Thieves

redhanded

Help please! 3 scumbags broke into a shed in a house beside ballyshunnock lake near Carrolls Cross,, 15min from waterford city. They were taken parts off a car when my mother found them, They made a go for her with a large spanner and then tried to knock her down in their red volkswagen caddy with 01 CN .... reg, the reg had two badges on it as seen in germany /poland and other mainland Europe countries as tax and insurance. Has anyone seen a red vw caddy around waterford or dungarvan with these bastards acting suspiously because they tried to kill my mother by trying to hit her in the van so its attemped murder and I'd like to have a chat with them regarding that.

italodisco

Hope you got onto the garda.... And might be worth going out for a long drive for a bit of spotting..... Dirtbags..... Absolute ratbags..... If only you had of caught them in the act ....

redhanded

yea so annoyed it was my mother that found em and not me, I would of let all the tyres on their van down and rang the cops. Nothing they could do then

spankmemunkey

Those badges are just stuck on by enthusiasts, like you can get your car reg on plates to make them look like german plates,

Sounds like a VW enthusiast, sorry to hear about this and we should all be vigilant, ill keep my eye out for you

go to www.vagdrivers.net

There is a VW community in waterford go on there and ask for people to look out for them or do they know them.

cocoshovel

Im sorry, but the forum cant help you. You should have gotten onto the Gardai about this immediately. Or else your chances of anything happening are going to be ZERO

Avox

I live near the 5 cross roads and didn't notice any vans passing down our way around that time!

bradknowell

cocoshovel wrote: »

Im sorry, but the forum cant help you. You should have gotten onto the Gardai about this immediately. Or else your chances of anything happening are going to be ZERO

Could have been onto the cops already.
Forums and facebook already proved themselves a few weeks ago when that young fellas dog was found up the country.
I'm nowhere near there op but ill keep a look out anyways for the pricks

redhanded

Yea my mother called cops straight away, they left tools behind em but cops said there would be too many fingerprints on them to be any good for evidence, like u said the Internet can prove a very useful tool for getting info, there was a blue fiat pinto stolen from outside the house when there was no1 around about 2 months ago, high possibility of being repeat offenders, my mother listened to them outside the garage b4 foolishly and bravely confronting them and said at least one had a polish accent and one an Irish

Media999

Thats a case for crimewatch if ever i seen one. Give them a ring and tell them they nearly killed your mother and see will they show it. Could use it as an example of the rise of burglarys etc..

thomasm

redhanded wrote: »

Yea my mother called cops straight away, they left tools behind em but cops said there would be too many fingerprints on them to be any good for evidence, like u said the Internet can prove a very useful tool for getting info, there was a blue fiat pinto stolen from outside the house when there was no1 around about 2 months ago, high possibility of being repeat offenders, my mother listened to them outside the garage b4 foolishly and bravely confronting them and said at least one had a polish accent and one an Irish

So rather than seeing if prints are on a weapon used in an attempted assault and robbery the cops are just going to assume there would be too many fingerprints on them. What a load of sh1te. I'd be onto someone more senior about that. Surely prints could be matched off car they were robbing pieces off also.

redhanded

thats what I said to my mother, But the guards said it would just be sitting up in the barracks in the corner so somebody might as well use them.yea crimwewatch might be an idea, bugularies are getting out of control, Theres a big rise in burgularies in the town but the countryside is out of control, Its gone to the stage where people cant leave their house and constantly trying to get rid of vans pulling in the drive looking for scrap and stuff while scouting over your shoulder, There was always an element of this but its non stop. I mean you could put up big gates but they take the gates when you not there, Dog? they take the dog? cops? they take the cops

Potential-Monke

Without taking away from the incident, I think I should clarify the fingerprint situation. Ireland is not like CSI (actually, nowhere is). To get a useable fingerprint, it has to havre been more or less left on glass or a glass like surface. Depending on the tools, you wouldn't get a print off them, the exception being a steel hammer neck, blade of a saw, or sonething similar. Wrenches, spanners, etc, no good.

I hopeyour mother is ok, it's a damn shame that people in the country are being increasingly subjected to this. Because thisis the second crime in as many months, I would recommend looking into home cctv, decent equipment can be bought now for €300.

