Today’s Irish Independent

rom

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=80227704&postcount=60

BeepBeep67

That's Gary Crossan with the buggy - manages the AK shop in Bray, finished 15th in 27:09 and his Mrs (Maria McCambridge) in the middle - 26:35. Was talking to him before and after - seemed pleased with his run .

RacoonQueen

Is that Maria McCambridge yer man is holding back?

edit: yes, didn't see beepbeeps post

LacticAthlete

Did the child finish 14th? Age group record?

Krusty_Clown

Who's the baldy lad behind Maria McCambridge?

rom

BeepBeep67 wrote: »

That's Gary Crossan with the buggy - manages the AK shop in Bray, finished 15th in 27:09 and his Mrs (Maria McCambridge) in the middle - 26:35. Was talking to him before and after - seemed pleased with his run .

Do you know him well, could you ask him the name and brand of the buggy as would like to get one ?

InsaneBolt

What time did the baby buggy around in? Great pic, but wonder about the health and safety issue placing the child in such a potentially dangerous situation. Would race organiser insurance co be pleased? Only wondering!!

BeepBeep67

rom wrote: »

Do you know him well, could you ask him the name and brand of the buggy as would like to get one ?

Won't see him for a bit - but just call the Bray store.

rom

BeepBeep67 wrote: »

Won't see him for a bit - but just call the Bray store.

Will give them an email. They might find the call a tad strange.

nerraw1111

Clearly, it's a mclaren. *I'll get my coat.

thirstywork2

http://www.babyjogger.co.uk/performance.html

Same pram as Paula used.Have to get one myself

http://www.flickr.com/photos/edenhill77/7762894130/in/set-72157631027344408/

MrCreosote

InsaneBolt wrote: »

What time did the baby buggy around in? Great pic, but wonder about the health and safety issue placing the child in such a potentially dangerous situation. Would race organiser insurance co be pleased? Only wondering!!

What's potentially dangerous about it?

Top speed of 20kph or so.

If it was a childseat on a bike you'd easily exceed that and nobody would bat an eyelid.

BeepBeep67

Krusty_Clown wrote: »

Who's the baldy lad behind Maria McCambridge?

That was as close as I got

walshb

What is the logic and reasoning for the pram and baby? Very odd, and also, yes, it is possibly very dangeorus and completely unnecessary. That crowd looks so so set on that line. He placed that child in danger for what?

robinph

walshb wrote: »

What is the logic and reasoning for the pram and baby? Very odd, and also, yes, it is possibly very dangeorus and completely unnecessary. That crowd looks so so set on that line. He placed that child in danger for what?

Because him and the Mrs were running by the looks of it. Only 14 people beat the buggy and one of those was the mother, not much harm in it. If they were mid pack runners then maybe, but starting from the front and being faster than everyone else still with the buggy we can't really criticise.

Gringo78

walshb wrote: »

What is the logic and reasoning for the pram and baby? Very odd, and also, yes, it is possibly very dangeorus and completely unnecessary. That crowd looks so so set on that line. He placed that child in danger for what?

Obviously he wanted to run - since his wife was also running the race who was going to look after the kid?? To be honest, I can't see how the child is in much danger when he starts from the front, running on closed roads so will have nothing coming against him, basically clear road. Much more risk in just a normal run around a park with a buggy where you can have dogs, cyclists, anything coming against you.

As for the crowd looking set to go - Gary has enough pace in him to put distance to the crowd behind him easily. Probably ran the first 500m harder than he normally would (effort wise) to make clear road for himself. Somebody 5-10min slower might be a bit more dangerous though as they'd have no place starting up the front and so would be back in the general melee.

