whey protein or weight gainer supplements?

road dog

Hi all
Im new to boards and this is my first post so excuse me if i am repeating something that has been asked before.Currently im under weight 10 stone 11 lbs,im 27 year old male.I have been working out for the past 4 months and not gaining much weight so about 2 weeks ago i started a strength training programme and have started to eat 5-6 healthy meals a day.Im using a whey protein supplement at the moment.I dont think im getting enough calories each day so i wanted to ask if i should be taking a weight gainer or a protein supplement or maybe both together.Thanks!

UL_heart_throb

Stupidity deleted. Any more of this nonsense and you'll be banned again.

fearcruach

The key is to estimate your calorie expenditure vs your actual calorie intake.

While the content of the food matters, overall weight loss/gain is governed by the amount of calories taken in vs the amount taken out.

You want to eat ~500 kcals over your maintenance limit for weight gain with minimum fat gain.

http://interzone.kicks-ass.net/Calculating_calories.xls - This is a good spreadsheet for estimating your calorie needs.

Use myfitnesspal.com to track how many calories you are eating a day. Until you know how much is going in then it'll be pure chance if you are going over.

As for whey vs mass gainer, it will depend on the above. If you are getting enough kcals from your daily food intake then you won't need a gainer. If you are under your protein for the day then you could use the whey. Aim for 1g of protein per lb bodyweight.

Personally, I use a weight gainer but this is due to the nature of my work that means I can't sit down to a meal during. So it's purely convenience that I use it.

diegowhite

Get protein powder and blend it with porridge oats, cheap healthy and puts on weight:D

Gummy Panda

Please post daily diet in detail

meijin

UL_heart_throb wrote: »

Hi bothar madra

i am the current boards.ie Health and Fitness consultant, I am quite busy this minute, i will try to have a reply for you tonight.

Just to let you know about my pedigree I took over from Hanley, who took over from Will Heffernan, who took over from G'em, who took over from Dragan, who took over from Transform, who took over from Jak. So you're in safe hands.

:eek:

road dog

Gummy Panda wrote: »

Please post daily diet in detail

8-9 am:whey shake(40g mixed with milk and water) + bowl of porridge with milk + 2 wholewheat slices of bread + tea/glass of orange juice

11.30-12:either an omlette,boiled eggs,tin of tuna,salmon+apple,bannana

3.30-4:yogurt + peanut butter sandwich

workout for an hour followed by whey protein shake 40 g


5-5.30:dinner-either potatoes or pasta with either chicken,beef,fish with choice of veg

8pm-ham or chicken sandwich

11pm-porridge

I sometimes snack in between meals,Would it be better for me to build some mass before i start working out?

Doctor_Socks

road dog wrote: »

8-9 am:whey shake(40g mixed with milk and water) + bowl of porridge with milk + 2 wholewheat slices of bread + tea/glass of orange juice Replace the water in the shake with more milk. Make a smoothie with whey, milk, peanut butter and bananas or something along those lines for extra cals

11.30-12:either an omlette,boiled eggs,tin of tuna,salmon+apple,bannana Add a s**t load of cheese to the omelette

3.30-4:yogurt + peanut butter sandwich Why not have 2 sandwiches?

workout for an hour followed by whey protein shake 40 g Have some blended oats with it aswell

5-5.30:dinner-either potatoes or pasta with either chicken,beef,fish with choice of veg Try and eat bigger portions, potatoes are a great source of cals I find

8pm-ham or chicken sandwichAgain, why not two? It might be awful stuffing yourself when you're already full but that's what needs to be done

11pm-porridge

I sometimes snack in between meals,Would it be better for me to build some mass before i start working out?

It's a decent diet, need to up the calories though as you've said. I think the easiest way to do it would be to start having milk with meals.

It's not better to build mass before working out, it will just be fat. Eat big while lifting big to get big! I found that when I started working out that I started to eat more naturally, whether it was from working up an appetite from exercise or realizing that the barbell won't go any higher without eating a ton more before working out!

road dog

thanks doc
yea i already drink lots of milk and it seems to just put weight on my face and not my body hehe

Brian?

road dog wrote: »

thanks doc
yea i already drink lots of milk and it seems to just put weight on my face and not my body hehe

Nutritionally your diet is not bad, but we have no idea what the portion sizes are.

You need to work out how many calories you need to eat for maintenance and add 500 for weight gain.

I find myfitnesspal.com very good, if you have a smart phone they do an app.

road dog

anyone know a good strength training programme?

