Digital Switchover

Duster

Mods - I know there is a forum for Saorview and the Digital Switchover but just wanting some more local info. That forum way too large.

So the questions to any local (East Donegal) experts...

1) The UK channels (BBC, UTV, CH4 etc) - will they be available from the Strabane transmitter on Freeview after analogue switchoff ? I tried to tune them on my "freeview enabled TV" last week but no luck

2) Can a Saorview Approved TV pick up both the Irish Saorview and the UK Freeview channels at the same time ?

That will do for starts - any information would be appreciated

oranbhoy67

I dont know about the 1st question but i know the answer to the second - no , the UK & Eire digital TV frequencies are both entirely different , the only way you could have access to them both on the one TV is if you use 2 separate digital receivers and switch between the both, personally ill be sticking to the UK transmission till such a time that Saorview receivers become more affordable & have more than just a few channels available.. i could be waiting a while!

homer simpson

Duster wrote: »

Mods - I know there is a forum for Saorview and the Digital Switchover but just wanting some more local info. That forum way too large.

So the questions to any local (East Donegal) experts...

1) The UK channels (BBC, UTV, CH4 etc) - will they be available from the Strabane transmitter on Freeview after analogue switchoff ? I tried to tune them on my "freeview enabled TV" last week but no luck

The signal has been "turned down" lately I live not too far away and my signal has gotten worse by about 50% meaning I've lost a good few channels and other come & go. That's using a freeview box bought in the north.

Did you get the TV in ROI or NI, you'll only get NI channel's with an NI baught TV as they are on different frequencies.

2) Can a Saorview Approved TV pick up both the Irish Saorview and the UK Freeview channels at the same time ?

That will do for starts - any information would be appreciated

This question is better asked over on the sat forum, but yes you can get a set top box that does both, you'll need a dish though AFAIK, you can go into your PO and get it all for €349 that's installed and all equiptment (got a leaflet through the door last week about it, you need the leaflet to do it too). But your better off asking in sat forum, in fact if you look most of the info will be there already.

theblueirish

Duster wrote: »

Mods - I know there is a forum for Saorview and the Digital Switchover but just wanting some more local info. That forum way too large.

So the questions to any local (East Donegal) experts...

1) The UK channels (BBC, UTV, CH4 etc) - will they be available from the Strabane transmitter on Freeview after analogue switchoff ? I tried to tune them on my "freeview enabled TV" last week but no luck

2) Can a Saorview Approved TV pick up both the Irish Saorview and the UK Freeview channels at the same time ?

That will do for starts - any information would be appreciated

1) Strabane will not start broadcasting until October 10th with a few channels, when RTE analogue is turned off on October 24th Strabane will come on broadcasting all Digital Stations. If you receive a good analogue picture now you should be able to receive digital channels no problem.

2) Yes a Saorview approved TV will pick up both Saorview and Freeview on the same TV, so will alot of TV's that are not Saorview approved. When buying one check that it has a Mpeg 4 decoder and not Mpeg 2.
If it is not Saorview approved you may not get the digital teletext, it will depend on the TV and if it has Mheg5.
If buying a TV in NI make sure that it is Freeview HD not just Freeview.

GoldenGreen

theblueirish wrote: »

1) Strabane will not start broadcasting until October 10th with a few channels, when RTE analogue is turned off on October 24th Strabane will come on broadcasting all Digital Stations. If you receive a good analogue picture now you should be able to receive digital channels no problem.

2) Yes a Saorview approved TV will pick up both Saorview and Freeview on the same TV, so will alot of TV's that are not Saorview approved. When buying one check that it has a Mpeg 4 decoder and not Mpeg 2.
If it is not Saorview approved you may not get the digital teletext, it will depend on the TV and if it has Mheg5.
If buying a TV in NI make sure that it is Freeview HD not just Freeview.

just to expand on the Freeview HD and buying a TV in the North, freeview HD works off a mpeg 4 decoder, which is what saorview works with too, if you just get a Freeview tv then it will just have the mpeg 2 decoder which will not decoded saorview, you might pick up the audio but no picture.
Also if the TV is HD it does not mean the the Freeview receiver is HD so always check that it a Freeview HD receiver that built into the TV.

byte

To expand even further, Saorview is to Nordig standards whilst Freeview HD is to UK's own D-Book Standards, so a few things may not work. Generally things are fine though with a few exceptions (if buying Panasonic in the North for example, be SURE it works on Saorview before heading South again, regardless if it has MPEG4 video decoders or not)

It should also be noted that Saorview uses DVB-T, whereas Freeview HD channels use DVB-T2 so HD channels probably won't work on Saorview hardware

It's a MINEFIELD!

