I think it's important to be seen

midlandsmissus

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2122091/Oksana-Makar-dead-Ukranian-teen-posted-video-describing-gang-rape-dies-injuries.html

A video a girl made in hospital after being gang raped and set on fire. She died today.

Why oh why is the world the way it is at the minute?

Immaculate Pasta

midlandsmissus wrote: »

Why oh why is the world the way it is at the minute?

No it's not. Just stop reading the Daily Mail.

AngryBollix

I get the feeling joe duffy will be discussing this on liveline tomorrow

Temptamperu

Thats just horrible

RIP.

AngryBollix

Immaculate Pasta wrote: »

No it's not. Just stop reading the Daily Mail.

Didnt they also have a story recently about a pakistani girl who was attacked with acid.

benway

midlandsmissus wrote: »

Why oh why is the world the way it is at the minute?

Ah here.

Do you have to go to the Ukraine to drag up some misery now?

The world has 6 billion people, some of them do awful things, but the vast majority are decent, just trying to get through their day and take care of their loved ones.

If you focus disproportionately on the negative, you're bound to see the world that way.

Not taking away from the horror of the crime, but I don't buy the whole "the world's going to hell in a hand-cart" line in the slightest.

A0

midlandsmissus wrote: »

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2122091/Oksana-Makar-dead-Ukranian-teen-posted-video-describing-gang-rape-dies-injuries.html

A video a girl made in hospital after being gang raped and set on fire. She died today.

Why oh why is the world the way it is at the minute?

Simple... Winnie the pooh world. Sentences, punishments never match with the faults - crimes committed, etc.

AngryBollix

Unfortunate typo in thread title. (Although neither word had been spelt correctly)

amacachi

Batsy mustn't be online, thought he'd be on saying the perpetrators must me black by now.

AlmightyCushion

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2012/03/18/article-2116538-1238056E000005DC-426_634x459.jpg

I don't know what is better, the tits or the irony of the "Death for Sadists" sign. Actually, it's the tits.

Immaculate Pasta

AngryBollix wrote: »

Didnt they also have a story recently about a pakistani girl who was attacked with acid.

That's the way the Daily Mail work. They publish a shock story to get people talking about it.

The story is a tragedy yes there's no denying that. Newspapers have some obligation to publish a story when something bad has happened. But this racist newspaper feeds on bad news and loves it. It sensationalises everything. I think if I read the Daily Mail everyday of the week, I'd be grabbing the noose by Thursday. If it's not the child rapists, it's the immigrants or scumbags.

Whatever the Daily Mail wants to make you think, the world isn't a bad place really and the 99.9% of people aren't bad people, they're just people trying to live their lives :cool:

benway

A0 wrote: »

Sentences, punishments never match with the faults - crimes committed, etc.

Taking it you have intimate knowledge of sentencing policy in the Ukraine, then? Or is that just a pat response to any given crime story?

shedweller

The world really is gone to hell. I think there should be a mandatory death penalty for that kind of thing.

Pace2008

AngryBollix wrote: »

Didnt they also have a story recently about a pakistani girl who was attacked with acid.

Probably. If something particularly nasty has happened they'll be sure to report on it with ghastly relish, and make it seem as if there's every chance of it happening to you or someone you know on a brief stroll to the shops.

midlandsmissus

AlmightyCushion wrote: »

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2012/03/18/article-2116538-1238056E000005DC-426_634x459.jpg

I don't know what is better, the tits or the irony of the "Death for Sadists" sign. Actually, it's the tits.

Cold, AlmightyCushion, cold.

Shryke

AlmightyCushion wrote: »

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2012/03/18/article-2116538-1238056E000005DC-426_634x459.jpg

I don't know what is better, the tits or the irony of the "Death for Sadists" sign. Actually, it's the tits.

I just see tits.

Dudess

midlandsmissus wrote: »

Why oh why is the world the way it is at the minute?

The world used to be a lot worse.

A0 wrote: »

Simple... Winnie the pooh world. Sentences, punishments never match with the faults - crimes committed, etc.

