DHL Clearance Delay - requesting 'proof of purchase' for customs?

makeorbrake

As per the thread title - ordered something online - from China (where else!).

Now in Shannon - and DHL tell me it's been seized by customs - they won't release until I provide proof of purchase.


This seems to be a new development - at least - never used to happen before (admittedly have not ordered up much kit in the last while but used to do on a regular basis - up until last year).

Anyone else come across this?

sheehan12

customs probably whant some tax on it when it outside the eu. or you bought sumthing that is illegal to have in ireland ?

rubadub

I have had to send in paypal receipts, and know others who have too.

They might not have a clue how to value the item, sometimes they will just make up a value, especially if you/the seller tried to pull a scam and put a really low value on it.

Celeron Media

As per the thread title - ordered something online - from China (where else!).

Now in Shannon - and DHL tell me it's been seized by customs - they won't release until I provide proof of purchase.


This seems to be a new development - at least - never used to happen before (admittedly have not ordered up much kit in the last while but used to do on a regular basis - up until last year).

Anyone else come across this?

Yeah I have the same problem with DHL every 3 weeks. Myself and the customs reps are on first name basis at this stage.
Some sellers from China do under value packages and If the customs officers or customs reps are in doubt of the value they will ask the importer to send a copy of the invoice such as a PayPal receipt, bank statement etc...

Just send it onto them by email and wait few days for them to get finger out to clear the package and send it out for delivery and collect the VAT. Also check the VAT is correct before paying, DHL are known for overcharging on VAT.

makeorbrake

Ok, thanks all. The vendor had decreased the amount - not by request - from what I recollect - they have always done it (regardless of which one I used).


This is the first time customs have queried it. The actual cost breaks down as follows;


$115.00 USD
Shipping and handling $39.70 USD
Tax $4.60 USD
Total $159.30 USD

What should customs (or dhl) be charging on the basis of the above?

Stokolan

makeorbrake wrote: »

Ok, thanks all. The vendor had decreased the amount - not by request - from what I recollect - they have always done it (regardless of which one I used).


This is the first time customs have queried it. The actual cost breaks down as follows;


$115.00 USD
Shipping and handling $39.70 USD
Tax $4.60 USD
Total $159.30 USD

What should customs (or dhl) be charging on the basis of the above?

Possibly about €45 based on 21% vat 6% duty and a €10 administration fee.

But then my maths is terrible

Celeron Media

Roughly about €28.98 + admin fee which might be €1 in this case. No customs duty should be due on that value.
You shouldn't be paying tax in China either it's outside the EU.

makeorbrake

Celeron Media wrote: »

Roughly about €28.98 + admin fee .....You shouldn't be paying tax in China either it's outside the EU.

Does the fact that I have paid tax in China mean they shouldnt apply any tax here?

Celeron Media

Does the fact that I have paid tax in China mean they shouldnt apply any tax here?

No unfortunately your still going to have pay the 23% vat rate here in Ireland. You do have the option to pay before the goods are imported but it's still going to be the same rate.

mathepac

Stokolan wrote: »

Possibly about €45 based on 21% vat 6% duty and a €10 administration fee.

But then my maths is terrible

23% VAT?

aujopimur

The couriers usually charge €30 admin..

makeorbrake

aujopimur wrote: »

The couriers usually charge €30 admin..

wtf? If that comes up, I'll reverse the whole process and get a refund through paypal.

Celeron Media

The couriers usually charge €30 admin..

What??

Elaine Murphy

Well first of all this is going on for a long time, I order from China all the time and DHL seize it by customs and ask for PayPal invoices etc... So that they can charge you customs and excise of 23% over €25 as far as I remember (My orders do be over €100 each time so its irrelevant to unless I order under that amount). So thats why it has been seized they don't believe what price is on the invoice and want you to pay them to allow the items to go to u.

If however you do pay the customs and excise do get a receipt from the courier because I never did on one occasion and I am being accused of not paying it and they are sending letters from solicitors to pay them again (Not going to happen, but just to cover yourself)

The Customs and excise is basically Payable if you are getting anything from outside the EU and its rate is 23% as Celeron Media pointed out in their post.

Getting onto the point about the admin fees. It is not €30 or anyway near it with DHL its a standing rate of about €5 if u have to pay VAT ONLY.

If you have any other question don't be afraid to ask

Nody

aujopimur wrote: »

The couriers usually charge €30 admin..

