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Did You ever vote Fianna Fail?
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That's just depressing, I had rather liked John Bruton. I wonder why he never took any action?0
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lyndonjones wrote: »How can you vote for a party that is steep in scandal and have total disregard for the working man??
if you are speaking of labour. they have never supported the working man.0 -
Deleted User wrote: »The only roots Fianna fail have is how to line their own pockets while bankrupting the country again and again. If you had any consideration for the generations after you you would ensure that that corruption on the state is removed for good.
What exactly would it take for you to not vote for them ? Would it have to be mass genocide or something:mad::mad::mad:maybe if you or your children had to emigrate you may not "consider voting for them again":eek:
Remember the last 3 previous Fianna Fail leaders have been found to be corrupt, and yet you'd consider voting for them again ???
Who I vote for, and why I vote for them is my own business. If I like the candidate, and he has a great work rate when it comes to MY constituenncy, then I will not punish them for being Fianna Fail. There is still pleanty of good people in the party and in the Dail. Now as to what has come out in the papers tv etc, you don't seriously think that Fianna Fail are the only party involved, hello Lowry, Cosgrave????. Coming back to mass genocide it was the free state pricks,which Fine Gael has it's roots, that dragged my great grandfather and two of his brothers along the road before beating them sensless and eventually shooting them dead, leaving three widows behind and 9 kids without a Father. Fianna Fail has had great leaders. lynch, lemass Dev etc were fine statesmen. Not defending the undesirable actions of those three leaders, they still did great work. Bertie and Alberts work on the peace process can not be forgotten, Fine gael when in power were holding 'so called peace talks' with John Major with Sinn Fein outside the gate, like hello, where did they think they were going?. As for Charlie I would love to resurect him as Taoisech from the dead and send him over to deal with Merkel and Zarkozy, because he wouldn't take any ****, not like that lapdog Enda Kenny. I know people will be up in arms over that comment, but Haughey had balls of steel, and that what this country needs. Same goes for Dev/0 -
Who I vote for, and why I vote for them is my own business. If I like the candidate, and he has a great work rate when it comes to MY constituenncy, then I will not punish them for being Fianna Fail. There is still pleanty of good people in the party and in the Dail. Now as to what has come out in the papers tv etc, you don't seriously think that Fianna Fail are the only party involved, hello Lowry, Cosgrave????. Coming back to mass genocide it was the free state pricks,which Fine Gael has it's roots, that dragged my great grandfather and two of his brothers along the road before beating them sensless and eventually shooting them dead, leaving three widows behind and 9 kids without a Father. Fianna Fail has had great leaders. lynch, lemass Dev etc were fine statesmen. Not defending the undesirable actions of those three leaders, they still did great work. Bertie and Alberts work on the peace process can not be forgotten, Fine gael when in power were holding 'so called peace talks' with John Major with Sinn Fein outside the gate, like hello, where did they think they were going?. As for Charlie I would love to resurect him as Taoisech from the dead and send him over to deal with Merkel and Zarkozy, because he wouldn't take any ****, not like that lapdog Enda Kenny. I know people will be up in arms over that comment, but Haughey had balls of steel, and that what this country needs. Same goes for Dev/
You sound like a true FF supporter.
Do you realise that you are the reason I never ,never , never , ever , ever will vote for you , someone like you or someone you vote for .0 -
You sound like a true FF supporter.
Do you realise that you are the reason I never ,never , never , ever , ever will vote for you , someone like you or someone you vote for .
And I couldn't give a flying **** what you think, I'm not a true FF supporter,. I'm prob veering towards SF at the moment, but if a candidate that I like is running, i will vote for him, even if he is FF.0 -
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MOD NOTE:
Let's take a deep breath and bring the temperature down a notch, please.0 -
You sound like a true FF supporter.
Do you realise that you are the reason I never ,never , never , ever , ever will vote for you , someone like you or someone you vote for .
Ah! The steadfast refusal to consider voting for a party regardless of policy or circumstance. Now there's a brave new departure in Irish politics. And yet you decry FF supporters who still follow their party?0 -
Ah! The steadfast refusal to consider voting for a party regardless of policy or circumstance. Now there's a brave new departure in Irish politics. And yet you decry FF supporters who still follow their party?
