Crow Decoying/calling

Mezamo

Lads,
Just want to get a definiative answer on this if anyone knows if decoying or/and calling crows is illegal. The birds are causing damage to a spring barley crop and need to be controlled. Any help would be appreciated!

Spunk84

Mezamo wrote: »

Lads,
Just want to get a definiative answer on this if anyone knows if decoying or/and calling crows is illegal. The birds are causing damage to a spring barley crop and need to be controlled. Any help would be appreciated!

From what I told decoys are illegal now !

4200fps

I'm sure if you shoot them and place them in a decoy cradle that be legal. There's no Garda going to be walking into a field saying ''hey is that a decoy crow''? Unless he knows the law inside and out and has eyes greater than a hawk to tell its not a real crow standing in the meadow. I don't know if decoy crows is illegal but who in gods name is going to checking it out seriously not being smart or giving out i'm just saying. Around this neck of the country no heed be passed and thats for sure as your protecting your crop. Blow every crow you see is what i say and decoy away and if your unsure use a decoy cradle which is legal i'm sure

J.R.

Using crow decoys is illegal - can only use duck, goose & pigeon decoys.

Using a crow call is okay as long as it's not an electronic call......can use a call you blow into to.......anything battery operated is illegal.


I know it sounds crazy....at this time of year pigeons are doing the same damage as crows......can use pigeon decoys but can't use crow decoys....doesn't make sense!

Also pigeons are classed as a game species from 1st Nov. - 31st Jan. and you can use pigeon decoys even though no decoys are allowed for game species........makes you wonder who writes these laws?????..............saying that I wouldn't recommend or advise anybody to break the law.

For decoys, if you want to stay within the law....then you will have to shoot a few crow and use these as decoys......nothing wrong with that.......only artifical decoys are illegal.

Birdnuts

J.R. wrote: »

For decoys, if you want to stay within the law....then you will have to shoot a few crow and use these as decoys......nothing wrong with that.......only artifical decoys are illegal.

Whats the storey with stuffed crows?? - I remember reading about a lad somewhere in the UK who used them to great affect. Its a stupid law allright that says you can decoy game species but not certain vermin ones:rolleyes:

PS: Some of the darker pigeon decoys look like crows anyways;)

Farmlife

how about if you used a very dark black coloured pigeon? surely those wildlife rangers aren't racist? plus if you were to shoot a crow who's to say what position it hit's the ground, so that's not really decoying

Birdnuts

rgugliel wrote: »

how about if you used a very dark black coloured pigeon? surely those wildlife rangers aren't racist? plus if you were to shoot a crow who's to say what position it hit's the ground, so that's not really decoying

Many of those feral pigeons are very dark allright:D;)

4200fps

This is all you need and using a real bird is always better than a plastic decoy. This should take you at the least 5mins to make. I use Tig-welding rods

http://youtu.be/nupDmSf6R8g

Mezamo

Thanks for the clarification lads... I had a feeling this was the case... I agree with 4200 though, not many people will be around to see if I'm using either :-) ill be leaving the decoys behind..

dodderangler

A good way of gettin loads of crows especially even with a rifle and works on magpies aswell what u can do is get urself a real crow dead and a fake hawk like what they use on factory's for pigeon
Place the hawk on ground and the dead crow at its feet and trust me every crow or magpie within 3 km will be down flying around trying to scare off the fake hawk and u can take them in the trees with rifle or bring shotgun and take them as they swoop down seen video on YouTube years ago bout it and works

ssl

Has anyone got the legislation making decoying and electronic calling illegal

The hawke sounds a good idea. Picking them off on the ground would be good craic. Might have a look for decoy.
I wouldn't be on for shooting them in the trees with a rifle, unless it was an air rifle or a .22 with bird shot

4200fps

dodderangler wrote: »

A good way of gettin loads of crows especially even with a rifle and works on magpies aswell what u can do is get urself a real crow dead and a fake hawk like what they use on factory's for pigeon
Place the hawk on ground and the dead crow at its feet and trust me every crow or magpie within 3 km will be down flying around trying to scare off the fake hawk and u can take them in the trees with rifle or bring shotgun and take them as they swoop down seen video on YouTube years ago bout it and works

I want to try that one. Good information dodderangler . Makes sence too!

