Its not about sex Its about power.

I want to be very specific about this Its not about women being raped by a someone they are in a relationship with or whom they know. I am talking about rape/or sexual assault by a strange.

The response ...Its not about sex its about power is always offered as the
reason men rape or sexual assault women. To extrapolate out from that it must mean that as its specifically a sexual assualt....power over women must be involved in the mechanics of sexual arousal for men that commit rape/sexual assault
what are we to understand from this?

This is something that is rarely discussed as far as I can tell.

Chucken

mariaalice wrote: »

I want to be very specific about this Its not about women being raped by a someone they are in a relationship with or whom they know. I am talking about rape/or sexual assault by a strange.

The response ...Its not about sex its about power is always offered as the
reason men rape or sexual assault women. To extrapolate out from that it must mean that as its specifically a sexual assualt....power over women must be involved in the mechanics of sexual arousal for men that commit rape/sexual assault
what are we to understand from this?

This is something that is rarely discussed as far as I can tell.

Being raped by someone you know or a stranger is the same thing surely?
It's still rape..and yes its all about power.
The rapist gets off on power.

The reason I said stranger and not someone the person knows is that while the act is the same if the person is known to the victim rape could be the continuum of other sorts of abuse that are going on in the relationship.

I do think there is a tendency to almost airley trip out the answer about it being about power and not sex with out examing what exactly that means.

lazygal

I'm getting less convinced by the rape is about power arguments. I think some of the time its purely about sex, as in the man (speaking from my experience) wants it and doesn't really see a woman not giving consent as a barrier. I posted about my experience in the recent support thread on sexual assault. I might be totally off the mark, but in many of the cases described, a man wanted sex or some sort of sexual contact, and just used the most convenient target possible to satisfy this desire. There's obviously some sort of power imbalance in a physically stronger man overpowering a woman, but I think the 'rape is about power not sex' line is a bit of a cop out, almost like its a natural thing for men to want to exert 'power' over women through sex. Whereas sometimes (as in my experience) it was about a horny guy who wanted full sex and wasn't particularly concerned about whether I consented.

PrincessLola

Have you seen that reddit thread where actual rapists explained their stories? (and then got patted on the back by other posters)

I think maybe its about a feeling of entitlement, entitlement to sex.

Ambersky

Its usually a bit simplistic to say there is any one cause for anything and that that is it discussion over. But I do know what you mean mariaalice I have heard it said that rape is about power and never about sex.
Funnily enough Wikipedia has quite a good entry on the various theories around the causes of sexual violence and of course there is an interesting list of sources at the end of the article. Worth a read in my opinion
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Causes_of_sexual_violence

"There is no single theory that conclusively explains the causes of sexual violence; the motives of perpetrators can be multi-factorial and are the subject of debate. Researchers have attempted to explain the motivations in terms of socioeconomics, anger, power, sadism, sexual pleasure, psychopathy, ethical standards, attitudes toward the victims and evolutionary pressures.........

On the Power Rape it has this to say
"For these rapists, rape becomes a way to compensate for their underlying feelings of inadequacy and feeds their issues of mastery, control, strength, authority and capability. The intent of the power rapist is to assert their competency. The power rapist relies upon verbal threats, intimidation with a weapon, and only uses the amount of force necessary to subdue the victim.

The power rapists tends to have fantasies about sexual conquests and rape. They may believe that even though the victim initially resists them, that once they overpower their victim, the victim will eventually enjoy the rape. The rapist needs to believe that the victim enjoyed what was done to them, and they may even ask the victim to meet them for a date later.

Because this is only a fantasy, the rapist does not feel reassured for long by either their own performance or the victim's response. The rapist feels that they must find another victim, convinced that this victim will be "the right one".

Hence, their offenses may become repetitive and compulsive. They may commit a series of rapes over a short period of time".

On the question of sexual gratification which I think is the area you are interested in it has this to say

Sexual gratification

Though anger and power are believed, by some academics, to be the primary motivation for most rapes,[9] in 1994, Richard Felson coauthored the controversial book "Aggression and Coercive Actions: A Social-Interactionist Perspective" with James Tedeschi, a book which argues that sexual fulfillment is the motive of rapists, rather than the aggressive desire to dominate the victim.[10] Felson believes that rape is an aggressive form of sexual coercion and the goal of rape is sexual satisfaction rather than power. Most rapists do not have a preference for rape over consensual sex.[11][12][13][14][15][16] In one study, male rapists evaluated with penile plethysmography demonstrated more arousal to forced sex and less discrimination between forced and consensual sex than non-rapist control subjects, though both groups responded more strongly to consensual sex scenarios.

