Where would you be going without a bell on your bike!?!

AlfaZen

http://www.limerickleader.ie/community/community-news/cyclists-should-have-bells-on-bikes-limerick-activist-says-1-4062690

Limerick Leader
CYCLISTS in the city need to be more aware of pedestrians and stop listening to personal stereos when they are out cycling, according to community activist, Sean O’Neill.

<Sherlocked>

Does he have any idea how much weight a bell would add to the bike?:rolleyes:

ednwireland

my going to work bike has one - never used it

monkeypants

Tape devices? Were their bikes made by DeLorean?

ednwireland

monkeypants wrote: »

Tape devices? Were their bikes made by DeLorean?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TKYQ5ibxslI

Jawgap

He said: “Any ideas to increase safety for pedestrians is welcome. I cycle a lot to get to work and for fitness, and you are going to come across people who are walking on trails and pathways. Bells would make them aware.”

I agree 100% - if pedestrians wore bells (like you put on a cat) they'd be easier to hear and you'd be more aware of them!

Cookie_Monster

Bells are infact not legal on bikes:

Statue book
http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/1963/en/si/0190.html

Audible warning device.

28. (1) Every vehicle (other than a pedestrian-controlled vehicle) shall be fitted with an audible warning device complying with the provisions of sub-article (2) of this article, capable of giving sufficient warning of the approach or position of the vehicle.

(2) The device referred to in sub-article (1) of this article shall not consist of—

(a) a gong, siren or other strident-toned device except in the case of a vehicle used for fire brigade, ambulance or police purposes, or

(b) a bell, except in the case of—

(i) a vehicle used for fire brigade, ambulance or police purposes, or

(ii) a bicycle—

I. the engine of which does not exceed 50 cubic centimetres in cylinder capacity as calculated in accordance with article 27 of the Road Vehicles (Registration and Licensing) Regulations, 1958 ( S.I. No. 13 of 1958 ) and

II. which is incapable of exceeding 24 miles per hour on a dry level road under normal atmospheric conditions.

B (ii) II. clearly disallows a bell on a bike, 38k on a flat road is perfectly doable :)

Hermy

Shouting "Look out!" is far more effective than any bell.

jinkypolly

What if the pedestrian is wearing a personal stereo or one of dem ghetto blaster thingumybobs?

kenmc

AlfaZen wrote: »

Limerick Leader
CYCLISTS in the city need to be more aware of pedestrians and stop listening to personal stereos when they are out cycling, according to community activist, Sean O’Neill.

<Sherlocked>

Lol, I read "communist".

buffalo

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

Bells are infact not legal on bikes:

Statue book
http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/1963/en/si/0190.html

B (ii) II. clearly disallows a bell on a bike, 38k on a flat road is perfectly doable :)

But they still need an "audible warning device" - so does that mean all road bikes must carry airhorns?

Also, what's a "pedestrian-controlled vehicle" in this context?

ednwireland

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

38k on a flat road is perfectly doable :)

you missed this bit

under normal atmospheric conditions.

sorry you cant do that into the normal howling gale

dermur

It actually reads as:

"The device referred to in sub-article (1) of this article shall not consist of...a bell, except in the case of...a bicycle"

Legal mumbo jumbo

dermur

buffalo wrote: »

But they still need an "audible warning device" - so does that mean all road bikes must carry airhorns?

Friend of mine actually used to carry an air horn powered from a fizzy drink bottle on his bike in China - frightened the gick out of me whenever he used it behind me - I thought I was about to be mown down by a truck:

seamus

So, cyclists should not cycle on the path. But they should have bells so that they can warn pedestrians when they are cycling on the path...

Mr O’Neill, a spokesman for Republicn Sinn Fein, also wants all cyclists to have bells, so that pedestrians can work out the distance a bike happens to be behind them.

If I had a bell, I wouldn't use it. Ever. Not out of principle, but for the same reason I practically never use the horn on my car - if you have enough time to both avoid the incident and use it, then you probably don't need to use it.