Duster

thanks all for the input so far....

The LG I have at the minute was bought in the north a few years ago and it is/was freeview enabled. However, I just tried last week to retune it to check if it could pick up the UK channels on its freeview....no joy whats so ever.

It did pick up the saorview digital channels (volume only) which was expected as its not a full HD tv.

I suppose I am just trying to figure out what to do for the switchover.

Do I wait and see if the freeview signal strength is boosted from Strabane on the changeover date which if it is, buying a new TV with Freeview HD will do the job . It would give me the BBC, UTV, CH4 and the Irish Saorviews.

If not, its looking like going down the route of freesat which I dont particulary want to do.

Also, does anyone know any good installers in the area (Newtown, Manor, Raphoe) who they could or would recommend should a big job be required ?

byte

The Volume only, is because the digital decoder is MPEG2, not MPEG4, as mentioned earlier. Nothing to do with being "full HD" as that only refers to the resolution of the screen.

If your signal from Strabane is good, then just wait til Switchover for the Freeview, no need for Freesat.

You will need a new set top box or TV to receive Saorview, whether it be a Saorview or FreeviewHD box/TV.

muffler

byte wrote: »

You will need a new set top box or TV to receive Saorview.

Just picking up on this point byte will it not be possible to pick up the Irish channels on freeview from Strabane for example (TV3 aside)

theblueirish

@ Duster
I get the impression you are trying to get UK channels at the minute from Strabane. Strabane is not broadcasting Freeview and will not until October.

@ Muffler
There is talk of RTE 1 &2 being broadcast on a "mini mux" from Strabane. I'm not sure if this will happen but if it does expect some content ie sport to be blacked out.

sesswhat

muffler wrote: »

Just picking up on this point byte will it not be possible to pick up the Irish channels on freeview from Strabane for example (TV3 aside)

Even if the mini-mux theblueirish talks about was broadcast from Strabane (and I don't think there are any plans to do so?), it would be DVB-T2 only, so it would still need a Freeview HD Box or TV to receive it. The same equipment would receive all the Saorview channels from our local transmitters anyway.

Eastern parts of Donegal, from Ballybofey to Letterkenny down through the East of Inishowen should be well covered for both Saorview and Freeview after switchover.

Generally speaking:

'Freeview HD' approved equipment should work for everything.*

'Saorview' approved equipment should work for all Saorview channels and Freeview SD channels (but not the Freeview HD channels)

'Freeview' approved equipment may only work for Freeview SD channels.

* Before buying anything I would suggest getting the make and model number and running it past the Terrestrial forum first.

Firblog

People picking up UK digital channels in Killybegs at the min, fairly prone to breaking up etc at the min tho, would expect it to improve vastly come the big switch on..

byte

muffler wrote: »

Just picking up on this point byte will it not be possible to pick up the Irish channels on freeview from Strabane for example (TV3 aside)

Aye, I had forgotten about the "minimux" that RTE and TG4 will peruse after switchover. I didn't realise it'd run from Strabane Tx though? It's only to run from a select few. Most other areas will get overspill easily.

It is understood that the new multiplex for Northern Ireland intended to carry TV services TG4, RTÉ1 and RTÉ2 from selected transmitters in Northern Ireland will be a fully integrated part of the UK digital terrestrial TV system. The broadcasters intend to cross carry full electronic programme guide data for UK digital terrestrial TV. The multiplex will use the Digital TV Group "D book" specification DVB-T2 transmission mode 16 QAM, FEC rate ½ (DTG 164). This means that the services should be fully receivable with "Freeview HD" accredited models. It is unlikely to be receivable by TVs, recorders or set-top boxes not bearing the “Freeview HD” trade mark. Some households may require a new or additional rooftop aerial to receive the multiplex.
It is currently expected that the new multiplex will be broadcast from the Brougher Mountain, Black Mountain, and Carnmoney Hill transmitters.

http://www.digitaltelevision.gov.uk/publications/pub_technote_tg4_NI.html

It should also be noted that where possible, it's best to try receive Saorview, as it'll have TV3, 3e, etc, but not only that, it's most likely that the minimux version of RTE will have sports and maybe some films replaced with blank screens due to not having NI rights, the same as on Sky in NI.

muffler

There is loads of info here for people who are or will continue to get their signals from NI.

byte

Aye, including an info doc in Ulster Scots. Tight bit of reading!