Are you aware of the irony in your post ? ''and yet you decry FF supporters who still follow their party'' and steadfastly refuse to vote for any other party . And this despite over 40 years of curruption !0 -
Are you aware of the irony in your post ? ''and yet you decry FF supporters who still follow their party'' and steadfastly refuse to vote for any other party . And this despite over 40 years of curruption !
Yeah I'm aware of the irony. It was kinda the point of the whole thing. The refusal to alter your viewpoint regardless of the current situation isn't a very wise decision in my opinion. It's just the flip side that's all0 -
Who I vote for, and why I vote for them is my own business. If I like the candidate, and he has a great work rate when it comes to MY constituenncy, then I will not punish them for being Fianna Fail. There is still pleanty of good people in the party and in the Dail. Now as to what has come out in the papers tv etc, you don't seriously think that Fianna Fail are the only party involved, hello Lowry, Cosgrave????. Coming back to mass genocide it was the free state pricks,which Fine Gael has it's roots, that dragged my great grandfather and two of his brothers along the road before beating them sensless and eventually shooting them dead, leaving three widows behind and 9 kids without a Father. Fianna Fail has had great leaders. lynch, lemass Dev etc were fine statesmen. Not defending the undesirable actions of those three leaders, they still did great work. Bertie and Alberts work on the peace process can not be forgotten, Fine gael when in power were holding 'so called peace talks' with John Major with Sinn Fein outside the gate, like hello, where did they think they were going?. As for Charlie I would love to resurect him as Taoisech from the dead and send him over to deal with Merkel and Zarkozy, because he wouldn't take any ****, not like that lapdog Enda Kenny. I know people will be up in arms over that comment, but Haughey had balls of steel, and that what this country needs. Same goes for Dev/
My god!. I thought people like you had gone extinct. You do realise its not 1921 anymore ? Have you no consideration for the current and future generation at all ?. Its no wonder we live in a corrupt bankrupt state when there is still shockling attitudes like yours still existing.:rolleyes: You do realise its voters like you that has inflicted immigration on another generation of young Irish people and poverty on the rest. But keep living in the 1920's if thats all you can manage.
I'd love to see Fine gael, fianna fail, and sinn fein wiped out in the morning. Then you may have to engage your brain for the first time when voting. Then policies that effect living Irish people instead of your great grandaddy might come in to play.:mad:0 -
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If I like the candidate, and he has a great work rate when it comes to MY constituenncy, then I will not punish them for being Fianna Fail.
This attitude is, in my opinion, the cause of so much of the problems over the last 20 years.
The fact is you are not just voting for a TD, you are also voting for a party. We are not a country of independents. The TD with the great work rate in your consistency is going to vote with his party, that is the point of political parties. If you elect him you are giving him such a mandate. How much work he does locally is irrelevant when it comes to his support in the Dail for a party who's national policies have been disastrous for the country.
When you vote for a FF candidate you are voting for FF policies, because you are giving your TD a mandate to go to the Dail and vote with the party.0 -
Deleted User wrote: »My god!. I thought people like you had gone extinct. You do realise its not 1921 anymore ? Have you no consideration for the current and future generation at all ?. Its no wonder we live in a corrupt bankrupt state when there is still shockling attitudes like yours still existing.:rolleyes: You do realise its voters like you that has inflicted immigration on another generation of young Irish people and poverty on the rest. But keep living in the 1920's if thats all you can manage.
I'd love to see Fine gael, fianna fail, and sinn fein wiped out in the morning. Then you may have to engage your brain for the first time when voting. Then policies that effect living Irish people instead of your great grandaddy might come in to play.:mad:
go to hell or to connaucht, who I vote for is my business, you were the one who mentioned genocide. I'm well aware what year it is thank you, i was only making reference to your remarks on genocide. Don't you dare blame me for the problems of this country, Fianna Fail were a catch all party during the boom, so mind your own business as to who everyone else votes for. You have your say. I'll have mine, and so will everyone else that bothers to cast their vote.0 -
This attitude is, in my opinion, the cause of so much of the problems over the last 20 years.
The fact is you are not just voting for a TD, you are also voting for a party. We are not a country of independents. The TD with the great work rate in your consistency is going to vote with his party, that is the point of political parties. If you elect him you are giving him such a mandate. How much work he does locally is irrelevant when it comes to his support in the Dail for a party who's national policies have been disastrous for the country.
