Cycling - The 'new breeds' mindset.

Colonialboy

Im finding this new breed of cyclist and cycling, annoying me, they seem to be focusing on the wrong things. Anyone else any thoughts or maybe its just me.

I cycled long before and all thru the Celtic tiger, now all these dickheads in work who spent the Celtic tiger telling me they had a new Alfa Romeo or 3-series beamer, have discovered cycling and are telling the world , they have woken up to the joys of something thats relatively free (cycling, yet they still want to spend as much money as they can on it) and are telling me how they did this trip and their avg speed is this and HR was this and .. who gives a f*k... They dont seem to mention anything of interest regarding what they saw on the cycle or a new route or something of natural beauty they saw...

They still arent getting the point of cycling, they are applying the same Celtic tiger philosophy to their cycling. Spend as much money as I can and bore someone else with all the details.
And whats worse is they are giving 'genuine cyclists' a bad name cos they arent just boring cyclists with their rubbish they are boring non-cyclists also.

Im all for improving fitness and goals and wanting and enjoying ones improvements but Im not finding it balanced by the other 'purer' side of cycling. I accept the A1s and elites do need to look on the bike as more than just enjoyment, and good luck to them , I admire their dedication but I think alot of the new breed of cyclists are not getting 'it'

Maybe its broader more philosophical and sociological issue, something to do with the modern society we live in and the pace we live at, Im delighted to see so many people on the roads these days, its fantastic,
but get a grip people.

Idleater

I like my Alfa Romeo. And I've been cycling years and years.

seamus

"Genuine" cyclists, "purer" side of cycling?

Sounds like cycling snobbery to me, tbh. Your colleagues aren't the party I'd be judging.

Stop worrying about everyone else's motives and just enjoy yourself.

leeroybrown

I'm with seamus on this one. I couldn't care less why someone gets on a bicycle so long as they do. It sounds like you miss the days when cycling was an exclusive thing for people who got the 'purer' side of 'it'. Grow up.

Inquitus

Cycling isn't a one size fits all sport, some people like touring and getting out in nature, some like sportives and leisure rides, some only cycle as a means of getting around, and others like to race and train. Surely we should just allow people to enjoy whatever approach they wish to take to cycling, and be thankful the sport is on the up!

kenmc

Best saved up for a friday methinks.

smacl

Colonialboy wrote: »

They dont seem to mention anything of interest regarding what they saw on the cycle or a new route or something of natural beauty they saw...

Are you sure?

Crippens1

Been cycling since the late 60s, racing since the late 70s and first car was a 1984 Alfa Romeo 33 - still have the badge and the wooden steering wheel !

Postit

Colonialboy wrote: »

or maybe its just me.

Yep!

Jawgap

did someone get their arse handed to them in a commuter race.......:D

I had an Alfa - a 155 1.8 16V job in red - I still miss it and think of it often.

Junior

Looks like there's trouble int mill lad. In my day ... yadda .. yadda..

Scuba_Scoper

This 'new' breed just means that the sport is becoming mainstream... look at the plethora of sites like trainingpeaks, trainerroad, strava, garmin, gizmodo and many more I have not heard of yet that only exist as a means of recording stats, analysis, training plans.... all this means is that you will have more and more people involved that will ultimately benifiit all in the community...

Every sport needs a Fred. It's what makes the professionalm, attainable and available.

Do you think manufactures would be producing the best and lightest components in a mass market consumerist society if it were not for this 'new' breed.

So, hug a Fred, let go of your angst, we do enjoy the ride.;)

Kav0777

Colonialboy wrote: »

Maybe its broader more philosophical and sociological issue, something to do with the modern society we live in and the pace we live at

or maybe you are just a bit grumpy today

doozerie

A new "breed"? Must be the result of mixing the gene pools of motorists and cyclists - 'tis no wonder the resulting offspring are so odd, what with the genetic defects from this strange and unnatural inter-breeding. No good will come of it, we're doomed. Doomed! Etc.

el tel

Crippens1 wrote: »

Been cycling since the late 60s, racing since the late 70s and first car was a 1984 Alfa Romeo 33 - still have the badge and the wooden steering wheel !