Hermy

dermur wrote: »

It actually reads as:

"The device referred to in sub-article (1) of this article shall not consist of...a bell, except in the case of...a bicycle"

"...which is incapable of exceeding 24 miles per hour on a dry level road under normal atmospheric conditions.

hardCopy

I have a bell on my bike. Very useful for clearing peds out of the cycle track from Clontarf to Sutton. Also very useful in town, apparently non-cyclists can't see bikes so if you have a green light and no cars to accompany you through a junction pedestrians just emerge from the footpath to swarm the junction. A shout works just as well, but some times you get sick of shouting, and a bell sounds so much more civilised.

Hermy

hardCopy wrote: »

...a bell sounds so much more civilised.

Agreed.

Doctor Bob

The extract from the law posted above essentially says that a bike must have an audible warning device. If it is incapable of going over 24 mph, the device can be a bell.

And the use of an Airzound is illegal.

(Is that the same law that exempts bikes designed for racing from the obligation to have a bell? That line usually gets trotted out whenever there's a bell thread and roadies are falling over themselves looking for dispensations.)

A lot of people (on Boards, at least) seem to have a problem with bells on their bikes, and I never understand why. Many of them (you) are the same people who will wear a helmet because even though you'll probably never need it, some day, some day, you might just be glad you wore it, but apparently the same doesn't apply to having bell. Or am I missing something?

Rovi

If it's good enough for Peter Sagan...

Ciannor

good set of eyes and decent brakes are more important i reckon

PhoenixParker

seamus wrote: »

So, cyclists should not cycle on the path. But they should have bells so that they can warn pedestrians when they are cycling on the path...



If I had a bell, I wouldn't use it. Ever. Not out of principle, but for the same reason I practically never use the horn on my car - if you have enough time to both avoid the incident and use it, then you probably don't need to use it.

A bell isn't really the equivalent of a horn though.

Cars have engine noise which warns other road users of their approach. One of the big discussions you can see with electric vehicles is the problems associated with how quiet they are. There are proposals to add a noise to alert people to their approach. You see the same thing with the luas, Luas drivers have to use their bells frequently in part because they're so quiet, and that's in spite of the fact that they're on a very very clearly marked rail line. Compare how often a Luas driver needs to use his bell to how often a Taxi driver uses his horn.

A bell falls somewhere between a horn and engine noise as an approach alert.

Raam

I'm not putting a fúcking bell on my bike.

Qualitymark

I have a gigantic Dutch bell (sold with a package covered in "Wow! It's loud!" and "Can be heard for 100 metres!" in Dutch); haven't put it on the bike yet, waiting to get a bike in my right frame size. But look forward to ringing it.

If you don't want to put on a bell but do want to have a warning device, set your brake blocks at a slight angle so they screech when you brake.

nukin_futs

Mr O’Neill, a spokesman for Republicn Sinn Fein, also wants all cyclists to have bells, so that pedestrians can work out the distance a bike happens to be behind them.

Ah yes - a quick mental calculation using the speed of sound and taking account of the doppler effect and the pedestrian will know exactly where the cyclist is.
On the other hand pedestrians could just keep out of cycle lanes and look before stepping out i.e. take some personal responsibility. Much the same as I look to see what cars are doing as I cycle.

Raam

As a result of so much cycling, does anyone else here check behind them before changing line or direction when walking? Oh, just me, OK.

hardCopy

Raam wrote: »

As a result of so much cycling, does anyone else here check behind them before changing line or direction when walking? Oh, just me, OK.

Not just you! Although the plus side is that I'm more observant than ever when I drive.

Hermy

As a result of so much driving I've been known to reach for the indicators when out walking.

Raam

Walking cyclists be pointing out pavement cracks n' shít to the dudes behind 'em.

monument

Re headphones: This thread applies: http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2056699820

seamus wrote: »

If I had a bell, I wouldn't use it. Ever. Not out of principle, but for the same reason I practically never use the horn on my car - if you have enough time to both avoid the incident and use it, then you probably don't need to use it.

Using that logic the Luas would never get anywhere in the city centre.

The trams have bells and horns: The bell (as with a bicycle bell) is mostly an early warning system.

And, as I've said here many times before, ringing a bell and pulling breaks is as easy as cycling a bike.