No Freeview From Limavady

Same issue applies here in Speenogue Burt At moment with Digital Signal Coming from Limavady Transmitter cannot get Signal at all.

Have sent emails to <snip please don't post people's e-mail addreses>

I have been in contact with all Media Organisations UTV.BBC,RTE about this same issue as this is the broadcasters area and have a vested interested that we get a good picture after digital switchover from both sides of the border under the Good Friday Agreement.

Would you be able to find out who runs and operates TV mast at Limvady Co. Derry and weathers assurances can be got that residents who live in Border Areas I.E. Burt Co.Donegal who have always got a picture from this tranmitter will still remain get picture from Limvady after switchover.

homer simpson

No Freeview From Limavady wrote: »

Same issue applies here in Speenogue Burt At moment with Digital Signal Coming from Limavady Transmitter cannot get Signal at all.

Have sent emails to <snip please don't post people's e-mail addreses>

I have been in contact with all Media Organisations UTV.BBC,RTE about this same issue as this is the broadcasters area and have a vested interested that we get a good picture after digital switchover from both sides of the border under the Good Friday Agreement.

Would you be able to find out who runs and operates TV mast at Limvady Co. Derry and weathers assurances can be got that residents who live in Border Areas I.E. Burt Co.Donegal who have always got a picture from this tranmitter will still remain get picture from Limvady after switchover.

Now why do you think anyone this side of the border is entitled to receive NI freeview? We don't pay a TV license in the north so aren't entitled to anything from Limavady.

No Freeview From Limavady

uk transmitter operators in fact do have an obligation cross-border agreement was signed north/south,think you need to check your facts out before posting on here!

just because i live on the border does not mean tv broadcasts stop at the border,tranmissions singals do cross borders overspill dont you know

No Freeview From Limavady

check your facts domer simpson

theblueirish

Freeview is already broadcasting from Limavady albeit not at full power yet.

Derry and Strabane do the first part of their switch over on October 10th with the remainder happening on 24th.

I am sure you will be able to receive freeview from Derry or Strabane although it will be 'freeview light' in the sense that it will not broadcast all that Limavady will broadcast.

Duster

homer simpson wrote: »

Now why do you think anyone this side of the border is entitled to receive NI freeview? We don't pay a TV license in the north so aren't entitled to anything from Limavady.

No need for such sarcasm to what was a very reasonable query / question :rolleyes:

homer simpson

Duster wrote: »

No need for such sarcasm to what was a very reasonable query / question :rolleyes:

Not a hint of sarcasm in my post at all. People who complain about not getting something they are not really supposed to get bug me that's all.

homer simpson

No Freeview From Limavady wrote: »

check your facts domer simpson

I waited until I got home to check this as I was starting to doubt myself, but I was right;

"On 1 February 2010 Ireland's Minister for Communications Eamon Ryan signed an agreement with the UK's Ben Bradshaw. This agreement will enable viewers within Northern Ireland to watch RTÉ One, RTÉ Two and TG4 on a free-to-air basis as of 2012. The agreement between both jurisdictions will also guarantee that viewers within the Republic of Ireland will be able to view BBC One Northern Ireland and BBC Two Northern Ireland on the Republic of Ireland's free-to-air service to debut in late 2010. A cross-border initiative has always been on the agenda for the Green Party in the Republic of Ireland. However it was later announced that a change has occurred such that BBC services are now to be offered in the Republic of Ireland on a 'paid for' basis and not the original free-to-air basis"

Noel Dempseys Den

homer simpson wrote: »

I waited until I got home to check this as I was starting to doubt myself, but I was right;