When you vote for a FF candidate you are voting for FF policies, because you are giving your TD a mandate to go to the Dail and vote with the party.
The same goes for you. You don't know who else I have voted for in the past. I have voted outside fianna fail many time, but i wont punish a politician I like because he's Fianna Fail.I will reward those who work for me.0 -
Wasn't in the country from 1994 to 2006,Never voted for them before I left and haven't voted for them since I came back.0
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go to hell or to connaucht, who I vote for is my business, you were the one who mentioned genocide. I'm well aware what year it is thank you, i was only making reference to your remarks on genocide. Don't you dare blame me for the problems of this country, Fianna Fail were a catch all party during the boom, so mind your own business as to who everyone else votes for. You have your say. I'll have mine, and so will everyone else that bothers to cast their vote.
Margio.
Fianna Fail voter = Fianna Fail Government = Corruption + Incompetence = Immigration+ Poverty
Its with people like you that these problems are allowed start, you cannot disown fianna fails actions when you helped put them into power.
Continuing to vote for them when for generations have been found to be corrupt and incompetent just speaks of me feinism. I'd say your grandparents fought for (what they seen as) the good of the country and not for themselves. You appear to have lost there ideals when now you vote for the party that does most for just you. When instead you should be voting for the party that does most for the country, or at least tries.0 -
Deleted User wrote: »Margio.
Fianna Fail voter = Fianna Fail Government = Corruption + Incompetence = Immigration+ Poverty
Its with people like you that these problems are allowed start, you cannot disown fianna fails actions when you helped put them into power.
Continuing to vote for them when for generations have been found to be corrupt and incompetent just speaks of me feinism. I'd say your grandparents fought for (what they seen as) the good of the country and not for themselves. You appear to have lost there ideals when now you vote for the party that does most for just you. When instead you should be voting for the party that does most for the country.
So who in your opinion are these?0 -
I voted first in 1981 and I have.never missed a general election since. I never gave FF as much as a number 12 on my ballot paper! My father was a staunch anti Haughey campaigner and woe betide anyone in the house who didn't agree. It did help that my mother was on the same side as my Dad! I think if you grew up seeing FF as the devil incarnate you're hardly likely to change.0
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Er, no it doesn't. When I vote I vote for the TD and the party. And I certainly do blame my TD for the faults of his or her party. That is the whole point of a party system.The same goes for you.
Nor do I care, that is not relevant to the point at hand.You don't know who else I have voted for in the past.
Then you do not understand how the party system works.I have voted outside fianna fail many time, but i wont punish a politician I like because he's Fianna Fail.I will reward those who work for me.
A FF TD has a requirement to vote for the Fianna Fáil party agenda. If he doesn't he will be kicked out of the party. He signals to you, the electorate, that this is how he will behave in the Dail by running as a FF candidate. He could run as an independent, but doesn't.
If you are voting for a FF TD then you are voting for the national policies of the Fianna Fáil party.0 -
If you are voting for a FF TD then you are voting for the national policies of the Fianna Fáil party.
This is the problem with Irish politics. Me fein voters voting for some 'local issues' TD irrespective of his party allegiance and the 'ethos' of that party. 'Ah yes the party seems to condone crooks and it mismanaged the economy but yer man looks after me well'. If some Irish equivalent of the BNP fielded a 'nice fella' would they vote for them? With voluntary membership of parties, your membership taints you by association.
Pfft. As reasonable as trying to pick a cherry out of a dirty diaper.0 -
Quote from Zombrex ''Then you do not understand how the party system works''
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Excuse me but i have a degree in politics, so i know all about the party system. There is more to the Fianna Fail party than what you have just mentioned. Sean Lemass and Jack Lynch were honourable and decent politicians, and I feel that Brian Cowen was a man of incredible integrety. Ok Ireland is ****ed at the moment, but do you know for sure that FG / Lab etc would have done a better job.?, recessions come and go, and the smart economy will **** off as fast as the celtic tiger did. If I was to be totally honest, I would prefer a Government a in Germany that is made up of ministers with senior professional backgrounds in their area., but FG were all promioses with reform etc, and all they can do is look in to abolosishing the Seanad. It's not my fault that the party system i so domineering in this country. I will cast my vote as long as I am alive and physically able to do so, because people died so generations after them could cast a vote in this country. you say that you don't care that I have voted for others other than FF, but you berate me for voting for them.0 -
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Excuse me but i have a degree in politics, so i know all about the party system. There is more to the Fianna Fail party than what you have just mentioned. Sean Lemass and Jack Lynch were honourable and decent politicians
What the heck does that have to do with the current economic crisis?