It isn't that simple, no.

AngryBollix

Shryke wrote: »

I just see tits.

Not seeing tits is the real issue

RichieC

Fk me that's bad... RIP.

mikemac1

Daily Mail, terrible newspaper but an incredible website

It's one the best and most popular websites around

The readers are not dumb, if you look in the comment section they are always ripping apart the writers for mistakes. And there sure are a lot of mistakes
The biggest Daily Mail critics are the people who read it every day, not the ones who never read it and just dismiss it

Take a break from it OP, if you keep reading that site you'll turn to the dark side and see the bad in every situation

A0

benway wrote: »

Taking it you have intimate knowledge of sentencing policy in the Ukraine, then? Or is that just a pat response to any given crime story?

Unless you are blind / naive / little travelled, it's known worldwide that sentences hardly match with what victims experience. There's always a lawyer to "help" criminals.

midlandsmissus

Pace2008 wrote: »

Probably. If something particularly nasty has happened they'll be sure to report on it with ghastly relish, and make it seem as if there's every chance of it happening to you or someone you know on a brief stroll to the shops.

I do agree that the dailymail oversensationalise everything and love imparting doom and gloom on the nation, but this is not just a tragic case, it's a politically interesting case pf corruption.
The three men identified by Oksana were released without charge. The Ukranian media have reported that one of the men named's parents have high political connections.

Coriolanus

If we hadn't read about it would have zero effect on us. There's enough things that need worrying about, things that effect us in real concrerte ways, without digging up every misery story the world over.

Crann na Beatha

This post has been deleted.

Celly Smunt

AlmightyCushion wrote: »

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2012/03/18/article-2116538-1238056E000005DC-426_634x459.jpg

I don't know what is better, the tits or the irony of the "Death for Sadists" sign. Actually, it's the tits.

do you have those new de-pixelating glasses?

AlmightyCushion

pmcmahon wrote: »

do you have those new de-pixelating glasses?

No but my eyesight is pretty bad. If I take off my glasses I can see them perfectly.

44leto

midlandsmissus wrote: »

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2122091/Oksana-Makar-dead-Ukranian-teen-posted-video-describing-gang-rape-dies-injuries.html

A video a girl made in hospital after being gang raped and set on fire. She died today.

Why oh why is the world the way it is at the minute?

The world is actually getting better, Judicial torture, cruel and unusual punishments, murder rates, violent crime rates, rapes even wars are down in rates. Look at the rights revolution, civil rights, women's rights. gay rights children's rights and even animal rights.

I know it appears we are regressing because crimes like the above are in every newspaper, on the internet and beamed into our living rooms. But if you analyse the raw worldwide data in total we are actually progressing and have been since the enlightenment.

Pace2008

mikemac1 wrote: »

Daily Mail, terrible newspaper but an incredible website

It's one the best and most popular websites around

The readers are not dumb, if you look in the comment section they are always ripping apart the writers for mistakes. And there sure are a lot of mistakes
The biggest Daily Mail critics are the people who read it every day, not the ones who never read it and just dismiss it

Take a break from it OP, if you keep reading that site you'll turn to the dark side and see the bad in every situation

I don't see what's so incredible about it. It's like the paper - same bigoted hate pieces, same vapid celeb dross, same appalling misrepresentation of science and medicine - but with more articles. In fact, the only argument I've seen put forward justifying the supposed magnificence of the website is that it that there's a lot of stuff on it. Which is a bit like being impressed by a book because it has a lot of pages in it.

As for the people taking the articles apart, I'd imagine a good chunk of these are people who've been linked to the site, say from a forum such as boards, rather than the Mail's loyal headship.

AngryBollix

Aquila wrote: »

Покойтесь с миром

I agree

benway

A0 wrote: »

Unless you are blind / naive / little travelled, it's known worldwide that sentences hardly match with what victims experience. There's always a lawyer to "help" criminals.

So, you basically have no idea what you're talking about, right?

