A nice little petrol story.....

voz es

Last night while filling the car up with petrol it hit me how stupid this entire petrol problem is. How stupid the austerity measures that the government is undertaking in order bring back our sovereign is .The amount of money we are paying on tax direct and indirect is awesome, it’s epic like.

Watch this video, I remember watching its ages ago and thinking how ridiculous it is, I wasn't really mad then just passively annoyed, but I’m thinking its ridiculous and I'm looking at these petrol prices going up and up I’m angry now.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=76VOnzXQMsU

We have the petrol out the coast it was obtained through corruption so it should be null and void in my opinion; it is very simply the case. We should be petitioning countries in order to the rights back as it was against the law European and state what occurred the license was obtained through illegal activities.


Where i said petrol i ment to say natural resources, silly boy other than that my arguement is right

My name is URL

Oh god, not this shite again

Biggins

I'm fairly sure that there was no illegal contract activities in giving our oil/gas rights away.
As much as I dislike Shell Oil (or any others) having taken advantage of our oil/gas and our government previously giving it away for little or nothing, you can be sure the contracts involved were carefully put in print to cover all asses legally.

Was there some corruption sometime somewhere? - Its Ireland, a possibility...

Colmustard

This Shlt again

Rubbish

There has been 5 billion spent by multinational oil companies and not one commercial oil field was ever found. Only recently has someone struck oil.

So what would you have said if the Irish government had squandered 5 billion. Rightly you would be screaming murder and offer an alternative. You would say why not give a guarantee to prospective oil exploring companies that they will only pay a minimal tax on the find. That way we get a bonus tax, a new Irish industry and employment and a tax revenue from that.

That policy was one of FFs better ideas. Norways oil was guaranteed there was already wells in the northsea. Also it is shallow water oil which is cheaper to explore and harvest while our prospective finds are deep sea.

Tonyandthewhale

voz es wrote: »

Last night while filling the car up with petrol it hit me how stupid this is:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=76VOnzXQMsU

Couldn't agree with you more.

Defiler Of The Coffin

voz es wrote: »

We have the petrol out the coast it was obtained through corruption so it should be null and void in my opinion; it is very simply the case. We should be petitioning countries in order to the rights back as it was against the law European and state what occurred the license was obtained through illegal activities.

There's petrol out the coast? Which coast are you talking about? If you're talking about the Corrib Gas Field there's no petrol there

ejmaztec

Defiler Of The Coffin wrote: »

There's petrol out the coast? Which coast are you talking about? If you're talking about the Corrib Gas Field there's no petrol there

Saudi Arabia

Colmustard

Defiler Of The Coffin wrote: »

There's petrol out the coast? Which coast are you talking about? If you're talking about the Corrib Gas Field there's no petrol there

There was a big find off cork a few months ago. It wont be operational till 2014.

kneemos

Tonyandthewhale wrote: »

Couldn't agree with you more.

Couldn't agree with you.

Two words,

"Peak oil"

That's all...

Colmustard

Deleted User wrote: »

Two words,

"Peak oil"

That's all...

Not yet.
Another 2 words
Weak Euro.

kneemos

Deleted User wrote: »

Two words,

"Peak oil"

That's all...

A ploy to push up prices....six words.

voz es

Colmustard wrote: »

This Shlt again

Rubbish

There has been 5 billion spent by multinational oil companies and not one commercial oil field was ever found. Only recently has someone struck oil.

So what would you have said if the Irish government had squandered 5 billion. Rightly you would be screaming murder and offer an alternative. You would say why not give a guarantee to prospective oil exploring companies that they will only pay a minimal tax on the find. That way we get a bonus tax, a new Irish industry and employment and a tax revenue from that.

That policy was one of FFs better ideas. Norways oil was guaranteed there was already wells in the northsea. Also it is shallow water oil which is cheaper to explore and harvest while our prospective finds are deep sea.

we should not have washed our hands off a natural resource! Public private partnerships was the way to go, there expertise our resourses. there expertise was not worth much without our resources. Oil gas what ever it was.

racso1975

Turf not an option thanks to eu

Defiler Of The Coffin

Colmustard wrote: »

There was a big find off cork a few months ago. It wont be operational till 2014.

Great! But not much good for petrol prices at the moment.

Knex*

In New York at the moment the price of petrol would equate to something along the lines of €0.75c per litre ($3.50 a gallon).

Been told its almost up to €1.70 at home! :eek:

marshbaboon

Expensive petrol you say? I don't have a car so sucks to be you I guess.

Oh GOD I'm such a failure...