Through the 2000s the FF government sustained an unsustainable property bubble, despite warnings from all quarters that was a terrible idea. This lead to both the economic crash when the property house of cards crumbled and the over stretching of the banks which had to be bailed out by the tax payer simply to continue with a functioning economy.
If the government had been kicked out by the people long before the crash of 2008 it is highly doubtful that a FG or Labour government would have continued the policies that just caused the government to fall.
But of course this didn't happen because the country was full of people who were more than happy to believe the FF nonsense.I feel that Brian Cowen was a man of incredible integrety
If by "integrity" you mean almost super human ability to ignore all the advice he was getting in order to pretend that there was no problem, then I agree 100% with you.It's not my fault that the party system i so domineering in this country.
It is your fault though if you ignore the party system we have in this country by voting solely on local issues and ignoring that the TD you elect to the Dail will vote with his party, which in the case of FF was for disastrous economic policies. How many swimming pools or pot holes he gets fixed won't change that.
If you don't like it vote for an independent.you say that you don't care that I have voted for others other than FF, but you berate me for voting for them.
I said I don't have to know who you voted for, your position would be bad no matter which party you were voting for.0 -
What the heck does that have to do with the current economic crisis?
Through the 2000s the FF government sustained an unsustainable property bubble, despite warnings from all quarters that was a terrible idea. This lead to both the economic crash when the property house of cards crumbled and the over stretching of the banks which had to be bailed out by the tax payer simply to continue with a functioning economy.
If the government had been kicked out by the people long before the crash of 2008 it is highly doubtful that a FG or Labour government would have continued the policies that just caused the government to fall.
But of course this didn't happen because the country was full of people who were more than happy to believe the FF nonsense.
But by voting for an independent, am I not fuelling the party system, we all know they can be very pivotal in creating a government
If by "integrity" you mean almost super human ability to ignore all the advice he was getting in order to pretend that there was no problem, then I agree 100% with you.
It is your fault though if you ignore the party system we have in this country by voting solely on local issues and ignoring that the TD you elect to the Dail will vote with his party, which in the case of FF was for disastrous economic policies. How many swimming pools or pot holes he gets fixed won't change that.
If you don't like it vote for an independent.
I said I don't have to know who you voted for, your position would be bad no matter which party you were voting for.
You are stupid to assume that FG and Lab would have avoided the crash. Someone gave an example earlier on in the thread about how FG promised to outspend FF coing up to the elections before the crash. You are also ignorant to assume that I don't agree with FF policys. They have as good policies as any parties. When everything was rosie in the garden every one wanted them to spend spend spend, (FG would have done the same), and when the whole thing collaped. every one was protesting against the cuts. Cuts had to be made, difficult decisions had to be taken, they were, but maybe not difficult enough, nothing like in Germany and Britain, who were also rocked by the recession.0 -
Through the 2000s the FF government sustained an unsustainable property bubble, despite warnings from all quarters that was a terrible idea. This lead to both the economic crash when the property house of cards crumbled and the over stretching of the banks which had to be bailed out by the tax payer simply to continue with a functioning economy.
If the government had been kicked out by the people long before the crash of 2008 it is highly doubtful that a FG or Labour government would have continued the policies that just caused the government to fall.
I'm afraid if you believe that you should really go back and do a little research. As recently as 2007 FG were in a race with FF to spend as much of the budget surplus as possible. If I recall they were predicting growth of about 4.5% and tax revenues within a few hundred millions of the FF estimate in their GE manifesto that year. The property bubble and all it's associated windfalls was firmly part of their strategy for managing the economy. They alongside Labour were proposing to drop income tax rates to match the FF proposals, the lower rate was dropping to 18% and allowances were on the increase. The golden goose was going to keep on delivering for them as well. I even have a recollection of Gerry Adams standing on a podium with the clarion call 'It's your money' repeated over and over again.
