London 2012

Ah_Yeah

Anyone going to be watching the Eventing/Jumping for this? Does anyone know a channel that will give full coverage of all Equestrian events?

helibelly

start here, http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/olympics/2012/sports/equestrian

in fact if you've got Sky go to channel 141 (the Beeb) and press the red button, then select the London 2012, and you get to a feature page with a a A-Z at the top, you get to Equestrian from there. Just been watching the Dressage for the Three day event and skipping over to the Ladies fencing (the other hobby).

(if you've not got BBC one on your sky package go to the settings page and add channels, you'll need to to add channels to your "Other Channels" option, do the following -

With your digibox turned on, press the "Services" button (near the top of the remote).

Select number 4 (System Setup), and then 4 again ("Add Channels").

In the appropriate fields enter the following (you move through the fields using the up and down arrow keys).


In the Frequency field enter: 10.773,

The next three fields are toggle fields, i.e. using the left and right arrows will change the value.

Toggle Polarisation to : H
Toggle Symbol Rate to: 22000
Toggle FEC to : 5/6

Then select the last button - Find Channels.

Ah_Yeah

thanks a mill! Unfortunately I've got UPC so no red button for me

later12

Yes no red button here, just the old fashioned RTE 1 and 2.., however you ought to be able to catch a lot of the action online via tv network providers?

I have some mates watching the dressage at the Royal Naval College in Greenwich this morning, and was getting all of their updates and photos from facebook, so with the world wide web there are always ways and means

Borderfox

If you watch rte you wouldnt think we have any equestrian competitors. Red button on bbc is excellent

byhookorbycrook

Have tweeted my annoyance to @RTELondon2012, seems you only count if you are a boxer.

convert

A few minutes ago RTE did a quick round up of the Irish team's performances today, and not one mention was made to or clip shown or the equestrian riders. Absolutely disgraceful. :mad: And unfortunately I don't have anything other than the bog standard channels where I am at the moment, so have no BBC red button

Good link here for results: http://www.london2012.com/equestrian/event/eventing-individual/phase=eqx003400/index.html

Borderfox

In the Star on Thursday they had a double page spread on the guy doing the 50km walk!!

Just wait if the Equestrian competitors win any medals and they will be all over them like a rash. The will run some Inpho/Sportsfile file pictures out and will go on as if they covered their every movement.

Rant over ***

byhookorbycrook

It might be an idea for people to contact RTE and make their feelings known.Let them know that people actually ARE interested in equestrian sport.

FueledByAisling

click equestrian in the playlists here to watch it http://www.eurovisionsports.tv/london2012/index.html . You can buy a cable to link your laptop to your tv I have to do this because only 3 channels on UPC are broadcasting the Olympics non of which are showing equestrian sports!

later12

Borderfox wrote: »

In the Star on Thursday they had a double page spread on the guy doing the 50km walk!!

Just wait if the Equestrian competitors win any medals and they will be all over them like a rash. The will run some Inpho/Sportsfile file pictures out and will go on as if they covered their every movement.

Rant over ***

I find this breathtaking.

Equestrian sport is our second biggest field in terms of our Olympic competitors and although we have an unfortunate history at the Olympics, is probably our most internationally renowned sporting pursuit. It's something we actually do well; no offence to that guy doing the 50km walk, but it would be nice to see the riders given a little more coverage.

byhookorbycrook

Not to mention the amount of money the industry generates here.

convert

Wow, the sports report on the RTE 9 o'clock news actually showed a brief clip of Camilla Speirs's and Mary Kyle's dressage test, and a short interview with both her and Zara Phillips!

convert

Unfortunately they made no reference to Aoife Clarke's good test, or to Joseph Murphy or Patrick Ryan. Clearly they didn't feel they could mention them as they hadn't bothered to go out Greenwich to report on the dressage on Saturday or to get any footage of them. Aoife's good perforamance on Saturday obviously shamed them into travelling 'all the way out there' yesterday.

FueledByAisling

BBC1 will be broadcasting the cross country in a few minutes!

granturismo

FueledByAisling wrote: »

click equestrian in the playlists here to watch it http://www.eurovisionsports.tv/london2012/index.html .!

Live feed starts in 7 minutes. Type equestrian into the search box to get a countdown to the live feed.

Ah_Yeah

Brilliant - this stream is great, thanks a million for that link!

It is an absolute shocker that they are not showing it on tv, it's a great sport that everyone watches, so many people who don't ride themselves go to the Dublin Horse Show, there would be high viewership on RTE if they showed it.

granturismo

Ah_Yeah wrote: »

Brilliant - this stream is great, thanks a million for that link!