As for crimewarch, I believe its the gardai who decide what goes on it.

ROCKMAN

Potential-Monke wrote: »

Without taking away from the incident, I think I should clarify the fingerprint situation. Ireland is not like CSI (actually, nowhere is). To get a useable fingerprint, it has to havre been more or less left on glass or a glass like surface. Depending on the tools, you wouldn't get a print off them, the exception being a steel hammer neck, blade of a saw, or sonething similar. Wrenches, spanners, etc, no good.

I hopeyour mother is ok, it's a damn shame that people in the country are being increasingly subjected to this. Because thisis the second crime in as many months, I would recommend looking into home cctv, decent equipment can be bought now for €300.

As for crimewarch, I believe its the gardai who decide what goes on it.

Ok fingerprints must be taking from smooth surfaces... so explain to me how come they didn't even try on a mirowave left (dropped) in my backgarden when the scumbags where interupted ,, Just too ****ing lazy and couldn't be arsed is my opinion.

As for OP Sorry to hear your story they're becoming to common , But fair play to your mother (ok some may say stupid ) but i think her bravery deserves to be applauded . if more people had her attitude it might make these scum think twice.

Not The Real Scarecrow

ROCKMAN wrote: »

Ok fingerprints must be taking from smooth surfaces... so explain to me how come they didn't even try on a mirowave left (dropped) in my backgarden when the scumbags where interupted ,, Just too ****ing lazy and couldn't be arsed is my opinion.

As for OP Sorry to hear your story they're becoming to common , But fair play to your mother (ok some may say stupid ) but i think her bravery deserves to be applauded . if more people had her attitude it might make these scum think twice.

Truth of the matter is it costs too much to get it done for what the Guards consider a minor incident. Also as pointed out , the forensic tech they have at their disposal is wayyyy outdated.

Potential-Monke

ROCKMAN wrote: »

Ok fingerprints must be taking from smooth surfaces... so explain to me how come they didn't even try on a mirowave left (dropped) in my backgarden when the scumbags where interupted ,, Just too ****ing lazy and couldn't be arsed is my opinion.

Obviously I can't answer that, but it's unusual that they wouldn't have it tested, it's a different set of Gardai that do the testing so it's nothing to do with laziness, possibly as said above it's too expensive for attemtped thefts... I don't know.

Media999

Potential-Monke wrote: »

I would recommend looking into home cctv, decent equipment can be bought now for €300.

Fake camera can be had for 20 on ebay. Leave it on your front gate.

http://www.ebay.ie/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=m570&_nkw=fake+camera

I know its not ideal but will give you a bit more peace of mind if your short on cash.

Finnbar01

Meatwad wrote: »

Truth of the matter is it costs too much to get it done for what the Guards consider a minor incident.

I don't think this was a minor incident:

''They made a go for her with a large spanner and then tried to knock her down in their red volkswagen caddy''

I know several people (including my own) whose houses were broken into and the attitude they got from the guards is they couldn't be arsed.

It seems that burglaries are not taking as serious say as minor traffic violations.

d3exile

Potential-Monke wrote: »

ROCKMAN wrote: »

Ok fingerprints must be taking from smooth surfaces... so explain to me how come they didn't even try on a mirowave left (dropped) in my backgarden when the scumbags where interupted ,, Just too ****ing lazy and couldn't be arsed is my opinion.

Obviously I can't answer that, but it's unusual that they wouldn't have it tested, it's a different set of Gardai that do the testing so it's nothing to do with laziness, possibly as said above it's too expensive for attemtped thefts... I don't know.