The rest of it rusted away, did it?

kincsem

It's a broad church. :pac:

Colonialboy

leeroybrown wrote: »

I'm with seamus on this one. I couldn't care less why someone gets on a bicycle so long as they do. It sounds like you miss the days when cycling was an exclusive thing for people who got the 'purer' side of 'it'. Grow up.

fair enough Im out on a limb in this one... its not an element of cycling snobbery ... as I said in the OP

Im delighted to see so many people on the roads these days, its fantastic,

I dont mind why they get on the bike, its just the way they talk about it when they are off, its like im doing a different sport to them.
Its me I think,I dont have that ultra-competitive spirit, I remember watching a guy chase me in a triathlon a few years back, we were like running for 30th place or something, I kept looking back and he was looking at my huffing and puffing meanwhile I was jogging along, not pushing myself at all enjoying the last half a mile of the run, it was a beautiful sunny day. I let him pip me on the line, (really I did), I couldnt be arsed racing him and I wasnt going to let him spoil my nice run with an amazing views down into Kinsale and sun shining and he looks at me as he goes past ( I got yeah) and I was thinking , I wasnt even racing you. Why would you be bothered racing me, you dont even know me. You do realise that Im not playing your game, but I dont think he did. Maybe it is all about the winner, just being a winner to the people around whatever level your at.

Theres other elements to my thinking ... and Im not saying its ALL or NOTHING, or a black and white issue

I think the newbies are causing issues in the pelotons also ..there was a recent crash in an A4 race in Cork, 2 very experienced cyclists brought down meteres from the finish by an inexpereinced newbie going for 9th place in an A4 race, by pulling a manouver like the one that caught Cav in the Giro recently. These guys are out of work etc , bikes banjaxed long term injuries etc... maybe others have thought on the safety issues in races these days..

Ive no problem with the 'newer breed' wanting to race.. hell it just adds to the fun when rolling past them on the hoods when they are on the drops..:D

PurpleBee

you just don't like being beaten! stop pretending. as far as I know races aren't for admiring the scenery, it doesn't matter what the level is.

Jawgap

So are you saying it's not about the bike.......

lennymc

actually, the op brings up a valid point about newbie racers, and one i was surprised at. as a newbie A4 racer i was surprised that they just let anyone out there without some sort of guide/advice/induction day to fast group riding. Pay my money for the licence, and thats it, away I go. I raced motorbikes previously, and it was a lot harder to get a race licence for that than a cycle race, and IMHO the cycle racing takes more concentration and much more spatial awareness and is mentally more demanding than the motorbikes.

ThisRegard

Colonialboy wrote: »

and I was thinking , I wasnt even racing you. Why would you be bothered racing me, you dont even know me. You do realise that Im not playing your game, but I dont think he did. Maybe it is all about the winner, just being a winner to the people around whatever level your at.

But you were, by entering that 'race' you were racing against everyone else in the race, whether you liked it or not.

And nothing worse than getting pipped right on the finish line, I'd be sore too

Postit

Colonialboy wrote: »

I remember watching a guy chase me in a triathlon a few years back, we were like running for 30th place or something, I kept looking back and he was looking at my huffing and puffing meanwhile I was jogging along, not pushing myself at all enjoying the last half a mile of the run, it was a beautiful sunny day. I let him pip me on the line, (really I did), I couldnt be arsed racing him and I wasnt going to let him spoil my nice run with an amazing views down into Kinsale and sun shining and he looks at me as he goes past ( I got yeah) and I was thinking , I wasnt even racing you. Why would you be bothered racing me, you dont even know me. You do realise that Im not playing your game, but I dont think he did.

You were in a race, but you "couldn't be arsed racing" and yet you remain bitter about a guy beating you to the line......"a few years back".

Here's the Oxford dictionary definition of a race: a competition between runners, horses, vehicles, etc. to see which is the fastest in covering a set course.