Darkglasses

I frequently used my bell when I commuted in Dublin City Centre. Ok, it wasn't euro-cool, but it was very effective for politely warning pedestrians who might be crossing without looking or waiting for the green man that I'm on the way (especially when turning left onto George's Street from Dame Street.) Handier and more appropriate than shouting in my opinion.

However, now that I'm commuting on country roads with practically no pedestrians, it'd be worthless to have the bell. I am on the look-out for a massive air-horn to indicate to cars that pass me dangerously that I am ****ing pissed off at them.

macnab

Bike safety: Republican Sinn Fein spokesman Sean O'Neill added: “If it is against the law for a motorist to use a mobile phone while driving, surely there is a equal danger posed by a cyclist who is listening to a tape device while cycling. This is an area that needs to be examined before some pedestrians are injured by careless cyclists in Limerick.”

By this "logic" anybody who has impaired hearing ability either by choice or by accident of birth should not be legally allowed to cycle, or as the issue is road safety awareness, they should not be allowed use a public byway.
So is Mr O'Neill suggesting that deaf people should not be allowed cycle or walk in public places??

Jawgap

macnab wrote: »

Bike safety: Republican Sinn Fein spokesman Sean O'Neill added: “If it is against the law for a motorist to use a mobile phone while driving, surely there is a equal danger posed by a cyclist who is listening to a tape device while cycling. This is an area that needs to be examined before some pedestrians are injured by careless cyclists in Limerick.”

By this "logic" anybody who has impaired hearing ability either by choice or by accident of birth should not be legally allowed to cycle.........

That'd be most of Limerick then.......

A nice 'driiiiiiingy' bell on something like a Pashley is lovely, but this is a wannabe Shinner-reject politician looking for publicity and unfortunately getting it.

Lusk Doyle

macnab wrote: »

Bike safety: Republican Sinn Fein spokesman Sean O'Neill added: “If it is against the law for a motorist to use a mobile phone while driving, surely there is a equal danger posed by a cyclist who is listening to a tape device while cycling. This is an area that needs to be examined before some pedestrians are injured by careless cyclists in Limerick.”

By this "logic" anybody who has impaired hearing ability ....... by accident of birth should not be legally allowed to cycle, or as the issue is road safety awareness, they should not be allowed use a public byway.
So is Mr O'Neill suggesting that deaf people should not be allowed cycle or walk in public places??

How did you get that from his quote? I see nothing there about disability, merely the use of phones and tape devices.

hardCopy

Lusk Doyle wrote: »

macnab wrote: »

Bike safety: Republican Sinn Fein spokesman Sean O'Neill added: “If it is against the law for a motorist to use a mobile phone while driving, surely there is a equal danger posed by a cyclist who is listening to a tape device while cycling. This is an area that needs to be examined before some pedestrians are injured by careless cyclists in Limerick.”

By this "logic" anybody who has impaired hearing ability ....... by accident of birth should not be legally allowed to cycle, or as the issue is road safety awareness, they should not be allowed use a public byway.
So is Mr O'Neill suggesting that deaf people should not be allowed cycle or walk in public places??

How did you get that from his quote? I see nothing there about disability, merely the use of phones and tape devices.

I'm sure this is just the beginning of his campaign to ban radios and windows in cars.

seamus

monument wrote: »

Using that logic the Luas would never get anywhere in the city centre.

The trams have bells and horns: The bell (as with a bicycle bell) is mostly an early warning system.

And, as I've said here many times before, ringing a bell and pulling breaks is as easy as cycling a bike.

Ah but the Luas is on a fixed track and doesn't have the luxury of changing direction to avoid an incident.

I see your point, and I understand that ringing a bell could be useful at places like college green. But I'd be skeptical that the kind of idiots who step out in front of bikes would pay any heed to a bell at all. I would rather have my hands covering my brakes than my bell.

macnab

Lusk Doyle wrote: »

macnab wrote: »

Bike safety: Republican Sinn Fein spokesman Sean O'Neill added: “If it is against the law for a motorist to use a mobile phone while driving, surely there is a equal danger posed by a cyclist who is listening to a tape device while cycling. This is an area that needs to be examined before some pedestrians are injured by careless cyclists in Limerick.”