If something has been left outside for a medium to long period of time or even a very short time dependant on the conditions, it is 'weathered' and the trace oils needed for a fingerprint are destroyed, so no prints

Easier to blame the guards for being lazy tho when you don't know the science behind it

The partial and possibly unique reg is the way to go I'd say, not a huge amount of 11yr old caddys around and if you can assume they're from Waterford city or county it narrows the search further

Definitely recommend the CCTV option, and lights, the secret of crime prevention is making the place less appealing than next door

ROCKMAN

d3exile wrote: »

If something has been left outside for a medium to long period of time or even a very short time dependant on the conditions, it is 'weathered' and the trace oils needed for a fingerprint are destroyed, so no prints
Easier to blame the guards for being lazy tho when you don't know the science behind it
The partial and possibly unique reg is the way to go I'd say, not a huge amount of 11yr old caddys around and if you can assume they're from Waterford city or county it narrows the search further

Definitely recommend the CCTV option, and lights, the secret of crime prevention is making the place less appealing than next door

Scumbags interupted ,dropped mircowave ,escaped over back wall ,Guards on scene 10 mins max later (must have been in the area ),And still didn't even try SO SCIENCE OR NO SCIENCE , they looked and acted like lazy c**nts ...that didn't give a f**k ,

Ps weather was a nice sunny evening.

d3exile

ROCKMAN wrote: »

d3exile wrote: »

If something has been left outside for a medium to long period of time or even a very short time dependant on the conditions, it is 'weathered' and the trace oils needed for a fingerprint are destroyed, so no prints
Easier to blame the guards for being lazy tho when you don't know the science behind it
The partial and possibly unique reg is the way to go I'd say, not a huge amount of 11yr old caddys around and if you can assume they're from Waterford city or county it narrows the search further

Definitely recommend the CCTV option, and lights, the secret of crime prevention is making the place less appealing than next door

Scumbags interupted ,dropped mircowave ,escaped over back wall ,Guards on scene 10 mins max later (must have been in the area ),And still didn't even try SO SCIENCE OR NO SCIENCE , they looked and acted like lazy c**nts ...that didn't give a f**k ,

Ps weather was a nice sunny evening.

Do you kiss your mother with that keyboard?!

If it was as you say you should definitely take exception to it and complain (not rant)


However I don't recall there being a nice sunny evening in Ireland since 1992

ROCKMAN

d3exile wrote: »

Do you kiss your mother with that keyboard?!

If it was as you say you should definitely take exception to it and complain (not rant)


However I don't recall there being a nice sunny evening in Ireland since 1992

Jesus a comedian.
Science nerd with humour about as rare as a sunny day in Ireland .

Did complain , alot of good that did .

sorry if my use of language offends you but thats how I feel about the sorry excuses that turned up that sunny evening.

wmpdd3

Again, I dont want to take away form this violent burglary, but my father car was broken into , they forced the window down, it was covered in fingerprints.The guards refused to lift prints, they felt the prints were no use to them.

To be honest I think in the country even with real/fake cameras or dogs wont keep some thieves away.

Monty Burnz

Meatwad wrote: »

Truth of the matter is it costs too much to get it done for what the Guards consider a minor incident. Also as pointed out , the forensic tech they have at their disposal is wayyyy outdated.

If you think about it, the Gardaí are the ultimate state employees with zero competition for the service they provide. Hence their methods are decades out of date compared to private industry. The 'state of the art' PULSE system they deployed a few years ago with great fanfare is little different to the sort of software businesses introduced to keep track of customers in the 60s.

membersonly

I thought this thread would have lead to the capture of these thieves by now...do we have any leads?

d3exile

Monty Burnz wrote: »

Meatwad wrote: »

Truth of the matter is it costs too much to get it done for what the Guards consider a minor incident. Also as pointed out , the forensic tech they have at their disposal is wayyyy outdated.

If you think about it, the Gardaí are the ultimate state employees with zero competition for the service they provide. Hence their methods are decades out of date compared to private industry. The 'state of the art' PULSE system they deployed a few years ago with great fanfare is little different to the sort of software businesses introduced to keep track of customers in the 60s.

Hardly the Guards' own fault that they are ill equipped with outdated policies and technology? Responsibility for that rests with The Commissioners office and the DOJ not lifting a finger

saying they're the ultimate state employees with zero competition for the service they provide is the reason their methods are decades out of date compared to private industry doesn't really wash as every police force on the planet has zero competition for services supplied yet can manage to have proper funding and the legal and technical backing of their government, Ireland, however is an exception with email only properly being introduced now, Internet still rare and operating systems from 2000 and 1989... Not the guard on the ground's fault

Anyway we're drifting dangerously off topic so I'm gonna catch my rant before I go in full flight!