I won't defend FF for their handling of the economy but I won't delude myself that any of the opposition parties were in any way more attuned to the unsustainability of it. I firmly believe that the only discussion one can have in this regard is who would have dealt with the initial fallout better. And that's a hypothetical question now0 -
Laminations wrote: »This is the problem with Irish politics. Me fein voters voting for some 'local issues' TD irrespective of his party allegiance and the 'ethos' of that party. 'Ah yes the party seems to condone crooks and it mismanaged the economy but yer man looks after me well'. If some Irish equivalent of the BNP fielded a 'nice fella' would they vote for them? With voluntary membership of parties, your membership taints you by association.
Pfft. As reasonable as trying to pick a cherry out of a dirty diaper.
I agree with certain aspects, but the only way to solve this properly is to give co councils more power in the form of regional governments eg provinces, then have a seperate cabinet made up of professionals in Dublin dealing with the issues that benefit the country as a whole.0 -
You are stupid to assume that FG and Lab would have avoided the crash. Someone gave an example earlier on in the thread about how FG promised to outspend FF coing up to the elections before the crash. You are also ignorant to assume that I don't agree with FF policys. They have as good policies as any parties. When everything was rosie in the garden every one wanted them to spend spend spend, (FG would have done the same), and when the whole thing collaped. every one was protesting against the cuts. Cuts had to be made, difficult decisions had to be taken, they were, but maybe not difficult enough, nothing like in Germany and Britain, who were also rocked by the recession.
We'll never know what might have happened. Though the Fianna Fail way was always to throw money at any problem, they have rarely shown any restraint. They as good as bought a few elections over the years whether that be by abolishing domestic rates, or tax decreases for the lower paid, or large social welfare increases, or pay increases for the public service. After the kicking Fine Gael got in the 2002 election for suggesting restraint we the public sowed the seeds for what eventually happened. So even though it's correct to say by 2007 all parties were promising the earth I'm still happy to say we ended up far worse with Fianna Fail. When the crunch came they tried to throw money at it as usual and we see how that worked out.0 -
I agree with certain aspects, but the only way to solve this properly is to give co councils more power in the form of regional governments eg provinces, then have a seperate cabinet made up of professionals in Dublin dealing with the issues that benefit the country as a whole.
Regional governments? So we can have the situation we had in the late 80's to mid 2000's were FF and FG dominated every council and zoned land corruptly. The only voices of reason were Labour who had one corrupt councillor that was thrown out after voting in a corrupt zoning decision straight away. FF and FG still have corrupt councillors from that time in their ranks. Labour and the Greens were the only voices of reason then, Trevor Sargeant was assaulted in a council chamber for ripping up a bribe all councillors got.lynch, lemass Dev etc were fine statesmen.
Lynch, bankrupted the country in the 1980's with his giveaway election of 1977.
Dev, kept Ireland in economic penury from 1932-1959.
Lemass, modest economic gains. Maintained the Catholic Churches special role in society, to the detriment of thousands beaten and abused in a Catholic run education system. Also to the detriment of mothers who could not divorce, even if their husband was beating and raping them. Also to women who had to quit their jobs if they got married.but Haughey had balls of steel, and that what this country needs. Same goes for Dev/
Haughey apparently 'stood up to Thatcher' according to FFers. Haughey was an economic Thatcherite. Setting up the IFSC, to rival the city of London as an international money laundering facility is something Margaret Thatcher would have been proud of. Haughey was also corrupt to the core, and should never have held high office.
As for Dev, sending our constitution to be proof read by the Vatican in 1937 showed no balls of steel. Showing balls of steel would have been creating a true Republic, and not the Theocratic hell hole Ireland was up until very recently.0 -
I agree with certain aspects, but the only way to solve this properly is to give co councils more power in the form of regional governments eg provinces, then have a seperate cabinet made up of professionals in Dublin dealing with the issues that benefit the country as a whole.
There definitely needs to be a separation in local/community affairs and national governance. The end of constituency clinics would be a start. Any local issues are taken to the council (who are voted in at senior positions by the people). Bi-weekly or monthly town hall meetings would then be the forum to raise national issues and get updates from your TD. These public meetings would be attended (on stage) by any government or opposition TDs for that area and anyone from the council or with some reasonable mandate intending to run for a national seat to voice their concerns and share their views. They'd be independently moderated and take questions from the audience (the local community). Discussion of local issues would not be permitted here unless it was an issue resulting from national policy. This would end the behind closed doors clinic meetings which lack transparency and waste TDs time.