I was a bit premature - I couldnt get any of the two videos to play during lunch at work, I'll try them at home tonight.

Ah_Yeah

granturismo wrote: »

I was a bit premature - I couldnt get any of the two videos to play during lunch at work, I'll try them at home tonight.

I got it to play once and the stream was great, I accidentally clicked out of it, and when I tried to stream again, it seems to play the pre-roll ad and not the stream after

later12

convert wrote: »

Unfortunately they made no reference to Aoife Clarke's good test, or to Joseph Murphy or Patrick Ryan. Clearly they didn't feel they could mention them as they hadn't bothered to go out Greenwich to report on the dressage on Saturday or to get any footage of them. Aoife's good perforamance on Saturday obviously shamed them into travelling 'all the way out there' yesterday.

RTE were showing coverage of the XC this morning/ afternoon, with coverage by the reliable old John & Robert Hall; kept on up until about Michael Ryan's disastrous fall at the Saxon village fence (what the Hell happened there) But then Aoife Clarke was about to come up and they decided not to show anymore. Grr.

Ah_Yeah

Is anyone following Team Ireland on Facebook? I'm in work so can't watch the live stream, but it says Camilla Speirs has been eliminated.

Edit: She fell off.

Post here

later12

Ah_Yeah wrote: »

Is anyone following Team Ireland on Facebook? I'm in work so can't watch the live stream, but it says Camilla Speirs has been eliminated.

Edit: She fell off.

Post here

So we have to use all of our remaining rider's scores - hopefully nobody else being eliminated.

Such a shame; she had the best Team Ireland score after the dressage, and of course an even bigger shame for her and her team on a personal level. The course looks deceptively straightforward but it's so undulating and winding and maybe that is having something to do with eliminations. Good to hear they are both alright.

Ah_Yeah

later12 wrote: »

So we have to use all of our remaining rider's scores - hopefully nobody else being eliminated.

Such a shame; she had the best Team Ireland score after the dressage, and of course an even bigger shame for her and her team on a personal level. The course looks deceptively straightforward but it's so undulating and winding and maybe that is having something to do with eliminations. Good to hear they are both alright.

Apparently it was at the Rose Garden fence. It is a pity, she did a cracking test yesterday.

Regarding the course, I really like it, I especially like the introduction of the Tower of London fences (15 & 16 I think?), it gives a real combined training feel, and a bit different, which is always good. The water jumps look tough enough, but overall a nice course.

donfers

fair play to mark, last man to go and knew he couldn't make an error, huge pressure, it would have been understandable if he took it very slow and steady but he only picked up 7.20 penalties, a lot of bottle shown there

as for micheal, he was first to go and the pathfinder so flying around the course - only came a cropper at a fence near the end, understandable to an extent as he was taking risks


but what the hell happened with Camilla? if she had gone clean around the course at a decent time we would be maybe 5th in the team and she would have given herself a great chance in the individual, i've been hearing a lot about how great she has done this year, and the wonderful form she (and her horse) have shown but the fact is that she has failed on the biggest stage which is very disappointing after the good dressage - which leads me to my next point, when a rider is unseated where is the blame generally apportioned? is it the horse, the rider, bad luck, bad riding, what? As a non equestrian expert I don't want to be too quick to judge/criticise but we had high hopes for her and she is gone and i am just looking for an explanation as to what went wrong - how did she manage to blow it?

later12

donfers wrote: »

but what the hell happened with Camilla? if she had gone clean around the course at a decent time we would be maybe 5th in the team and she would have given herself a great chance in the individual, i've been hearing a lot about how great she has done this year, and the wonderful form she (and her horse) have shown but the fact is that she has failed on the biggest stage which is very disappointing after the good dressage - which leads me to my next point, when a rider is unseated where is the blame generally apportioned? is it the horse, the rider, bad luck, bad riding, what? As a non equestrian expert I don't want to be too quick to judge/criticise but we had high hopes for her and she is gone and i am just looking for an explanation as to what went wrong - how did she manage to blow it?

Yeah it would be interesting to see her fall, I didn't see it yet.

Solid fences are always risky at the end of a round when horses are tired, and that probably had something to do with Michael Ryan coming a cropper, but there was definitely a rider effect there as well. From what I saw, it looked like Ryan was picking up contact, perhaps fearing that the horse might run out, but completely lost momentum approaching the take off and the horse was too tired to overcome it. Nobody wants to be too harsh on any of the riders at a time when there is such pressure but I think Ryan probably made a mistake in his approach.