Gummy Panda

road dog wrote: »

anyone know a good strength training programme?

Starting strength
bill Starr 5x5
madcow 5x5

Dietsquirt

Optimum Nutrition Serious Mass, i'm 27, 12 stone. i've put on about a stone in 9mths, i train 3/4 times a week, i'm eating more food (good/clean food!) and taking Serious Mass. You can get a 5 kg bag in any protein shop for around €55. I highly recommend it.

You won't get ripped from serious mass, but you'll put on muscle mass.

DO IT!

road dog

thanks for the advice,would you recommend using a whey protein shake with the mass gainer?

road dog

you only get 16 servings from a 5.5kg bag of serious mass and need to take 2 a day so basically i need to buy one every 8 days.seems expensive:(

Gummy Panda

If you want a weight gainer check out bulkpowders.co.uk

they have two products complete mass and lean mass. both cheaper and better carb source

Dietsquirt

If you've taken a protein shake before, you'll know the scoops were small enough. Serious mass scoops are around a cup each. They 'recommend' you take 6 of them a day (2 morning, 2 before training, 2 before bed). Because i upped my food intake it was too much for me to take that much supplement. i took 4 a day and i put on a good bit of muscle in a few months. A bag lasted me about 3 weeks. The easiest way to put on muscle is to eat more protein (chicken, beef, etc...).

To answer your earlier question i wouldn't recommend a protein shake as well, it's not necessary. The only i other supplement you could take (in my opinion!!) is a creatine monohydrate. Optimum Nutrition do one for €20 ish.


If you invest in it, eat well and train 3-4 times a week, i GUARANTEE results.

Good luck

UpandUnder

road dog wrote: »

8-9 am:whey shake(40g mixed with milk and water) + bowl of porridge with milk + 2 wholewheat slices of bread + tea/glass of orange juice

11.30-12:either an omlette,boiled eggs,tin of tuna,salmon+apple,bannana

3.30-4:yogurt + peanut butter sandwich

workout for an hour followed by whey protein shake 40 g


5-5.30:dinner-either potatoes or pasta with either chicken,beef,fish with choice of veg

8pm-ham or chicken sandwich

11pm-porridge

I sometimes snack in between meals,Would it be better for me to build some mass before i start working out?

From looking at your diet, I think you need a lot more protein. Aim for 2g per Kg of body weight as protein is what will build muscle and increase your weight. Eat only clean food as this will prevent fat gains.

An example of my diet is as follows and I have made good gains:

Meal 1 - Porridge, 6 large egg whites and two full eggs, orange juice,

Meal 2 - Large chicken breast, Sweet Potato, Cup of green veg,

Meal 3 - Cup of tuna, garden salad, olive oil, brown pasta

Meal 4 - Large chicken breast, Brown rice, Veg

Meal 5 - Pre Work out - Protein, Porridge Oats & peanut butter shake

Meal 6 - Post work out - Protein shake, and banana

Meal 7 - Fish, steak or turkey rashers sandwich on brown bread

Meal 8 - Cottage cheese - Casein protein is slow digesting so this is good for your last meal.


Eat whole almonds between meals if hungry.

The mass gainers are OK but real food is better for you. They also contain a lot of sugar. I prefer protein with oats and peanut butter as a quick meal. A hell of a lot cheaper then mass gainers.

Change your routine every 4 weeks or so, so that your body does not get used to the program.

Hope this helps!

Weylin

road dog wrote: »

Hi all
Im new to boards and this is my first post so excuse me if i am repeating something that has been asked before.Currently im under weight 10 stone 11 lbs,im 27 year old male.I have been working out for the past 4 months and not gaining much weight so about 2 weeks ago i started a strength training programme and have started to eat 5-6 healthy meals a day.Im using a whey protein supplement at the moment.I dont think im getting enough calories each day so i wanted to ask if i should be taking a weight gainer or a protein supplement or maybe both together.Thanks!

try a few of these and see what happens ...........
http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/proteinshakes.htm

road dog

fearcruach wrote: »

The key is to estimate your calorie expenditure vs your actual calorie intake.

While the content of the food matters, overall weight loss/gain is governed by the amount of calories taken in vs the amount taken out.

You want to eat ~500 kcals over your maintenance limit for weight gain with minimum fat gain.

http://interzone.kicks-ass.net/Calculating_calories.xls - This is a good spreadsheet for estimating your calorie needs.

Use myfitnesspal.com to track how many calories you are eating a day. Until you know how much is going in then it'll be pure chance if you are going over.