Grow up!

niceonetom

Colonialboy wrote: »

Its me I think,I dont have that ultra-competitive spirit, I remember watching a guy chase me in a triathlon a few years back, we were like running for 30th place or something, I kept looking back and he was looking at my huffing and puffing meanwhile I was jogging along, not pushing myself at all enjoying the last half a mile of the run, it was a beautiful sunny day. I let him pip me on the line, (really I did), I couldnt be arsed racing him and I wasnt going to let him spoil my nice run with an amazing views down into Kinsale and sun shining and he looks at me as he goes past ( I got yeah) and I was thinking , I wasnt even racing you. Why would you be bothered racing me, you dont even know me. You do realise that Im not playing your game, but I dont think he did. Maybe it is all about the winner, just being a winner to the people around whatever level your at.

He was probably racing you because he was in a race. That is what a triathlon is, you do know that, right? Entering a race and then getting all pissy because, low and behold, other people are racing seems very odd. Congratulating yourself on 'not playing your game' seems totally bizarre - well done on not getting sucked into a race at this officially organised and sanctioned race that you deliberately entered, that would be beneath you. Or something. Apparently.

Colonialboy wrote: »

Ive no problem with the 'newer breed' wanting to race.. hell it just adds to the fun when rolling past them on the hoods when they are on the drops..:D

But I thought you weren't the competitive type?

Lusk Doyle

I have a gripe, well not really a gripe, well maybe it is a gripe. I'll post it anyway and see how many people think I'm cool!!!

Colonialboy

PurpleBee wrote: »

you just don't like being beaten! stop pretending. as far as I know races aren't for admiring the scenery, it doesn't matter what the level is.

"you just don't like being beaten " sounds very American in fact it reminds me of my time cycling in America actually .Maybe its just the Americanisation of our society.
Anyways I guess thats where we are different and will remain different.

heres an example
If you watched one of last years ITU events in London where one of the Brownlees brothers Alistair collapsed on the run , he had a serious exhaustion issue and stumbled and fell. shortly before this HIS OWN brother ran right past him ignoring the alarming distress and state he was in ... (cos " races aren't for admiring the scenery, it doesn't matter what the level is ")
now what if something even worse had happened to Alistair, collapsed and died, how would jonny feel if hed run past him then , just to win some poxy race , probably fine cos as you say (cos " races aren't for admiring the scenery, it doesn't matter what the level is ")
I think if he had stopped and helped his brother it would have been a very different signal he would have sent.
Id be dissapointed if one of my kids grows up and acts like that when they are competing.

I guess its across lots of sports and society in general now I guess, who cares if Ashley young dived for the penalty, Man U. wanted to win the league and its infected the next generation coming tru. Is sport even sport anymore or is it just a buisness, George Hook touches on this idea frequently in his raidio show discussing different sports.

Im just doing a vox pop really to see what the sentiment is out there on this issue, similar to during the Celtic Tiger I turned my back on all that crap and was vocal against it, but most people said I was some 'eco green kill joy' .
Part of me thinks if the boom was still on alot of this 'new breed' wouldnt be seen dead on a bike but would be embracing a new 7 series BMW on the way to the golf club with a new set of woods.

Your right, I shouldnt let 'their attitude bother' me... and its just good overall for cycling to see so many on the road. Thanks (arent forums great to just vent a bit) twas much cheaper than dropping 60 notes at the therapist.

niceonetom

Lusk Doyle wrote: »

I have a gripe, well not really a gripe, well maybe it is a gripe. I'll post it anyway and see how many people think I'm cool!!!