People may criticise such a system by saying that local councillors who have a local presence and solve local issues daily would then be voted to national office and TDs would lose out. But I think the distinction would mean people are more likely to retain good councillors and only 'promote' them on the back of a good performance at the town hall meetings where they could demonstrate their suitability for the Dail and national politics.
But margio, while you're waiting for that to happen you need to vote on a candidate with consideration of the party they stand for.0 -
I'm afraid if you believe that you should really go back and do a little research. As recently as 2007 FG were in a race with FF to spend as much of the budget surplus as possible. If I recall they were predicting growth of about 4.5% and tax revenues within a few hundred millions of the FF estimate in their GE manifesto that year. The property bubble and all it's associated windfalls was firmly part of their strategy for managing the economy. They alongside Labour were proposing to drop income tax rates to match the FF proposals, the lower rate was dropping to 18% and allowances were on the increase. The golden goose was going to keep on delivering for them as well. I even have a recollection of Gerry Adams standing on a podium with the clarion call 'It's your money' repeated over and over again.
I won't defend FF for their handling of the economy but I won't delude myself that any of the opposition parties were in any way more attuned to the unsustainability of it. I firmly believe that the only discussion one can have in this regard is who would have dealt with the initial fallout better. And that's a hypothetical question now
You didn't read my post properly. The other parties eventually ended up copied FF because it was the popular thing to do, despite terrible terrible policies FF were riding high. Of course the other parties start promising more of the same.
What the country should have done is kick FF out of power and giving a clear mandate to the other parties that this is not what they wanted. They didn't because it was what the country wanted. We were happy to revel in the good times and believe the nonsense.0 -
Political parties do not avoid a crash like the one we had, countries do. The country should have kicked out FF and then demanded the other parties change the direction of the country. Oddly this is how democracy is supposed to work.You are stupid to assume that FG and Lab would have avoided the crash. Someone gave an example earlier on in the thread about how FG promised to outspend FF coing up to the elections before the crash.You are also ignorant to assume that I don't agree with FF policys. They have as good policies as any parties. When everything was rosie in the garden every one wanted them to spend spend spend, (FG would have done the same), and when the whole thing collaped.
Hence bad policies
What part of their economy policies in the 2000s did you agree with?0 -
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Pride Fighter wrote: »Regional governments? So we can have the situation we had in the late 80's to mid 2000's were FF and FG dominated every council and zoned land corruptly. The only voices of reason were Labour who had one corrupt councillor that was thrown out after voting in a corrupt zoning decision straight away. FF and FG still have corrupt councillors from that time in their ranks. Labour and the Greens were the only voices of reason then, Trevor Sargeant was assaulted in a council chamber for ripping up a bribe all councillors got.
Lynch, bankrupted the country in the 1980's with his giveaway election of 1977.
Dev, kept Ireland in economic penury from 1932-1959.
Lemass, modest economic gains. Maintained the Catholic Churches special role in society, to the detriment of thousands beaten and abused in a Catholic run education system. Also to the detriment of mothers who could not divorce, even if their husband was beating and raping them. Also to women who had to quit their jobs if they got married.
Haughey apparently 'stood up to Thatcher' according to FFers. Haughey was an economic Thatcherite. Setting up the IFSC, to rival the city of London as an international money laundering facility is something Margaret Thatcher would have been proud of. Haughey was also corrupt to the core, and should never have held high office.
As for Dev, sending our constitution to be proof read by the Vatican in 1937 showed no balls of steel. Showing balls of steel would have been creating a true Republic, and not the Theocratic hell hole Ireland was up until very recently.
It was 1937, Church and state were hand in hand, It wasn't that many years before that Catholics were subjected to penal laws. It's fine for us all to look back now and criticise the political-religion actions taken. we were a devout religious country, compared to now, so it easy now to wonder why church and state wern't seperate. But only for Dev the 26 counties wouldn't entirely be free. Cumann na Gaedhael had no intention of removing oath, claiming back treaty ports etc.Same goes for Lemass, he industrialised Ireland. Where himself and Dev differed were areas such as entry in to the EEC. Dev didn't want us to lose our soveirngty in anyway, and looking back now, maybe he was right, maybe he wasn't. As for regional government, as long as TD'S are elected by their constituents there will always be pork barrell politics and localism will flourish under those conditions. If there were regional /provicial governments, they should be responsible for potholes, all the **** that our legislators should not be dealing with.0
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