"On 1 February 2010 Ireland's Minister for Communications Eamon Ryan signed an agreement with the UK's Ben Bradshaw. This agreement will enable viewers within Northern Ireland to watch RTÉ One, RTÉ Two and TG4 on a free-to-air basis as of 2012. The agreement between both jurisdictions will also guarantee that viewers within the Republic of Ireland will be able to view BBC One Northern Ireland and BBC Two Northern Ireland on the Republic of Ireland's free-to-air service to debut in late 2010. A cross-border initiative has always been on the agenda for the Green Party in the Republic of Ireland. However it was later announced that a change has occurred such that BBC services are now to be offered in the Republic of Ireland on a 'paid for' basis and not the original free-to-air basis"

Anyone in Speenogue is much more likely to receive UK transmissions from Sheriff's Mountain (Derry City), not Limavady. Iskaheen Mountain blocks line of sight as far as I can remember. Right now, as of 8th October, Sheriffs Mountain is NOT carrying Freeview. However, BBC Two analogue is being switched off at midnight on 9th October (tomorrow night) and some Freeview channels will be available for the first time from the Derry transmitter and the other relays in the North that up to now have not carried digital channels. Choice of box is either UK Freeview HD (advertised in Derry the other week in the Diamond at £50) or an ROI Saorview box at €75.

Where we are with cross border TV is that only Divis and Brogher Mountain will broadcast RTE One, Two and TG4. Limavady will not. The ROI is deemed to be covered by Freesat and Sky. That's it. Zero point in asking Arqiva about ROI coverage, they have no obligation at all to ROI viewers.

byte

http://www.digitaluk.co.uk/transmitternetwork/tools__and__resources/almanac/installer_newsletters_transmitter_groups2009_pdfs/NI_BroMtDivisLima_1MO_13_Sept_12_Final_revised.pdf

This PDF might be worth a gander, showing what's going down and how they're going about it.

donegal_road

byte wrote: »

Aye, including an info doc in Ulster Scots. Tight bit of reading!

I just saw that.. lol

theblueirish

Its started!!!!!

sesswhat

If you are getting TV from any of the following transmitters you can check for the BBC Freeview channels now with a digital TV or set top box:

Limavady CH50 (Signals much stronger than previously)
Londonderry (Sheriff's Mountain) CH44
Strabane CH45

cappichino

Bought a laurus saorview box in aldi last month .This morning it also tuned in the freeview stations on channel 45 .Am delighted as I thought I'd also have to buy a few freeview boxes on the 24 October. We never got a great signal from the north but it is coming in a 95%

muffler

Just did a scan there and have a lot of BBC freeview channels using just the old analogue aerial

sesswhat

muffler wrote: »

Just did a scan there and have a lot of BBC freeview channels using just the old analogue aerial

That should be the case for most people. Anyone already getting a reasonable reception through an aerial for the UK channels should not need to change the aerial to get Freeview, provided their signal is coming from a transmitter in NI.

Above all, don't let anyone try to tell you a 'Digital' aerial is needed as such a thing does not exist. Freeview, and Saorview, are broadcast using good old-fashioned UHF.

dinorebel

If you're getting the analogue uk stations through the aerial would a cheap set top box from the north work in Letterkenny.

muffler

dinorebel wrote: »

If you're getting the analogue uk stations through the aerial would a cheap set top box from the north work in Letterkenny.

It will.

You wont need one if its a digital TV though.

sesswhat

dinorebel wrote: »

If you're getting the analogue uk stations through the aerial would a cheap set top box from the north work in Letterkenny.

The cheaper boxes in the north marked 'Freeview' will only work with the standard definition UK channels.

A locally bought Saorview certified box can be used for the Irish and UK digital channels, including any Irish HD channels.

Meanwhile a 'Freeview HD' box from the north can be used for HD Freeview, SD Freeview and should also work for Saorview.*

* Before buying anything I would suggest getting the make and model number and running it past the Terrestrial forum first.

NIMAN

Its not 100% that a Freeview HD box will work with Saorview.

I had one
http://www.amazon.co.uk/TechniSat-Freeview-Terrestrial-Receiver-functionality/dp/B003XU78CC
and it didn't work properly.

worked for half of them, but on the other half of the channels I got sound only, no picture.

sesswhat

NIMAN wrote: »

Its not 100% that a Freeview HD box will work with Saorview.

There have been problems with some Freeview HD boxes as you say. I've edited the post to add the same warning as previously.

dinorebel

muffler wrote: »

It will.