The maximum charge a courier company can charge is 15 EUR for the service of declaring it and collecting VAT...

pleasant Co.

aujopimur wrote: »

The couriers usually charge €30 admin..

bullshit

Stokolan

mathepac wrote: »

Stokolan wrote: »

Possibly about €45 based on 21% vat 6% duty and a €10 administration fee.

But then my maths is terrible

23% VAT?

Guess I'm still living in the past

makeorbrake

After it being held up in customs for over 1 week, item now received - along with a bill for 'import vat' of €49.98.


That's exactly how it's described on the form I've just signed.
The item cost $159.30. According to xe.com that equals €121.76.

If 23% VAT is applied, that should be an additional €28.

€49.96-€28=€21.96

What is the charge of €21.96 for exactly?

rubadub

makeorbrake wrote: »

The item cost $159.30.

Does that include postage? was it a courier? (who typically charge more than an post for processing)

makeorbrake

rubadub wrote: »

Does that include postage? was it a courier? (who typically charge more than an post for processing)

Yes - it includes postage/delivery ->
$115.00 USD
Shipping (DHL) and handling $39.70 USD
Tax $4.60 USD
Total $159.30 USD

rubadub

I would imagine their exchange rate is slightly worse than XE. The max handling is €15. You are below the level for duty.

The only other extra charges I know of would be for excisable stuff, like perfume.

Unless they did not believe your valuation, or if other charges were listed on the invoice and wrongly applied.

makeorbrake

rubadub wrote: »

I would imagine their exchange rate is slightly worse than XE. The max handling is €15. You are below the level for duty.

The only other extra charges I know of would be for excisable stuff, like perfume.

Unless they did not believe your valuation, or if other charges were listed on the invoice and wrongly applied.

I've emailed them - asking for clarification. Their 'receipt of shipment' is vague - in that it itemises the amount under 'import VAT'. However, that can't possibly be the case. They initially disputed the amount - as the chinese vendor had provided a hookey invoice with the shipment (not at my request I hasten to add). The calculation can only be based on the total sum I mentioned above - as I provided them with a copy of the paypal email confirming that amount.

I can only assume that this must be going on - on a wholesale basis. No doubt I will not get a response from dhl on this initially - but I will be following it up to a full conclusion. I would encourage others to do likewise.

makeorbrake

I've just got this response back from DHL to my query;

"Please be advise that taxes is calculated on the full CIF (Cost of good, insurance if applicable, freight) value of the goods. You Paypal receipt only provide the total value of the goods."

I've responded - pointing out that the paypal receipt is INCLUSIVE of all costs - including delivery - and asking once again for a breakdown in their calculation of the amount of €49.96

5500

Looks like they are charging you an "estimated" shipping cost from their reply and that's how your invoice was higher. Ive lost track of the amount of times I've had/still am having the same argument with fedex.

Basically revenue say that a shipping value of 0 cannot be declared on the invoice even if it was included in the total cost of your purchase. The import agents then randomly calculate a figure based on the weight of the item you received on what they assume it would cost to ship, and add this to your total invoice.

makeorbrake

5500 wrote: »

Looks like they are charging you an "estimated" shipping cost from their reply and that's how your invoice was higher. Ive lost track of the amount of times I've had/still am having the same argument with fedex.

That's exactly what they are saying! (as per the last email which I just received from them).

5500 wrote: »

Basically revenue say that a shipping value of 0 cannot be declared on the invoice even if it was included in the total cost of your purchase. The import agents then randomly calculate a figure based on the weight of the item you received on what they assume it would cost to ship, and add this to your total invoice.

Both the receipt issued by the vendor and the paypal receipt clearly itemise a shipping cost - as part of the total sum which I paid over for the item. I've now brought this to their attention - and waiting on their response....

makeorbrake

Got a response from them saying that the ' receipt they had on file ' didn't itemise shipping. I only sent them ONE paypal receipt - which clearly itemised shipping.

Have sent that on to them once again - and awaiting their response.

If anyone is reading this - be sure to challenget this bullsh1t! This is clearly a revenue stream for them.

makeorbrake

Asked for a recalculation - and havn't heard back from the person I was dealing with in DHL. Now when I email them, the mail bounces back as undelivered (despite having corresponded via that address successfully last week).....strange.

Mail forwarded on to ie.imports@dhl.com . Out of principal alone, I will be following up on this until the VAT calculation is revised.

makeorbrake

Still no answer from them. ....

makeorbrake

Guy from DHL finally responded (obviously, someone internally had forwarded on the other mails I sent to imports and a couple of others in there). Says amended VAT calculation submitted to customs. Once it is approved, they will credit me the difference.