Joey.

donfers wrote: »

fair play to mark, last man to go and knew he couldn't make an error, huge pressure, it would have been understandable if he took it very slow and steady but he only picked up 7.20 penalties, a lot of bottle shown there

as for micheal, he was first to go and the pathfinder so flying around the course - only came a cropper at a fence near the end, understandable to an extent as he was taking risks


but what the hell happened with Camilla? if she had gone clean around the course at a decent time we would be maybe 5th in the team and she would have given herself a great chance in the individual, i've been hearing a lot about how great she has done this year, and the wonderful form she (and her horse) have shown but the fact is that she has failed on the biggest stage which is very disappointing after the good dressage - which leads me to my next point, when a rider is unseated where is the blame generally apportioned? is it the horse, the rider, bad luck, bad riding, what? As a non equestrian expert I don't want to be too quick to judge/criticise but we had high hopes for her and she is gone and i am just looking for an explanation as to what went wrong - how did she manage to blow it?

I don't know what happened to Camilla, but apparently she was flying up until the fall and was in a really good position time wise.
You could see from miles out that Michael would struggle over the fence, it looked like he just stopped riding and let the horse fall back to nothing. Even the most honest horse would be too tired to save the rider at that point. Complete rider error, but it's easily done.
Without seeing the fall I think it's unfair to blame anyone, it could have been rider error, maybe Jiff slipped or left a leg over the fence?

Valentina

Mark Todd makes it look so easy

convert

All 3 Irish horses have passed their inspections this morning and are waiting for their first round of show jumping (which began at 10.30am).

7 horses failed this morning.

Ah_Yeah

Update on Camilla and Just a Jiff:

https://www.facebook.com/eventingireland/posts/428742773831344

later12

Ireland now in 5th place overall!

Fantastic comeback under such difficult circumstances. Don't expect to hear much about it in the Irish media.

Delighted for Mary King earlier, what a heroic rider and still going strong. If we can't get a medal lets at least hope the British can pick one up.

Ah_Yeah

later12 wrote: »

Ireland now in 5th place overall!

Fantastic comeback under such difficult circumstances. Don't expect to hear much about it in the Irish media.

Delighted for Mary King earlier, what a heroic rider and still going strong. If we can't get a medal lets at least hope the British can pick one up.

I haven't had a chance to watch it, but will on lunch, are all Irish riders finished?

later12

Yes all done in the team jumping, just the individuals now starting at 2.30pm.

Here are the rankings

Imhof Tank

5th, and ahead of Australia, US, France - thats highly respectable.

fits

A Decent performance. But we'll never be thereabouts until serious effort is made to improve the dressage. Things need to change, starting from pony club level.

Ah_Yeah

fits wrote: »

A Decent performance. But we'll never be thereabouts until serious effort is made to improve the dressage. Things need to change, starting from pony club level.

Dressage is not emphasised enough at pony club level, a lot of people only start to take part in dressage when they see the difference it makes in the jumping.

There is a lot of stigma associated with Dressage as being "boring", but I love it, in fact I could do flatwork for hours.. I'd be dead after it, but it's a great workout for horse and rider, and great for really "busy" horses.

fits

If you cant ride a decent dressage test, you cant ride a horse imo.

later12

fits wrote: »

A Decent performance. But we'll never be thereabouts until serious effort is made to improve the dressage. Things need to change, starting from pony club level.

Think there's some evidence to suggest that's already happening
http://www.horsesportireland.ie/eventing/european-pony-championships-ireland-sweep-to-victory-with-team-and-individual-gold-medals.12647.html

fits wrote: »

If you cant ride a decent dressage test, you cant ride a horse imo.

No offence, but that sounds like an absolutely daft motto.

The various disciplines all have varying objects; be that speed, agility, restraint, whatever. If you can summon all of your aids and mental abilities to ride successfully across hunting country, or a XC course, or a racetrack, or a showjumping arena, then who is anybody to say that you 'cannot ride'?

For what it's worth, I wouldn't have any hesitiation in saying that all of our eventers can ride a "decent" dressage test... this is the Olympic Games, not Nenagh Show.

fits

later12 wrote: »

No offence, but that sounds like an absolutely daft motto.
.

Its true though! On the hunting field last year I was speaking with a group of people and mentioned that I was getting flatwork lessons. The response was a 'but you dont need lessons'.

I agree that there is skill to jumping. But to get to the top levels you need to have the refinement of dressage and its just not seen as a necessary skill from the start in our equestrian culture.