I like a gripe too. In fact I'm pretty sure I was griping WAY before you were griping. Before it was cool. I use 'random inverted commas' and everything. But I have very specific ways of enjoying my griping and I can tell immediately that you, Mr. Celtic Tiger blow-in gripist, are enjoying your griping in slightly different way to the way that I'm enjoying mine. YOU'RE ENJOYING IT WRONG!

mloc123

Colonialboy wrote: »

I dont mind why they get on the bike, its just the way they talk about it when they are off, its like im doing a different sport to them.
Its me I think,I dont have that ultra-competitive spirit, I remember watching a guy chase me in a triathlon a few years back, we were like running for 30th place or something, I kept looking back and he was looking at my huffing and puffing meanwhile I was jogging along, not pushing myself at all enjoying the last half a mile of the run, it was a beautiful sunny day. I let him pip me on the line, (really I did), I couldnt be arsed racing him and I wasnt going to let him spoil my nice run with an amazing views down into Kinsale and sun shining and he looks at me as he goes past ( I got yeah) and I was thinking , I wasnt even racing you. Why would you be bothered racing me, you dont even know me. You do realise that Im not playing your game, but I dont think he did. Maybe it is all about the winner, just being a winner to the people around whatever level your at.

So let me get this right... you pay to enter races that you don't bother racing? And you complain about other people spending their money in foolish ways. Odd.

Lumen

Aren't triathletes supposed to gripe about drafting, transition etiquette and the acceptability or otherwise of inter-gender foot touching during pool lane overtakes?

niceonetom

I think tri-athletes only dress like they're inter-gender.

smacl

@ColonialBoy, cycling caters far more for a much wider range of competitive, semi-competitive and non-competitive group and solo activities than most other sports. Look at the likes of sportives, audax, etc... Plenty of opportunity to take on significant personal challenges without having to compete against anyone other than yourself. If you want to race then race, if you just want to participate you still can.

ThisRegard

Nobody dropped dead or collapsed around you, and by you 'racing' they weren't going to either.

And stop going on about the celtic tiger, it just makes you sound like you have a massive chip on your shoulder.

Crippens1

el tel wrote: »

The rest of it rusted away, did it?

Yes :mad:, but love is (was) blind !

Colonialboy

smacl wrote: »

@ColonialBoy, cycling caters far more for a much wider range of competitive, semi-competitive and non-competitive group and solo activities than most other sports. Look at the likes of sportives, audax, etc... Plenty of opportunity to take on significant personal challenges without having to compete against anyone other than yourself. If you want to race then race, if you just want to participate you still can.

I think thats my point ....even in sportives etc (non race events) the level of ultra competitiveness is off the charts or has shifted considerably in my time. The particpation element doesnt seem to be in balance with the competition element.

I think my toe in the water mini survey has revealed something of what I thought was out there, judging by the heavy reaction its clear some people are even uber-competitive when it comes to posting some thoughts on a forum.
As Ive said before Ive the same admiration and respect for a tubby A4 completing a 50km as an Elite competing in the Ras, its all about personal achievement but some people have the wrong different to my own attitude , just my opinion.

btw im not a tri-athlete, ive done a few in my time but even that word and whole world 'tri-athlete' has taken on some disdain,dont ye think,maybe I dont want cycling to go the same route.

Lusk Doyle

Oh my God! Go and lock yourself in a room and throw away the key will you! Better yet, bring a number of keys and compete against yourself to see how far you can throw them. Oh wait, that's not right at all now, is it?

Chips Lovell

Colonialboy wrote: »

I think the newbies are causing issues in the pelotons also ..there was a recent crash in an A4 race in Cork, 2 very experienced cyclists brought down meteres from the finish by an inexpereinced newbie going for 9th place in an A4 race, by pulling a manouver like the one that caught Cav in the Giro recently. These guys are out of work etc , bikes banjaxed long term injuries etc... maybe others have thought on the safety issues in races these days..

Ive no problem with the 'newer breed' wanting to race.. hell it just adds to the fun when rolling past them on the hoods when they are on the drops..:D

Most of the time I see this happening it isn't the noobs causing the problems. Some of the most reckless riding I've seen in races is by fellas who've been racing for a decade or more, switching across people's wheels to move up and roaring dogs abuse at anyone who calls them out on it.

That's not to say there isn't bad riding amongst newer riders. Many of them are a bit nervous and way too fond of the brakes. But that's out of inexperience rather than pure selfishness.

Colonialboy

Vladimir Kurtains wrote: »

Most of the time I see this happening it isn't the noobs causing the problems. Some of the most reckless riding I've seen in races is by fellas who've been racing for a decade or more, switching across people's wheels to move up and roaring dogs abuse at anyone who calls them out on it.