Monty Burnz

d3exile wrote: »

Hardly the Guards' own fault that they are ill equipped with outdated policies and technology? Responsibility for that rests with The Commissioners office and the DOJ not lifting a finger

Who manages the Gardaí?

bradknowell

membersonly wrote: »

I thought this thread would have lead to the capture of these thieves by now...do we have any leads?

Even I know as a newb that any thread on here that talks about a crime inevitably turns into a cop bashing thread.
If people don't think the cops do anything then don't ring them when something happens.
Imho if the person who said the cops where out in a few minutes and didn't find anyone but the person presumed the scumbags where still around, why didn't you get a Hurley or something and go catch them yourself? Feck that.

Monty Burnz

bradknowell wrote: »

Even I know as a newb that any thread on here that talks about a crime inevitably turns into a cop bashing thread.
If people don't think the cops do anything then don't ring them when something happens.
Imho if the person who said the cops where out in a few minutes and didn't find anyone but the person presumed the scumbags where still around, why didn't you get a Hurley or something and go catch them yourself? Feck that.

Because if you did find them and had to use your hurley, you would be charged, not them.

Potential-Monke

Monty Burnz wrote: »

Who manages the Gardaí?

The Commissioner, who is managed by the Department of Justice, or more specifially the Minister for the Dept of Justice (or even more specifically, his lackies).

My final word on the matter is Ombudsman, if you feel hard done by by the actions of 1 or 2 Gardai, then complain them. Even if nothing comes of it, it's a record, and records build up over time. Plus, it is only the odd Garda who's useless, but you never hear of the many many calls they do to a satisfactory (albeit, probably unsolved) level.

Anyway, @OP, any update?

Monty Burnz

Potential-Monke wrote: »

The Commissioner, who is managed by the Department of Justice, or more specifially the Minister for the Dept of Justice (or even more specifically, his lackies).

Or, to put it another way, Gardaí manage the Gardaí. The minister for the Dept of Justice 'manages' it in much the same way that the minister of Finance manages the ESB - i.e. not at all.

membersonly

bradknowell wrote: »

Even I know as a newb that any thread on here that talks about a crime inevitably turns into a cop bashing thread.
If people don't think the cops do anything then don't ring them when something happens.
Imho if the person who said the cops where out in a few minutes and didn't find anyone but the person presumed the scumbags where still around, why didn't you get a Hurley or something and go catch them yourself? Feck that.

1. I was only joking.

2. Just because you have a new username doesn't mean you're a newb.

Potential-Monke

Monty Burnz wrote: »

Or, to put it another way, Gardaí manage the Gardaí. The minister for the Dept of Justice 'manages' it in much the same way that the minister of Finance manages the ESB - i.e. not at all.

Well, yeah. Where's this going?

Monty Burnz

Potential-Monke wrote: »

Well, yeah. Where's this going?

I'm just observing that as the ultimate state-sector, competition free activity, policing lags the rest of human enterprise by - it would appear - 50 years. This isn't strictly their fault, but perhaps some time and energy could be put into looking at what lessons can be taken from the business world and applied to tackling crime (like the PULSE example - bringing Irish policing bang up to the 1960s).

bradknowell

membersonly wrote: »

1. I was only joking.

2. Just because you have a new username doesn't mean you're a newb.

I'm only gowling. That's how I troll lol

Potential-Monke

Monty Burnz wrote: »

I'm just observing that as the ultimate state-sector, competition free activity, policing lags the rest of human enterprise by - it would appear - 50 years. This isn't strictly their fault, but perhaps some time and energy could be put into looking at what lessons can be taken from the business world and applied to tackling crime (like the PULSE example - bringing Irish policing bang up to the 1960s).

Ah, i see, and i agree, some modernisation and business know how should be brought into the force, as the majority of those with the power to make changes were promoted into those positions, possibly without any prior experience/knowledge in management, and by doing a course it makes them immediately able to manage a division/region/force.

I also know that there was a state of the art system coming to Waterford prior to the recession, and was at signature stage before being pulled the day before it was signed, which would have made Waterford Garda Station the most advanced Garda station in the country, and one of the most advanced in Europe (all in terms of resource management/crime tracking).