RandyMann

If some of the (faster) road running fraternity give out about midpack runners holding up the fast runners along with walkers, and people with buggys etc. surely there should be a one rule for all?
This guy gets excused cause hes faster than most of the pack? I wouldnt care myself cause I dont run the roads, but you know there would be a lot of the slower runners/walkers thinking now, "well look at your man with the buggy, thats a great idea for the next race"

jeawan

Gringo78 wrote: »

Obviously he wanted to run - since his wife was also running the race who was going to look after the kid?? To be honest, I can't see how the child is in much danger when he starts from the front, running on closed roads so will have nothing coming against him, basically clear road. Much more risk in just a normal run around a park with a buggy where you can have dogs, cyclists, anything coming against you.

As for the crowd looking set to go - Gary has enough pace in him to put distance to the crowd behind him easily. Probably ran the first 500m harder than he normally would (effort wise) to make clear road for himself. Somebody 5-10min slower might be a bit more dangerous though as they'd have no place starting up the front and so would be back in the general melee.

Fair balls to him can not see it being dangerous at all . i would be pissed if i was behind him though man imagine getting beaten by a lad pushing a buggy in a race :P

DULLAHAN2

I remember last year i was doing the letterkenny 10km and about 3 k into it, he comes past me at awful speed. I had seen him at the start and just presumed he was going to walk with the baby as he was at the back of the pack. Next day on the radio there was tons of calls into the local radio station giving out about it. I dont see a problem with it.

RandyMann

Sure lets have a rule, sub 35min 10k runners bring your children and buggys, egg and spoon, whatever, the rest of you, well, you know the rule

Gringo78

RandyMann wrote: »

Sure lets have a rule, sub 35min 10k runners bring your children and buggys, egg and spoon, whatever, the rest of you, well, you know the rule

I'd be 99% sure that he cleared it with the race director beforehand that he was going to run with a buggy. The race director will know how many people are going to be running and the spread of times so can make the call as to whether its dangerous or not.

robinph

RandyMann wrote: »

If some of the (faster) road running fraternity give out about midpack runners holding up the fast runners along with walkers, and people with buggys etc. surely there should be a one rule for all?
This guy gets excused cause hes faster than most of the pack? I wouldnt care myself cause I dont run the roads, but you know there would be a lot of the slower runners/walkers thinking now, "well look at your man with the buggy, thats a great idea for the next race"

If he was a mid 30 minute+ 10k runner then yes it would be an incredible bad idea to start in the normal place in the pack so he should then start at the back with the walkers and work his way through gaps as they appear. He started in an appropriate position for his speed, and other than a slow start I very much doubt he held anyone up.

It's the not starting in an appropriate position that people complain about.

RandyMann

robinph wrote: »

If he was a mid 30 minute+ 10k runner then yes it would be an incredible bad idea to start in the normal place in the pack so he should then start at the back with the walkers and work his way through gaps as they appear. He started in an appropriate position for his speed, and other than a slow start I very much doubt he held anyone up.

It's the not starting in an appropriate position that people complain about.

I dunno, as regards race etiquette, I believe in the one rule for all principal. It works on the track so the road should be no different. There would be few complaints then.

Brianderunner

He should be disqualified, arguably he could have used the buggy as an aid to assist with running downhill etc. Who's to say the buggy didnt have a motor in it?

I dont buy the whole "who'll mind the kid" stuff. Surely there is someone they use for that kind of thing.

ThisRegard

Christ, people do have little to whinge about. I don't see what the big deal is, he's obviously done it a few times and kicks the ass off those who complain anyway.

walshb

robinph wrote: »

Because him and the Mrs were running by the looks of it. Only 14 people beat the buggy and one of those was the mother, not much harm in it. If they were mid pack runners then maybe, but starting from the front and being faster than everyone else still with the buggy we can't really criticise.