And of course our eventers can ride a decent test, but its not good enough is it! Its always our bogey and we wont win medals until it improves. There's no reason why it cant. No reason why we cant do as well as the Brits at dressage, we're riding the same horses for the most part.

later12

Results from the Individuals; Aoife Clark being the best of the Irish.

later12

fits wrote: »

Its true though! On the hunting field last year I was speaking with a group of people and mentioned that I was getting flatwork lessons. The response was a 'but you dont need lessons'.

But by and large, you don't need as vigourous flatwork experience for hunting; they were presumably speaking in the context of hunting. I've known some heroic hunters in their 60s and 70s whose courage and ability I would love to be put in the same league with, yet they probably couldn't shoulder-in to save their lives. There are no hard and fast rules about what riding must entail.

That was my point about all of the displines having their own objects. I agree that our dressage needs work, but if the ponies are anything to go on, that may be happening down the line.

Irish grassroots riding has changed immeasurably even in my lifetime (and I'm 25). I remember when I was starting out in pony club, the idea of someone not being interested in hunting or racing was almost quaint in our club.

We have traditionally been a more 'rustic' and faster horse people than the more measured and dressage orientated Europeans. But yes dressage has grown up in the past few years, and the demographics of equestrianism have changed so that disciplines like that have seen progress - cue the pony championships. We are still a heavily speed oriented country, for good reason of course, and it won't happen overnight.

Imhof Tank

Ah_Yeah wrote: »

Dressage is not emphasised enough at pony club level, a lot of people only start to take part in dressage when they see the difference it makes in the jumping.

There is a lot of stigma associated with Dressage as being "boring", but I love it, in fact I could do flatwork for hours.. I'd be dead after it, but it's a great workout for horse and rider, and great for really "busy" horses.

There would be relatively few pony clubbers involved in pure dressage or combined training, but most are doing one day events all summer from under 12 level up so they are doing plenty of tests.

There is a also a view in the pony club that you will get nowhere in pure dressage without a specialist pony - not an option for most parents looking for all rounders to do a bit of everything.

IMO people are being unnecessarily negative here - we are world class in practically every equestrian pursuit with the exception of pure dressage. Putting greater emphasis on dressage would mean less jumping and that will drive kids away.

Have we ever even finished higher than 5th anyway?

Ah_Yeah

Imhof Tank wrote: »

There would be relatively few pony clubbers involved in pure dressage or combined training, but most are doing one day events all summer from under 12 level up so they are doing plenty of tests.

There is a also a view in the pony club that you will get nowhere in pure dressage without a specialist pony - not an option for most parents looking for all rounders to do a bit of everything.

IMO people are being unnecessarily negative here - we are world class in practically every equestrian pursuit with the exception of pure dressage. Putting greater emphasis on dressage means less jumping and that will drive kids away.

Have we ever even finished higher than 5th anyway?

I never said that it was pure dressage people should be involved in, but from someone who worked in a yard teaching pony club kids for quite a while, they were just not interested in flatwork full stop until they realised it was quite important. They just wanted to warm up and go straight to doing a grid or a course of fences.

I just think it's really important to stress the importance of flatwork, not necessarily pure dressage.

fits

later12 wrote: »

yet they probably couldn't shoulder-in to save their lives.

I'm not even talking about shoulder-in. I'm talking about riding a decent circle, about having your horse supple and bending correctly with hindquarters engaged. Hell, I'm talking about riding a horse in a straight line.

These skills are useful in all spheres, even in hunting. A lot of kids just want to get up and go hell for leather over fences, and thats great too but every rider should have the basics in place. Basics of balance and suppleness and responsiveness.

Imhof Tank

Ah_Yeah wrote: »

I never said that it was pure dressage people should be involved in, but from someone who worked in a yard teaching pony club kids for quite a while, they were just not interested in flatwork full stop until they realised it was quite important. They just wanted to warm up and go straight to doing a grid or a course of fences.

I just think it's really important to stress the importance of flatwork, not necessarily pure dressage.

99% of active pony club members do one day events and therefore cant avoid dressage - even if they want to.

Its not that the importance of flatwork dawns on them one day and they all volunteer for extra dressage sessions.

The point was being made that the pony club arent putting enough emphasis on dressage. People can argue about how much is "enough" but its wrong to imply that dressage doesnt feature full stop.

Ah_Yeah

Imhof Tank wrote: »

99% of active pony club members do one day events and therefore cant avoid dressage - even if they want to.

Its not that the importance of flatwork dawns on them one day and they all volunteer for extra dressage sessions.

The point was being made that the pony club arent putting enough emphasis on dressage. People can argue about how much is "enough" but its wrong to imply that dressage doesnt feature full stop.

It may have changed in recent times, as the last time I taught pony club would have been about 3 years ago.

