OoP (Out of Position) Players

DerTierarzt

Watching the fairly intense Toulouse - Toulon Top 14 Final yesterday, I couldn't help but notice the erstwhile Australian flanker George Smith playing at 11. It got me thinking...

How many other players can people think of that were noticeably played out of position? So I'm not talking locks swapping 4 for 5 or vice-versa, even scrum halves playing as 10s is less impressive with the prominence of Morgan Parra and Dimitri Yachvilli...

I'll get the oval rolling:

1. John Smit switching from hooker to prop
2. Denis Leamy filling in at 12 for an injury ravaged Munster towards the end of a Magners League season

.ak

I think D. Wallace was tried at 12 as well. Failed tho.

Fishooks12

Bergamasco at 9 has to be the biggest failure

WeeBushy

AFAIR Niall Ronan was tried out a couple of times at scrum half in his last season at Leinster.

.ak

Speaking of the Eye-talians, using Botes at 10 was a failure too, he's an excellent SH.

.ak

Isa Nacewa makes an excellent flanker to pack down the scrums.

Fishooks12

R Samo played on the wing and at 8 for Australia during the last world cup

GerM

.ak wrote: »

I think D. Wallace was tried at 12 as well. Failed tho.

Played wing once, if not twice, for Munster. Niall Ronan played 9 and 12 also for Leinster A. Andy Farrell played flanker, outhalf and centre at Sarries. Cian Healy played hooker throughout schools and with Ireland schools as well as centre for Clontarf once or twice. Ben Foden spent a spell playing 9 a few years ago. Radike Samo has played both 8 and wing for Australia. Richardt Strauss has played at openside and hooker at professional level. I'm sure there are plenty more!

irishbucsfan

Mike Tindall is another one, played flanker.

sydthebeat

isnt there a super 15 hooker who starter out as a winger?? the name aludes me.

irishbucsfan

I remember Agen had a player who played loose head and on the wing. That's was the most extreme one I've ever seen.

Of course Munster fans would fancy Marcus Horan as a bit of a winger

jacothelad

Nigel Brady sent on as loosehead prop by McLaughlin.
Niall O'Connor sent on.

finatron

.ak wrote: »

Isa Nacewa makes an excellent flanker to pack down the scrums.

Douglas Howletit did it a few years ago with munster

Fishooks12

irishbucsfan wrote: »

I remember Agen had a player who played loose head and on the wing. That's was the most extreme one I've ever seen.

Of course Munster fans would fancy Marcus Horan as a bit of a winger

He was almost better on the wing for us than Dowling!

Will23

DerTierarzt wrote: »

Watching the fairly intense Toulouse - Toulon Top 14 Final yesterday, I couldn't help but notice the erstwhile Australian flanker George Smith playing at 11.
[/LIST]

Kiwi David Smith played at 11 for Toulon yesterday afaik...

chupacabra

Pierre Spies played a few games at wing for the Bulls a few seasons ago

Fishooks12

chupacabra wrote: »

Pierre Spies played a few games at wing for the Bulls a few seasons ago

He should have stayed there

TheKeenMachine

Isaac Boss and Piri Weepu have played back three

Flincher

Will23 wrote: »

Kiwi David Smith played at 11 for Toulon yesterday afaik...

Yep, George Smith was with Stade as a medical joker. But he played centre for them against Toulon in the Amlin a few weeks ago.

GerM wrote: »

Ben Foden spent a spell playing 9 a few years ago.

Foden started off as a 9, and Sale moved him to wing and fullback. I was looking through some old magazines a while back and found an interview with him as he moved to Northampton and he said a large part of his reasoning for moving was so he could play at scrumhalf. I think the move to the back 3 was very much under protest until he realised he was actually fairly handy there.

I think it is only in the last few seasons he has started working on his fullback game.

.ak

TheKeenMachine wrote: »

Isaac Boss and Piri Weepu have played back three

I'm seeing a trend here...

So basically Kiwis can play 1-to-15.

Fishooks12

.ak wrote: »

I'm seeing a trend here...

So basically Kiwis can play 1-to-15.

Weepu could easily "fit in" at 1, 2 or 3 I'd say too

twinytwo

Fishooks12 wrote: »

R Samo played on the wing and at 8 for Australia during the last world cup

i wonder why....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WLaSAxYQmns

sandyfordboi

sydthebeat wrote: »

isnt there a super 15 hooker who starter out as a winger?? the name aludes me.

schalk brits maybe he plays as a hooker for saracens maybe was a wing in super rugby?