J.R.

dodderangler wrote: »

A good way of gettin loads of crows especially even with a rifle and works on magpies aswell what u can do is get urself a real crow dead and a fake hawk like what they use on factory's for pigeon
Place the hawk on ground and the dead crow at its feet and trust me every crow or magpie within 3 km will be down flying around trying to scare off the fake hawk and u can take them in the trees with rifle or bring shotgun and take them as they swoop down seen video on YouTube years ago bout it and works

Unfortunately, I'd imagine that the hawk / owl would also be classed as a decoy.......not allowed under legislation

J.R.

ssl wrote: »

Has anyone got the legislation making decoying and electronic calling illegal

Wildlife Act Ammendment 2000

TABLE
(1) Notwithstanding anything contained in this Act apart from this section, but subject to section 42, a person shall not—
(c) use a stuffed or artificial decoy in the form of any bird for the purpose of hunting any protected wild birds, other than wood pigeons, wild duck and wild geese, or
(3) Notwithstanding the foregoing provisions of this section, the Minister may by order prohibit throughout the State or in any particular area thereof—
(b) the use of any orally or manually operated whistle or other instrument or appliance (not being recording apparatus) which imitates, or emits calls similar to, the calls of plover, wild duck or wild geese or emits recorded such calls.

pugw

J.R. wrote: »

for the purpose of hunting any protected wild birds

Are crowes protected wild birds? Would they not be classed as vermin??

Birdnuts

pugw wrote: »

Are crowes protected wild birds? Would they not be classed as vermin??

You have a point - the derogations allow certain crow species(Rook, Hoodie, Jackdaw) to be trapped and shot. I guess its one of those grey areas

J.R.

pugw wrote: »

Are crowes protected wild birds? Would they not be classed as vermin??

All birds are now classed as protected species.


There is no such term as 'vermin' in the Wildlife Acts

Some species have an open season where they can be shot with shotgun only.....game species..pheasant, duck, woodcock, snipe etc.

Some species are protected but can be shot during the year if causing damage / likely to cause damage...these are rooks, jackdaws, greycrows, magpies, pigeons, feral pigeons and collard doves.


I don't agree with above but it's the law.

I personally think that shooters should be allowed to shoot rooks, jackdaws, greycrows, magpies, pigeons & feral pigeons the whole year round....just my opinion!

jarv

http://www.npws.ie/media/npws/publications/legaldocs/Declaration%20for%20Leinster%20Sept%202011.pdf

Method of control- "Shooting with rifle or shotgun ; cage trap (including use of decoys)"

So this is from the NPWS site and say you can decoy?

4200fps

J.R. wrote: »

Wildlife Act Ammendment 2000

TABLE
(1) Notwithstanding anything contained in this Act apart from this section, but subject to section 42, a person shall not—
(c) use a stuffed or artificial decoy in the form of any bird for the purpose of hunting any protected wild birds, other than wood pigeons, wild duck and wild geese, or
(3) Notwithstanding the foregoing provisions of this section, the Minister may by order prohibit throughout the State or in any particular area thereof—
(b) the use of any orally or manually operated whistle or other instrument or appliance (not being recording apparatus) which imitates, or emits calls similar to, the calls of plover, wild duck or wild geese or emits recorded such calls.

I seen a decoy owl in Ardee sports Thursday last. So you can't use a decoy owl/hawk to hunt vermin? The owl/hawk would only be used to hunt vermin not protected species so would that not be legal? I'm confused now

Birdnuts

jarv wrote: »

http://www.npws.ie/media/npws/publications/legaldocs/Declaration%20for%20Leinster%20Sept%202011.pdf

Method of control- "Shooting with rifle or shotgun ; cage trap (including use of decoys)"

So this is from the NPWS site and say you can decoy?

That would be my reading of the situation - there's been a number of threads on this subject over the years but as I said earlier, decoys for Crows are one of those Grey areas. In any case, given that the derogations are clear that both trapping and shooting of these Crow species is legal at any time of the year, I cannot see anything illegal about shooting crows that are attracted to a decoy thats placed in(or on) a simple cage trap for example.

Vegeta

Another one of those areas where the judge may read the legislation and go for or against you on the day.