That's not to say there isn't bad riding amongst newer riders. Many of them are a bit nervous and way too fond of the brakes. But that's out of inexperience rather than pure selfishness.

fair point, its often the old fellas who should know better setting the bad example,apologies to newbies offended by my OP, Ive seen alot of crap old fellas break the group up just to show some new cyclist they could once ride , and the newbie gets disillusioned cos they are lost along the road.
The sort of fellas who'd be better off marshalling or riding with the right group..your good at marshaling I hear lusk doyle

dingdong1234567

Colonialboy wrote: »

Im finding this new breed of cyclist and cycling, annoying me, they seem to be focusing on the wrong things. Anyone else any thoughts or maybe its just me.

I cycled long before and all thru the Celtic tiger, now all these dickheads in work who spent the Celtic tiger telling me they had a new Alfa Romeo or 3-series beamer, have discovered cycling and are telling the world , they have woken up to the joys of something thats relatively free (cycling, yet they still want to spend as much money as they can on it) and are telling me how they did this trip and their avg speed is this and HR was this and .. who gives a f*k... They dont seem to mention anything of interest regarding what they saw on the cycle or a new route or something of natural beauty they saw...

They still arent getting the point of cycling, they are applying the same Celtic tiger philosophy to their cycling. Spend as much money as I can and bore someone else with all the details.
And whats worse is they are giving 'genuine cyclists' a bad name cos they arent just boring cyclists with their rubbish they are boring non-cyclists also.

Im all for improving fitness and goals and wanting and enjoying ones improvements but Im not finding it balanced by the other 'purer' side of cycling. I accept the A1s and elites do need to look on the bike as more than just enjoyment, and good luck to them , I admire their dedication but I think alot of the new breed of cyclists are not getting 'it'

Maybe its broader more philosophical and sociological issue, something to do with the modern society we live in and the pace we live at, Im delighted to see so many people on the roads these days, its fantastic,
but get a grip people.

Yawn

dave_o_brien

This is fantastic! OP, perfect thread, this is a win-win for you! If people agree with your opinion, you're right. If they don't, they're the people you were talking about, and wouldn't get it because they don't understand the "purer" side of cycling.

Me? Opinions? I like bikes, and stuff. That is all.

Lusk Doyle

Colonialboy wrote: »

Some of the most reckless riding I've seen in races is by fellas who've been racing for a decade or more, switching across people's wheels to move up and roaring dogs abuse at anyone who calls them out on it.
The sort of fellas who'd be better off marshalling or riding with the right group..your good at marshaling I hear lusk doyle

Indeed I am! I don't roar abuse during races though and I'm in the right group! Group 3. I don't care about the result. I'm there to hammer it!!! Out of interest, were you any good at sports as a child/teenager?

Mycroft H

I like my bike. Other people like their bikes, I can live with that.

el tel

So you like tai chi cycling and your 'boring' 'dickhead' colleagues like ninjitsu cycling.

But no has a problem with this, except you.

So while the boring dickheads are sharing takes of wattage, HR and derring-do you can sit like billy no mates in your smug superiority.

I think you summed it up perfectly yourself: Who gives a f*k?

johnk123

I don't understand you're argument at all. I've been cycling for over a year now and I have also never realised there was a "point of cycling" I was supposed to get. They way I saw it, people spend their hard earned coins on shiny bikes and go off and enjoy them. Race, do a sportive, or just go at your own pace at the weekend, whatever you want.


I still can't see where you're coming from with the celtic tiger reference though. I don't understand it at all. Like what ThisRegard said, it just sounds like you have a chip on your shoulder. I don't see the big deal with people who want to spend money on their hobby. That's always going to be the case... Since I was a kid and went to my first training sessions for various sports, there was always the kids that were no use but had all the gear...

But what harm... I know a lot of guys in their 30's and 40's who know and admit full well that they'll never be faster than me on the bike but they still enjoy adding bits and pieces to the bike and upgrading when they can. Isn't that half the fun in cycling? At least trying to look like you know what you're doing!