But, all this is now on the long finger due to bugdetary cuts, the recession, taxes, etc. The force is getting smaller, regardless of what the media or others say, and it is and will continue to have a negative effect.

d3exile

Monty Burnz wrote: »

Because if you did find them and had to use your hurley, you would be charged, not them.

Charged? Sure they'd never catch you, they're useless and lazy, with outdated computer systems and they manage themselves, answerable to no one blah blah blah blah

Monty Burnz

d3exile wrote: »

Charged? Sure they'd never catch you, they're useless and lazy, with outdated computer systems and they manage themselves, answerable to no one blah blah blah blah

They wouldn't have to catch you because it wouldn't occur to you to do a runner. By the way, are you following the thread from TBH about the person crashing into his car and driving off? He's been chasing the guard responsible for it for weeks.

rinsedpie

A friend caught an 18yearold African boy shoplifting in his groceries today; caught him as he was about to reach the door; garda was called; shockingly they warned him that the boy could sue him as he HAS NOT MADE IT OUT OF HIS SHOP YET and therefore couldnt be arrested..and he was released! My friend got his merchandise back. LOL! the law in this country almost favours the criminals. If that boy was caught in his native country, he would have been beaten senseless.

Tubbs4

rinsedpie wrote: »

A friend caught an 18yearold African boy shoplifting in his groceries today; caught him as he was about to reach the door; garda was called; shockingly they warned him that the boy could sue him as he HAS NOT MADE IT OUT OF HIS SHOP YET and therefore couldnt be arrested..and he was released! My friend got his merchandise back. LOL! the law in this country almost favours the criminals. If that boy was caught in his native country, he would have been beaten senseless.

Your friend should of known that you can not accuse anyone of robbing until they leave the store with goods.
This law was around for seats and an Irish person can also sue.
While it is a stupid law that can be abused by dropping the goods before you leave the store and then sue if accused.

I feel bad for your friend and hopes he is not sued but he learnt today some laws.

Sorry if off topic from the original post.

rinsedpie

Thanks Tubbs, he asked me to ask around if this was true, so, there you go. I'll let him to look out for this sort of thing.

Tubbs4 wrote: »

Your friend should of known that you can not accuse anyone of robbing until they leave the store with goods.
This law was around for seats and an Irish person can also sue.
While it is a stupid law that can be abused by dropping the goods before you leave the store and then sue if accused.

I feel bad for your friend and hopes he is not sued but he learnt today some laws.

Sorry if off topic from the original post.

Media999

So a security guard / shopkeeper can just grab anyone they feel like while there still in the shop , rough them up and use the excuse he thought they where robbing.

Such a racist bringing the fact hes African into it. Sounds like a sh*t racist businessman who needs to be educated.

Hope your racist friend is sued for being a fool and not knowing basic laws. No pity at all.

mike65

We don;t need any Dub racists on this thread.

deisedave

Media999 wrote: »

So a security guard / shopkeeper can just grab anyone they feel like while there still in the shop , rough them up and use the excuse he thought they where robbing.

Such a racist bringing the fact hes African into it. Sounds like a sh*t racist businessman who needs to be educated.

Hope your racist friend is sued for being a fool and not knowing basic laws. No pity at all.

Yeah in my experience if I was to be paranoid of anyone specific minority robbing, Africans would not be anywhere near the top of my list.

rinsedpie

Media999 wrote: »

So a security guard / shopkeeper can just grab anyone they feel like while there still in the shop , rough them up and use the excuse he thought they where robbing.

Such a racist bringing the fact hes African into it. Sounds like a sh*t racist businessman who needs to be educated.

Hope your racist friend is sued for being a fool and not knowing basic laws. No pity at all.

i think it was very unfair for my friend. the boy was caught on his cctv and the gardai seen it. nothing to do with race, whoever is caught stealing should not get away with it. the boy says he bought the thing in another shop etc. when it happens to you only then you will feel it is suppose, no wonder my friend was so mad. i think that shop ws insured of course but thats beside the point. so the kid got away with it to do it another day elsewhere knowing that even when he was shown the video of himself he still got away scott free.