Bailing out child

haulagebasher

With ADHD I understand aggressive outbursts to an extent, but there have also been cases of planned attacks on family members in their sleep. That to me is cold and calculated, not impulsive as you would expect with ADHD. So I don't even think that's the only factor.

On that basis alone, for the sake of avoiding serious injury or death, I would say that the patient be removed from the home and sectioned. Given the grave circumstances, I would be approaching the HSE and notifying the Gardai and pleading extraordinary circumstances to have him committed to long term care. Having attempts made on your life while you are sleeping is an extreme case. TBH action should have been taken long before it has come to the stage where you cannot go to sleep for fear of being killed. This has revealed a whole new level of seriousness which is quite frightening. I hope something is organised ASAP. If there is long term difficulty in ensuring he medicates, I would say psychosurgery would offer an effective mode of adabitng the sexually violent behaviours. Serious side effects must take second place now since the acts have been revealed to be so serious. There is a HUGE difference between breaking into peoples houses and making an attempt on a sleeping persons life.
Another avenue of medical treatment parralell to the ADHD meds/surgery would be to have the medical team consider the use of Provera, which can substatially reduce the drive of sexually motivated offenders by interrupting hormones. It also causes a reduction in physical strength by preventing muscle growth. It may be particularly effective in controlling a 16 year old as they are going through puberty and it will block development of physical strength characteristics. A very effective treatment for safety concerns IMHO. It is used a lot in prisons in the USA.
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EDIT: No sexual motivation - duly noted.

MagicSean

haulagebasher wrote: »

If the child is refusing all reasonable attempts to help and offers of treatment, and bearing in mind my last post, do you think that there would be a viable case in arguing that they are not of sound mind and thus are incapable of making decisions regarding medical treatment.

He could just be an asshole. Why do people always look for some underlying cause. Can you not accept that some people are just bad?

haulagebasher

^^TBH I don't accept "being an asshole" as being a sufficient analysis of the problem. Even if he is "an asshole" something caused him to be this way and as a treatment, or damage limitation at least, for his safety and the safety of family adequate treatment must be secured. It is very difficult to get a person into a long term care institution but once they are in they are there in a controlled environment where meds/surgery can be administered as required. Now, I know the OP has revealed that the violence was non-sexual in nature but it has been carried out in the past where Provera has been administered as a preventative measure just in case sexually based violence were to develop. Certainly, int the case of long term care institutions it has been known to develop in previously non-sexually violent patients.Now when we have a situation where a patient will not accept medication, we have implants but these only last for so long before needing to be replaced. Given that he could be released or could flee care, psychosurgery really does provide the most reliable solution in such instances. I'm not sure if it's practiced here but it certainly is available in the mainland UK - the NTPF may be an option. One particularly interesting procedure which I have studies in the last few years is the Bilateral cingulotomy wherein the supra callosum fibres are obliterated which in many cases resulted in transforming practically uncontrollably violent patients into remarkably placid individuals. One side effect that occured in a number of the patients though was that they became entirely unmotivated and incapable of taking the initiative to completeing the most basic tasks, despite maintaining all of the higher facualties wholly intact. For instance they would have to be prompted to do basic things like get up or eat a meal. They would also have been capable of carrying out complex mental tasks such as algebraic calculations if they were prompted to do so (assuming of course that they were capable of such before the surgery). That particular patient was a former avionics engineer before becoming ill. A facinating subject by all accounts.

I do note that it is currently non-sexual but preventative measures such as this have been used in the past and have been (still are) quite effective.

Muir

The parent heard from the social worker a while ago. They are attempting to get the child a placement, although it'll be difficult as they can't be placed with other children. But hopefully that might help.

ResearchWill

Muir wrote: »

The parent heard from the social worker a while ago. They are attempting to get the child a placement, although it'll be difficult as they can't be placed with other children. But hopefully that might help.

Good, to see it going down this road, it won't be easy and will be a long road, maybe this event has brought the issues to ahead. But I really think all these avenues be exhausted before throwing in the towel.

MagicSean

ResearchWill wrote: »

Good, to see it going down this road, it won't be easy and will be a long road, maybe this event has brought the issues to ahead. But I really think all these avenues be exhausted before throwing in the towel.

I think it's the same road. Sounds like the child is being placed into the care of the HSE as he wasn't bailed.

ResearchWill

MagicSean wrote: »

I think it's the same road. Sounds like the child is being placed into the care of the HSE as he wasn't bailed.

A previous post from the OP "I will add, the child was bailed out by the parent last night,"

So last night the child was bailed. While this child may very well end up on the road. While care is not ideal there it is better than St. Pats. There are specialist units in the UK with very good success rates any chance is better than no chance.

MagicSean

ResearchWill wrote: »

A previous post from the OP "I will add, the child was bailed out by the parent last night,"

So last night the child was bailed. While this child may very well end up on the road. While care is not ideal there it is better than St. Pats. There are specialist units in the UK with very good success rates any chance is better than no chance.

Isn't Pats closed?

ResearchWill

MagicSean wrote: »

Isn't Pats closed?

As far as I know it's still open, but 16 to 17 year olds are going to oberstown. I believe St Pats will be fully closed in 2015 I think with all children detained in Oberstown in one of the 3 detention schools.

Sorry for saying he would be detained in st Pats habit.

biddybops

haulagebasher wrote: »

^^TBH I don't accept "being an asshole" as being a sufficient analysis of the problem. Even if he is "an asshole" something caused him to be this way and as a treatment, or damage limitation at least, for his safety and the safety of family adequate treatment must be secured. It is very difficult to get a person into a long term care institution but once they are in they are there in a controlled environment where meds/surgery can be administered as required. Now, I know the OP has revealed that the violence was non-sexual in nature but it has been carried out in the past where Provera has been administered as a preventative measure just in case sexually based violence were to develop. Certainly, int the case of long term care institutions it has been known to develop in previously non-sexually violent patients.Now when we have a situation where a patient will not accept medication, we have implants but these only last for so long before needing to be replaced. Given that he could be released or could flee care, psychosurgery really does provide the most reliable solution in such instances. I'm not sure if it's practiced here but it certainly is available in the mainland UK - the NTPF may be an option. One particularly interesting procedure which I have studies in the last few years is the Bilateral cingulotomy wherein the supra callosum fibres are obliterated which in many cases resulted in transforming practically uncontrollably violent patients into remarkably placid individuals. One side effect that occured in a number of the patients though was that they became entirely unmotivated and incapable of taking the initiative to completeing the most basic tasks, despite maintaining all of the higher facualties wholly intact. For instance they would have to be prompted to do basic things like get up or eat a meal. They would also have been capable of carrying out complex mental tasks such as algebraic calculations if they were prompted to do so (assuming of course that they were capable of such before the surgery). That particular patient was a former avionics engineer before becoming ill. A facinating subject by all accounts.

I do note that it is currently non-sexual but preventative measures such as this have been used in the past and have been (still are) quite effective.

Jesus wept.
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