they will only be aware of what they are told by users, by Bus Éireann and by the NTA. Users also need to make their voice heard by writing to or e-mailing the NTA/ Bus Éireann.

The morning gap in services both ways Wexford-Rosslare Harbour could be filled by extending the 09.00 Waterford-Wexford route 40 to the Harbour (10.00 ex Wexford) and returning from Rosslare Harbour to Wexford at 10.30. As this will result in extra costs it would likely to have to be counterbalanced by withdrawing a journey (e.g. the route 40 12.30 Wexford - Rosslare Harbour and 13.00 return). Route 370 operates at roughly similar times i.e. 11.45 Wexford-Rosslare Harbour and 13.45 return. Not for a moment am I advocating that the 12.30 & 13.00 route 40 journeys be cut but looking at the matter realistically it seems to be the only way of commercially providing a mid-morning trip each way and filling the four hour interval.

Donkathon

Notices up today,

Such a disgrace

I live in barndarrig co.wicklow and the have cut 3 stop, The Beehive, Lil Doyle's & Jack Whites all 3 are right on the main road and cannot add any delay to the route if nobody is there to get on the bus it just keeps going

I know at least 5 very elderly people who use this service and now were left about 8 miles away from a town in the middle of nowhere with no public transport

Disgraceful

LXFlyer

Well get onto the National Transport Authority. They are responsible for the provision of subsidised services for people such as these.

BE is operating these services on a commercial basis, something most people don't seem to understand. What's needed is a limited service stopping at these locations that is supported by a subsidy. It doesn't need to be hourly but sufficient to allow people get to town/hospital etc. and do their business.

Only by lobbying the NTA will anything such as this come about.

Niles

Donkathon wrote: »

Notices up today,

Such a disgrace

I live in barndarrig co.wicklow and the have cut 3 stop, The Beehive, Lil Doyle's & Jack Whites all 3 are right on the main road and cannot add any delay to the route if nobody is there to get on the bus it just keeps going

I know at least 5 very elderly people who use this service and now were left about 8 miles away from a town in the middle of nowhere with no public transport

Disgraceful

Indeed. Although they have yet to bother putting up a notice at Inch.

I agree with lxflyer in that we should be writing to the NTA (I have done so, along with my TDs and councilors). I would urge anyone concerned to do likewise. There are plenty of moans about this on BÉ's facebook page but to be taken seriously lobbying the NTA is what's needed.

lxflyer wrote: »

Well get onto the National Transport Authority. They are responsible for the provision of subsidised services for people such as these.

BE is operating these services on a commercial basis, something most people don't seem to understand. What's needed is a limited service stopping at these locations that is supported by a subsidy. It doesn't need to be hourly but sufficient to allow people get to town/hospital etc. and do their business.

Personally I would happy with such a limited service. One compromise might be to get the route 6 New Ross bus to serve these locations, loadings on that bus never seem to be high. Not much good for the Ballycanew road granted.

dublinman1990

There is a general feeling IMO that this service is being run into the ground with the way that the cuts that are about to take place.

Is there is a case that the cuts which are taking place soon due to overlapping other BE routes as well as it overlaps with the 5 and 133?

bmaxi

dublinman1990 wrote: »

There is a general feeling IMO that this service is being run into the ground with the way that the cuts that are about to take place.

Is there is a case that the cuts which are taking place soon due to overlapping other BE routes as well as it overlaps with the 5 and 133?

I don't know why that would be, the service is well supported, certainly from Gorey.
I also dispute the fact, mentioned in an earlier post, that any Expressway service is a commercial venture. No operation within the CIE group of companies could be considered a purely commercial venture.

Niles

They've caved a little on the St.Vincent's issue, it will now have three services each way. Doesn't do anything for the users of the request stops/Ballycanew road though.

http://www.buseireann.ie/news_timetable.php?id=1184&month=Sep

I would question the timings given though... five minutes from Busáras to Kildare St., and another five minutes from there to Vincent's? Not going to happen. You have to wonder if those who approve such timings have ever actually used the bus/have a basic sense of geography.

foggy_lad

Niles wrote: »

They've caved a little on the St.Vincent's issue, it will now have three services each way. Doesn't do anything for the users of the request stops/Ballycanew road though.

http://www.buseireann.ie/news_timetable.php?id=1184&month=Sep

I would question the timings given though... five minutes from Busáras to Kildare St., and another five minutes from there to Vincent's? Not going to happen. You have to wonder if those who approve such timings have ever actually used the bus/have a basic sense of geography.

Unless people officially complain about the timings in significant numbers bus Eireann will ignore them and assume that their customers are happy.

man98

V_Moth wrote: »

You are right, apologies.

I wonder though where that leaves the Eurolines feeder service (formerly?) departing Dublin at 15.30. Checked the Bus Eireann Eurolines section and it is still possible to buy tickets for this route after the timetable change.

The route still runs to London which runs once day by Pembroke.

kmurph

Noticed this morning that the 8 am bus to Dublin came into the Wexford stop from the Rosslare direction. Are the buses still being based and serviced in Rosslare?

Saraahh

I think what they should do is put back in all the bus stops and take out the ones they are not going past. Because the Beehive, Lil Doyles and Jack Whites they are going past them it be different if bus eireann were going out of their way to get to these bus stops. Now I can't get the bus in anymore after school to my Wicklow because of these bus stops being taking away.

Saraahh

:mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad: it is unbelievable what they have done gone and taking away bus stops that are there and it be different if they were going out of their way to get to them but they are not. the Beehive, Lil Doyles and Jack whites it stupid what they have done. no they have lost passagers because of this.