Prison population

In early 2010, there were over 147,000 people held at prisons and more than 38,000 at pre-trial detention facilities in Ukraine, which is three times as many as in Western European countries[5], and half as much as in the United States. In 2009, the number of inmates in Ukraine rose for the first time in seven years, there was also an increasing number of instances of suicide and HIV contraction at penitentiary institutions. 761 died and 44 inmates killed themselves in 2009, the number of suicides in 2008 was 40.[5] Between 1996 and 2001, about 26 percent in various prisons across Ukraine tested HIV-positive. In a January 2006 study, between 15 and 30 percent of prisoners tested HIV-positive.[6] Early 2005 rates of up to 95 percent of the prisoners were found Hepatitis C positive.[6] in 2011 6,000 inmates had HIV and 5,500 suffered from an active form of tuberculosis.[7]
Various inmates have been kept in pre-trial detention for up to 12 years, as there is no legal limit.[7]

[edit]Conditions

Convicts in Ukrainian prisons work 7 or 8 hours a day, except for weekends.[8] Prisoners get to keep part of the money raised from the sale of the items they produce.[8] They are limited to four pairs of shoes.[8] Computers, cell phones and other electronic gadgets are strictly forbidden in jail.[8] Bathing may be limited to once a week.[8]
According to the US Department of State Human Rights Report 2009 conditions in prisons and detention facilities in Ukraine are harsh and the pretrial detention was seen as arbitrary and lengthy.[9] According to Amnesty International allegations of torture and ill treatment in police custody increased in 2010.[3]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prisons_in_Ukraine

midlandsmissus wrote:

The Ukranian media have reported that one of the men named's parents have high political connections.

This is a fair point, and if raising awareness internationally helps to force the authorities to deal with the perpetrators then it'll be worthwhile.

But let's be clear, if we were to list every awful thing that was done today and post it here, we'd think the world was fcked. If we were to list every kind loving thing that was done today, we'd have a much, much longer list, and we'd think it was all sunshine and lollipops. Neither accurately reflect the reality, but there's much more good than there is evil. Perspective is a wonderful thing.

A0

benway wrote: »

So, you basically have no idea what you're talking about, right?

Well done 600 posts!
Come on, don't be annoyed.

Being jailed doesn't always mean appropriate sentence. Thanks for the link, it confirms what I thought (although I have to say their prisons seem to be much better than other countries' prisons). But it's still not matching with what the victims experience.

SteppingStone

Bring back the electric chair! Prison sentences are too short for the likes of these scumbags! They get out in a few years and are able to commit the same crimes again. Makes me sick!:mad: May this poor girl RIP.

midlandsmissus

SteppingStone wrote: »

Bring back the electric chair! Prison sentences are too short for the likes of these scumbags! They get out in a few years and are able to commit the same crimes again. Makes me sick!:mad: May this poor girl RIP.

They didn't even get charged, due to government corruption and connections. Apparantly there is big discussion going on in the Ukraine over it. One reason why they did it? They knew they could get away with it. Hopefully this changes things in the Ukraine, it has got alot of people talking.

Kiera

AlmightyCushion wrote: »

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2012/03/18/article-2116538-1238056E000005DC-426_634x459.jpg

I don't know what is better, the tits or the irony of the "Death for Sadists" sign. Actually, it's the tits.

They always have brown boobs. I want brown boobs

kfallon

Kiera wrote: »

They always have brown boobs. I want brown boobs

Get out your bovril so

SteppingStone

midlandsmissus wrote: »

They didn't even get charged, due to government corruption and connections. Apparantly there is big discussion going on in the Ukraine over it. One reason why they did it? They knew they could get away with it. Hopefully this changes things in the Ukraine, it has got alot of people talking.

Jeez! :eek:That's insane. Hopefully it does change things.

My name is URL

The girl was clearly in agony and her mother essentially forced her into taking part in that video. She basically even said she didn't want to. =(

Monty Burnz

benway wrote: »

Not taking away from the horror of the crime, but I don't buy the whole "the world's going to hell in a hand-cart" line in the slightest.