As for whey vs mass gainer, it will depend on the above. If you are getting enough kcals from your daily food intake then you won't need a gainer. If you are under your protein for the day then you could use the whey. Aim for 1g of protein per lb bodyweight.

Personally, I use a weight gainer but this is due to the nature of my work that means I can't sit down to a meal during. So it's purely convenience that I use it.

Hey Fearcruach
What gainer do you use?Iv just ordered Optimum nutrition serious mass from discountsupplements.It has 50g protein per serving(scoops are big)
Do you think i would need to maybe take a protein supp aswell or would the protein in the weight gainer be sufficient
Im looking to put on weight and build muscle
Just wondering what you think,Thanks

KingK

Just a quick question on cottage cheese. I have never tasted it and usually have a scoop of whey with milk before bed. But would like to get cottage cheese for the casein,does it taste as bad as i'm being told?

Gummy Panda

KingK wrote: »

Just a quick question on cottage cheese. I have never tasted it and usually have a scoop of whey with milk before bed. But would like to get cottage cheese for the casein,does it taste as bad as i'm being told?

Not really. its just a bit lumpy. Try mix it with berries or peanut butter.

Dathai

road dog wrote: »

Hey Fearcruach
What gainer do you use?Iv just ordered Optimum nutrition serious mass from discountsupplements.It has 50g protein per serving(scoops are big)
Do you think i would need to maybe take a protein supp aswell or would the protein in the weight gainer be sufficient
Im looking to put on weight and build muscle
Just wondering what you think,Thanks

Should have just bought the protein dude. 2 x 330g servings and ~250g of that is carbs. Tastes horrible as well.

road dog

Oh well,i need to put on the weight first to be able to turn that into muscle
I will use a seperate whey protein shake aswell or maybe mix them both

fearcruach

road dog wrote: »

Hey Fearcruach
What gainer do you use?Iv just ordered Optimum nutrition serious mass from discountsupplements.It has 50g protein per serving(scoops are big)
Do you think i would need to maybe take a protein supp aswell or would the protein in the weight gainer be sufficient
Im looking to put on weight and build muscle
Just wondering what you think,Thanks

I used this one from MyProtein.co.uk. http://www.myprotein.com/ie/products/total-gainer

It does the job it says on the tin, last about a month if you're having it once a day. It tastes very nice but can be lumpy if you're just shaking it. If it's blended, it's lovely.

As other's have said try and eat real food if you can. Oats, peanut butter, eggs etc. I use the mass gainer as the nature of my work means that I don't have time to sit down to a meal at certain times during the day. It's purely for convenience.

As for the amount of protein to take, I would aim for 1g per lb bodyweight. So use myfitnesspal.com to figure out how much protein you take in per day. If you aren't getting enough and there isn't scope to add more chicken/beef/eggs/peanut butter/milk etc then get a whey protein as well.

road dog wrote: »

Oh well,i need to put on the weight first to be able to turn that into muscle
I will use a seperate whey protein shake aswell or maybe mix them both

You don't turn weight into muscle. Fat cannot be changed into muscle. You build muscle regardless if you are 10st or 20st. Eat 1g per lb bodyweight in protein and eat 500 cals above your daily maintenance (you can figure this out from the spreadsheet in my post above).

Don't be tempted to stuff yourself full of pizzas and kebabs just to put on weight. Eat good nutritious food and plenty of protein and you'll put on more muscle and less fat.

road dog

Point taken about turning fat into muscle but i need to put on weight as im fairly skinny atm 11 stone at 6 ft 1
So im aiming for 3000 cals a day and most days i can eat that through clean foods but somedays i will need the mass gainer
My goal is to get to 12 and a half stone maybe 13
Im working out 4-5 times a week
Just had the ON serious mass weight gainer,i got strawberry ,tastes nice:D

fearcruach

road dog wrote: »

Point taken about turning fat into muscle but i need to put on weight as im fairly skinny atm 11 stone at 6 ft 1
So im aiming for 3000 cals a day and most days i can eat that through clean foods but somedays i will need the mass gainer
My goal is to get to 12 and a half stone maybe 13
Im working out 4-5 times a week
Just had the ON serious mass weight gainer,i got strawberry ,tastes nice:D

Be careful about training too much. You can overtrain and you won't see any gains. If you are going to be training 4 - 5 times a week then I'd nearly increase your calorie goal to 3100 - 3300 to account for this.

road dog

Yea ive had problems with over training before without really understanding the nutrition side of things.Maybe a little more protein aswell would help with that.Thanks again