I responded to that mail - and unlike earlier today, when I was getting 'delivery failure notice' on mails sent to him - there was no issue with the last mail I've just sent him....go figure....:rolleyes:

NOTICE TO ALL OF YOU WHO ENCOUNTER THIS SAME ISSUE WITH DHL

Challenge them on this! They are ripping you off otherwise.

makeorbrake

I'm still waiting....

I asked for an update and was told that "the officer (for Revenue) is out of the office and she will give me (DHL) an update upon her return".

If that's the truth, then it's astounding. The mail was left openended. I responded by saying I will be in touch on Friday.


If your in this position - DONT let them off the hook with this - regardless of the sum. Out of principal, I will not let this go - and nor should anyone else!

recipio

I agree, as a general principle you can't trust couriers or the customs/excise dept.
I've had dollars turned into euros and ( succesfully ) appealed a grossly high customs charge.
The trouble is the delivery guy arrives at your door and most of us havn't the exact figure worked out in advance. You are not going to argue with the man so best to pay and then work out the charges.

makeorbrake

Latest: I asked for an update - and was told that there was a customs backlog in SHN.


If they think I will drop this....."From my cold dead hands"!

Celeron Media

I'm in the same situation at the moment. They over charged me on VAT again and refuse to refund me.

makeorbrake

Celeron Media wrote: »

I'm in the same situation at the moment. They over charged me on VAT again and refuse to refund me.

DHL or customs?

At the moment - it's DHL that i'm dealing with - and they are using customs as an excuse ie. customs are busy, blah, blah, blah.


Call me a conspiracy theorist but I believe this is a revenue generator within dhl.

I reckon they are doing this wholesale. Any chance we can all get together on this? Are there other readers here on boards in the same boat (or have been in the recent past)?

makeorbrake

I mailed in the early hours of this morning - and again this afternoon. In response to the second mail, I got an 'out of office' response. Resent the same query to the main dhl imports address - copying the original contact - and no 'out of office' response.


Don't allow yourself to be fobbed off by this lot!

makeorbrake

They responded saying (again) that this is due to customs - and that it's not their fault!

The whole things a joke!

sandin

Why do so many people blame the frontline?

Do you blame the gardai for a burglary or a nurse because an opertaion went wrong.

DHL's job is to collect, process and deliver. If a false invoice has been issued with the goods and therefore evasion of taxes, customs have the absolute right to destroy the goods without giving you a chance to change things.

HOWEVER, customs do give you an opportunity to provide absolute PROOF of the amount paid and if it still does not add up properly they will put their own estimated value on the goods.

As a business importing from China, sometimes they are small single box loads, I specifically tell suppliers that only invoices with full value should be included.

As for customs delays - its currently about 5 days.

Fault for this - is the chinese suppliers or those under declaring.

makeorbrake

sandin wrote: »

Why do so many people blame the frontline?
Do you blame the gardai for a burglary or a nurse because an opertaion went wrong.

Taking your analogy to task, if the Gardai didn't investigate in the aftermath - then that's an issue.
Where is the CUSTOMER in all of this?

sandin wrote: »

DHL's job is to collect, process and deliver. If a false invoice has been issued with the goods and therefore evasion of taxes, customs have the absolute right to destroy the goods without giving you a chance to change things.

Then they should destroy them! That's nothing to do with me - I gave no such instruction - and if they destroyed the goods, I'd quite simply invoke a visa chargeback.

sandin wrote: »

HOWEVER, customs do give you an opportunity to provide absolute PROOF of the amount paid and if it still does not add up properly they will put their own estimated value on the goods.

This is the point. I provided proof. They tell me that the 'first' paypal receipt I provided them with was the one that was used to calculate the duty. However, I only provided them with one - and one only (as there can only be bloody one)!

sandin wrote: »

As for customs delays - its currently about 5 days.

Try over a bloody month! And don't tell me that I haven't got the fob off from DHL as part of this process.

sandin wrote: »

I specifically tell suppliers that only invoices with full value should be included.....Fault for this - is the chinese suppliers or those under declaring.

As stated previously - and inferred above - that's none of my doing and none of my concern!

The bigger question.....


WHERE is the customer in all of this?

makeorbrake

Still no response or movement on this.....

makeorbrake

I've now been notified that a cheque will be sent out with a refund of €19.55. Awaiting clarification on the amount to ensure that it's accurate.

I had to ask once more for details on their internal complaints process (as hadn't been provided following a previous request). Not sure whether this had any bearing on getting things moving - but just wanted to mention it for the benefit of anyone reading this - and finding themselves in the same position.