What the implications of such a theory is I dont know. Havent really though about it but maybe it gives some hope that rapists at least some rapists can unlearn associating rape with sex and learn to see it differently. I dont know just throwing it out there.

Lyaiera

I think the "rape is about power" idea is useful. But really it's boiling down a multi-faceted idea. I think much like how "slut shaming" is completely wrong the idea that rape is about power is completely correct. Rape is totally about the rapist exerting themselves over the victim. Nothing the victim did was the cause! It was always the rapists decision to take advantage of the victim. And that's why I think a lot of people are so dissatisfied when people say, "She shouldn't have walked down that street." Or when like in a recent thread a video showed a women drunkenly going home with a man. These aren't the causes of rape. The rapist is the cause of rape. But the "woman" did walk down that street, and she did go home with that man. Those aren't the causes of rape but they are the multiplicitude of decisions that were a factor in the circumunstances that lead up to the rape. They were all things if someone had hindsight they might have done differently. However, ultimtely the person raping someone is the rapist and the other person is the victim. And that's why people say "rape is about power." Because ultimately, to rape someone has to exert themselves over another. And that is power. At some point someone had to physically assault another. That's the point it is rape. All the other aspects are more or less, but when the instance of rape has happened, that is purely the decision of the rapist.

flowerchild

Lyaiera wrote: »

But the "woman" did walk down that street, and she did go home with that man. Those aren't the causes of rape but they are the multiplicitude of decisions that were a factor in the circumunstances that lead up to the rape. They were all things if someone had hindsight they might have done differently..

Rape is abuse of power - the willingness to put everything aside except the power of the rapist to act upon their preferences. It has nothing to do with how someone dresses or where they walk or who they go home with - because if it were a different person, not a rapist, there would be no danger of rape.

I don't see why it matters so much. If you start going on about how it's about sex, victim blaming is going to be a natural consequence
it shouldn't be done, that's that

Ambersky

I think rape should first be looked at from the perspective of the victim or survivor as Lyaiera has explained.
From that perspective as it is always an expression of power over the victim no matter the intent or reasons the rapist has for doing it.
In court cases the impact of this attack on the person should also be foremost in the Judges and the Jury's minds.

I see looking at the reasons Why a person rapes as being useful in order to treat the rapist and prevent them from doing it again.
I also think it could be useful to prevent societal factors where people, particularly young men are growing up in environments where rape is part of the culture as in areas where gang rape can be a part of youth culture. (parts of South Africa and American cities)
We are always giving out that there are too few treatment facilities for sexual offenders in this country and I would imagine understanding what makes a man rape is a major part of being able to address that problem behavior.

I agree that the idea that a man was simply looking for sex and if he had been "given" it he would not have needed to rape has been used to both justify rape and to blackmail some women like wives into having sex with someone they didnt want to. The idea that rape is just about sex can lead to sympathy for the rapist who could not control himself and for the woman who led him on and any and all women who did not provide sex for him or any potential rapist. This is kind of where the old feminist idea that all men are potential rapists comes from. It is also from this experience that I dont feel comfortable with an explanation for anything that is totally generalized and must not be questioned.
But if it is not true that power is the only reason or even the sole reason rapes happen then it isnt useful to substitute one untruth with another we would prefer.
People know when they are being fed a line and eventually dont trust the people insisting on one form of the truth.

Madam_X

Glad you brought this up, Mariaalice - I've even read "It's never about sexual release." Of course it can be about sexual release, surely?!!

All the replies have been very interesting, what I was trying to get at was how one narrative on rape or sexual assault has become the dominant one in any discussion and its become so matter of fact as an explanation that people are almost afraid to say hang on my experiences of sexual assault was different ( fair play to lazygirl for challenging the accepted norm )

Something else I find interesting is how some people seem to believe that while the explanation that its about power and not sex is possibly not a full answer, they don't want to explore a fuller answer because they want to keep the cultural narrative that emphasizes men having power

mariaalice

mariaalice wrote: »

Something else I find interesting is how some people seem to believe that while the explanation that its about power and not sex is possibly not a full answer, they don't want to explore a fuller answer because they want to keep the cultural narrative that emphasizes men having power

Oh I was just being contrary, don't mind me