Indeed. Probably 10 years ago we'd never have heard of this crime, and 30 years ago nobody in the Ukraine other than the girl's family would have heard of it. What were the odds of the murderers being brought to justice back then?

44leto

My name is URL wrote: »

The girl was clearly in agony and her mother essentially forced her into taking part in that video. She basically even said she didn't want to. =(

I know it was uncomfortable to watch and the mother did push her. BUT judging by the reaction in the Ukraine and the circumstances of the accused been released, the video was the best thing the mother could do to get justice in that country. That will allow some closure for the victims family, so I believe the mother was right to push it.

I remember reading about domestic violence/violence against women in the former soviet union. The figures are huge and there are very few convictions. IMO that's in part is down to the macho culture of those places, of course that is not the whole explanation. But the more visible these crimes are the better chance the epidemic of violence against women there will be addressed.

Mr Benevolent

AlmightyCushion wrote: »

I don't know what is better, the tits or the irony of the "Death for Sadists" sign. Actually, it's the tits.

You really like pixilated tits?

the keen edge

Terribly sad story, but the usual sensationalism by fcuking daily mail.

Sub headline:Medics had amputated one of her arms and both her legs to keep her alive.

Three sentences into the story: Her harrowing hospital video, filmed by her mother, emerged after medics had been forced to amputate one of her arms and both her feet in a battle to keep her alive.

Not that getting two feet amputated is acceptable, but you get the craic.

Radharc na Sleibhte

Jesus they are the best looking feminists i ever seen.

Those responsible should be jailed.
Death penalty is too easy.
Life.
As in, from now, til the day you die.

44leto

Radharc na Sleibhte wrote: »

Jesus they are the best looking feminists i ever seen.

Those responsible should be jailed.
Death penalty is too easy.
Life.
As in, from now, til the day you die.

What makes you think they are feminists, to me they are women who are sick of the status quo in that country. If I lived there I would be out protesting to and I am a guy.

midlandsmissus

44leto wrote: »

What makes you think they are feminists, to me they are women who are sick of the status quo in that country. If I lived there I would be out protesting to and I am a guy.

Well said. Extreme Sexism in society benefits no-one, the women are tortured, and the men lose their human side.

As they say: abuse harms the abused and the abuser, as the abuser is not learning right from wrong.

midlandsmissus

Great they've been re-arrested!

Link here.http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-17546743

Notice two of their parents were former government officials and that it sparked a national outcry. Thank God, there is hope for humanity yet.

44leto

midlandsmissus wrote: »

Well said. Extreme Sexism in society benefits no-one, the women are tortured, and the men lose their human side.

As they say: abuse harms the abused and the abuser, as the abuser is not learning right from wrong.

And that's it, a zero tolerance to any type of violence towards any section of our communities and in general that makes it a safer and better place to live for all.

But morally this crime is hateful and disgusting and the perps nearly walked, what does that say about the attitudes to women in that part of the world.

44leto

midlandsmissus wrote: »

Great they've been re-arrested!

Link here.http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-17546743

Notice two of their parents were former government officials and that it sparked a national outcry. Thank God, there is hope for humanity yet.

Some good news at least now lets hope their punishment fits the crime.

El Siglo

Jaysus that's bad, fucking animals. Well hopefully they don't bribe their way out of their sentences and get as equal treatment as any other criminal in a Ukrainian prison.

tommyboy2222

Great to see the boards.ie jury have convicted these men already.

As they usually do.

midlandsmissus

tommyboy2222 wrote: »

Great to see the boards.ie jury have convicted these men already.

As they usually do.

She identified them. There is a video circulating in the Ukraine media of one of the men admitting it to police. He was still released.

44leto

tommyboy2222 wrote: »

Great to see the boards.ie jury have convicted these men already.

As they usually do.

If they are innocent, great, but at least the crime will get a full investigation now, instead of compiling it as another statistic of violence against women which is what usually happens in the former soviet union and other parts of the world. Central America been another one and of course Africa.