Energy problem when running on paleo like diet.

sky is the limit

Ok I have cut out all the carbs most sugars (just in coffee twice a day) and have come down a couple pounds in the last few days which is great.

The problem I am now having is when i went for my usual run the other day i struggled, now i did finish it but it was hard though my time was good. (5k)

today was a disaster, I had zero energy i managed about 2k and simply had to quit, I am wondering if my cutting out almost entirely of carbs has had an effect?

I do like the paleo like diet but not at the expense of my running?

Transform

sky is the limit wrote: »

Ok I have cut out all the carbs most sugars (just in coffee twice a day) and have come down a couple pounds in the last few days which is great.

The problem I am now having is when i went for my usual run the other day i struggled, now i did finish it but it was hard though my time was good. (5k)

today was a disaster, I had zero energy i managed about 2k and simply had to quit, I am wondering if my cutting out almost entirely of carbs has had an effect?

I do like the paleo like diet but not at the expense of my running?

Pot up exactly what you eat typically and current training.
Height and weight also

--Kaiser--

Paleo doesn't mean zero carb. Also you should be ramping up your fat intake if you are cutting carbs

sky is the limit

Transform wrote: »

sky is the limit wrote: »

Ok I have cut out all the carbs most sugars (just in coffee twice a day) and have come down a couple pounds in the last few days which is great.

The problem I am now having is when i went for my usual run the other day i struggled, now i did finish it but it was hard though my time was good. (5k)

today was a disaster, I had zero energy i managed about 2k and simply had to quit, I am wondering if my cutting out almost entirely of carbs has had an effect?

I do like the paleo like diet but not at the expense of my running?

Pot up exactly what you eat typically and current training.
Height and weight also

Hi I am 5.11 and weight is 90 kg I posted my full diet on another thread entitled "confused about nutrition" just a few days ago so it should be easy to find. I would link it except I am on a smart phone typing this. Maybe you could have a look? Just to let you know I have cut out whole grains since I posted it up and am eating a lot of salmon and steak for my fats as well as olives etc.
My training is three days a week running 4-6 k at the moment. I am not doing weights but will be starting some body weight soon.

sky is the limit

--Kaiser-- wrote: »

Paleo doesn't mean zero carb. Also you should be ramping up your fat intake if you are cutting carbs

Sorry I don't mean zero carbs, I eat plenty of veg and a small intake of fruit. I guess I mean bad carbs or carbs from grains etc. I don't eat pasta breads rice or potatoes ( except sweet potatoes )

the drifter

i dont normally do nice things....but here we go...taken from the other thread

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2056739410

Okay folks here is a typical days diet for me. Just to note that I work evenings from 5 till 1 so I dont eat breakfast real early.


Breakfast about 10.30 am

Porridge with a drop of avonmore super milk to cool it down, unfortunately I also have to sweeten it so I have about a tablespoon of sugar too I like honey but was told in a food allergy test to avoid it.

A few walnuts (I love nuts)

Water one glass (I drink pure filtered water straight out of the tap) When I have it in I will have tropicana OJ instead of the water (about half the week i guess)

One yoplait hazelnut yoghurt.


12.am or thereabouts I will have an apple or some grapes and a glass of water


Lunch 2.30 pm 3 slices of mccambridge wholemeal brown bread with either turkey breast or cream cheese topped with some cherry tomatoes,
Sometimes I will have a can of heinz ravioli or a tin of Baxters healthy option soup.

More water.


Late afternoon a a few more walnuts and a couple of squares of 70% dark chocalate more water.


Dinner about 7pm I am lucky to be able to use the oven in work anytime


A piece of fish or lean mince or chicken breast usually plaice or sole for the fish a good handful of veggies,frozen. An egg with it too (I know sounds weird) More water


That is a typical day for me obviously I wont have this exact diet every day so I will give alternatives below.


Alternative breakfast, pot of greek yoghurt with blueberries , bolied egg, slice or two of the mcambridges brown bread with jam.


OR

a 2 egg omlette .


Lunch alternative could be smoked salmon slices on wholemeal bread with tea.

OR

Tuna salad the the ones from tesco. Or sliced mature cheddar on the brown bread.



Dinner alternative

Lean mince or chicken breast with vegetarian a bean burger (tesco)

Sometimes about once a fortnight I have those lovely IKEA swedish meatballs with vegetables.


I dont snack anymore ,I do sometimes have a pub dinner on a sunday though.

I dont generally eat after 9ish but if I do its rice cakes or some nuts with feta cheese as an example.

I love my food now more than ever and even though I seem to have hit a wall in terms of weight loss I must admit that the inches seem to be coming off as my jeans are starting to fall down (not a pretty sight)


Any pointers?

Thanks!

sky is the limit

Thanks so much mod! I must point out though that since I put up that diet, on the advice of some good folk on the thread I have dropped the porridge brown bread rice cakes etc , anything with those kind of carbs. Now a lot more salad olives and more eggs etc.

Hanley

Where's the paleo diet come in to this!?

....anyway - you need to eat carbs to support your activity levels.

I'd be surprised if "low carb" had an effect after 2k in unless you were pushing the pace super hard. You might just be fatigued. And from that post you're almost certainly not eating enough calories daily.

groovyg

Maybe you should contact this guy Barry Murray, or along to one his events. http://www.optimumnutrition4sport.com/

He is a runner and seems to follow the paleo plan.

El_Dangeroso

sky is the limit wrote: »

Ok I have cut out all the carbs most sugars (just in coffee twice a day) and have come down a couple pounds in the last few days which is great.