You wont need one if its a digital TV though.

I have Sky and a digital tv what I'm looking for is a way to get a signal for an old tv in the kids playroom.If a £20 set top box will work through the aerial that would be ideal.

sesswhat

dinorebel wrote: »

I have Sky and a digital tv what I'm looking for is a way to get a signal for an old tv in the kids playroom.If a £20 set top box will work through the aerial that would be ideal.

The trouble with the £20 Freeview boxes is that you will have no Irish channels after the 24th October. A Saorview box may be more suitable if you want RTE Junior, TG4 etc.

You will probably need to connect through a SCART socket. There will be no HD but this will likely not be an issue.

dinorebel

sesswhat wrote: »

The trouble with the £20 Freeview boxes is that you will have no Irish channels after the 24th October. A Saorview box may be more suitable if you want RTE Junior, TG4 etc.

You will probably need to connect through a SCART socket. There will be no HD but this will likely not be an issue.

Not to fussed about the lack of Irish channels as will have them in main room.If I could get BBC,ITV,C4 ect I will be happy enough.

muffler

dinorebel wrote: »

Not to fussed about the lack of Irish channels as will have them in main room.If I could get BBC,ITV,C4 ect I will be happy enough.

You shouldn't have any problems in getting those

harpstilidie

Done a scan last night to see what UK channels I could get on the Saorview box and it picked up all the BBC channels but didn't pick up UTV, Channel 4 etc. Will it be possible to get those channels at all after the switchover? I also connected my HDMI cable to my saorview box but it still won't show RTE 2 in HD just SD. I assume I can't get the HD version as it isn't a Saorview approved box?

sesswhat

harpstilidie wrote: »

Done a scan last night to see what UK channels I could get on the Saorview box and it picked up all the BBC channels but didn't pick up UTV, Channel 4 etc. Will it be possible to get those channels at all after the switchover? I also connected my HDMI cable to my saorview box but it still won't show RTE 2 in HD just SD. I assume I can't get the HD version as it isn't a Saorview approved box?

The other channels will follow on the 24th.

RTE2 is HD-only on Saorview. Do you have it connected by SCART as well?

What is the model number of the box?

harpstilidie

sesswhat wrote: »

The other channels will follow on the 24th.

RTE2 is HD-only on Saorview. Do you have it connected by SCART as well?

What is the model number of the box?

Thanks. Yeah connected by SCART into the TV and the HDMI lead from the box into the TV.

It's a DVB-T Receiver HD H.264/MPEG-4. Model number from what I can gather is DTR5104M.

sesswhat

Try connecting by HDMI only, or select HDMI as the source on the TV. When using SCART, any HD pictures get downscaled to SD.

harpstilidie

sesswhat wrote: »

Try connecting by HDMI only, or select HDMI as the source on the TV. When using SCART, any HD pictures get downscaled to SD.

Connected by HDMI only now and it still looks like it's in SD not HD. There is some kids programme on at the minute though so hard to tell!

sesswhat

A lot of the content uses SD material which is then upscaled by RTE. The best results are from material originally shot in HD, like many sports events. As time goes on they should have more 'Native HD'.

I don't know much about that receiver, but there may be an option somehere in the menus to change the output resolution.

harpstilidie

sesswhat wrote: »

A lot of the content uses SD material which is then upscaled by RTE. The best results are from material originally shot in HD, like many sports events. As time goes on they should have more 'Native HD'.

I don't know much about that receiver, but there may be an option somehere in the menus to change the output resolution.

Thanks man, appreciate the help. I'll check the next time they have a programme shot in actual HD. It does seem slightly better quality than the other channels so it may have worked.

sesswhat

Try 7pm tomorrow;)

harpstilidie

sesswhat wrote: »

Try 7pm tomorrow;)

Exactly what I was thinking! All set to watch a horror show in stunning HD

muffler

If its any help there are details of the available channels and coverage after the switch over for the Strabane region here and the Limavady region here

firemansam4

Was reading this thread earlier today and thinking to myself that I might try tune in the bbc channels into our saorview box when i get home, was thinking maybe that the tv reception we had from our loft aerial probably wouldn't pick them up

But just switched on the saorview box and an extra 10 BBC channels appeared on it without having to tune anything in - they all seem to work fine, as good as the saorview stations.