CardinalJ

You don't like 'new' cyclists, because they're competitive...... you don't like triathlons, because people think they're triathletes...... So you don't like competition? Am I right?

I know what you mean about people going on and on about cycling, but its just people who are getting into something new. Same as a kid learning to ride....... a bike.

Jawgap

Pardon me if I get this wrong, but reading the OP's original post again it seems to suggest that cycling should be somewhat like surfing - done for the sake of it.

As Jay diMartino puts it......

"Surfing is Rider, Board, and Fluid

Real surfers don’t need a team or a game to test their mettle. In the real surfing world, there are simply rider, board, and a fluid, uneven, and predictably unpredictable playing field, an unfeeling surface ready to swallow you whole or spit you out in shreds onto the sand, or worse, lay dormant and leave you lost and dry among the landlocked masses who have no understanding of why you get up at dawn in the splitting cold for nothing more than mushy wind swell (Man! That was one insanely complex sentence). Heck, I doubt you even know why you surf. And that's what's so great about it."

Swap surfing for cycling and board for bike and you get the idea.......

That's fine with me and if that's your view of cycling, fair enough, but it doesn't mean anyone who does it differently is necessarily doing it wrong

Also I think if you are in a race, you should be there to compete or else it's just a fast training spin - and sometimes the competition is just with yourself....

Now, my green tea is going cold and I've still hours of meditation to do.....


ommmmmmmmmm!!!!!!:)

Beasty

I thought the OP was getting at me, then I realised I drive a Volvo ...;)

CardinalJ

"I liked the band before they were cool"

fixie fox

Colonialboy wrote: »

..there was a recent crash in an A4 race in Cork, 2 very experienced cyclists brought down meteres from the finish by an inexpereinced newbie going for 9th place in an A4 race,

What's wrong with sprinting for 9th in any race? Are u one of those anti Cat4 snobs, lacking respect?

Lusk Doyle

Jawgap wrote: »

Pardon me if I get this wrong, but reading the OP's original post again it seems to suggest that cycling should be somewhat like surfing - done for the sake of it.

As Jay diMartino puts it......

"Surfing is Rider, Board, and Fluid

Real surfers don’t need a team or a game to test their mettle. In the real surfing world, there are simply rider, board, and a fluid, uneven, and predictably unpredictable playing field, an unfeeling surface ready to swallow you whole or spit you out in shreds onto the sand, or worse, lay dormant and leave you lost and dry among the landlocked masses who have no understanding of why you get up at dawn in the splitting cold for nothing more than mushy wind swell (Man! That was one insanely complex sentence). Heck, I doubt you even know why you surf. And that's what's so great about it."

Swap surfing for cycling and board for bike and you get the idea.......

That's fine with me and if that's your view of cycling, fair enough, but it doesn't mean anyone who does it differently is necessarily doing it wrong

Also I think if you are in a race, you should be there to compete or else it's just a fast training spin - and sometimes the competition is just with yourself....

Now, my green tea is going cold and I've still hours of meditation to do.....


ommmmmmmmmm!!!!!!:)

Yes, but where do the great whites enter into the cycling fray?

Jawgap

Lusk Doyle wrote: »

Yes, but where do the great whites enter into the cycling fray?

Dumper trucks, coaches and taxis are the cycling equivalents of sharks

ck101

I am back on the bike after many years off, mainly due to the partying of the Celtic Tiger years, getting married and raising children.

It's good to be able to purchase quality equipment that I couldn't as a schoolboy, take time out and get fit at the same time. If I can find someone to talk to about my current interest in cycling, training or equipment great.

One of the benefits of capitalism is that you can spend your money on whatever you want. I am offending any purists by my actions sorry, do I tell you how to spend your money?

Roger Hassenforder

Colonialboy wrote: »

Im finding this new breed of cyclist and cycling, annoying me,.....bla bla

you internet arrivistes banging on about Freds makes me sick , I remember well when us real men were getting the ARPANET going....