Michalak scrum half that plays as fly half for the sharks and france when he plays!

errlloyd

Thomas O Leary was a full forward Hurling player who kept getting put at scrum half by Ireland.

Morf

sydthebeat wrote: »

isnt there a super 15 hooker who starter out as a winger?? the name aludes me.

Craig Burden for the Sharks it seems.

matthew8

chupacabra wrote: »

Pierre Spies played a few games at wing for the Bulls a few seasons ago

Was he good? Because he seems far more suited there than at 8.

Clearlier

Fishooks12 wrote: »

Bergamasco at 9 has to be the biggest failure

He also played on the wing several times for Italy before he told whoever the coach was that he had had enough.

errlloyd wrote: »

Thomas O Leary was a full forward Hurling player who kept getting put at scrum half by Ireland.

IIRC TOL has also played 10, 13 and both wings for Munster

Fishooks12 wrote: »

R Samo played on the wing and at 8 for Australia during the last world cup

Jim Williams was another who was a winger before he was a 6/8.

I remember Jeremy Davidson making his debut against Fiji on the flank - not an experiment that was ever repeated....

The English prop (loads of strength, a little less technique) whose name escapes me was a flanker before he was a prop.

BOD played at fullback for the lions in a couple of the warm up games on his first tour - like a fish out of water. He also played a European pool game at outhalf against Toulouse and in Toulouse - pretty sure that the score was >50 and he never played there again.

Eric Miller filled in at fullback on a couple of occasions for Ireland - actually looked pretty handy but he hated it.

There are loads of examples of players moving from the back row to the second row.

Neil Jenkins at fullback for the lions in '97. He may have kicked the lions to victory but I've rarely seen a more uncomfortable fullback!

John Hayes played in the 2nd row before he moved to prop (around the time that lifting was allowed IIRC).

Christian Cullen playing 13 when he was the greatest 15 in the world.

Umaga made a successful switch from winger to 13.

twinytwo

Clearlier wrote: »

He also played on the wing several times for Italy before he told whoever the coach was that he had had enough.



IIRC TOL has also played 10, 13 and both wings for Munster



Jim Williams was another who was a winger before he was a 6/8.

I remember Jeremy Davidson making his debut against Fiji on the flank - not an experiment that was ever repeated....

The English prop (loads of strength, a little less technique) whose name escapes me was a flanker before he was a prop.

BOD played at fullback for the lions in a couple of the warm up games on his first tour - like a fish out of water. He also played a European pool game at outhalf against Toulouse and in Toulouse - pretty sure that the score was >50 and he never played there again.

Eric Miller filled in at fullback on a couple of occasions for Ireland - actually looked pretty handy but he hated it.

There are loads of examples of players moving from the back row to the second row.

Neil Jenkins at fullback for the lions in '97. He may have kicked the lions to victory but I've rarely seen a more uncomfortable fullback!

John Hayes played in the 2nd row before he moved to prop (around the time that lifting was allowed IIRC).

Christian Cullen playing 13 when he was the greatest 15 in the world.

Umaga made a successful switch from winger to 13.

i woud have paid a large sum of money to have seen that:D

geotrig

Shane Williams played scrum half before he moved to the wing

pickarooney

Clearlier wrote: »

The English prop (loads of strength, a little less technique) whose name escapes me was a flanker before he was a prop.

Andrew Sheridan played in all three rows. He was always just the wrong size fro each position I felt. Too tall to scrummage, too heavy too lift, too immobile to break.

Clearlier

twinytwo wrote: »

i woud have paid a large sum of money to have seen that:D

To be fair it was far from being BOD's fault. It was very early on his career when Leinster hadn't learned how to compete away from home. However he was never suited to playing out half. His kicking technique even for a centre is pretty average.

Just remembered that Austin Healy played every single position in the backline (as well as referee).

bilston

Andrew Trimble played in the back row for Ireland only the other week against the Barbarians albeit through an injury crisis.

GerM

Clearlier wrote: »

To be fair it was far from being BOD's fault. It was very early on his career when Leinster hadn't learned how to compete away from home. However he was never suited to playing out half. His kicking technique even for a centre is pretty average.

Indeed. Wouldn't hold it against BOD too much. It was 2002 so he was established at the time. Leinster were short on options and had to play Toulouse just when they were on the cusp of becoming the great team of the early decade. Final score was 43-7 but that doesn't reflect the game. We were actually competitive before their far superior bench ran riot in the last quarter. 3-0 at half time according to the report.

