Why no Irish craft Beers in CANS?

upforit101

Imo there is a market for putting some Irish craft beers (specifically Lager) into cans.

I would love it if you could get Franciscan well brewery "Rebel Lager" or Porterhouse "Temple Brau" in cans.

And I don't buy the arguement that it's not feasible/can't be done.

This American brewery is doing it.
http://www.mauibrewingco.com/mbc/MBCHome.html

It would great for the summer & music festival season.

Technocentral

Not a lager fan but I'd love to bring some good Irish ales in cans to the Electric Picnic this year, don't think there is the market for it in Ireland though, Britain and the States yes but not here.

rcaz

It's only catching on with craft breweries relatively recently, right? I know in the US there are Oskar Blues and Sly Fox, and recently Sierra Nevada started canning.

Canning beers is a lot more expensive than bottling them, I guess a lot of breweries can't afford the machines they'd need to can their beers? And also, a lot of people see canned beers as inferior to bottled beers, just based on the vessel. I bet a lot of brewers are reluctant to move to cans for that reason.

The pros far outweigh the cons for canning though. Just money and people's perceptions are the obstacles I guess. Check out this infographic.

Technocentral

I got cans of Fullers ESB, London Pride and Abbot Ale in Devaneys of Dundrum last year for the Picnic, the older guy who owns the place said that there was virtually 0% (apart from me!) interest in cans that weren't the usual pish (Bud, Carlserg, Heineken) so they probably wouldn't be getting them anymore.

Martyn1989

Just in support of rcaz's point the canning lines are apperently quite a bit more expensive then bottling. I also heard the general design on the can is very expensive to produce and can be quite difficult.

And of course theres alot of Irish people who don't like canned beer or see it as inferior and the craft breweries angle is superiour quality.

Gandhi

This discussion came up before here:

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=67747335

Article here on microbreweries using canning:

http://www.chow.com/food-news/54741/canned-beer-thats-actually-good/

Apparently some Canadian company came up with a new canning technique back in 2001 that has made it cost-effective for smaller breweries to switch from bottling to canning.

irish_goat

Surely it'd be possible for an Irish craft brewer to use another companies canning facilities e.g. Coca Cola's?

Although, I would wonder if there would be a sufficient enough market for it.

BaZmO*

I'd agree that it's generally the quality perception that's biggest obstacle. However, personally I'd love to see more craft breweries do it.

And I'd especially like to try this one.....



I'm actually drinking a can of Fullers London Porter as I type, and quality certainly isn't an issue, and the same goes for the London Pride.

I also tried Brewdogs Punk IPA in a can recently and thought it was top notch. Not sure if supermarkets would be too keen on the livery though.

n97 mini

Irish micros have more basic problems. Like getting Irish barley malt. Most of them are exclusively using English malt.

oblivious

n97 mini wrote: »

Irish micros have more basic problems. Like getting Irish barley malt. Most of them are exclusively using English malt.

Also Irish maltsters dont provide any specialty malt like crystal, chocolate or other base malts other than a pale/stout and lager.

yoyo

Cans ftw, can't stand bottles :pac:

Nick

Berty

With the cost of production as many send their bottles to the UK to be bottled I imagine the cost of having two production lines on the go might be too much to bear.

BaZmO*

Beer Baron wrote: »

With the cost of production as many send their bottles to the UK to be bottled I imagine the cost of having two production lines on the go might be too much to bear.

Many? Really? Who exactly sends their bottles [sic] to the UK to be bottled?

Martyn1989

BaZmO* wrote: »

Many? Really? Who exactly sends their bottles [sic] to the UK to be bottled?

The Carlow Brewing Co where, dunno if they still are. I'm sure someone around here will know. I think a couple have bottling facilities now

BeerNut

BaZmO* wrote: »

Who exactly sends their bottles [sic] to the UK to be bottled?

Carlow, Hooker and Trouble. Possibly Hilden too.

Seaneh

Has the idea of a "co-op" been floated between the breweries?

They could pool resources and increse their buying power for hops, malts, bottles etc, share a bottling line maybe?

Surely this would benefit all involved?

BaZmO*

BeerNut wrote: »

Carlow, Hooker and Trouble. Possibly Hilden too.