Imhof Tank

fits wrote: »

A lot of kids just want to get up and go hell for leather over fences, .

On for example the hunter trials scene, yes I would agree.

But the kids you are referring to are not representative of all young riders in Ireland.

There is a very structured route to follow up through the pony club - which involves plenty of flatwork. The pony club model has given us most of our top eventers, showjumpers and jockeys so it cant be that inadequate in terms of teaching the basics.

later12

fits wrote: »

I'm not even talking about shoulder-in. I'm talking about riding a decent circle, about having your horse supple and bending correctly with hindquarters engaged. Hell, I'm talking about riding a horse in a straight line.

These skills are useful in all spheres, even in hunting.

Ah ok, there I do agree with you.

But that's just basic riding; the part I took issue with was riding a decent dressage score being a pre-requisite for being 'able to ride', which I would have taken to mean at least an Elem or Medium level of dressage. If you're talking about prelim/ novice tests as basics that riders in all disciplines should be able to manage, fair enough.

Imhof Tank

Ah_Yeah wrote: »

It may have changed in recent times, as the last time I taught pony club would have been about 3 years ago.

Dont know about that. Ive been going to one day events with my kids for more than 3 years and there has always been a huge emphasis on the one day event qualifiers, championships etc.

The point I am making - dont accuse the pony club of being uninterested in dressage or blame it for Ireland's failure to medal at the Olympics.

Ah_Yeah

Imhof Tank wrote: »

Dont know about that. Ive been going to one day events with my kids for more than 3 years and there has always been a huge emphasis on the one day event qualifiers, championships etc.

The point I am making - dont accuse the pony club of being uninterested in dressage or blame it for Ireland's failure to medal at the Olympics.

Oh not at all, I think I picked up on a post and went off into a tangent of my own about the importance of flatwork

I think that our riders performed really well in the dressage. And regarding the pony club, there were always kids who were involved heavily in eventing and dressage, but they were always primarily interested in jumping. Which, as a kid, is what I was interested in too.

Esroh

Firstly I'll add my congrates to the Team. Remember this its their results in non-championship events that got us the 5 riders to the Olympics as they missed out on automatic qualification from Euro/World championships. This has come about by working on their dressage which has improved .

Re the kids non interest in flat work(dressage) Those of you who mention the Pony Club have to take a look at the numbers who are in it and compare them to those who are not, but Jump every weekend. It reaches maybe 30% of young riders in Ireland
Showjumping is the dominate Equestrian Sport here and its jumping clear rounds that is number 1 . If a kid jumps a clear round while riding like a Sack of Spuds they are praised. If you look at the winter leagues they all run classes over 50cm which are packed with kids who cannot ride a straight line, canter on the correct leg, most don't even know what riding on the correct diagional is , but they get a red rosette for Their Pony Jumping a Clear Round.
Take this scenario.
2 winter leagues 20 miles apart.
League A Starters Stakes is a combined training class Cross Poles and Little Dressage Test,(Straight Line, Trot a circle, canter a circle, change rein and repeat, straight line, halt square .Then jump a course of 6 cross poles

League B Starters stakes is a Cross Pole course .
Which one do you think most would turn up at.

Ah_Yeah

Esroh wrote: »

Firstly I'll add my congrates to the Team. Remember this its their results in non-championship events that got us the 5 riders to the Olympics as they missed out on automatic qualification from Euro/World championships. This has come about by working on their dressage which has improved .

Re the kids non interest in flat work(dressage) Those of you who mention the Pony Club have to take a look at the numbers who are in it and compare them to those who are not, but Jump every weekend. It reaches maybe 30% of young riders in Ireland
Showjumping is the dominate Equestrian Sport here and its jumping clear rounds that is number 1 . If a kid jumps a clear round while riding like a Sack of Spuds they are praised. If you look at the winter leagues they all run classes over 50cm which are packed with kids who cannot ride a straight line, canter on the correct leg, most don't even know what riding on the correct diagional is , but they get a red rosette for Their Pony Jumping a Clear Round.
Take this scenario.
2 winter leagues 20 miles apart.
League A Starters Stakes is a combined training class Cross Poles and Little Dressage Test,(Straight Line, Trot a circle, canter a circle, change rein and repeat, straight line, halt square .Then jump a course of 6 cross poles

League B Starters stakes is a Cross Pole course .
Which one do you think most would turn up at.

I agree 100% with you here. It's not just the pony club. And in fact, kids who ride in Pony club most likely do more flatwork than those who are not members of the Pony Club.

Our riders have done a great job so far, looking forward to the next event!