Biggins

voz es wrote: »

we should not have washed our hands off a natural resource! Public private partnerships was the way to go, there expertise our resourses. there expertise was not worth much without our resources. Oil gas what ever it was.

1. Indeed, we should not have 'washed' our hands of a natural resource so cheap.
2. If your debating over an issue - it helps your point of view if you can tell the difference between what your actually debating about - Oil/gas, whatever it was!

Pottler

racso1975 wrote: »

Turf not an option thanks to eu

Feck the EU. I am currently converting our Punto to run on turf. As soon as I manage to lift the Aga into the boot and plumb in the pipes we're off. I will be the one laughing at all ye with your high fuel prices. Once again, the missus is sceptical, but that's nothing new. I can see no flaws.

Colmustard

Defiler Of The Coffin wrote: »

Great! But not much good for petrol prices at the moment.

It wont be either, the price will still be set by the international markets.

I replaced my car last november I am so glad my priority in choosing a car was fuel economy.

I get 5 to 600 miles out of a 45 litre tank.

And I have a bike which I will be using more.

Guy:Incognito

Knex. wrote: »

In New York at the moment the price of petrol would equate to something along the lines of €0.75c per litre ($3.50 a gallon).

Been told its almost up to €1.70 at home! :eek:

If you get out a saw , cut us off Texas and send it over with the oil fields in place we can drop our prices a bit.

There's nothing to be celebrated in burning through a finite natural resource as quickly and cheaply as possible.

Colmustard

Originally Posted by voz es
we should not have washed our hands off a natural resource! Public private partnerships was the way to go, there expertise our resourses. there expertise was not worth much without our resources. Oil gas what ever it was.

Did we have 5 billion to spare on a gamble and it was a gamble. That would have been a very irresponsible thing to do with Irish taxpayers money.

kneemos

Pottler wrote: »

Feck the EU. I am currently converting our Punto to run on turf. As soon as I manage to lift the Aga into the boot and plumb in the pipes we're off. I will be the one laughing at all ye with your high fuel prices. Once again, the missus is sceptical, but that's nothing new. I can see no flaws.

The Aga might be heavier than the Punto.

My name is URL

Since you're comparing Ireland with Norway in a thread about petrol prices, OP, I'm sure you realise that fuel costs a lot more in Norway? Over €2 per litre, so what makes you think that costs in Ireland would fall if we retained public ownership of our small oil reserves?

Defiler Of The Coffin

Colmustard wrote: »

It wont be either, the price will still be set by the international markets.

I replaced my car last november I am so glad my priority in choosing a car was fuel economy.

I get 5 to 600 miles out of a 45 litre tank.

And I have a bike which I will be using more.

True. It still all has to be refined and processed and whatnot. I can't see much of an oil industry springing up here.

I'm driving a lot less myself these days, instead of driving long distances I'll take the bus unless it's massively inconvenient to use public transport (sadly in a lot of cases it is)

ScumLord

Two words.

drdeadlift

My name is URL wrote: »

Since you're comparing Ireland with Norway in a thread about petrol prices, OP, I'm sure you realise that fuel costs a lot more in Norway? Over €2 per litre, so what makes you think that costs in Ireland would fall if we retained public ownership of our small oil reserves?

Wages are ALOT higher in Norway.

Colmustard

Defiler Of The Coffin wrote: »

True. It still all has to be refined and processed and whatnot. I can't see much of an oil industry springing up here.

I'm driving a lot less myself these days, instead of driving long distances I'll take the bus unless it's massively inconvenient to use public transport (sadly in a lot of cases it is)

Yeah I don't drive to town either, I cycle and by the looks of it so are a lot of others.

It might, Cork could become an Aberdeen if the government get the policy right. For instance Tax breaks for offshore oil auxiliary companies, creating the college courses for the expertise needed etc. I am sure they will be doing something, at least I hope they will.

Defiler Of The Coffin

Colmustard wrote: »

Yeah I don't drive to town either, I cycle and by the looks of it so are a lot of others.

It might, Cork could become an Aberdeen if the government get the policy right. For instance Tax breaks for offshore oil auxiliary companies, creating the college courses for the expertise needed etc. I am sure they will be doing something, at least I hope they will.

Hopefully you're right, but will there be enough oil there to justify the investment needed? As long as there are no ecological disasters like the Gulf then it can't do any harm, might be just the shot in the arm that Cork needs.

I'm fortunate enough to live in a place where I can walk into work, no spend on fuel and no unpredictable commutes or early rises. Sometimes I can go a month without refilling the car. Not doable for many I know!

Colmustard

Colmustard wrote: »

Not yet.
Another 2 words
Weak Euro.