J.R.

jarv wrote: »

http://www.npws.ie/media/npws/publications/legaldocs/Declaration%20for%20Leinster%20Sept%202011.pdf

Method of control- "Shooting with rifle or shotgun ; cage trap (including use of decoys)"

So this is from the NPWS site and say you can decoy?

What it means, as far as I know, is you can use a live decoy in Larsen Traps but not a stuffed or artifical decoy...................doesn't really make sense , does it?

J.R.

4200fps wrote: »

I seen a decoy owl in Ardee sports Thursday last. So you can't use a decoy owl/hawk to hunt vermin? The owl/hawk would only be used to hunt vermin not protected species so would that not be legal? I'm confused now

problem is that now crows and magpies are classed as protected species (no such thing as vermin in Wildlife Acts)

Birdnuts

J.R. wrote: »

problem is that now crows and magpies are classed as protected species (no such thing as vermin in Wildlife Acts)

You'd want to be an over paid lawyer in the Four Gold Mines to get to the bottom of this crow decoy issue allright:rolleyes: - the NPWS/Minister of State could make things easier up for the ordinary Joe Soap on this issue by highlighting:

1) the fact that the derogations which allow the shooting and trapping of crows under the updated Wildlife Act are the final word on the matter

2)by clearly stating how these derogations relate to the use of all types of Crow decoys in all circumstances.

4200fps

J.R. wrote: »

problem is that now crows and magpies are classed as protected species (no such thing as vermin in Wildlife Acts)

Any mag or crow that flies within 50 yards of my side by side isn't protected at all

Vegeta

At this point I'm just going to remind people of rule number 5 in the charter

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=66892670&postcount=5

Several government bodies read the site (DoJ read shooting section frequently) so admitting questionable behavior here is an odd posting style.

I know of 3 people contacted by the Gardai because of postings on boards. That figure will only rise.

Invincible

4200fps wrote: »

J.R. wrote: »

problem is that now crows and magpies are classed as protected species (no such thing as vermin in Wildlife Acts)

Any mag or crow that flies within 50 yards of my side by side isn't protected at all

Have yet to see you shooting one !

Spunk84

Vegeta wrote: »

At this point I'm just going to remind people of rule number 5 in the charter

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=66892670&postcount=5

Several government bodies read the site (DoJ read shooting section frequently) so admitting questionable behavior here is an odd posting style.

I know of 3 people contacted by the Gardai because of postings on boards. That figure will only rise.

would you not give individuals a heads up the gards were coming?

dodderangler

How are they protected their horrible mean bas***d things the big greys do hang round sheep waiting on lambs and farmers do be more than happy for us to shoot them
Suppose rats and rabbits will be protected next

Birdnuts

dodderangler wrote: »

How are they protected their horrible mean bas***d things the big greys do hang round sheep waiting on lambs and farmers do be more than happy for us to shoot them
Suppose rats and rabbits will be protected next

Under the latest Wildlife Act, every bird species is now protected - but the derogations allow certain species to be shot and trapped, including certain crow species(Grey Crows etc.) if causing damage. Its the same with the open season for certain game birds and wildfowl as regards what species can be hunted with a shotgun.

http://www.npws.ie/media/npws/publications/legaldocs/Declaration%20for%20Leinster%20Sept%202011.pdf

The derogation above is for Leinster but there the same for rest of the country as indicated on the NPWS web site - in other words farmers etc. and people authorised by them can legally trap and shoot the species listed in the above derogation if they are threatening livestock, crops etc.

4200fps

Invincible wrote: »

Have yet to see you shooting one !

lol good man pete when you do decide to meet me shooting:p. Maybe some day this year you might. Don't be late again tomorrow

Invincible

4200fps wrote: »

Invincible wrote: »

Have yet to see you shooting one !

lol good man pete when you do decide to meet me shooting:p. Maybe some day this year you might. Don't be late again tomorrow

Any time you're not playing x-box with the other kids,we will go! I was on time, not half hour late like you Tuesday

Grizzly 45

b) the use of any orally or manually operated whistle or other instrument or appliance (not being recording apparatus) which imitates, or emits calls similar to, the calls of plover, wild duck or wild geese or emits recorded such calls.

So dont use a cassette recorder etc that has a mic or a recording function for duck ,goose or plover.;)