IF you do find yourself in this position, don't allow yourself to be sidetracked. Many would say the $ refund doesn't justify the time and effort invested. However, on principal - this sort of thing simply shouldn't be tolerated.

Myles6670

its bloody annoying,, asking for proof of payment after the package has traveled half way across the world.. iv sent them 3 e-mails of proof and am still waiting.. ridiculous........

Jarren

emails tend to get ignored,ring them.

Myles6670

iv called 3 times today and have been put on hold,, left messages, and then my credit went.. not much else i can do:(

makeorbrake

Myles6670 wrote: »

iv called 3 times today and have been put on hold,, left messages, and then my credit went.. not much else i can do:(

Don't waste both your time and money on phone calls.

Stick with email. If you take further action at a later stage, the proof of their wrong doing is there in black and white - beyond doubt (and passing the parcel, sidestepping, ignoring you is unethical behaviour). They will ignore mails. Then I believe they can implement settings so that email from you comes back with an automatic response saying they are out of the office for X number of days. You will be given another email address - and the same might happen.

What they are looking for - is for you to give up and in that way, the problem is solved to their satisfaction (not yours). Get a good record of inaction via the collection of emails. Then - after an appropriate time has elapsed, ask them what their internal complaints procedure is - and ask them to send this on to you. At that point they're likely to act.

You may have to spend an disproportionate amount of time on this - but out of principal, you should see it through.

jamescd

Ordered some clothes from America and my tracking said Customs Clearance Delay for a day or so. I paid VAT/Duty in advance already so don't know why it was held in customs in the first place.

antocann

jamescd wrote: »

Ordered some clothes from America and my tracking said Customs Clearance Delay for a day or so. I paid VAT/Duty in advance already so don't know why it was held in customs in the first place.

how did you pay it already ? it wont be calculated till you send them the required paperwork to prove what it cost , once received over here

jamescd

I ordered from Aeropostale. They give you the option during checkout to pay VAT/DUTY in advance. DHL always declare everything so I just pay in advance everytime I order to avoid any hassle.

funkhouser

sandin wrote: »

DHL's job is to collect, process and deliver. If a false invoice has been issued with the goods and therefore evasion of taxes, customs have the absolute right to destroy the goods without giving you a chance to change things.-

What rubbish. Somebody makes a mistake on an invoice and you think customs have the "right" to destroy valuable goods? Come off it.

DYLF

funkhouser wrote: »

What rubbish. Somebody makes a mistake on an invoice and you think customs have the "right" to destroy valuable goods? Come off it.

Customs do have the right to destroy goods if they are fakes. but if they have an issue with an invoice being incorrect they HAVE to request an amended one. and if one is not provided they have to hold it for a minimum of 30 days before they can return it to the sender. its rare they'd destroy something for the invoice being incorrect

seanin4711

item delivered to shannon from china today and get the text from DHL to send a proof of purchase.
Grand sent invoice within 30mins of receiving text and no acknowledgement.
Whats the story do they on purpose not reply day one or two in order to charge you more?
total ****e if that's the case.
I don't mind paying my duty but come on everything is express until it hits these shores!

from dhl's website
"Receiving a Shipment
Shipments sent from outside the EU may be liable for Customs Duty, Excise Duty and VAT, which DHL is obliged to collect on behalf of the Irish Revenue Commissioners.
Goods are liable to VAT at the same rate as applies to the sale within the State of similar goods - usually 21%. VAT is calculated on the total of :
Value of the goods for customs purposes,
Amount of any other duty or tax applicable,
Any transport, handling or insurance costs between the place of introduction into the EU and the final destination within the State.
Gifts from one private individual to another up to the value of €45 and commercial shipments up to €22 are usually exempt from VAT. Import Duty is generally applied when the value of the contents exceeds €150. In all cases if the shipment is a gift then the accompanying proforma invoice should clearly state 'Gift' along with the usual details.
For one-off shipments where the value of the goods is less than €250 and the Import Duty due is less than €10 then an exemption from VAT and Duty may also be granted to customers who are VAT registered.
Note that these exemptions do not apply to gifts of alcohol, tobacco or perfume where standard charges apply, even when they are received from another EU country.
A copy of the recipient's passport or PPS number is required for shipments of personal effects received in Ireland from outside the EU.
For more information on Irish VAT and Duty please visit the Irish Revenue Commissioner website revenue.ie"

makeorbrake

@seanin4711: Have a read through the thread. Can't recall exactly but I think in order to firstly get the goods, I had to just pay whatever - and then come back and fight it out with them...which of course took forever!