BOD played outhalf a couple of years ago away to Connacht for a half when Sexton was injured and we were panicking about what to do for the Toulouse semi final. Went very badly though and Berne played against Toulouse. Last time I recall him stepping in there was for the second half of the NZ hammering in 2010. ROG was on the field but BOD actually stepped in at first receiver for the last 30 minutues. This was when the game had lost its structure and it actually worked well as he just went at them and offloaded. Was completely unpredictable. ROG was tucked away further out the field.

bilston

I remember Neil Francis calling on EOS to pick BOD at 10 in the 2007 WC!

Didn't he play out half until he was 18 or 19?

Tox56

bilston wrote: »

I remember Neil Francis calling on EOS to pick BOD at 10 in the 2007 WC!

Didn't he play out half until he was 18 or 19?

Wouldn't be surprised, the really good kids tend to be put in positions where they get the ball as much as possible and can control the game.

GerM

bilston wrote: »

I remember Neil Francis calling on EOS to pick BOD at 10 in the 2007 WC!

Didn't he play out half until he was 18 or 19?

Yes, played a bit there and at Irish underage level but moved out to accommodate Paddy Wallace. Played his rugby at 12 on the WC winning side but took the kicks at goal. Moved out to 13 gradually.

durkadurka

Lots of the best backs seem to be out halves or full back at schools level, before being moved to other positions when they join teams where there are loads of players of high ability.

It seems that the schools put the best players in those positions when they only have a few genuine talents to work with.

DerTierarzt

durkadurka wrote: »

Lots of the best backs seem to be out halves or full back at schools level, before being moved to other positions when they join teams where there are loads of players of high ability.

It seems that the schools put the best players in those positions when they only have a few genuine talents to work with.

Will Genia at ten probably counts as well

attic

DerTierarzt wrote: »

Will Genia at ten probably counts as well

Surprised noone go this one. D'Arcy as picked as winger when he was really a centre.

bamboozle

bilston wrote: »

I remember Neil Francis calling on EOS to pick BOD at 10 in the 2007 WC!

Didn't he play out half until he was 18 or 19?

yeah he was outhalf for Rock SCT back in 1997, he'd been scrumhalf understudy to Ciaran Scally for years before then.

still remember the SCT semi final in lansdowne road back in 97, BOD missed a drop goal in front of the posts in injury time and Rock lost to Clongowes featuring Des Dillon & D'arcy (at 15) great match.

much as i dont like him but Austin Healy is probably the best example of a utility back there is.

Leo Cullen was irish school's no. 8

totallegend

attic wrote: »

Surprised noone go this one. D'Arcy as picked as winger when he was really a centre.

D'Arcy began life as a full-back, moved to wing and only played centre when BOD got injured in 2003/4, so you could argue that he's being played out of position in the centre...

leonard7

the whole ireland team under declan kidney

[Jackass]

Tony Buckley playing prop instead of manning the burger vending outlet.

SomeFool

[Jackass] wrote: »

Tony Buckley playing prop instead of manning the burger vending outlet.

Always felt he lacked technique really, he was a skilful, powerful player who couldn't scrummage.

él statutorio

Denis Leamy playing at 12 a few years ago in Musgrave Park in a Munster Vs Leinster celtic league game. (for the first half anyway).

SomeFool

Rob Henderson playing 10 for Munster a few years ago, pretty sure he punctured a ball each time he kicked one!

Cardinal Richelieu

Fairly sure quite a few mobile hookers started as flankers, Steve Thompson was a recent one. Ireland also seemed in the past to try a lock in the backrow for 1 or 2 games. Jeremy Davidson, Paddy Johns, not sure if they did it with Galway?

.ak

No more personal jabs at players. I've already banned someone over this. It's an interesting thread, let's not make it a closed thread thanks.

Swiwi

Any number of quality NZ fullbacks shifted to centre for crucial world-cup fixtures. Cullen in '99, MacDonald in '03, Muliainia in '07. Defies belief really...

CatFromHue

Swiwi wrote: »

Any number of quality NZ fullbacks shifted to centre for crucial world-cup fixtures. Cullen in '99, MacDonald in '03, Muliainia in '07. Defies belief really...

Funnily enough the centres who go to the wing tend to work out. Kahui, Umaga, and Nonu all did well on the wing.

Swiwi

CatFromHue wrote: »

Funnily enough the centres who go to the wing tend to work out. Kahui, Umaga, and Nonu all did well on the wing.

I think any half-decent player with a bit of speed & size can make a fair go of playing wing. Centre & full-back on the other hand require skills like reading the game and positional sense etc. It is clear (as so generously demonstrated by NZ on not one not two but THREE consecutive world cups) that centre & fullback are not interchangeable...