Wow! If that's true I'm flabbergasted. Just seems a bit crazy, and a lot of work.

BeerNut

BaZmO* wrote: »

a lot of work.

I'm going to guess you've never had to maintain a bottling line

thelynchfella

BeerNut wrote: »

I'm going to guess you've never had to maintain a bottling line

Is it that difficult? I did a tour of the Steam Whistle Brewery last year in Toronto, they looked like they'd a pretty simple bottling line. wouldn't have thought maintainance on it would have been that big a deal.

BeerNut

It's massive -- so many things can go wrong. And if your business depends on it it can be extremely stressful when it's not working right. When it does, though, of course brewers will show them off.

But I would say it's a hell of a lot easier to fill a tank with beer and a few weeks later get back palette-loads of perfectly carbonated, correctly filled, oxygen-free, infection-free, capped, labelled, clean, shelf-ready bottles.

Herb Powell

IME, it seems to be mandatory to add 20 mls of piss to each can-canned beer just never tastes as good to me.

rubadub

Herb Powell wrote: »

IME, it seems to be mandatory to add 20 mls of piss to each can-canned beer just never tastes as good to me.

Have you ever done blind tasting on the same beer? Some poster did in another thread and he and his mates were surprised as they could not really tell the difference -and I think most of them went in with an anti-can bias.

(They poured the cans & bottles into glasses obviously)

pawrick

I'd definitely prefer to buy in a can if going to a friend house etc. just for convenience sake as cans are a lot easier to carry then loose bottles - I havent seen Irish brands in the bottle packs you see miller etc. in yet. I do prefer the look of the bottles though.

Seaneh

On the subjest of bottles vs cans.
I much prefer cars.
They are lighter, easier to store and cannot be effected by uv light.

Having blind tested a load of fullers beers from can and bottle it was impossible to tell which was which.

pawrick wrote: »

] I havent seen Irish brands in the bottle packs you see miller etc. in yet.

8 Degree's do little 6 packs of bottles, with the cardboard carrier thing.
Tis handy.

pawrick

thanks - never tasted that one, I'll look out for it.

Seaneh

pawrick wrote: »

thanks - never tasted that one, I'll look out for it.

I like their Howling Gale Ale and Their Red a lot.
Their Porter is good too.

Haven't tried their Pislner but probably won't bother.
I despise lagers...

Van Occupanther

Seaneh wrote: »

Having blind tested a load of fullers beers from can and bottle it was impossible to tell which was which.
.

Bought a few cans of London Pride last night, tasted the same to me although I'll be doing a blind test over the weekend to check. Only €1.89 a can too.

Technocentral

Van Occupanther wrote: »

Bought a few cans of London Pride last night, tasted the same to me although I'll be doing a blind test over the weekend to check. Only €1.89 a can too.

Where did you buy those Pride cans mate?

BaZmO*

Technocentral wrote: »

Where did you buy those Pride cans mate?

Dirnkstore have them, but they're slightly dearer at €1.99 each

Technocentral

BaZmO* wrote: »

Dirnkstore have them, but they're slightly dearer at €1.99 each

Cheers was wondering if anywhere Dublin south side had them too.

the beer revolu

Anyone know if you can you 'can condition' beer - ie. have a secondary fermentation in the can?
If so, I wonder would CAMRA be accepting of it?

BeerNut

the beer revolu wrote: »

would CAMRA be accepting of it?

Of course. Why wouldn't they?

CAMRA wrote:

beer brewed from traditional ingredients, matured by secondary fermentation in the container from which it is dispensed, and served without the use of extraneous carbon dioxide.

Type of container is not prescribed.

rubadub

Video of the canned SN here
http://www.beerpulse.com/2012/01/sierra-nevada-pale-ale-12-packs-go-into-production-video/

Van Occupanther

Technocentral wrote: »

Where did you buy those Pride cans mate?

Got them in O'Briens in limerick.

They also had Old Speckled Hen in cans and seem to have both of them regularly.

oblivious

BeerNut wrote: »

Of course. Why wouldn't they?
Type of container is not prescribed.

yep they got CAMRA by they short and curlies if they want its conditioned inn the serving vessel