By this "logic" anybody who has impaired hearing ability ....... by accident of birth should not be legally allowed to cycle, or as the issue is road safety awareness, they should not be allowed use a public byway.
So is Mr O'Neill suggesting that deaf people should not be allowed cycle or walk in public places??

How did you get that from his quote? I see nothing there about disability, merely the use of phones and tape devices.

I never used the word disability, I said impaired hearing ability. As in your hearing is impaired because you are listening to loud music.

Jawgap

Lusk Doyle wrote: »

How did you get that from his quote? I see nothing there about disability, merely the use of phones and tape devices.

macnab wrote: »

I never used the word disability, I said impaired hearing ability. As in your hearing is impaired because you are listening to loud music.

Obviously I'm not the clever, funny b@stard I think I am:D

I cross out 'hearing' in an attempt to be funny.

monument

seamus wrote: »

I would rather have my hands covering my brakes than my bell.

A bell should be so you can do both! You fingers cover break and your thumb covers the bell.

seamus

monument wrote: »

A bell should be so you can do both! You fingers cover break and your thumb covers the bell.

Maybe I've got small hands, but I can't think of any physical placement of the bell that would allow me to brake on the hoods and press the bell with my thumb

monument

seamus wrote: »

Maybe I've got small hands, but I can't think of any physical placement of the bell that would allow me to brake on the hoods and press the bell with my thumb

I suppose it depends on the bike or handlebars, cargo bike and hybrid with flat bar:

Rock of Gibraltar

I really don't see why you wouldn't want a bell on your bike. That's like saying you wouldn't want a horn on your car, like the bell you wouldn't use it all the time but when you wanted to use it and you didn't have it it would annoy the hell out of you.
We moan like crazy about pedestrians walking on cycle paths, why not do as the Dutch and terrorise with bells?
They should be sold as standard (same with lights) on bikes sold as commuter bikes.

Raam

It's not even remotely the same thing.

MajesticDonkey

I assume this is only focused on hybrid/commuter bikes, 'cause I sure as hell ain't putting one on my racer.

Doctor Bob

seamus wrote: »

I can't think of any physical placement of the bell that would allow me to brake on the hoods and press the bell with my thumb

I may have just the thing...

(Fingers crossed you're not a Campag man!)

Cookie_Monster

Rock of Gibraltar wrote: »

I really don't see why you wouldn't want a bell on your bike.

same reason I don't want reflectors, highvis vest or a helmet, they're not needed and not of any benefit to have.

macnab wrote: »

Bike safety: Republican Sinn Fein spokesman Sean O'Neill added: “If it is against the law for a motorist to use a mobile phone while driving, surely there is a equal danger posed by a cyclist who is listening to a tape device while cycling. This is an area that needs to be examined before some pedestrians are injured by careless cyclists in Limerick.”

so we should ban car radios then, right?

Rock of Gibraltar

Yeah I'm referring to commuter bikes.
If you're cycling in the city you're bound to interact with pedestrians and other commuting cyclists, a bell is very useful to alert people to your presence.
They're a legal requirement in the Netherlands and they use they like crazy, if as a pedestrian you put a foot in a cycle path you get a corus of dings that would give you nightmares. They'd also use their bell to alert other cyclists if they were overtaking in the cycle path.

macnab

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

same reason I don't want reflectors, highvis vest or a helmet, they're not needed and not of any benefit to have.


so we should ban car radios then, right?

My point exactly. If you apply this idiots principles you would end up with half the population banned off the road. The book "Animal Farm" comes to mind.

ThisRegard

This is the solution to our non existent problem

details here http://www.gizmag.com/hornster-worlds-loudest-bicycle-horn/22457/

Hermy

Rock of Gibraltar wrote: »

...why not do as the Dutch and terrorise with bells?

How does that work?

Cookie_Monster

Hermy wrote: »

How does that work?

you rip the bell off the handlebar and throw it at the idiots?

Hermy

Would you stop and dismount first?
And what about the risk of damage to paintwork?