The problem I am now having is when i went for my usual run the other day i struggled, now i did finish it but it was hard though my time was good. (5k)

today was a disaster, I had zero energy i managed about 2k and simply had to quit, I am wondering if my cutting out almost entirely of carbs has had an effect?

I do like the paleo like diet but not at the expense of my running?

You don't say how long you've been on this? There is always an adjustment period when switching to lower carb. Your energy dips and you feel crappy for a couple of days, then you feel much much better.

5k is not endurance running by any means and you should be able to do it lower carb. If it continues to be an issue, bolus your carbs prior to workout, as in have around 60g together.

That will allow you the energy to run while continuing to drop pounds.

meijin

I'm mostly paleo and quite low carb (before workouts) and run up to 12 miles (~1h 40min) on weekend with no carbs for breakfast before (just meat + nuts), or sprints intervals / tempo session during the week in the evening and my carbs during the day are salad/veggies and two apples. About 50%+ of kcals from fats though (nuts, olives, olive oil, avocado, coconut oil, also from meats). I don't have any problems with energy during the run, and even if I feel a bit low sugar before, once I start running I feel OK.

But, it takes a while to get used to this, and you might feel a bit dizzy when lowering carbs too rapidly and running, so make sure to do it gradually. Have some carbs + protein after the session. That's the time when I go high carb I'm not very strict on paleo then - glucose/maltodextrin + whey are best . 1h later I would have regular food with moderate amount of carbs + fruits smoothie (banana, some berries) then back to regular low carb meals. I plan to carb load a bit before HM race though, but that's really an exception

have you cut fat and carbs? I seen "lean mince" etc, are you not taking in enough fats to run your body on perhaps? Up the fats imo. Eggs, cheese, meats, avacados, coconut oil for cooking.

sky is the limit

Thanks guys for all the pointers. Today I went for my regular 5k run and managed about 3k and had to stop again. That said I felt a fair bit better than the other day when I was dizzy with tiredness. I am by no means an endurance runner but 5 k is endurance at my level lol!

As some have mentioned maybe its a good idea to transition slowly and thats what I an now doing. As I did say in the thread title I am on a paleo" like" diet as opposed to going whole hog but yea I have cut out all breads pasta rice and other stodgy carb-laden foods and I dont miss them it must be said.

I am still consuming dairy as it agrees with me, and am trying to get my mitts on coconut oil for cooking.

Hopefully ist just a transition issue!

El_Dangeroso

meijin wrote: »

I plan to carb load a bit before HM race though, but that's really an exception

There's a huge advantage to training low (glycogen) and racing high, because you're body is used to the more difficult method of fuel (fat), it is like nitrous in the tank of a car when you do eat carbs, can't think of a better reason than race day!

meijin

sky is the limit wrote: »

Thanks guys for all the pointers. Today I went for my regular 5k run and managed about 3k and had to stop again.

other suggestions
- run slower (you'll need less glycogen)
- track your food for few weeks in myfitnesspal and make sure you're eating enough

Mr. CooL ICE

+1 what meijin said regarding running slower.

For a long time, I found 4/5k to be completely exhausting and would be a massive workout for me. My diet was fine though, but i realised after I ran an 8k race that I was running too fast. After taking some time out from road running for treadmill running, I re-established my running technique and have done a HM without any major issue.

First, make sure you warm up. Make sure your heart rate is elevated 5-10 mins before you leave the house. Even a 5 minute walk to the shop before you stretch might do. Try different running techniques. If you find it hard to run slow, try using your upper leg muscles less and your lower leg muscles more. Concentrate on using your feet/calf muscles to propel you forward instead of your knees/quads.

Sorry for going beyond the scope of the forum, but that's what I found useful

I don't understand why running slower would be a benefit (other than if the training goal is to be able to make it X distance).

Other than anecdotal evidence, has anyone any suggestions why this would matter?

I personally would prefer to run as fast as I possibly could for 20/30mins as a training exercise as opposed to running X Km in however many minutes it takes.

I'd want my body working hard, for shorter periods, as opposed to asking it to "endure". I think that a paleo style diet and lifestyle doesn't suit itself too well to marathon runners etc, basically because in my opinion we're not really designed to run marathons!

If I was training for the goal of running a HM (which I have done this year) or a full Marathon, I'd obviously taper that advice to suit. But for a general training and exercise goal, with the aim of increasing fitness lowering bodyfat, I'd be far more likely to recommend the short/sharp burst exercises.

Mr. CooL ICE

Not basing it on anything solid, but I remember reading/hearing that if you want to improve endurance, it's better to increase road time than increase speed. If you were training for general sports, HIIT would obviously be better.

OP said he was having difficulty with energy levels from 2k to 4k distances. I know the change in diet is going to be a contributing factor, but I think modifying how he approaches his running would help him adjust to his body's new energy composition.

siochain

try a tablespoon of coconut fat before your runs.

my recipe for ultimate pre-trainer:
tea spoon of coconut fat
cup of good fresh ground coffee

sky is the limit

Thanks to all who took the time to reply . I must say these boards are so so good,
great advice from folks who have been there and done it.

Tonight it all came together so nicely. I ran 7 k in 45 with very little trouble infact it was easy.

I took the advice from meijin and lord chessington to just take it slowly using my calves to propel me and get into the rhythm was excellent for me. Thank you.

I also had a fantastic smoothie this morning which was made from a banana some dessicated coconut ,a spoon of almond butter an omega 3 fortified egg with cranberry juice some berries and ice and just blended it all together for a delicious drink which really agreed with me.

I had sweet potato lean chicken and green veg for dinner and went for the run a couple of hours after. I am still mostly paleo and loving it. I think I may just have gone through that bad few days that everyone seems to go through . Onwards and upwards!