Supply isn't keeping up with demand either, hence the stubbonly high prices!

Rabidlamb

Sneaky Shinner is sneaky

Colmustard

Defiler Of The Coffin wrote: »

Hopefully you're right, but will there be enough oil there to justify the investment needed? As long as there are no ecological disasters like the Gulf then it can't do any harm, might be just the shot in the arm that Cork needs.

Its a big field estimates are its over a billion barrels and it is light crude which is even better again as it is cheaper to pump out and process. If the government play their card right it could make Cork a very wealthy county. I also hope there is no disaster, but that is all we can is hope. I think the lessons have been learned from the gulf oil disaster fiasco.

Also if there is one field it means there are others.

Deleted User wrote: »

Supply isn't keeping up with demand either, hence the stubbonly high prices!

True, the second the oil hits the surface it is demanded, the far east keep demanding more and it is rumoured that the jeddah saudi fields are running dry.

But if it was peak oil the price would be about a tenner a litre so not yet. There still are new fields been discovered.

donegal_road

Rockefeller, prohibition and ethanol run engines

Most people are not aware that Henry Ford's Model T came in a variation
that allowed the driver to switch the carburetor to run the engine on
farm-made ethyl alcohol. This allowed the operator to stop at local farms
(equipped with stills) to refuel his/her car during long trips through the
backcountry. The Standard Oil Company and its
industrialist-founder John D. Rockefeller wasn't too happy with this
arrangement. After all, Rockefeller's company had a virtual monopoly on
gasoline at this time in our nation's development.

Since the late 1800's there had been a growing Alcohol Temperance Movement developing among reformers. Rockefeller saw an opportunity in this. It is well-documented that local efforts to curb alcohol consumption were
expanded to the national level when high-profile figures like Rockefeller
joined in the anti-alcohol efforts. Was he so concerned with the social
problems that abuse of alcohol was said to cause?

No... John D. Rockefeller was not concerned with family dynamics in the
working classes. But he was influential in changing the goals of the
movement from temperance to prohibition. He gave the equivalent of $60
million in today's dollars to an obscure group pushing for prohibition
called the Women's Christian Temperance Union. As we know, his
contribution to the outlawing of the production and sale of alcohol was
successful. Of course, Rockefeller and the oil companies reaped tremendous
profits as a result. Remember that the period covered by the 18th
Amendment (1919-1933) coincided with the huge rise in the sale and
operation of automobiles. America was on the move, and all of these cars
were now operated solely on gasoline. By the time that the 21st Amendment
was passed, ending the prohibition of alcohol, the standard was already
set and worked completely in the favor of the Rockefeller family.

Jev/N

Another cogent and well-informed view, yay!

My name is URL

drdeadlift wrote: »

Wages are ALOT higher in Norway.

But fuel costs aren't dictated by average wage levels, it may play some small indirect role in determining the cost but if you look at other countries with higher average wages than Ireland you'll notice that they also have far lower fuel costs, and likewise many countries with a lower average wage have higher petrol costs, so it's clear that one is not necessarily based on the other.

The OP seems to think that if Ireland retains public ownership of its reserves, that fuel costs will naturally fall. The opposite is in fact more likely to happen as the state would need to increase tax in order to maintain and put to use the resources.

Colmustard

donegal_road wrote: »

Rockefeller, prohibition and ethanol run engines

That is a daft solution, we will be facing serious food inflation next year as it is.

As more land is turned over to ethanol that compounds the problem.

They are experimenting with bacterial diesel I think that maybe the future.

Batteries and hydrogen cell are non runners. Lithium and other battery chemicals are also a relatively rare commodity. If they start using these commodities in a billion cars, there would be non left soon.

tricky D

Defiler Of The Coffin wrote: »

As long as there are no ecological disasters like the Gulf then it can't do any harm, might be just the shot in the arm that Cork needs.

Colmustard wrote: »

If the government play their card right it could make Cork a very wealthy county.

Very unlikely. The oil is the wrong type for the Whiddy Island Refinery and will likely go to Rotterdam for that. Also, the platform is currently serviced from Liverpool for infrastructure reasons and that is unlikely to change much.

Colmustard

tricky D wrote: »

Very unlikely. The oil is the wrong type for the Whiddy Island Refinery and will likely go to Rotterdam for that. Also, the platform is currently serviced from Liverpool for infrastructure reasons and that is unlikely to change much.

I was just hoping, they could build a suitable refinery and insist they use it for some of the production, also there are other industries that could build up because of our new oil industry.

It will be worth pursuing that, it will also be good PR for the oil company.