Fact is that he and his wife could not have know what would have happened until it happened. Turned out that all was ok, and that most of the other runners were useless.;)

Gambas

Gringo78 wrote: »

I'd be 99% sure that he cleared it with the race director beforehand that he was going to run with a buggy. The race director will know how many people are going to be running and the spread of times so can make the call as to whether its dangerous or not.

hmm....personally I think it was a bad call okay'ing it, if that is what happened. It was a talking point afterwards (observations rather than complaints) and next year they are going to have some job convincing people that no buggies really means no buggies. And the start was chaotic enough (having to get around walkers within 100m of the start) without adding that into the mix.

http://www.galwaycityharriers.com/streets-galway/corrib-oil-sog-2012-final-instructions-entrants

Race Safety
- For the safety of all, headphones, iPods, buggies, younger children or pets are not permitted on the race-route.
- Please obey the instructions of the Gardaí and race-officials at all times during the evening.
- Do not leave car-keys, mobile phones, wallets or other valuables in the changing rooms or elsewhere in the vicinity of the start/finish area.

walshb

Brianderunner wrote: »

I dont buy the whole "who'll mind the kid" stuff. Surely there is someone they use for that kind of thing.

Absolutely. Are people trying to claim that he had to do it due to the lack of a child minder?:rolleyes:

Bottom line: It's just not on. It's either a race or it's not, and this crap of pushing buggies while running a competitive race is just bonkers.

RandyMann

Cause its Gary Crossan, "lets lick his arse"(cause hes faster than anyone here), if it was anyone else, "look at this eejit with the buggy"

Hypocritical boards viewpoint coming through again....

jeffontour

I think that's great to see. The parents love running, the child is involved from an early age and nobody gets hurt by it.

He started in a position matched to his ability. If everybody did that races would go much smoother, be they pushing a buggy, dressed as a dinosaur or in a club singlet.

Gambas

1435 - lol

robinph

It's the guy in the AK kit at the other end of the line who seems to be false starting and pushing the other people backwards I've got more of an issue with.

RandyMann

jeffontour wrote: »

I think that's great to see. The parents love running, the child is involved from an early age and nobody gets hurt by it.

He started in a position matched to his ability. If everybody did that races would go much smoother, be they pushing a buggy, dressed as a dinosaur or in a club singlet.

Sounds like you are the type that would run with the fox and hunt with the hounds...

sconhome

RacoonQueen wrote: »

Is that Maria McCambridge yer man is holding back?

edit: yes, didn't see beepbeeps post

That lad is from the Oranmore store, Peadar Harvey. Front line littered with AK runners & vests.

Logo'd up the nappies on the baby too.

Re running with the buggy, what do people see are the dangers? He's front of the pack with a running buggy designed for the job, clear closed roads, no traffic. Be more dangerous if he started back of the pack and had to run through the walkers. Possibility of clipping heels and tripping, pulling or tipping the buggy over is more likely there.

I've ran several races with kids (my own!) in the buggy and they love the thrill.

Outside

It beats the usual embarrassing bath tub baby photos for that young fella growing up!

He started in a position suiting his abilities so I don't see a problem! Closed roads and marshalled course made it safer than your usual stroll in the park with your buggy! Fair play.

TFBubendorfer

RandyMann wrote: »

If some of the (faster) road running fraternity give out about midpack runners holding up the fast runners along with walkers, and people with buggys etc. surely there should be a one rule for all?

The problem is not running with a buggy - the problem is if you are blocking other runners.

That guy finished in 15th position, thereby him starting in the front row was perfectly justified.

shels4ever

Outside wrote: »

It beats the usual embarrassing bath tub baby photos for that young fella growing up!

He started in a position suiting his abilities so I don't see a problem! Closed roads and marshalled course made it safer than your usual stroll in the park with your buggy! Fair play.

I'd have a problem with it, if it was a mid pack runner starting at the front, but in this case he wasn't in anyone's way

TRR

shels4ever wrote: »

I'd have a problem with it, if it was a mid pack runner starting at the front, but in this case he wasn't in anyone's way

I've no problem with it myself but would be worried that somebody not as fast as GC looking at that photo thinks its a good idea and tries to replicate it in their next race thereby causing delays.

RandyMann

TFBubendorfer wrote: »

The problem is not running with a buggy - the problem is if you are blocking other runners.

That guy finished in 15th position, thereby him starting in the front row was perfectly justified.

Surely the issue is abiding/not abiding with race rules? If he was wearing headphones, that is not a problem cause hes not getting in anyones way?
Race rules are there for a reason, one rule for all to avoid chaos and uphold safety.
Is the thinking here that if you are "fast and out the front", rules don't apply?
I am of the opinion that is you are an elite/fast runner you should lead by example, follow the rules and others will follow. I don't understand how a race director would bend the rules for him. How was he to know how fast Gary could run with the buggy? What if he stumbled at the start? How would it be safe for the child if there were loads of people in the rush stumbling onto that?
Rules should not be a grey area, they are black and white no matter how fast you are or the position you start in.

RandyMann

You know, I have never seen the rule at a track race, "no buggies allowed on the track while racing" I think its because they believe no one would be so ****ing stupid to do that. Common sense kinda prevails there.... :rolleyes:
Anyway I'm off to work, I will leave it at that.

shels4ever

TRR wrote: »

I've no problem with it myself but would be worried that somebody not as fast as GC looking at that photo thinks its a good idea and tries to replicate it in their next race thereby causing delays.

Yep good point there.

sideswipe

The biggest problem with this is that the child won't be happy to sit in the buggy at a slow pace, good luck to him trying to stroll around the shops! 'Faster Daddy, Faster'.
I've been a spectator to a few 5 & 10K races in the US and there are often multiple buggies in races over there it seems. Really don't see a problem, good on him.

dna_leri

My first reaction was wtf is he doing.
My second reaction was its GC, fair play for going sub35 with a buggy.
My third reaction was the rules say "no buggies allowed" so the rules should be enforced no matter who you are, how fast you go or whether you are on the front or back row.

walshb

RandyMann wrote: »

Surely the issue is abiding/not abiding with race rules? If he was wearing headphones, that is not a problem cause hes not getting in anyones way?
Race rules are there for a reason, one rule for all to avoid chaos and uphold safety.
Is the thinking here that if you are "fast and out the front", rules don't apply?
I am of the opinion that is you are an elite/fast runner you should lead by example, follow the rules and others will follow. I don't understand how a race director would bend the rules for him. How was he to know how fast Gary could run with the buggy? What if he stumbled at the start? How would it be safe for the child if there were loads of people in the rush stumbling onto that?
Rules should not be a grey area, they are black and white no matter how fast you are or the position you start in.

Nothing to add here. Spot on!

walshb

jeffontour wrote: »

nobody gets hurt by it.

.

Apart from the possibility of a small child going face first into the ground should something happen. The guy pushing was obviously pushing fast. He was not strolling. I just cannot see why the tit would do something like this.

jeffontour

walshb wrote: »

Apart from the possibility of a small child going face first into the ground should something happen. The guy pushing was obviously pushing fast. He was not strolling. I just cannot see why the tit would do something like this.

Do you object to people with kids in seats on bikes?

jeffontour

RandyMann wrote: »

Sounds like you are the type that would run with the fox and hunt with the hounds...

Thanks, I'll bear that in mind.

Nonoperational

Whatever about the safety aspect which is probably pretty much a non issue, he looks like a right attention seeking ****** running a race pushing a buggy.

walshb

jeffontour wrote: »

Do you object to people with kids in seats on bikes?

No!

I also don't object to babies/children in baby seats in cars. What is your point?

jeffontour

Gringo78 wrote: »

I'd be 99% sure that he cleared it with the race director beforehand that he was going to run with a buggy. The race director will know how many people are going to be running and the spread of times so can make the call as to whether its dangerous or not.

If that's the case then I don't know what the fuss is about. It was on that understanding I made my first post in the thread. If the race director cleared it I don't know why people are so bothered by it. But I'm sure those of you who are will all be happy to tell me.

Bugsy2000

I'm just waiting for the video footage of him freewheeling the downslopes, all tucked up behind the buggy for aerodynamics.